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Author Topic: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions  (Read 8621 times)

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Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #75 on: May 22, 2008, 08:04:01 PM »
Because unless you offer a solution, you have no business criticizing others.

Unless you're willing to pick up the tab on the unborn kid, shut the fuck up.

I wish I could be Pro-Life...in fact, I'm completely for life...however, I live on the planet Earth, where it takes a looooooot of money to keep a kid living decently, and unless your baby ends up being a child actor, the rate of return is shit.

Where are the pro-lifers when that 16 year old girl does "the right thing" and keeps her kid, then basically throws away any chance of having some sort of career?  Great, like we need another waitress in this country.

Or, where are the pro-lifers when there's a 4 year old kid trapped nightly in a doggie kennel while the mom is having her douchebag boyfriend ass-fuck her prior to smoking a few rocks of crack?

Frankly, if I were anywhere near Pro-Life, my stance would be that anyone who has an abortion should also be voluntarily sterilized...."Fool me once, shame on me...but you ain't fooling me twice!"  Just like we spay and neuter our dogs and cats, we should do the same to people who can't be responsible with their dingalings.

All I'm talking about here is responsibility.  Abortion is an issue where NO ONE is right.  The aborters should've been more responsible at the beginning.  The pro-lifers just need to shut the fuck up because they're not willing to take responsibility after the fact.  The only "right" in the entire thing is that the government should have no say whatsoever in whether or not abortion is legal.

*can't keep mouth shut any longer*  Completely off abortion topic!  I got pregnant at 16, had my daughter at 17.  I graduated with honors. . .have a good job at a law office. . .almost have my AA and will be going on to get my BA.  My life was NOT ruined and just because someone has kids young does NOT mean their life is ruined!  And don't go spouting crap at me about how MOST of them end up like that cause I know a nifty few (meaning a heck of a lot) who turned out going to college and having fulfilling lives.  People like you are the problem.  Not pro-life or pro-choice. . .people like you. 



Keep it PG-13 man, this is a public thread.

AND you DO need to keep it pg-13 because I WILL go to a siren. . .

Offline BlackRose

Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #76 on: May 22, 2008, 08:15:56 PM »
*can't keep mouth shut any longer*  Completely off abortion topic!  I got pregnant at 16, had my daughter at 17.  I graduated with honors. . .have a good job at a law office. . .almost have my AA and will be going on to get my BA.  My life was NOT ruined and just because someone has kids young does NOT mean their life is ruined!  And don't go spouting crap at me about how MOST of them end up like that cause I know a nifty few (meaning a heck of a lot) who turned out going to college and having fulfilling lives.  People like you are the problem.  Not pro-life or pro-choice. . .people like you. 

AND you DO need to keep it pg-13 because I WILL go to a siren. . .

*pets ShroudedPoet* Its okay...

No use getting worked up over things. Some people just don't have all the facts... or any of them...

Honestly? This thread was supposed to be about the abortion laws... not about whether or not abortion was right.

The government has every legal right to tell you what you can and cannot do with their property, that is, your body.

Steering the subject back on track...

Late term abortions sound more like murder to me... but thats just me. If it's still born or has a terrible defect, I think it's only humane to terminate it...

I mean really, think about it...

Why is it inhumane to allow a dog to suffer if the vet says it should be put down when it may very well lead a hard, painful life, but it is "against God's will" to terminate a a pregnancy where the child will lead a hard and painful life?

THAT, ladies and gents, makes no sense to me.

Oh, and the first person to retort with, Dogs aren't humans, they shouldn't get the same consideration... Well, please don't.

Offline Ariabella

Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #77 on: May 22, 2008, 08:17:53 PM »
My only response to your analogy is that I've always felt it wrong also that someone with a terminal illness with no hope for cure or a good life also could not, by their choice, be euthanized instead of living a life filled with pain and inability to live.

