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Author Topic: Fate/Infinity  (Read 9186 times)

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Offline Kunoichi

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #100 on: June 18, 2014, 11:13:27 PM »
I'd say it probably depends on who we wind up getting for our Rider and Caster, actually. ^^; I believe Tamamo no Mae and Jeanne d'Arc were the last choices suggested for those classes?

Offline Garuss VakarianTopic starter

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #101 on: June 18, 2014, 11:24:55 PM »
Yes, and I can confirm Tamamo as Caster. And, I believe Jeane is being Rider.

Offline Kunoichi

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #102 on: June 18, 2014, 11:38:58 PM »
Okay, then in that case, she'll probably be the Master of Rider.  La pucelle, the pure, virtuous maiden of France was made into a Saint after her death, teamed up with the lewd, lascivious lady who they call the Wicked Witch of the West...  It'll be like a buddy cop movie. ;D

Offline Zaer Darkwail

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #103 on: June 18, 2014, 11:44:03 PM »
Okay, then in that case, she'll probably be the Master of Rider.  La pucelle, the pure, virtuous maiden of France was made into a Saint after her death, teamed up with the lewd, lascivious lady who they call the Wicked Witch of the West...  It'll be like a buddy cop movie. ;D

That indeed sounds awesome :). Although it can result also possibly some interesting conflict between master and servant.

Offline Drake Valentine

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Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #104 on: June 19, 2014, 02:07:14 AM »
Update Sadao's personality. On cell. History and other modifications will come when I get on PC.

Edit: Updated Sadao, mostly part of his history, corrected some things, threw in song. Added Magecraft. 

Also, hope he doesn't seem OP. He is a neutral party completely for the war, meaning as long as he isn't aggro he won't attack or intervene and as long as innocents aren't target he won't go policing the Masters. He needs something to hold a candle against potential threat of Heroic Spirits. I rather him not be candidate or possible candidate altogether; because I can't really see him wanting the grail for anything. Kind of like what's his face in Zero, but the grail choose him, but I don't see Sadao wishing/desiring for it.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 09:05:22 AM by Drake Valentine »

Offline Lynnette

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #105 on: June 19, 2014, 10:02:38 AM »
Update Sadao's personality. On cell. History and other modifications will come when I get on PC.

Edit: Updated Sadao, mostly part of his history, corrected some things, threw in song. Added Magecraft. 

Also, hope he doesn't seem OP. He is a neutral party completely for the war, meaning as long as he isn't aggro he won't attack or intervene and as long as innocents aren't target he won't go policing the Masters. He needs something to hold a candle against potential threat of Heroic Spirits. I rather him not be candidate or possible candidate altogether; because I can't really see him wanting the grail for anything. Kind of like what's his face in Zero, but the grail choose him, but I don't see Sadao wishing/desiring for it.

Is there anything about Fate that doesn't seem OP though?

Also, my character is done, just waiting for the green light from our GM before I post it.

Offline Zaer Darkwail

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #106 on: June 19, 2014, 12:18:05 PM »
In Fate universe in general even weakest heroic spirits (like assassins) own mortals and mages alike. The knight classes especially because their innate magic resistance (even at weakest like with my char they reduce impact of spells on half where higher grades are outright immune to them).

There could be exceptions like caster heroic spirit 'buffing' their master to have tougher skin or such and thus able survive direct hit from heroic spirit but otherwise heroic spirits should not be considered something what any mage even willingly goes face against. Only way beat heroic spirit is by another heroic spirit. As if any mortal who is able beat heroic spirit, gets classification to become heroic spirits themselves (like one Archer did by becoming counter guardian). A ancient samurai who mastered skill to point it challenges gods became heroic spirit also.

Offline Garuss VakarianTopic starter

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #107 on: June 19, 2014, 03:47:55 PM »
Yeah, any one with enough strength or skill can become a heroic spirit. For example. Any one remember archer in Fate stay? Ill say no more. ^^

Offline Ryven

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Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #108 on: June 19, 2014, 03:56:43 PM »
Is there still room? >.>

Offline Lynnette

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #109 on: June 19, 2014, 03:58:28 PM »
Is there still room? >.>

yeah, we still have room :) We currently lack... I think it's two servants and X masters.

