Trump

[Deamonbane]

What's the word on people calling it a false-flag operation by Antifa? Or the Deep State?

[TheHangedOne]

That shit needs to be reported to the FBI, I am sure it has by now but everyone should be reporting that shit.

For anybody with the technical skills and know-how, the FBI is currently offering bounties on some of the individuals that hit the Capitol.  Prizes for finding terrorists range in the 5,000 to 50,000 range.

https://www.fbi.gov/contact-us/field-offices/washingtondc/news/press-releases/fbi-seeking-information-related-to-violent-activity-at-the-us-capitol-building

Although this posting does not show the bounties (that seems to be the dominion of news articles), this would seem to be the relevant website to consult.

What's the word on people calling it a false-flag operation by Antifa? Or the Deep State?

Plenty of people have taken to Alternative Social Media to decry Antifa for daring to sully their pristine reputation.

[Skynet]

Brian Sicknick, a police officer who was hospitalized from attacks by the protestors, has now died from his injuries.

[clonkertink]

Trump has conceded.

Not that it really means anything; he was all but handcuffed to the teleprompter. But it is still a concession speech, so I guess I'm out $20.

[TheHangedOne]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ParlerWatch/comments/ksr5sg/parler_reacts_to_trumps_concession/

And to go with Clonk's post, here we have a thread dedicated to screenshotting the MAGA people over on Parler, as they have an existential meltdown.

[clonkertink]

"He plants on having Don Jr take on the Presidental role."

That one gets me good, for some reason.

[Beorning]

I just checked Trump's Twitter and I honestly think that Trump fans display the behaviour of brainwashed people from some dystopian setting.

I mean, an hour after the riots Trump said to the rioters "We love you!", called them patriots etc. Now, he took a 180-degree turn and says they will be punished, that they don't represent the American people etc. And yet, over at this very Twitter post of his, multiple supporters are saying he's the greatest president ever, a true leader, that they are so sad to see him go etc. Seriously, can't these people see that he just threw the people he incited to riot under the bus?

Seriously, a woman got herself killed to help him prove that he won these damned elections - and now* he says about people like her that they should be punished???

[TheHangedOne]

So it looks like Trump is finally losing his lawyers.

I just checked Trump's Twitter and I honestly think that Trump fans display the behaviour of brainwashed people from some dystopian setting.

Those are the actions, thoughts, and feelings of indoctrinated cultists.  The only way our nation's people can heal from this bullshit, is through a massive application of cult deprogramming. Which is very much unlikely to happen. These people will end up killing and dying for him.

[Missy]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ParlerWatch/comments/ksr5sg/parler_reacts_to_trumps_concession/

And to go with Clonk's post, here we have a thread dedicated to screenshotting the MAGA people over on Parler, as they have an existential meltdown.

Too late. He's only doing this cuz continueing to incite isn't going to bite him the ass, it's going to grind his ass into hamburger, then cycle it through again to make that hamburger into a fine paste. This is the most reasonable he's sounded in ever, he finally did what his staff has been wishing he'd do for years, listen to them and let them censor and leash his impulses.

He's been building up to Wednesday for years, there's multiple hanging questions about him being involved in potentially seditious acts, he's dodged all the bullets on that, but by being the underhand, never by allowing the truth to be examined. Wednesday culminated the true intent of his campaign for the past five years. It's too late for I'm sorry, once you get to the point of treason, you're a traitor, you'll learn to regret there are no apologies for treason.

I'm only hoping the incoming DoJ pursues it with all haste, the Blues now proceed to aggressively dismantle all effects which enabled president Trump to accomplish what he has. This is not optional, it is critical, failure to do so represents a surrender of Democracy and America to seditionists, mobs and tyranny.

[TheVillain]

A Gentle Historical Reminder -
Before officially taking power in 1933 the Nazis had a failed coup in 1923 called the Beer Hall Putsch. While the act itself failed, it's believed by historians that part of the reason they were able to take power in '33 was because the German Government decided on only minor, mostly symbolic repercussions to the then budding Nazi movement and made no major changes to their government strategy.

[TheHangedOne]

As TheVillain points out, I am quite worried that if we if don't have some people getting blackbagged and sent to Sites That Do Not Exist. Or, as I'd prefer, a public execution.

If the risks are few, then people will, of course, break the law. If the risks are high, then people will be less inclined to risk it.