Offline Greenthorn

Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #78 on: May 22, 2008, 08:19:38 PM »
.......the government says abortions are bad (and some pro-lifers) yet it's okay to go and participate in wars where many children/pregnant women are killed...*ponders*

But oh wait, that's right..."it's not the same thing", "it's not our children/pregnant women"

*walks out and away from the backlash*

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #79 on: May 22, 2008, 08:23:09 PM »
*pets ShroudedPoet* Its okay...

No use getting worked up over things. Some people just don't have all the facts... or any of them...

Honestly? This thread was supposed to be about the abortion laws... not about whether or not abortion was right.

The government has every legal right to tell you what you can and cannot do with their property, that is, your body.

Steering the subject back on track...

Late term abortions sound more like murder to me... but thats just me. If it's still born or has a terrible defect, I think it's only humane to terminate it...

I mean really, think about it...

Why is it inhumane to allow a dog to suffer if the vet says it should be put down when it may very well lead a hard, painful life, but it is "against God's will" to terminate a a pregnancy where the child will lead a hard and painful life?

THAT, ladies and gents, makes no sense to me.

Oh, and the first person to retort with, Dogs aren't humans, they shouldn't get the same consideration... Well, please don't.

*breathes*  I know, it wass just. . .  *shakes head*  wrong, and I wouldn't normally say something that someone believes is WRONG. . .  I know. . .  I really do think that when it says in, the constitution (correct me if I'm wrong cause I think I am. . .it says it somewhere, maybe bill of rights)  That everyone has the right to life. . .I think that's enough.  Now yes I know that if it IS dead there is no reason to carry it to term but if there's a chance it will servive. . .and I've known tons of disavled people who've lived wonderful lives.  Now as for the dogs. . .they're living creatures too. . .putting them out of their pain isn't necessarily a bad thing but they've had a chance to live life. . .unborns only experience inside the womb if they are aborted.  But anyway. . .Thanks for not flaming me for getting upset at. . .I WILL NOT CALL PEOPLE NAMES. . .the poster who posted such filth.

Offline Trieste

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #80 on: May 22, 2008, 08:32:57 PM »
It looks like it's time for a breather.

I will be more than happy to unlock this thread after people have settled down and are ready to discuss things in a calm manner. Or I'm at least going to give it some time. *smiles*

Offline Moondazed

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #81 on: May 23, 2008, 07:22:14 AM »
It appears to me that things calmed down on their own... no intervention necessary ;)

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #82 on: May 23, 2008, 09:37:31 AM »
It appears to me that things calmed down on their own... no intervention necessary ;)

*thumps noodle*  they might not have though. . .then people REALLY would hate me. . .

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #83 on: May 23, 2008, 09:53:37 AM »
In a Bill Clinton-esque voice- "I feel yer pain"

Do you?  Do you really?  (I'm from and curently live in that state and it disgustes me that he crawled from the swamps of Arky. . .lol)

Offline Moondazed

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #84 on: May 23, 2008, 10:14:32 AM »
Now now, does that have anything to do with the ban on late term abortion? ;)  A thread on Clinton would probably be a rousing read on this forum! *giggle*

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #85 on: May 23, 2008, 10:21:22 AM »
I don't know that I'd start it though. . .*sighs* 

Nifty little tidbit, abortion has been around for a very very long time. . .predates christianity. . .was practiced widely in pagan faith as a means of birth control. . .chew on that one for a while. . .lol

Offline Moondazed

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #86 on: May 23, 2008, 10:40:52 AM »
First you'll have to share factual evidence :)

Offline MadPanda

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #87 on: May 23, 2008, 10:45:25 AM »
As MD says, 'sources, please'.  Show us the data.

I suspect you mean infanticide, which is something completely different.

Offline Moondazed

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #88 on: May 23, 2008, 10:47:58 AM »
I have to giggle at the naughty medical images that enter my mind when someone abbreviates me *giggle*

Offline MadPanda

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #89 on: May 23, 2008, 10:49:12 AM »
Ahh.  Walked into that one, didn't I?  :)  Well, milady, you know where I am...

