You are either not logged in or not registered with our community. Click here to register.
 
December 03, 2016, 11:59:02 AM

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length

Click here if you are having problems.
Default Wide Screen Beige Lilac Rainbow Black & Blue October Send us your theme!

Hark!  The Herald!
Holiday Issue 2016

Wiki Blogs Dicebot

Author Topic: Winter is Coming...  (Read 36913 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline jouzinka

  • Elf Guardian of the Blind Unbowed,Unbent,Unbroken. Law, Hr nn, dollen i Rw
  • Lady
  • Addict
  • *
  • Join Date: Nov 2008
  • Location: Surely wielding my mad makeup skillz somewhere
  • Gender: Female
  • The E mantra: Sip, swallow, scroll, sip, swallow..
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 1
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #425 on: April 16, 2014, 04:54:08 PM »
You're right, Rem.
Don't read this if you haven't seen the last ep.
Jaime returns and he and Cersei hit it off right by Joffrey's corpse.

Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
I do believe Tyrion tried to send Shae away. If I remember, he gave her a necklace and told her she could buy a whole ship for it... and she said "why would I need a ship?" and threw it right back into his face.

Offline Drake Valentine

  • Architect of Worlds
  • Knight
  • Enchanter
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2009
  • Location: In the Deepest Depthes of Your Twisted Mind
  • Gender: Male
  • Making Your Darkest of Fantasies a Reality
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 0
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #426 on: April 17, 2014, 02:33:27 AM »
To be honest, I'm surprised it didn't happen last season.   Apparently

Don't read this if you haven't seen the latest episode
in the books, Jaime doesn't return to King's Landing until after Joffrey is dead.

Also, did Tyrion send Shae away in the books? I can't remember.

Shae
Was that his whore? He killed her by strangling her. In the books.

Offline jouzinka

  • Elf Guardian of the Blind Unbowed,Unbent,Unbroken. Law, Hr nn, dollen i Rw
  • Lady
  • Addict
  • *
  • Join Date: Nov 2008
  • Location: Surely wielding my mad makeup skillz somewhere
  • Gender: Female
  • The E mantra: Sip, swallow, scroll, sip, swallow..
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 1
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #427 on: April 17, 2014, 03:34:11 AM »
Shae
Was that his whore? He killed her by strangling her. In the books.
Yes and yes, but that will happen in episode 9 of this season.

Before that he did try to ship her away, in my opinion.

Offline Lilias

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #428 on: April 17, 2014, 04:25:25 AM »
And not just Shae, of course. ;) Big things always happen in ep. 9.

I'm so looking forward to ep. 8 myself. The Mountain and the Viper duking it out is all the money.

Offline RhapsodyTopic starter

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #429 on: April 17, 2014, 05:22:52 AM »
I thought the back-and-forth between Cersei and Oberyn was particularly well done.

I like Lena Headey as an actress. She plays Cersei so well, I want to reach into the screen and strangle the bitch.
Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
Of course, she hasn't done the dumbest thing she's ever done and re-armed the faith yet...
So that'll be interesting to watch as well.

Offline Stella

  • The Girl Who Waited, Marquess of Pembroke
  • Dame
  • Carnite
  • *
  • Join Date: Jan 2011
  • Location: Australia
  • Gender: Female
  • ever fancied someone you know you shouldn't?
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 0
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #430 on: April 17, 2014, 05:26:45 AM »
Oh, I cannot wait for that part. I love to hate Cersei. Her story is so, so good.

Offline Drake Valentine

  • Architect of Worlds
  • Knight
  • Enchanter
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2009
  • Location: In the Deepest Depthes of Your Twisted Mind
  • Gender: Male
  • Making Your Darkest of Fantasies a Reality
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 0
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #431 on: April 17, 2014, 07:52:28 AM »
Yes and yes, but that will happen in episode 9 of this season.

Before that he did try to ship her away, in my opinion.

I vaguely recall this in the books. 

Clash Of Kings
During this book it was mostly Tryion being madly in love with Shae. I think they were both back at the castle then, and he often frequent whore houses to throw the Queen off of his affair with Shae. Also Shae was made a maid of some noble lady.. Forgot her name, but this was to protect her from Ceresi(Queen name, can't recall all character names.)
Storm of Swords Read at your risk of being spoiled.
Within the book she became Sansa's maid(who Tryion was force to marry for political reasons.) The marriage with Sansa didn't seem to bother Shae, which made him uncomfortable. To keep Ceresi(is that the Queen's name) from discovering Shae's identity or having her expect any thing regarding Shae, he proposes a marriage deal for her(I believe it was.) Unfortunately before he could finalize the deal he was apprehended for the murder of Joffery. Shae testify against Tryion for another marriage deal with a knight that Ceresi had promised her.

