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Author Topic: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game  (Read 6284 times)

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Offline Kimera

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2016, 04:55:16 AM »
*Chuckles* Is everyone doing such exotic dragons that I shouldn't feel greedy playing a gold?

Starting to look that way doesn't it ^^

Offline ThisOneGal

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2016, 04:56:20 AM »
There's nothing wrong with vanilla dragons.

http://www.deviantart.com/art/precious-186360426

Offline Muse

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Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2016, 05:04:16 AM »
  That's adorable, Gal! 

  I think you're both right! 

  I'll ponder a Gold.  :) 

  Hm...  Guy or gal? 

Offline Kimera

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2016, 05:16:40 AM »
Wouldn't it actually be easier to balance things on their HD + LA rather then CR

A gold dragon wyrmling has CR 5, but 8HD and 4LA so 12 total

A white wyrmling has CR 2, yet only 3HD and 2LA, so only a 5th level char

A white young has CR 4, has 9 HD and 3 LA, also 12 and thus more in line with the gold wyrmling.

Offline Muse

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Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2016, 05:26:11 AM »
  I think Zaer intends to run an adaptation of the sample adventrues released with the second edition book? 

Online Chulanowa

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #30 on: December 11, 2016, 05:43:25 AM »
*Chuckles* Is everyone doing such exotic dragons that I shouldn't feel greedy playing a gold?

I've been eyeballing the possibility of a song or maybe gem dragon. But more than likely I'll end up going green, blue, or some flavor of metallic.

Fair warning; I like my dragons like I like my women; drawn by Larry Elmore in cheesy fantasy landscapes.  ;D I HATE 3.5's "dino-dragons with frill-wings" aesthetic.

Offline Kimera

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #31 on: December 11, 2016, 06:02:56 AM »
I've been eyeballing the possibility of a song or maybe gem dragon. But more than likely I'll end up going green, blue, or some flavor of metallic.

Fair warning; I like my dragons like I like my women; drawn by Larry Elmore in cheesy fantasy landscapes.  ;D I HATE 3.5's "dino-dragons with frill-wings" aesthetic.

A bit like these, by John Howe? Though I guess they are more like linnorms, being all serpentine and no wings

Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide


Offline Muse

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Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #32 on: December 11, 2016, 06:19:45 AM »
  I aprove of your taste in dragons, Chula!  And of women, too! 

  And song dragons are OSSUM!  :)

Offline PaleEnchantress

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #33 on: December 11, 2016, 08:00:06 AM »
Wouldn't it actually be easier to balance things on their HD + LA rather then CR

A gold dragon wyrmling has CR 5, but 8HD and 4LA so 12 total

A white wyrmling has CR 2, yet only 3HD and 2LA, so only a 5th level char

A white young has CR 4, has 9 HD and 3 LA, also 12 and thus more in line with the gold wyrmling.


I don't believe things are being "balanced" at all.  We chose a dragon; it starts Wyrmling, thats it.  Doesn't matter if it's a gold or a black. Zaer already clarified he didn't mean you can only chose a 3cr dragon.

I had made a case that since Zaer is reasonable, if you chose an underpowered option (white) and want a slight tweak you might be able to get it. There has been no offocial word on that. I was just trying to help out Chulan


*Chuckles* Is everyone doing such exotic dragons that I shouldn't feel greedy playing a gold? 

If you're playing Gold you should feel very greedy.  Gold dragons are pretty damn greedy even if they are good. - Aside from that exotic doesn't necessarily mean powerful. Just because it's rare doesn't mean it's better. If you want to play a gold dragon though, play one.  That's what the game is for. Playing dragons.




Edit: DO we start without equipment and possessions?
« Last Edit: December 11, 2016, 08:18:31 AM by PaleEnchantress »

Offline Zaer DarkwailTopic starter

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #34 on: December 11, 2016, 08:28:47 AM »
I see there is some differences in power and yes, plan is to play the first adventure from the module where you literally hatch from eggs and need deal with a threat which would rofl-stomp first level party members made from humanoids :P. I most likely increase the HD on wyrmlings who are lower CR than said gold wyrmling (or other wyrmlings with more HD in general). Nerfing is something I considered as well but I think I go with that highest CR outside epic dragons or CR 13 monster wyrmlings, we stick around 3-5 CR range wyrmling dragons and those lower than 5 get some HD upragde (or statical upragde somekind).

