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Author Topic: How do you know that Satan is the evil one?  (Read 1239 times)

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Offline ReijiTabibito

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Re: How do you know that Satan is the evil one?
« Reply #50 on: July 30, 2014, 11:45:08 AM »
You guys do realize the devil only appears a few times and never as a major player.
He only appears twice in the bible, once in the old testament with Solomon summoning him among the other dark spirits, demons, ect.
Once to tempt Christ with worldly power if he would surrender his morals.

That's it.

Actually, the devil appears one additional time in the Bible - the Book of Job.  Wherein he proceeds to wreck Job's life, burn down his house, kill all his children, afflict him with painful sores, and pretty much bring him to the brink of death.

Also, a lot has been made over the whole Plagues of Egypt, especially the last one, the deaths of the firstborn children.  But let me throw this in here - by the old covenant (IE, the one established with Moses), the only thing that could be atonement for sins was blood - animal blood was meant to be a substitute for the actual human blood (since sin meant death and separation from God).  And when God sent Jesus to be on the cross, who was Jesus?  God's firstborn son.

While the deaths of the firstborn were meant as a punishment upon Egypt for oppression and slavery, it was also meant as a sign for the Jews to remember when the real deal came around.

Someone I can speak with, or indeed argue with if it comes to that. Someone who isn't going to tell me "Do this, don't do that, end of story", but "You do what you think you have to, but make damn sure you're prepared to deal with the consequences."

There's never anything that says we can't speak, or even argue with God - I already gave Job as an example earlier (one guy and his three buddies arguing with God in one of the longer books of the Bible), but the book of Habakkuk (shorter one) is also about the titular prophet complaining to God.

Also, if one's stance truly is that 'I don't respect people who tell me "do this, don't do that, etc",' then that's a problem with law and authority right there.  After all, what is law but being told "do this" or "don't do this"?  The 1992 Supreme Court case Casey v. Planned Parenthood set forth a statement of autonomy.  Anthony Kennedy, who wrote the majority decision, said: "at the heart of liberty is the right to define one's own concept of existence, of meaning, of the universe, and of the mystery of human life."

Taken seriously, this doctrine would make a great deal of law unconstitutional because nearly all law can be said to curb the autonomy of those who are expected to obey them.  Under this idea, government can be, at best, a "procedural republic" - where government acts as a traffic cop to keep people pursuing their own goals from colliding with each other.

Offline Formless

Re: How do you know that Satan is the evil one?
« Reply #51 on: July 30, 2014, 12:17:27 PM »
Also, I believe the correct term in Islam is 'Iblis' (bringer of despair)?  With a pre-fall name of 'Azazael'?  (Might have too many z's there...)

That is correct. And ' Shaitan ' ( Arabic pronunciation ) means ' Devil '. Which many people confuse it with ' Satan'.

Offline Beorning

Re: How do you know that Satan is the evil one?
« Reply #52 on: July 30, 2014, 12:37:34 PM »
To throw in yet another perspective: have you heard of the Yazidi faith and the angel they worship, Tawuse Melek?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melek_Taus

This aspect of their faith seems to be close to Islamic story of Satan... with the difference that the Yazidi believe that the angel's refusal to bow to Adam was *good*.

Also, I'd like to say that I agree with what Ironwolf85 is saying :)
« Last Edit: July 30, 2014, 12:39:11 PM by Beorning »

Offline ReijiTabibito

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Re: How do you know that Satan is the evil one?
« Reply #53 on: July 30, 2014, 12:41:11 PM »
That is correct. And ' Shaitan ' ( Arabic pronunciation ) means ' Devil '. Which many people confuse it with ' Satan'.

Which is probably where Christianity picked it up - via the Crusades (Hey, arrows and swords weren't the only things being traded, there!).

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Re: How do you know that Satan is the evil one?
« Reply #54 on: July 30, 2014, 12:44:31 PM »
I know I've seen the name Malek Taus before.  I don't recall the exact context, though.  Very interesting find, Beorning.

Offline Mikem

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Re: How do you know that Satan is the evil one?
« Reply #55 on: July 31, 2014, 08:45:42 PM »
It actually is very logical to think that "Satan" isn't actually Evil, but is actually just (as mentioned before) an Adversary, or opponent to "God's Will". Because he didn't obey God he was castrated from Heaven and made the complete opposite of what God is meant to stand for. Honestly it just seems that the guy was horribly wronged for wanting more than an existence of servitude.

I may be going out on a very, very long limb here, and the following statement will probably offend several, but from all the things that I've heard about God's actions in the Bible, minus all the fluff and nobility and greatness that's placed in there to make him seem amazing, God actually sounds like a very, very "nice" Dictator/Autocrat.