Edit: At the rate they are going they will be on Dance of Dragons pretty soon and the writer still hasn't published the next book.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2014, 08:02:53 AM by Drake Valentine »

Offline Remiel

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #432 on: April 17, 2014, 09:06:24 AM »
And not just Shae, of course. ;) Big things always happen in ep. 9.

I'm so looking forward to ep. 8 myself. The Mountain and the Viper duking it out is all the money.

Except I think that the actor who originally played the Mountain in Season 1 was replaced.  :-\  I think they are trying to play down his role.

I could be wrong, though.

Offline Iniquitous

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #433 on: April 17, 2014, 09:37:05 AM »
No, he didn't. Her "leaving" King's Landing is a bit more... breath taking... in the book. And jouzi, watch the episode again, there is a clue as to who is responsible :)

Offline Drake Valentine

  • Architect of Worlds
  • Knight
  • Enchanter
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2009
  • Location: In the Deepest Depthes of Your Twisted Mind
  • Gender: Male
  • Making Your Darkest of Fantasies a Reality
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 0
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #434 on: April 17, 2014, 10:04:27 AM »
I pay no attention to the series much. In the series they killed the Mountain off or so they claimed in the first season after showing his head to the king. (Pretty sure that happened.) So how exactly is he going to fight when he was proclaimed dead?

Which never happened in the books. The shows seemed to be juggling characters or holding out on characters. I know they can't cast everyone, but still.

Offline consortium11

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #435 on: April 17, 2014, 10:36:18 AM »
Except I think that the actor who originally played the Mountain in Season 1 was replaced.  :-\  I think they are trying to play down his role.

I could be wrong, though.

Recast twice actually.

The first actor to play Gregor Clegane was Conan Stevens. He then morphed into Ian Whyte for the second series. And it's now been announced that Hafr Bjrnsson will play him going forward.

There's actually been quite a few quietly recast characters in GoT; Beric Dondarrion was changed as well.

Offline consortium11

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #436 on: April 17, 2014, 10:53:15 AM »
I pay no attention to the series much. In the series they killed the Mountain off or so they claimed in the first season after showing his head to the king. (Pretty sure that happened.) So how exactly is he going to fight when he was proclaimed dead?

I can't recall this at all actually... Gregor appeared regularly (albeit often in the background) during season 2 and has been mentioned as being alive (notably during reports on the Battle of Stone Mill) in Season 3.

During Season 1 a group was sent to hunt Gregor (as in the books) but were in turn reported to have been defeated and Lord Beric killed (as in the books).

Offline Aiden

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #437 on: April 17, 2014, 11:10:10 AM »
Regarding the Cleganes - Book 4-5 spoilers and theories.


Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
I don't think either of them are dead. That crazy mad scientist guy (working for Cersei, or was at first) has some zombie frankenstein that matches the size of the Mountain himself.

The hound is presumed dead, someone found his helmet and Arya left him dying of a fever. But I think he was rescued by that small monk (temple?) on that island. And he is just reformed, soul at ease. At least that is what I understood, since the hound's war horse is stabled there and the "new" monk is the only man capable of subduing it, something only the Houng could do.

Offline RhapsodyTopic starter

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #438 on: April 17, 2014, 04:35:07 PM »
I pay no attention to the series much. In the series they killed the Mountain off or so they claimed in the first season after showing his head to the king. (Pretty sure that happened.) So how exactly is he going to fight when he was proclaimed dead?

Which never happened in the books. The shows seemed to be juggling characters or holding out on characters. I know they can't cast everyone, but still.

Ned commanded Lord Beric Dondarrion to go out and bring Ser Gregor to justice after evidence came to light that he was burning and pillaging and looting peasants' fields. Beric is killed by the Mountain. The next time you see him is coming up in the next episode or two.

Offline Drake Valentine

  • Architect of Worlds
  • Knight
  • Enchanter
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2009
  • Location: In the Deepest Depthes of Your Twisted Mind
  • Gender: Male
  • Making Your Darkest of Fantasies a Reality
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 0
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #439 on: April 17, 2014, 07:31:45 PM »
Ned commanded Lord Beric Dondarrion to go out and bring Ser Gregor to justice after evidence came to light that he was burning and pillaging and looting peasants' fields. Beric is killed by the Mountain. The next time you see him is coming up in the next episode or two.

