Trump

[gaggedLouise]

Just wondering, how high is (normally) the turn-out of the white Christian vote, the evangelicals and "right-wing Christians"? I've always assumed that they had a consistently high voter turn-out and a strong will to "stand their ground". In the media, they often come across as a formidable. well-disciplined voter block ready to come out in masses to vote for the GOP, especially in senate and presidential elections - but someone told me today that in his opinion they have a mid-to-low voter turnout because many of them don't want to have anything to do with the political machinery, even by voting...I suspect he was only right about some marginal groups, but what's your view of this?

[Oniya]

Depends on how narrowly you define the term, but the Pew Research Group has numbers up to the 2018 election.

[TheGlyphstone]

Depends on how narrowly you define the term, but the Pew Research Group has numbers up to the 2018 election.

When they do vote, evangelicals are overwhelmingly Republican/Trump supporters, but I think Louise was more asking how likely self-identified evangelicals are to vote in the first place? That's harder to measure, because people who don't vote also don't usually respond to polls or surveys.

[gaggedLouise]

When they do vote, evangelicals are overwhelmingly Republican/Trump supporters, but I think Louise was more asking how likely self-identified evangelicals are to vote in the first place? That's harder to measure, because people who don't vote also don't usually respond to polls or surveys.

Yes, that's what I was after. Everyone knows that white, conservative US Christians overwhelmingly vote for the GOP when they do vote - but it's hard to find statistics about how willing they are to vote.

In breaking news: the NY Times has obtained a large set of Trump's much-wanted tax returns (both for him personally and much of his corporate empire) going back more than twenty years and up into detailed accounts for the first two years of his presidency.   

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/09/27/us/donald-trump-taxes.html

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/09/27/us/donald-trump-taxes.html

[Skynet]

For what it's worth, Mormons are a bit of an exception in that unlike Protestant Evangelicals, they are very aware that they made a deal with the Devil. The ICE concentration camps particularly horrify them, as the Mormon Church has been doing outreach in Latin America due to a belief that indigenous Americans and their descendants can trace their lineage to one of the Ten Tribes of Israel. Recent approval ratings for Trump and the GOP among Mormons are dropping, according so said article. Protestant Evangelicals don't seem to have such a level of self-awareness, with many incorporating him as some divine figure of righteousness like with Q-Anon's Great Awakening.

This is not to say that they're entirely off the hook, though. They still voted GOP overwhelmingly in past elections, and reluctantly backed Trump due to fears that Hillary would be pro-abortion and pro-LGBT, in spite of knowing of the vile things he's said about Latinos. They were just willing to throw everyone else under the bus for these sexist and homophobic causes.

Still, Utah has been one of the most Republican-friendly states in the USA, and Mormons have always been a bit of a cultural outlier among the broader evangelical community who still views them as heretics. Trump losing a fair chunk of them would be a big deal for the GOP, although we'll have to see how things shake out in November.

[Regina Minx]

Surprising, I think, exactly no one, Donald Trump allegedly paid just $750 in income taxes for the year 2016.

According to the Times, 'The records show a significant gap between what Mr. Trump has said to the public and what he has disclosed to federal tax authorities over many years.'

Breaking news: Area con man heavily in debt, reports contradictory things about his wealth, loses obscene amounts of money any time he tries to run a business.

[Missy]

We have chosen the form of the Destructor.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how-amy-coney-barrett-could-change-the-supreme-court/

[Callie Del Noire]

I have to wonder how long the NY Times’ source had the returns. So many years. I’m betting right now the folks at his accounting firm are looking at everyone who was on the floor that those records were on!

The fun part is..listening to the claims that they are fake, like anyone but a maga fanatic is not going to want proof.

[Haibane]

Re: tax declarations, the denials, lies and criminal activity just keep piling up. It's pathetic.

[Beguile's Mistress]

Re: tax declarations, the denials, lies and criminal activity just keep piling up. It's pathetic.

But, no one expected the Spanish Inquisition either.

[gaggedLouise]

I have to wonder how long the NY Times’ source had the returns. So many years. I’m betting right now the folks at his accounting firm are looking at everyone who was on the floor that those records were on!

The fun part is..listening to the claims that they are fake, like anyone but a maga fanatic is not going to want proof.

Yes, and some of his more simple-minded fans are now saying "Well, it must be an accident that this is hitting the news just a month before the election...right?". Perhaps not a complete accident, but it's not like Trump had been urged many times ever since 2016 to actually release these documents, is it? Every other serious presidential candidate in living memory have released their tax returns months before the elections, without complaint, but Trump always thinks he gets to play by special rules made for him only.

[gaggedLouise]

Funny (and deeply telling) comment on Trump from Youtube by a Trumptard:

Taxing the rich is equal to slavery: taking their money and yield away from them

Actually, if that line of thought is pursued to its conclusion, then the liberation of black slaves in the US was an attempt to enslave the white southern upper class after they had lost the war. 
 

[legomaster00156]

Every other serious presidential candidate in living memory have released their tax returns months before the elections, without complaint, but Trump always thinks he gets to play by special rules made for him only.

Strictly speaking, it was never a law that candidates have to, but it was common decorum.

