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Author Topic: I don't want to answer where I came from.  (Read 1083 times)

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Offline SaoTopic starter

I don't want to answer where I came from.
« on: April 25, 2013, 02:24:08 AM »
I don't know whether I should put this topic up in an international forum but it doesn't seem to be helpful sharing with with people in my country and I just need to let it out.

This matter has been discussed, warned, brought up... many times before on TV, newspaper..., but it just seems to be worse and worse. It leads me and some other people hesitate to answer the simple question "Where are you from?" I don't know about others but personally I don't want to give the potential friend/business partner...a bad impression at the very beginning but I also don't want to lie.

To make things short, here's the situation:

Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide

That is from Omar Borkan Al Gala's fan page, one of the three Emirati men deported from Saudi Arabia for being deemed too handsome. Ever since the Vietnamese facebook users find his page, they continuously spam it with Vietnamese comments. FB only is popular in my country around 2010 and due to the way those people write, I hope they are mostly younger than 18, but I'm not sure. They assaulted his profile and also assaulted other people any time they want. Like that Korean girl. Some other Vietnamese apologize her after that, but there're still some like Ngo Quang asking people not to like her comment, and Thế Nguyễn saying something like: "sorry you feel bad but that's only 2 people and you assume all of us are barbarians? Who do you think you are? And you know what, they're from my country so even if they're idiots, I'm still by their side not yours. What the fuck would you do to me now?" And again, in Vietnamese. And they even use our flag as avatar (a national anniversary is coming and it's a Patriotic movements among FB users). It's like saying "Hey, I'm Vietnamese and I'm rude."

I know that's how it is on internet, people hiding behind the screens and be rude to each other through keyboard, then think they're heroes. But I haven't seen that amount of people from any other country making a mess like that. Just only the fact that they messed up the guy's page is bad enough, let alone insulting other people. I wish I could say it's rare and our people are actually nice. But as a Vietnamese myself I've been bullied in high school. It wasn't really terrible though, and those bullier were young and stupid. Yet, that was just within a small classroom, this is international and not even the first time.

You could google "Happy Polla" to see the same thing happened to her FB.

And I heard that some game services had banned Vietnamese IP for players swearing in Vietnamese and indecent English on chatbox, hacking, and other things that I don't understand because I'm not a gamer.

Those were just the cases I know. I haven't traveled out of my country alone (I mean without a tourguy) so I haven't met anyone in person who couldn't guess that I'm Vietnamese. But I have experienced online that when they knew I'm Vietnamese, they ran away. I couldn't blame them, here on E I also ran away from other people if their previous posts show me they isn't nice, their writing style doesn't fit mine...Maybe they have bad experienced or just here about us, I don't know but I'm sure they have bad impression about how we are.

Could you be honest and tell me what would you think if someone you first meet says they're Vietnamese?
« Last Edit: April 25, 2013, 07:59:39 AM by Sao »

Offline Shjade

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2013, 03:32:22 AM »
Could you be hornet and tell me what would you think if someone you first meet says they're Vietnamese?

"It would appear this person I have just met is from Vietnam."

I'm paraphrasing, of course.

Considering how rampant gross amounts of racism are on the internet, I've more or less gotten used to the idea that the worst parts of any region are going to be touted as the "norm" for people from that region and, as such, have to ignore as much of that stereotyping as possible.

For instance, being from Brazil is tantamount to deserving of a visit to the firing squad if the League of Legends forums are to be believed as, according to various rants I've read there (with mass approval by other posters, sadly), Brazilians are apparently incapable of critical thinking or learning, anything resembling skilled gameplay, are all belligerent assholes and deliberately feed when criticized for playing poorly and all mob the NA LoL servers because it's free and they're all too poor to play games they'd have to actually buy, spam gold selling messages on other games, and on and on and on.

Now sure, some players might be guilty of these things, and some of those players might be Brazilian...but I've seen players from all around the world do that kind of shit. If I see someone asking about BR on League my first thought isn't, "Oh no,, I'm stuck with a Brazilian on my team," because all that bullshit about them is just that: bullshit. Have to screen it out and take people as individuals.