So try balance things while not disallow playing entire caste of metallic, gem or chromatic dragons.

PaleEnchantress: Well, some clans were detailed but not all true. As in module suggests you can invent lore for your clan and I am okay there is some greedy green dragon sorceress queen who drained life in past to empower herself but now her domain is lush and green. However to make clear if any dragon starts act or behave being 'above' the council in power or influence; they get roflstomped without questions asked despite who or what they are. Considering council of wyrms can anytime call elder wyrms kill squad to hunt down dracoliches and put end to them.

Point being that council of wyrms pushes for 'unity above all' as last time when they fought in draconic wars they got almost wiped out into extinction by mere humans! There is religious doghma as a reason for unity (and practical one as well). If you have personal issues with other dragon you go official trial for it (or can try kill/murder the dragon without anyone notice foul play is possible). But very last thing you as green dragon matriarch you would want to upset the council with any shehanigans. So very least all life draining magic is approved by council to happen inside her vast domain (or domain not ran by dragons; meaning you can harass humans much as you want across great ocean but that would be many months lasting non-stop flight trip for even elder wyrm).

As said, fluff okay with but overall remove any strong hints of rebellion (suspicion is possible and matriarch is kept eye on by the council but nothing is officially done). Politics as usual in sense. But it would be better if matriarch has other things in mind than try surpass the council in power (as it would be major catastrophe all parties involved).

ThisOneGal: I say no to lunar dragons. Just cause they are so disruptive in behavior in general (I would been okay of floating 'moon rocks' above the island), but anything which is threat to council is eliminated outright and thus lunar dragons who are alien in dragon standard and also chaotically going rampages/destruction (nor care 90% of stuff what other dragons care about) creates far too much security risks for dragons living in the isles. If lunar dragon as printed would show up; it would be eliminated by the council and put down like rampaging wild animal. Same treatment is reserved for normal dragons who go mad (rogue dragons who suffer insanity or other such major mental flaw and are disruptive/causing random mayhem).

There is difference of some temperemental elder wyrm going temper tantrum over their own domain, than one who goes temper tantrum all over the place and has no respect for the council. Council's respect is reinforced if neccesary to drive point to all dragons not mess with united might of rest of the dragons who respects the council.

In general, take into account dragons had in this world lived millenia in constant conflict, twice, in row. Once before Io arrived (they murdered and struggled openly vs each other), then on islands they continued and then Io interferred again by training humans to be perfect dragonslayers and most likely give them artifacts or other power boosts (like secret how build dragon orb artifacts) to drive his own children to constant threat of enslavement/murder by human dragonslayers as means to unite them and get along. This foundation and faith is very basis for everything in Council of Wyrms society, so keep that in mind when design dragon/char concepts.

So, do we actualy build Kindred yet?  Or wait 'til after teh Wyrmling module? 

You can design/create the kindred already but game starts with wyrmling mode and we play few adventures during that age and learning of the dragons. As that in itself is very foundation to form relationships outside clan structure with other dragons. You have mentors and semi-kindred people assisting you and guiding you until you reach close to juvenile age and then send back to your parents/clan where you learn about clan life (and then get assigned a true kindred companion, which link/bonding rules I post when time comes for it). Or some dragons decide work full time for council and so never pick clan and stay in council caverns (as there are dragons who chose duty above family this manner).

Offline Kimera

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #35 on: December 11, 2016, 10:20:47 AM »
I'm considering a serpentine styx dragon, but not sure if an earthbound dragon is going to hurt in the long run

Offline PaleEnchantress

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #36 on: December 11, 2016, 01:54:53 PM »
DO we start without gear?


Also that wasn't my first choice anyway.

Offline Zaer DarkwailTopic starter

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #37 on: December 11, 2016, 02:24:15 PM »
As dragons, yeap, no gear.