[gaggedLouise]

Strictly speaking, it was never a law that candidates have to, but it was common decorum.

Yes, I know, but Trump obviously doesn't recognize any kind of law, established practice or decorum except what he happens to feel is right for him. As president you're not supposed to blast the country's key foreign allies or treat their heads of state as dummies or trash in public, but Trump does that too all the time to show that "I can do it!" or to please his fans. His recurrent personal slights on Macron and Merkel, his childish boast that "Qieen Elizabeth said she had not had so much fun in many years as when I was there" - while photos of them told an entirely different story - and worst of all his scurrilous assault on the memory of the Bataclan victims during a crowdpleasing speech to his fans: "They meekly lined up to be shot...Phut. phut - You, come here! - phut". 

[Haibane]

Its simply good manners, honourable, decent behaviour and a badge of an honest person if they are running a country to say "sure, you can see my tax returns, I have nothing to hide."

When someone resists showing their tax returns, especially for so long then you KNOW they have something to hide. The suggestion that his many companies have been haemorrhaging money for years is laughable.

[Beguile's Mistress]

He never does something just because everyone else does it and doesn't understand that when you don't follow tradition you look like someone who has something to hide whether you do or not.

[Aiden]

Trump taxes do not surprise me at all.

The guy is a cheat and a liar.

What pisses me off his how LITTLE he paid.

750 dollars!

This is basically someone with  an income under 30k or so.

This alleged big business man worth billions, paid 750 dollars.

That assclown has only payed a fragment of what real Americans pay.

And off course all the Trump cult will hail him as a smart man for being so good at sticking it to big government. When a majority of them rely on the taxes paid by the rest of citizens who can't hide their assets or benefit from depreciating and writing their assets off as a loss.

[Sara Nilsson]

https://www.channel4.com/news/revealed-trump-campaign-strategy-to-deter-millions-of-black-americans-from-voting-in-2016

More info about the 2016 Trump campaign. A database of millions of americans and it pointing out the black voters and to try and stop them from voting.

[Fox Lokison]

Trump taxes do not surprise me at all.

The guy is a cheat and a liar.

What pisses me off his how LITTLE he paid.

750 dollars!

This is basically someone with  an income under 30k or so.

This alleged big business man worth billions, paid 750 dollars.

That assclown has only payed a fragment of what real Americans pay.

And off course all the Trump cult will hail him as a smart man for being so good at sticking it to big government. When a majority of them rely on the taxes paid by the rest of citizens who can't hide their assets or benefit from depreciating and writing their assets off as a loss.

Undocumented immigrants even pay their taxes more honorably than Donald Trump.

The IRS estimates that undocumented immigrants pay over $9 billion in withheld payroll taxes annually. Undocumented immigrants also help make the Social Security system more solvent, as they pay into the system but are ineligible to collect benefits upon retiring. In 2010, $12 billion more was collected from Social Security payroll taxes of undocumented workers than were paid out in benefits.

So the president of the United States finds a way to cheat on his taxes to pay a pittance, while people here who aren't even citizens go out of their way to pay their taxes in the US. A system they are only hoping they will get repaid for, as paying taxes is absolutely no promise they will become citizens, and they don't get any substantial returns from paying taxes.

And somehow they're the bad guys and he's a good dude. Talk about morally abhorrent.

[Aiden]

Trump doesn't care about  black people and immigrants, not breaking news.

I am at the point that any Trump thumping, Maga hat wearer is a racist.

If not, then lets go down the list.

Hates military
Is Pro choice but only if it is a mask or a haircut
Wants to save unborn babies but is ok separating children from their parents.

[Oniya]

So, Mr. Oniya told me at dinner today that the reason that the tax stuff is coming out is because Trump declared a huge loss during one of those years, and got a correspondingly huge refund from the IRS.  Now the audit is finishing up and there's enough hinky business that the IRS wants the money back.

I'm just going to leave this quote from Mark Hamill:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G56VgsLfKY4

[Haibane]

A further BBC report on the tax issue.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-54332956

[Oniya]

So, this statement aired on MSNBC news earlier today:



Text reads:  Biden Campaign Statement Ahead of Tues. Debate

'Vice President Biden intends to deliver his debate answers in words.  If the president thinks his best case is made in urine, he can have at it.  We'd expect nothing less from Donald Trump, who pissed away the chance to protect the lives of 200K Americans when he didn't make a plan to stop COVID-19.'

Kate Bedingfield
Deputy Campaign Manager

[Sara Nilsson]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2020/09/01/irs-chief-makes-more-than-100000-per-year-off-trump-property-documents-show/#6b9745e17488

The commissioner of the IRS—who is responsible for releasing President Trump's tax returns to Congress—owns two rental properties at the Trump International Waikiki that he profits off of while in office, according to new documents obtained by a watchdog group in Washington, raising new questions about his withholding of Trump’s tax returns as the president goes to court to keep them hidden.

I am shocked I say.. shocked... wait.. not so shocked.

[Beguile's Mistress]

So far, in the debate, Trump is 2-1 ahead of Biden in the number of words used because Trump spends most of his time talking over Biden.

Only people who can't listen or won't listen will believe Trump.