Was it? Bad memory, but then again perhaps the recast also threw me off since someone noted the dude changed to another actor. >.> So I was looking for the first actor and didn't see him.

Regarding the Cleganes - Book 4-5 spoilers and theories.


Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
I don't think either of them are dead. That crazy mad scientist guy (working for Cersei, or was at first) has some zombie frankenstein that matches the size of the Mountain himself.

The hound is presumed dead, someone found his helmet and Arya left him dying of a fever. But I think he was rescued by that small monk (temple?) on that island. And he is just reformed, soul at ease. At least that is what I understood, since the hound's war horse is stabled there and the "new" monk is the only man capable of subduing it, something only the Houng could do.

On That Reference
There is also a part where the woman visiting, forgot the knight female's name, she noted that the 'priest' was a large and muscular man.  I can't recall if any noted wounds were also present during that interaction. The priest states that he buried the Hound, that the man pretending to be the Hound wasn't him. The large black horse as you recall was there, but yea the Hound could only control him.

Offline RhapsodyTopic starter

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #440 on: April 18, 2014, 03:22:08 PM »
On That Reference
There is also a part where the woman visiting, forgot the knight female's name, she noted that the 'priest' was a large and muscular man.  I can't recall if any noted wounds were also present during that interaction. The priest states that he buried the Hound, that the man pretending to be the Hound wasn't him. The large black horse as you recall was there, but yea the Hound could only control him.

Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
Brienne of Tarth.

Sandor hated himself, deeply. He was self-destructive and had a hell of a death wish. For the priest to "bury the Hound", I always assumed was Sandor speaking metaphorically, burying his past and reinventing himself where he could be if not happy then at peace.

Offline Iniquitous

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #441 on: April 21, 2014, 02:07:25 PM »
Not sure I liked the scene between Jaime and Cersei last night. I can't figure out why they changed it to rape when in the books she mildly protested in the beginning then wanted it and was encouraging him. Kind of left a sour taste.  :-(

Offline jouzinka

  • Elf Guardian of the Blind Unbowed,Unbent,Unbroken. Law, Hr nn, dollen i Rw
  • Lady
  • Addict
  • *
  • Join Date: Nov 2008
  • Location: Surely wielding my mad makeup skillz somewhere
  • Gender: Female
  • The E mantra: Sip, swallow, scroll, sip, swallow..
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 1
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #442 on: April 21, 2014, 02:11:30 PM »
Not sure I liked the scene between Jaime and Cersei last night. I can't figure out why they changed it to rape when in the books she mildly protested in the beginning then wanted it and was encouraging him. Kind of left a sour taste.  :-(
I was pretty sure Oberyn talked about Elia, but now not so much.

Whom did you think he was talking about?


Never mind me. >.<; I thought the talk was about episode 2.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 04:13:33 PM by jouzinka »

Offline consortium11

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #443 on: April 21, 2014, 04:11:27 PM »
Not sure I liked the scene between Jaime and Cersei last night. I can't figure out why they changed it to rape when in the books she mildly protested in the beginning then wanted it and was encouraging him. Kind of left a sour taste.  :-(

I'm not a huge fan of it but I suspect there were meta-plot reasons for it.

One reoccurring theme in last night's episode was reemphasising shades of grey; lots of characters who tended to come across well to the viewer had "bad" moments. Littlefinger's betrayal of Ned Stark had sort of been subsumed by his political games and magnificent bastardness... so he ramps up the sinister Irish accent (I can't recall it being that pronounced previously) and has Hollard shot. People were falling for the redhead wilding and OTP'ing her and Jon... so Ygritte shoots a defenseless farmer in the head and takes part in the sacking (and slaughter) of a village. Everyone hates Cersei... so she has an episode where she actively does nothing wrong, her major positive trait is emphasised and instead is abused. The odd-couple of the Hound and Arya are producing some good comedy moments... so the Hound beats a(nother) defenceless farmer and steals what little he has.

I think the rape falls into that. Jaime started the series as the arrogant man who slept with his sister (pretty much making him the direct clause of the majority of the conflict during the show) and tried to murder a child when caught. Since then he's had much of his character rehabilitated and become someone fans can sort of root for following his capture, imprisonment, journey back to King's Landing and cold reception when he gets there. So now the point that despite all that he's also still a pretty nasty piece of work gets reemphasised with the rape.

As I say I'm not a huge fan of it... I tend to dislike the frequent use of rape in media at the best of times... and I rather fear it will either lead to radical plot changes or some scenes not really making sense. But it did theme into the overall theme of the episode.