Offline Kimera

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #38 on: December 11, 2016, 07:28:20 PM »
Can't seem to make up my mind. So many dragon species I like and would love to play  ^-^

Offline Zaer DarkwailTopic starter

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #39 on: December 11, 2016, 07:33:19 PM »
Yeah, even discovered new one like Steel Dragons, which makes another ideal dragon race for someone who feels comfortable wear humanoid form.

Offline PaleEnchantress

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #40 on: December 11, 2016, 08:35:31 PM »
Im playing Mircalla the Tome Dragon. I'm pretty sure I win at being the magically strongest and physically weakest dragon in the alliance.  I also have a humanoid form as I wish so yay for polymorphed dragon sex.


http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html#id=1035574


Will write something about the court to which I belong sometime.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2016, 08:39:27 PM by PaleEnchantress »

Online Chulanowa

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #41 on: December 11, 2016, 11:49:48 PM »
Your customization options as dragon PC are; use default stats of each dragon, but add +1 to any stat per 4 HD you got (so yes, you can play smarter than Int 6 white dragon but it needs to get 16 HD before it rises to 10 example to happen). Also you get feat at every odd HD you got. Besides the progress to next age stage you could had earned few class levels (but it will delay then bit on entering 'dragon sleep' mode where you advance age category).

I was thumbing through my Council of Wyrms book, and saw that they use stat generation as normal, with racial adjustments by color, so I was kinda hopeful for that approach :)

Is the +1 stat per 4 HD in addition to the stat gains at each age category? I.e., a Red Wyrmling advances to "Very Young," going from 7 to 10 HD; He'll get the floating +1 ability bonus from his 8th HD in addition to +4 STR, +2 CON, +2 INT, +2 WIS, and +2 CHA?

Offline Kimera

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #42 on: December 12, 2016, 03:21:12 AM »
Hmmm....brainstealer dragon (drag 337) and chole dragon (drag 344). Tentacle galore ^^

Offline Zaer DarkwailTopic starter

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #43 on: December 12, 2016, 05:36:39 AM »
I was thumbing through my Council of Wyrms book, and saw that they use stat generation as normal, with racial adjustments by color, so I was kinda hopeful for that approach :)

Is the +1 stat per 4 HD in addition to the stat gains at each age category? I.e., a Red Wyrmling advances to "Very Young," going from 7 to 10 HD; He'll get the floating +1 ability bonus from his 8th HD in addition to +4 STR, +2 CON, +2 INT, +2 WIS, and +2 CHA?

The +1 stat from every 4 HD is in addittion to the official stats of each dragon in each age category. So example; very young blue dragon has Str:15 Dex:10 Con:15 Int:10 Wis:11 Cha:10.

Thanks for having 9 HD it has two +1 point which a PC can freely distribute (and just need record the spend as their blue dragon enters later age categories they know which stat is elevated). So example PC plays bit 'brute' blue dragon so they add +2 to Str or they want round up the stats better so they add +1 to Str and +1 to Con.

Anyways the point being the council of wyrms is 2th edition campaign book and if we go directly translate the stats or mechanics there will be so many hiccups along the way that I decided we stick mostly with CR calculations (which I addressed with dragons less than CR 5 for wyrmlings get more HD to start with but not be more than standard dragons but later on get more class levels to compensate CR difference of dragons of various types). Also use standard dragon stats as well.

Unless I am horribly wrong and there excists official errate/list of dragon racial stat info like +4, +2 Con etc listing each and every published species. As complex as legendary monster game is I am trying keep my games KISS.

Offline Kimera

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #44 on: December 12, 2016, 06:17:53 PM »
Can't seem to make up my mind. Sort of going between a shadow and a deep dragon. (since the tentacles are a no go)

Offline PaleEnchantress

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #45 on: December 12, 2016, 06:55:15 PM »
Can't seem to make up my mind. Sort of going between a shadow and a deep dragon. (since the tentacles are a no go)


No tentacles? BLASPHEMY!