Offline Zaer Darkwail

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #110 on: June 19, 2014, 04:01:00 PM »
Aye, that's true. But reason for lack of modern heroic spirits is that most of people can achieve same amazing feats what some modern fighters or warriors are able to do.....they just need practice (lots of practice some cases). Lack of that wonder or the 'impossible' factor negates most modern folks ever becoming heroic spirits.

Now, it's not impossible become heroic spirit in modern times but it has become more challenging. You need to have skill potential which goes to beyond of 'possible for anyone' to 'only you could do this' and naturally a 'heroic quality' some kind which makes you a being of legend/myth or be awed upon.

So that's why I commented on any mortal taking on heroic spirit having either high opinion of one self or a death wish. Unless they indeed possess a supernatural heroic quality in them and skill/quality which goes beyond mortal levels.

Is there still room? >.>

Yup, as mentioned by Reaper :).

Offline Lynnette

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #111 on: June 19, 2014, 04:05:12 PM »
We lack Arthuria (Must be female because of raisins) and our caster I believe, though I think we had someone interested in that role... I'll take on the Saber role instead of having Arthuria there IF we don't find anyone else for it, and I'd rather not do that. However, if it ends up with no-one wanting to play the Saber role, then I will and we'll most likely have Arthuria be the Saber of the opposing faction (Has not been talked over, just a possibility).

We still lack four masters however, we really need more. Ideally we would have seven, but I guess we'll find one way or another to bend that IF we don't find enough people.

Offline Ryven

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Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #112 on: June 19, 2014, 04:31:01 PM »
I was looking at taking the caster role, if possible.  I would offer to take a master role, but I'm not sure how to go about making a character for that.  I don't know the limitations and guidelines for what a master is able to do as far as powers.  My knowledge of the series is limited to the Fate/Stay Night anime.

Offline Garuss VakarianTopic starter

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #113 on: June 19, 2014, 04:51:45 PM »
Sorry Caster was taken. She is Tamamo, and her player is our Kitsune, and Neko loving friend MelissaArtemis! ^^ . But as far as Masters are concerned. They basically use magic! Some families have specialties over others. (As an example: Tohsaka's infuse mana into gems. And can prepare spell's inside gems.) Alternatively a master only needs some magical ability to summon a servant. They need at least three of their Magic Circuits opened, and the capability to provide and feed mana to their servant. (Shirou is a special case. Since he only had one open, Magic Circuit.)  So with that in mind, even a nobody can be a master.

Edit: Yes as Reaper said we do need Arturia as Saber. But. As for Arturia being the opposing Saber. ^^ That is an idea to keep in mind if no one plays her.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 04:55:38 PM by Garuss Vakarian »

Offline Zaer Darkwail

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #114 on: June 19, 2014, 05:07:02 PM »
I would be saying OOC 'holy shit!' if Arturia appears as opponent  :o. Or Gilgamesh for that matter.

Anyways in regards providing/feeding mana; there is some clear indication that some 'sexual intercourse' occurs in giving it as mana is after all strictly tied to one's own body and only way to share that energy is through physical intimacy (at least what I had heard of the graphic novel depict it but I may be wrong).

Anyways in regards to master, the most ordinary guy was just a assassin with martial arts (Caster's master in Fate stay night being a retired assassin who worked as teacher in local school). No magic whatsoever, but likely innate magic potential none the less.

Holy Grail Wars picks masters randomly, they can be average joes or super badass mages or magus killers. Or even priests from church (basically 'interesting personality' is only requirement). It would not be far from truth that Holy Grail is a spectator who watches bloodbath and picks interesting people for sake of entertainment value.

Offline Garuss VakarianTopic starter

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #115 on: June 19, 2014, 05:16:43 PM »
Yep pretty much. In fact the Grails main incentive on picking it's members is: If they have a wish worth granting. Now dont confuse that as it being nice. All that means is, if your going to simply wish for fame and fortune then your a bore. But if let's say your wish is mass death and destrucion, or the Resurrection of a love one? Now there we go. If the wish is not interesting enough to cause tension, or a good show. Or for it to just have said wish blow up in your face. Then it wont like to use you. In fact, a thing to keep in mind: Is that the Holy Grail only summons spirits, or allows specific spirits to be summoned. If said spirits have a wish of their own. (As an example: Aturia seeks to change the coarse of her peoples history, and wish for things to have turned out more in her favor.) If the spirit it'self has NOTHING it wants. Then, the Grail wont summon it. (Which is why when Gilgamesh would say he had no interest in the grails wish granting. People would be surprised. When in actuality, one could assume His actual goals were to have wished for Rebirth, and Re Immortality. Much like Iskander's goal, of rebirth.)