I'd feel the same way about meeting someone Vietnamese even after seeing this (heretofore unknown to me) context about what is apparently "not uncommon Vietnamese Facebook behavior," let's say. I guess that kind of thing happens, oh well, whatever, doesn't mean I should expect it of this person I just met.

Though I'll admit, as far as "first thoughts" upon getting this introduction, I imagine one of the early ones I'd have would be, "Why did they feel a need to tell me they're Vietnamese?"


----


Seriously though, I have to admit, when I first read the OP my first thought was as follows:

Quote from: Shjade's brain
That is from Omar Borkan Al Gala's fan page, one of the three Emirati men deported from Saudi Arabia for being deemed too handsome.
...wait, what? They were deported for what? Are you shitting me? xD

Offline consortium11

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2013, 05:07:36 AM »
...wait, what? They were deported for what? Are you shitting me? xD

Apparently true

Offline Oniya

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Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2013, 06:14:17 AM »
If we judged everyone by how their fellow nationals acted on FaceBook, everyone would be convinced that there are no nice people anywhere in the world. 

Offline Formless

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2013, 06:30:10 AM »
Apparently true

Ok , I think I need to speak sense to those who want to see the truth rather than relay on ' facebook '.

As a Saudi myself. I have to say that this lie is as pathetic as the one who issued it , thanks to Facebook.

If anyone who can read Arabic. Please do a search in any ' Official ' media source for this incident. You'll find nothing , not from any Saudi source , or Emarati. Only on Facebook.

For his good looks? The moment people are ready to believe something as ridiculous as that ...

Forgive me fellow Elliquians but I find this highly unacceptable.

Offline consortium11

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2013, 07:32:29 AM »
Ok , I think I need to speak sense to those who want to see the truth rather than relay on ' facebook '.

As a Saudi myself. I have to say that this lie is as pathetic as the one who issued it , thanks to Facebook.

If anyone who can read Arabic. Please do a search in any ' Official ' media source for this incident. You'll find nothing , not from any Saudi source , or Emarati. Only on Facebook.

For his good looks? The moment people are ready to believe something as ridiculous as that ...

Forgive me fellow Elliquians but I find this highly unacceptable.

I believe this is the original story, from Elaph which is, as I understand, a somewhat respected (albeit liberal leaning) news source.

It's subsequently been picked up by reputable western news sources as well... the Telegraph for example.



On topic.

I'd think the same of someone who says they're from Vietnam as I would if they say they were from any other country with the only real difference being that I spent some time travelling through Vietnam. The area I used to live in had a strong Vietnamese immigrant population/influence and I loved it there. I literally wasn't even aware of this idea that the Vietnamese are supposedly rude or "trolls". I'm English... and therefore either a Mr Darcy or a beer-swilling football hooligan... and I'd take the view that Vietnamese are rude about as seriously as I take those stereotypes.

Offline SaoTopic starter

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2013, 07:59:13 AM »
It's not just FB, the FB things are just the one I saw and can check by myself. Like I said there were news about bad behaviors in real life and how we shouldn't make ourselves look ugly outside our country. I heard other things from nice Vietnamese leaving in other countries said how those bad people's behavior affected the way native people treat them. But I haven't experienced it so I can't say...

It's somewhat like Chinese stuffs aren't all bad, but when I see "made by China" I assume "bad quality". It's not true, I know but I can't help. So I just want to know how other people really think about us. And I also think I have to fix this  :-[

Quote
Could you be hornet and tell me what would you think if someone you first meet says they're Vietnamese?

Offline Trieste

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Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2013, 08:00:16 AM »
Could you be hornet and tell me what would you think if someone you first meet says they're Vietnamese?

"Oh, crap, I hope my habit of mispronouncing it 'vietmanese' doesn't offend her. I'll have to watch out for it and apologize profusely if I misspeak."

>.>


Offline Caeli

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2013, 08:11:22 AM »
Could you be honest and tell me what would you think if someone you first meet says they're Vietnamese?