Offline Stella

  • The Girl Who Waited, Marquess of Pembroke
  • Dame
  • Carnite
  • *
  • Join Date: Jan 2011
  • Location: Australia
  • Gender: Female
  • ever fancied someone you know you shouldn't?
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 0
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #444 on: April 21, 2014, 06:22:46 PM »
Yeah, it didn't make a lot of sense to me.  They have enough drama and angst coming up, it just seemed rather unnecessary imo.

Offline Ascia

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #445 on: April 21, 2014, 08:00:33 PM »
I'm not a huge fan of it but I suspect there were meta-plot reasons for it.

One reoccurring theme in last night's episode was reemphasising shades of grey; lots of characters who tended to come across well to the viewer had "bad" moments. Littlefinger's betrayal of Ned Stark had sort of been subsumed by his political games and magnificent bastardness... so he ramps up the sinister Irish accent (I can't recall it being that pronounced previously) and has Hollard shot. People were falling for the redhead wilding and OTP'ing her and Jon... so Ygritte shoots a defenseless farmer in the head and takes part in the sacking (and slaughter) of a village. Everyone hates Cersei... so she has an episode where she actively does nothing wrong, her major positive trait is emphasised and instead is abused. The odd-couple of the Hound and Arya are producing some good comedy moments... so the Hound beats a(nother) defenceless farmer and steals what little he has.

I think the rape falls into that. Jaime started the series as the arrogant man who slept with his sister (pretty much making him the direct clause of the majority of the conflict during the show) and tried to murder a child when caught. Since then he's had much of his character rehabilitated and become someone fans can sort of root for following his capture, imprisonment, journey back to King's Landing and cold reception when he gets there. So now the point that despite all that he's also still a pretty nasty piece of work gets reemphasised with the rape.

As I say I'm not a huge fan of it... I tend to dislike the frequent use of rape in media at the best of times... and I rather fear it will either lead to radical plot changes or some scenes not really making sense. But it did theme into the overall theme of the episode.

"Cersei fucked Lancel?"

Their relationship, Cersei and Jamie, never did make a lot of sense. And once the lust/passion leaves it, it's a giant unraveling that ultimately leaves Cersei alone in King's Landing. That didn't change, despite the narrative changes of the series over the book series. At least, it doesn't seem to have. I guess we'll find out when/if Jamie takes Riverrun.

Jamie's about my favorite character, and the only thing that bothered me is a N/C doesn't really fit Jamie's character. He's killed men for rape before, even when, "everybody done it." For a man with no honor, he has a surprising amount of honor once he loses that hand.

According to the Director of the episode, Alex Graves, the sex turned consensual by the end of the scene. I'm not sure, though, that's clear to the audience.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 08:07:20 PM by Ascia »

Offline Stella

  • The Girl Who Waited, Marquess of Pembroke
  • Dame
  • Carnite
  • *
  • Join Date: Jan 2011
  • Location: Australia
  • Gender: Female
  • ever fancied someone you know you shouldn't?
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 0
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #446 on: April 21, 2014, 09:29:53 PM »
According to the Director of the episode, Alex Graves, the sex turned consensual by the end of the scene. I'm not sure, though, that's clear to the audience.

I heard about that online ... only after reading an onslaught of angry blog posts questioning what Alex Graves considers consensual sex to be.

Offline Drake Valentine

  • Architect of Worlds
  • Knight
  • Enchanter
  • *
  • Join Date: Jun 2009
  • Location: In the Deepest Depthes of Your Twisted Mind
  • Gender: Male
  • Making Your Darkest of Fantasies a Reality
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 0
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #447 on: April 23, 2014, 02:13:25 AM »
Is Arya in Dance with Dragons? I have yet seen her chapter. Unless it is laaaate in the book.

Offline Aiden

Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #448 on: April 23, 2014, 02:40:18 AM »
Yes she is, but I think its only 2-3 chapters.

Offline jouzinka

  • Elf Guardian of the Blind Unbowed,Unbent,Unbroken. Law, Hr nn, dollen i Rw
  • Lady
  • Addict
  • *
  • Join Date: Nov 2008
  • Location: Surely wielding my mad makeup skillz somewhere
  • Gender: Female
  • The E mantra: Sip, swallow, scroll, sip, swallow..
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 1
Re: Winter is Coming...
« Reply #449 on: April 23, 2014, 03:57:42 AM »
Is Arya in Dance with Dragons? I have yet seen her chapter. Unless it is laaaate in the book.
She is the only character to have at least a chapter in every book.

Although she probably only has one or two in book one as that takes place in Westeros and by that time she is elsewhere.