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #90 on: May 23, 2008, 10:49:56 AM »
First you'll have to share factual evidence :)

This is stuff I learned in phiosophy so I'll actually have to search for it online.  Sorry, just trying to get it back on topic.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2008, 10:51:27 AM by ShrowdedPoet »

Offline Vekseid

Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #91 on: May 23, 2008, 10:50:04 AM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_abortion#Prehistory_to_5th_century

I had assumed it was fairly well known. The reason why infanticide was so common was because early abortion techniques were not always effective.

Offline MadPanda

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #92 on: May 23, 2008, 10:51:14 AM »
This is stuff I learned in phiosophy so I'll actually have to search for it online.

Philosophy != History

Just ask that Marx guy and his buddy Haeckel.

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #93 on: May 23, 2008, 10:52:28 AM »
We were talking about history at the time.  We (there was me and my friend as students and a great teacher. . .that's it) got off topic alot.

Offline MadPanda

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #94 on: May 23, 2008, 10:57:49 AM »
Uh huh.  Point is, a philosopher speaking about history is not necessarily also a historian, and there's a lot of bad data flying around out there (some of it from sloppy historians), so your philosophy prof (as cool as they might be) may not know how to separate data from noise.

That's not to say that they're wrong in any given case.  Just that being cautious with this stuff is a good idea, because there's a lot of cherry-picking that goes on.

And thanks for the link, Oh Mighty Mod.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2008, 10:59:50 AM by MadPanda »

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #95 on: May 23, 2008, 11:01:06 AM »
Uh huh.  Point is, a philosopher speaking about history is not necessarily also a historian, and there's a lot of bad data flying around out there (some of it from sloppy historians), so your philosophy prof (as cool as they might be) may not know how to separate data from noise.

That's not to say that they're wrong in any given case.  Just that being cautious with this stuff is a good idea, because there's a lot of cherry-picking that goes on.

Well, he was actually really good at that. Which sometimes sucked for us, the masters of BS.  But he is very historically inclined and not a philosopher, a phyisist actually.  And a mathmatician.  And I think he would have done great teaching Western Civ.  lol but I do understand what your saying.  A bit busy right now but I will get that info for you guys.

Offline Moondazed

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #96 on: May 23, 2008, 11:02:11 AM »
Why does it amuse me that Vek linked to Wikipedia for factual evidence? :P 

Just teasing, before anyone freaks out.

Offline Moondazed

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #97 on: May 23, 2008, 11:05:04 AM »
I don't know that I'd start it though. . .*sighs* 

Nifty little tidbit, abortion has been around for a very very long time. . .predates christianity. . .was practiced widely in pagan faith as a means of birth control. . .chew on that one for a while. . .lol

I have no doubt that as long as women have been getting pregnant there have been those who wished to become unpregnant... what I need proof of is the part that's in bold. 

And I'm not sure what that has to do with how American law applies to abortion... but whatever floats your boat ;)

Offline Sherona

Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #98 on: May 23, 2008, 11:07:04 AM »
Why does it amuse me that Vek linked to Wikipedia for factual evidence? :P 

Just teasing, before anyone freaks out.

Veks and I have debated the factual basis of Wiki and its usefulness. My argument, because its reader-editable it is unreliable, veks Argment - Most of the time admins of wiki jump to delete bizzare posts and that it makes a good jumping off point in research.

After discussion with him, and some of the interesting questions he has posed for me, I have to agree...its not something I would base my opinion solely on, but it does give a good starting point :D

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Virginia strikes down ban on late-term abortions
« Reply #99 on: May 23, 2008, 11:09:52 AM »
It had to do with abortion.  I was trying to get the thread back to some topic having to do with the original post.  I am a pagan myself so I didn't mean this as a bad thing.  Just an interesting thing.  Maybe I should just shut my mouth maybe then people won't jump me.