When I'm meeting people face to face, most don't volunteer their ethnicity unless asked, or it can be inferred from their name, from comments in the conversation, etc. I don't think it's relevant to each individual's behavior, and I (hope I) don't judge people by their race or ethnicity, or against a comparison of other individuals who share the same race/ethnicity.

I suppose my honest answer would be, "Am I supposed to care that you're Vietnamese for some reason?" I usually won't say that out loud, but if someone makes a point of it, it makes me wonder why.

Offline Moraline

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2013, 08:19:59 AM »
...  Could you be honest and tell me what would you think if someone you first meet says they're Vietnamese?

I usually think, "Cool, I've met someone from a far away Asian country. I can't wait to ask them about the culture of their homeland."

I'm from Canada and I like meeting new people from different countries.

Offline Oniya

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Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2013, 08:23:34 AM »
If it makes you feel any better, when I have traveled abroad, I have been thrilled to be mistaken for a Canadian.  The trope of the American tourist, in his self-clashing shirt, who talks loudly and slowly because 'them furriners should all speak English!' makes me cringe.

Offline SaoTopic starter

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2013, 08:31:44 AM »
Perhaps I should have given a situation? Something along the line "Hi, I'm from Vietnam, where are you from?" But I was taking about something more passive, like "I'm from ABC, where're you from" - "Oh, I'm from Vietnam."

Anyway, it's nice to know all of your answers.

"Oh, crap, I hope my habit of mispronouncing it 'vietmanese' doesn't offend her. I'll have to watch out for it and apologize profusely if I misspeak."

>.>


I don't know about others but I wouldn't be offended by that  :P. (Though I wonder how to speak that. I understand if it's misspell but mispronounce...). The only time I fell offended was when some one call my country "Nam" and when I said it meant "South" and it was just a part of my country's name, they still repeated it...


If it makes you feel any better, when I have traveled abroad, I have been thrilled to be mistaken for a Canadian.  The trope of the American tourist, in his self-clashing shirt, who talks loudly and slowly because 'them furriners should all speak English!' makes me cringe.

How could that possible  :o As far as I know you're a native English speaker?

Offline Trieste

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Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2013, 08:35:36 AM »
I don't know about others but I wouldn't be offended by that  :P. (Though I wonder how to speak that. I understand if it's misspell but mispronounce...). The only time I fell offended was when some one call my country "Nam" and when I said it meant "South" and it was just a part of my country's name, they still repeated it...

I don't do it on purpose but I confuse the M and the N all the time so that it comes out sounding like 'vietmanese' instead of 'Vietnamese'. My aunt does the same thing, so I don't know if it started out as a goofy game when I was little or what.

Offline Oniya

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Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2013, 08:38:29 AM »
I am a native English speaker :-) .  A large number of Canadians are bilingual English/French.  They also have a reputation of being much more polite than Americans.  (And fairly well-deserved, when I consider all the Canadians I've met personally.)

Offline Caeli

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2013, 08:42:05 AM »
I actually find it frustrating (having been born and raised in the United States) when people in the United States assume that I'm from a far away Asian country and ask me about the culture of my homeland. And then they don't believe me when I tell them I'm from [city X in] California.

It's not that I wouldn't be proud to be from some country that isn't the United States - I'm proud of my culture, intensely so, and still practice and believe in many of the traditions my parents raised me up with - but it's flabbergasting that the first assumption is that I'm a foreigner.

Online, of course, it doesn't come up as often, since it's not something that I stamp into the byline of every post. I assume also that since my appearance doesn't come into play, the question of ethnicity/race also doesn't come up unless it's a direct or explicit question about it.

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Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2013, 08:42:43 AM »
I've met people from Vietnam - and Russia, China, South Korea, the Arab Emirates, the Sudan, India and Somalia.  They are people and as long as they are not rude I'm fine.  I don't care where you come from.  Never have.  Never will.


Offline consortium11

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #16 on: April 25, 2013, 08:50:20 AM »
If it makes you feel any better, when I have traveled abroad, I have been thrilled to be mistaken for a Canadian.  The trope of the American tourist, in his self-clashing shirt, who talks loudly and slowly because 'them furriners should all speak English!' makes me cringe.