But still, it is much easier for a master to actually have Magical Circuits opened. And way more beneficial. Which is why most masters end up having some magical ability, or potential. As for sexual contact: Mana can be distributed in a number of fashions. Sexual means is one but not the only. If it was, how can a master feed mana to a Servant to worn out to even assume corporal form?

Offline Zaer Darkwail

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #116 on: June 19, 2014, 05:32:29 PM »
Servant has their own mana reserves which is presented by their 'Magic trait' ranking. Which can be refilled by Master or Master provide directly mana during the fighting if they are present. Which they can use to materialize or use as means harvest more mana (in various animes on Fate series show spells which drain mana or allows alternative consumption of mana even through live sacrifice). Those with Independent Action example has 'always' stored mana to linger around even without mana supply (meaning they run on either extra fuel or they do not need fuel for during certain amount of time to just move around and do stuff which do not include fighting).

At least this how I understand it. But indeed sex is not only option. But apparently common.

Offline Moon Hound Hati

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #117 on: June 19, 2014, 05:52:59 PM »
Well, on the wikia at least, servants do have their mana listed as, well, mana. Most of the servants I've checked just now have B level, though the berserkers seem to generally have lower scores for mana.

Edit: the score seems to change depending on the master, though, if they have had different ones. Arturia's ranges from B as Shirou's servant to A++ as Sakura's servant.

Edit2: ALL the stats seem to change depending on the master. What a confusing system. lol
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 06:00:11 PM by Moon Hound Hati »

Offline Zaer Darkwail

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #118 on: June 19, 2014, 06:01:25 PM »
Yeah, overall mana score may vary depending on master. So is Magic trait overall person's own magical skill then or personal mana bar which gets increased depending on master?

Offline Garuss VakarianTopic starter

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #119 on: June 19, 2014, 06:06:27 PM »
Yes, contact is more common. But, as an example of what I am talking about: After the fight with caster, Rider in Fate/Zero was drained to the point of uselessness. Due to refusal to take from Wavers mana. Acting only on the mana of his own mighty and heroic spirit. And as a result, was so weak he couldn't even take on Physical form, and was even undetectable by Saber due to his presence being as feint and weak as a light breeze. Waver Velvet, his master. Camps outside in safety, eating quite a bit beyond his fill in order to stock up on energy. While Rider drained mana until he can take form once more. Masters can basically throw their mana out into the air, for their servants to take. Im not sure if it is directly given, or if the Servant just takes whats exerted in the air. But they can get it without any physical or present contact, it just leaves the master quite weakened and vulnerable. Especially in Wavers case in that scene since if a battle at all happened, Rider couldn't protect him. Not even as much as raise a single corporal finger.

Moon Hound: Ya mana stats do vary. They change due to the servants reliance on the master for regenerating Mana. Although they do, as Zaer said start with their own reserves. (In Iskanders case it is I believe incredible! Only using Waver for mana, once. One time. Whole series just used his own reserves.) They can not replenish it. The masters mana output is even more important then how much mana the servants start with. Since if the master can not regenerate mana quickly, the servant is at a disadvantage. So a master who can take in a large amount of mana at one time, regenerate it quickly, and send it to their servant just as quickly gives the servant a A++ .

Did that make sense on explaining the Mana stat?
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 06:10:35 PM by Garuss Vakarian »

Offline Zaer Darkwail

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #120 on: June 19, 2014, 06:41:38 PM »
It makes sense to me. But there is also alternative method of providing mana which is deadly; is by linking your life force directly onto mana and thus provide a servant a constant 'overdrive' but when servant uses mana it drains your life as well. It explains why berserker was...well, super berserk (and also awesome) in Fate/Zero anime.

So servant's mana is kind of their own magic trait + master's magic trait combined. They cannot regenerate their own mana pool, but master can regenerate (unless they go with life link route which means given mana cannot be recovered by master but it gives a plenty of it).

Offline Drake Valentine

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Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #121 on: June 19, 2014, 07:37:45 PM »
On topic of normal person beating a Heroic Spirit.