[Skynet]

So it looks like Trump is finally losing his lawyers.
Those are the actions, thoughts, and feelings of indoctrinated cultists.  The only way our nation's people can heal from this bullshit, is through a massive application of cult deprogramming. Which is very much unlikely to happen. These people will end up killing and dying for him.

I don't know if this has been posted earlier, but a notable cult deprogrammer with 40 years of work wrote a book on how Trump's MAGA fanbase has all the calling cards of a cult movement.

The book's also a good insight into various examples of the President's speech tactics and how they're meant to instill a certain mental state in people positively inclined towards him. This isn't "mind control" per se (more a provocative title) but more the kind of thing hypnotists use to make people more pliable to suggestion.

[clonkertink]

As TheVillain points out, I am quite worried that if we if don't have some people getting blackbagged and sent to Sites That Do Not Exist. Or, as I'd prefer, a public execution.

If the risks are few, then people will, of course, break the law. If the risks are high, then people will be less inclined to risk it.

I'd have to vehemently disagree with blacksites. That would be giving in to the very authoritarianism we all want to repudiate. I'm also vehemently anti-death penalty. It's unnecessary. Throwing these people in jail for the better part of their lives is more than sufficient.

Both things are far too easily abused in the hands of people like Trump, and I'd like to ensure that neither are available the next time a wannabe dictator rolls into office.

[Bibliophilia]

As TheVillain points out, I am quite worried that if we if don't have some people getting blackbagged and sent to Sites That Do Not Exist. Or, as I'd prefer, a public execution.

If the risks are few, then people will, of course, break the law. If the risks are high, then people will be less inclined to risk it.

We have to expect and do better.  It's been proven that capital punishment isn't actually a deterrent to crime.  This right here is not okay, and we can not allow ourselves to become the monsters.

[Missy]

As TheVillain points out, I am quite worried that if we if don't have some people getting blackbagged and sent to Sites That Do Not Exist. Or, as I'd prefer, a public execution.

If the risks are few, then people will, of course, break the law. If the risks are high, then people will be less inclined to risk it.

It will only make a difference if the laws used to prosecute and suppress poor behavior are based and adjudicated in an appropriate degree of justice itself.

[TheHangedOne]

We have to expect and do better.  It's been proven that capital punishment isn't actually a deterrent to crime.  This right here is not okay, and we can not allow ourselves to become the monsters.

I'm going to ask a blunt question. It is a sincere question, not a rhetorical one.  Why?

I ask because in my late teens, I believed in non-violence. I believed in being the better person. But over the past two decades, all I have ever seen is those who try to be 'better' end up getting stabbed in the back; taken advantage of; mocked. All I've seen is that attitude getting us nowhere.

I am aware, though, that just because I have seen so much negativity, doesn't mean that others have. So, the question; why? I want to know what gives you faith. Not to laugh at you, not to de-legitimize your stance, but because I'd like to be able to believe that again.

[Oniya]

I'm going to ask a blunt question. It is a sincere question, not a rhetorical one.  Why?

I ask because in my late teens, I believed in non-violence. I believed in being the better person. But over the past two decades, all I have ever seen is those who try to be 'better' end up getting stabbed in the back; taken advantage of; mocked. All I've seen is that attitude getting us nowhere.

I am aware, though, that just because I have seen so much negativity, doesn't mean that others have. So, the question; why? I want to know what gives you faith. Not to laugh at you, not to de-legitimize your stance, but because I'd like to be able to believe that again.

Dyin's too quick for 'em.  As someone mentioned earlier, dragging their asses through a humiliating trial and sending them to someplace like Rikers in one-size-fits-all orange jumpsuits will reveal their true powerlessness.

[Skynet]

Because when you make the legal case to use the power of the State one way, it can also be used against you in the very same way.

Trump is terrible, yes. Letting hundreds of thousands of COVID death happen, the people being tortured in ICE custody for being born outside the US, granted administrative positions to all manner of incompetents and hatemongers, and dismantling vital infrastructure like so many of his GOP contemporaries.

But Trump was a fool, a man driven by impulse, a con man who bought into his own invulnerability. The people who stormed the Capitol believed they were invincible, but they had a humbling moment. They and their supporters are not going to go away. They still vote, they'll still run for public office, any legal precedent set to deprive them of rights will be turned right back on all those they hate and wish to see harmed.

[Skynet]

Whoops, this is what I get for not quoting. My response was to the Hanged Man.