I've been mistaken for a South African, Aussie and Kiwi in my time.

As someone who likes to think of himself of at least somewhat of a English gent I wasn't quite as thrilled...

Offline DeMalachine

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2013, 11:48:01 AM »
I went to school with one of the Vietnamese boat children - he was a good pal and a thoroughly decent sort.

Sao, if it's any consolation, I think plenty of people have the sense to realise that it's the actions of some fools on the internet who happen to be Vietnamese, rather than a reflection on the Vietnamese in general - as I think we've all cringed at what some of our own countryfolk get up to on social media. The other day, the subject of Abu Qatada cropped up on some Facebook page somewhere (for those not in know - Abu Qatada is resident in the UK and wanted in Jordan owing to alleged terrorist connections; the UK has been trying to deport him for ages, but owing to various legal technicalities hasn't been able to) which brought forth loads of messages from my fellow English all frothing at the mouth about this 'dirty Paki' who ought be shot and tortured. It was pretty ugly to say the least, but there's no bar to idiots using social media, no matter what their nationality.

Offline Cyrano Johnson

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Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #18 on: April 26, 2013, 12:18:26 PM »
The "Saudis deported people for being too handsome" meme really does feel like watching the making of an urban myth play out. That it's only been picked up as news in the West by outlets like the Telegraph and the NY Post -- or reported second-hand by a few others as a "here's the buzz on the social gadfly blogs" fluff piece -- isn't a good sign. I can see why Ark Noah is suspicious... and a bit unimpressed at the credulousness. But you have to hand it to him, Omar Borkan al Gala is actually handsome enough to make it seem almost credible.

Offline consortium11

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #19 on: April 26, 2013, 12:38:07 PM »
The "Saudis deported people for being too handsome" meme really does feel like watching the making of an urban myth play out. That it's only been picked up as news in the West by outlets like the Telegraph and the NY Post -- or reported second-hand by a few others as a "here's the buzz on the social gadfly blogs" fluff piece -- isn't a good sign. I can see why Ark Noah is suspicious... and a bit unimpressed at the credulousness. But you have to hand it to him, Omar Borkan al Gala is actually handsome enough to make it seem almost credible.

As I linked to previously, it appears to come from a legitimate source.

Offline Cyrano Johnson

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Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #20 on: April 26, 2013, 12:57:13 PM »
As I linked to previously, it appears to come from a legitimate source.

Yes I saw that, but since AFAIK Elaph is also known to post satire and humorous opinion pieces from time to time, I don't know if this is one of those* that some non-Arab news outlets have mistakenly treated as serious reportage (the "Onion effect"). I'm guessing from the pattern of its spread and the places where it is and isn't appearing that this is what's happened.

(* There was a real incident involving a Commission "volunteer" at the UAE pavilion at an Arabic culture festival in mid-April, but it wasn't nearly as funny as a story involving the mutaween "deporting people for being too handsome," which is what suggests to me that the Elaph piece is satirizing the Commission in response to the real event.)

Offline Chris Brady

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #21 on: April 26, 2013, 01:33:54 PM »
I honestly have no idea how to tell Asian cultures apart, other than hearing them speak their home tongue.  Then again, I can't tell Black cultures apart (Like Somali, Nigerian and the like), or even White America (North, South, Central) or European.  I just treat you as you are:

A human being.  Probably flawed, but human.  Just like me.

Offline SaoTopic starter

Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #22 on: April 27, 2013, 01:10:53 AM »
Thanks guys, I do feel better reading your responses. Now I think that's just a silly question.

Offline Oniya

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Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #23 on: April 27, 2013, 10:03:20 AM »
Among reasonably intelligent and mature adults, you shouldn't need to worry.  Those with a maturity of, say, twelve years old or lower... but they generally aren't much fun to have as friends or business contacts in the first place.  ;D

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Re: I don't want to answer where I came from.
« Reply #24 on: April 27, 2013, 11:38:47 AM »
What I would say?

"Cool, I've never met someone from Vietam before. Tell me about your country and culture."

Personally, I do not thing that it's a silly question. I think, each culture has to exist with silly prejudices and whatnot. It's just meh.