Scriptures (聖典, Seiten?) are powerful Conceptual Weapons that have only been granted to a few selected Executors. Kirei Kotomine believes weapons of this level could potentially allow a person to defeat a Heroic Spirit. The holy shield Gamaliel is used by Riesbyfe Stridberg and the Seventh Holy Scripture is used by Ciel - http://typemoon.wikia.com/wiki/Scripture#Scriptures

Also in one of the games.

Heaven's Feel Route - Kotomine vs Assassin
Kotomine fights against Assassin in the Heaven's Feel route, but it is not a true battle. While ten Black Keys and one of his Command Spells left over after removing most of the Crest Worms from Sakura would be more than enough for a low ranking spirit, he couldn't kill a Servant even if he managed to make successful strikes with all of them. He does believe that having a weapon on the Scripture scale could potentially allow him to defeat a Heroic Spirit. Though Assassin's dirks are only meant to judge an opponent's skill until he can make use of Zabaniya to land a fatal strike, all twenty-three are still thrown with the intent to kill, so Assassin sees Kotomine's skill in being able to block and avoid them for such a long period as admirable.

Kotomine, having seen Assassin fight Lancer, knows of this strategy and uses it against Assassin. Due to the unique nature of his heart, Zabaniya is unable to kill him, and Assassin is instead bound to a tree by the Black Keys. It is the equivalent of a scratch to him, but the holy nails keep him from saving Zouken. While he cannot directly fight against Servants, he claims that he can harm Servants without Masters with his Baptism Rite, so Assassin backs off afterwards.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 07:52:22 PM by Drake Valentine »

Offline Rave

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #122 on: June 19, 2014, 08:34:21 PM »
Bah, I'd seriously consider this game because of my love for this series, though it seems all the Servant roles are already taken  :-\ Shame.

Edit: I'll put down an interest for a master role here just for now.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 09:24:44 PM by Rave »

Offline MelisaArtemis

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Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #123 on: June 19, 2014, 08:55:32 PM »
By the way, about Grail's summoning rule: In general, there are 3 main aspect to the herroes summoned by the grail, 2 usually are the most commonly known by mages and the last 1 seem to be not quite as known outside of the ones who knows the working of the grail itself.

1. Amount of mana poured during the summoning gives the magus better chance in summoning stronger hero
2. Class of the servant summoned picked at random and some servant may qualify for more than 1 archtype
3. If you're looking to summon specific hero spirit or class, its better to have an anchor item to call them. (Most important rule)

Rule no. 3 is pretty much the one that actually matter during the summoning, that is the reason why Shirou manage to summon Arturia despite not having tribute or mana capability Avalon being a sheath pretty much guarantee that he would get Artuaria AND have her as Saber Class. This is also the reason why Rin summoned Archer Emiya, the gem used to heal shirou at the beginning being the anchor.

On the other side of the spectrum, there is Sakura who summoned Rider by pure magic power and nothing else, considering that Medusa easily qualify as both Rider and Caster comes down to pure luck.

By the way, Caster Medea and Soichirou was a special case: Soichirou didn't summon Medea and neither was he an official master in holy grail war. Medea killed the master that summoned her the moment she got summoned and escape... before running out of mana and found by Soichirou. They didn't make master/servant pact and medea is feeding off life force from the citizen of Fuyutsuki to feed herself with mana.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 09:05:53 PM by MelisaArtemis »

Offline Kunoichi

Re: Fate/Infinity
« Reply #124 on: June 19, 2014, 09:07:57 PM »
It makes sense to me. But there is also alternative method of providing mana which is deadly; is by linking your life force directly onto mana and thus provide a servant a constant 'overdrive' but when servant uses mana it drains your life as well. It explains why berserker was...well, super berserk (and also awesome) in Fate/Zero anime.

Not quite.  Actually, in the Nasuverse, the energy that modern Magi use to cast their spells is called Prana, and is made by taking energy from the surrounding environment (Mana) and mixing it with one's own personal energy stores (Od).  In the case of Jin Kariya and Zero Berserker, it was a matter of a poor-quality Master using a catalyst that summoned a high-end Servant who would have been difficult to support under the best of circumstances, and whose refusal to turn off Mad Enhancement made him outright impossible to maintain.

Previous Masters of Berserker-class Servants have died for similar reasons.