I'm going to ask a blunt question. It is a sincere question, not a rhetorical one.  Why?

I ask because in my late teens, I believed in non-violence. I believed in being the better person. But over the past two decades, all I have ever seen is those who try to be 'better' end up getting stabbed in the back; taken advantage of; mocked. All I've seen is that attitude getting us nowhere.

I am aware, though, that just because I have seen so much negativity, doesn't mean that others have. So, the question; why? I want to know what gives you faith. Not to laugh at you, not to de-legitimize your stance, but because I'd like to be able to believe that again.

[Missy]

Because when you make the legal case to use the power of the State one way, it can also be used against you in the very same way.

Trump is terrible, yes. Letting hundreds of thousands of COVID death happen, the people being tortured in ICE custody for being born outside the US, granted administrative positions to all manner of incompetents and hatemongers, and dismantling vital infrastructure like so many of his GOP contemporaries.

But Trump was a fool, a man driven by impulse, a con man who bought into his own invulnerability. The people who stormed the Capitol believed they were invincible, but they had a humbling moment. They and their supporters are not going to go away. They still vote, they'll still run for public office, any legal precedent set to deprive them of rights will be turned right back on all those they hate and wish to see harmed.

Then is it someone's right to incite a mob to storm the center of government, to interupt suppress the constitutionally founded process meant to sustain the peaceful transition of power, threaten the very welfare and lives of the duly elected offices of state (not to mention all the others there), lie and manipulate for the purpose of retaining power by whatever means necessary no matter the cost.

You must have a very low opinion of many people if you think  that will apply to most of them.

[Skynet]

The Hanged Man was alleging that those responsible be subjected to extra-judicial executions. Every US citizen, even the scum of the Earth, have the right to a trial.

Also public executions are gross and only serve society's sadistic impulses.

As TheVillain points out, I am quite worried that if we if don't have some people getting blackbagged and sent to Sites That Do Not Exist. Or, as I'd prefer, a public execution.

If the risks are few, then people will, of course, break the law. If the risks are high, then people will be less inclined to risk it.

[Missy]

Yeah I overlooked that, thanks.

In any case, yeah providing heavy judicial penalties in a court of law should serve as an effective deterrent, the precedent needs to be established now that doing what Trump has done is wrong and carry's heavy life changing penalties for two reasons; 1) Doing so establishes the precedent to confront and counteract other kleptocrats in the future, 2) Having such precedents may serve as either the effective deterrent or the effective means to prevent such events from advancing to such extremes in the future.

The truth is, we got pretty lucky this time, this was planned, and Trump supported it, built it up even, intended for it. Trump and all those who participated need to personally experience just how heavily the law weighs on the backs of criminals and seditionists. The law should be executed justly and the penalty exacted heavily.

Not to mention many of the prominent figures here are White Nationalist and violent terrorists, obviously, you can't let there bullshit slide, it sets a horrendous precedent.

[TheHangedOne]

I'm unconvinced that our justice system will actually be able to properly prosecute people in a timely manner, if at all. I would like to be proven wrong, but I can't have any hope any more. Not after this past year.

[Skynet]

I'm unconvinced that our justice system will actually be able to properly prosecute people in a timely manner, if at all. I would like to be proven wrong, but I can't have any hope any more. Not after this past year.

I get how you feel; it's downright infuriating to see right-wing insurgents and domestic terrorists get slaps on the wrist by sympathetic people in power. But in your hypothetical scenario, making it easier to prosecute them will make it easier to prosecute people more maligned than they are.

I'm reminded of some leftists upset about the George Zimmerman verdict. They had arguments how the US judicial system should have an easier time of convicting people. And those same leftists (quite justly) bemoan the racial disparities in policing, the amount of death row inmates who turn out innocent, the prison-industrial complex that prioritizes heavy sentences for non-violent drug offenders and other victimless crimes...and they are arguing for all of this to be an easier process.

Always remember that when you feel angry at the system, and want vengeance. You are right to feel angry and cynical at the nation's sorry state of affairs. But think of how many others will be affected by your proposals. Because the law is broad, sweeping, and harder to overturn once things are put in place. Look at the PATRIOT ACT, still going strong.

[RedPhoenix]

The absolute last thing anyone should want from all this is for the government to have less checks on its abuse of power. There are already many, many tools available to the police and courts to put these guys away for a very long time they just need to choose to use it.