Online Chulanowa

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #46 on: December 12, 2016, 08:48:48 PM »
I'm trying to decide between Green, Blue, Red, or Copper. I am also assuming that we're going with hte original CoW stance on alignment, that it's dragon-by-dragon, rather than color-by-color, so liek there bcan be a lawful good weirdo of a Red.

Offline Zaer DarkwailTopic starter

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #47 on: December 12, 2016, 09:07:56 PM »
Alignment depends on dragons yes than color of their scales.

Offline PaleEnchantress

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #48 on: December 12, 2016, 09:21:56 PM »
Alignment depends on dragons yes than color of their scales.

From what I understand any specific dragon court is going to be alignment aligned with it's primary color. IE The 5 courts listed as greed dragon courts are all Lawful evil. They do not, necessarily, only have Green dragons among them.  Any Dragon who joins a green dragon court is probably lawful evil, one step from lawful evil, or really dumb.  An individual green dragon can be neutral good (Though NPC green dragons at least tend toward LE there are plenty of exceptions. PC's may chose alignment freely)  but a Neutral Good Green Dragon would want nothing to do with any of the Green Dragon courts. They might find themselves better suited for that of an Amethyst dragon court or a Silver Dragon Court.


Did I get it fairly accurately Zaer?

Offline PaleEnchantress

Re: Council of Wyrms: 3.5 DnD Classic Game
« Reply #49 on: December 12, 2016, 11:36:18 PM »
Jadress







"Revered Mother, tell me about clan Jadress." An inquisitive little crystal dragon Wyrmling looked up at the great blue nursery matron with sparkling eyes. The Wyrmlings had just learned about the existence of dragon clans a couple months ago and it was a very hot topic for the hatchlings to chatter about.  The crystal wyrmling wanted to be one of the first dragons of all her peers to know the details about every clan. So far she had only heard two things mentioned about the clan: One, that the Jadress dragons were all lazy, and two that they had something rather rare among IO's Blood Idles; humans.

   The Blue Matron smiled and scooped up the wyrmling in her huge claws and gentle pulled her closer.  It was the smile of a stern but loving dragon, who enjoyed being able to share her vast knowledge with the youngest generation. "Clan Jadress is known for many things; the beauty of their city, their easy access to magic, their closeness with the dark elves, their extravagant parties, their slave-based economy. . ."

   "I thought they were known for being lazy" The crystal wyrmling suddenly blurted out, causing the authoritative matron to have to stifle a laugh at the little one's inadvertent brashness.

   "That's . . . not entirely true. In all fairness every clan's enemies look at their noteworthy traits through the most loathesome angle they can.  The Dragons of Clan Jadress prefer to let their servants and magic do the work for them. That is in no small part to the clan's popularity with our Arcane Dragon relatives. Arcane dragons bodies are weak and small but all of them are born with an innate talent for the kind of magic that can force others to do their bidding, whether through direct mind control or summoning. Jadress society as a whole depends on those powers.

   Their enemies call them lazy, they call them a bunch of other more colorful things too; Whores, Dilettantes, Bestiality Practitioners, Traitors, Magic Addicts, Perverts, Blasphemers, Narcissists, Megalomaniacs, and quite a few sexual euphemisms I do not wish to repeat in front of such young auditory senses. What is good and bad is a matter of perspective that you must decide for yourself.  Jadress has never violated laws set by the council the rest of their virtues and vices are the subject of opinion

   Depending on who you ask the population of Jadress is made of three to five castes. In simplest terms it's The Dragon Rulers, Dark Elf nobles, and slaves. Some see the elder dragons and the younger dragons as separate castes of rulers, and retainer slaves who work closely with their dragon master's are mostly elves and dark elves that like to see themselves as a caste above the common slaves who are mostly humans. It was inevitable that in our wars against the humans some of their kind would surrender as battle captives or succumb to the mind controlling powers of our kind.  It's no coincidence that the dragons who most often employ such magic are the ones with the biggest population of cowed human slaves. From what I hear the humans of Jadress live in complete terror and awe of their masters. Whatever sparks of rebellion were in them once are gone now

   Jadress has quite a few enemies but no one has yet felt the risk of attacking them to be worth it. Not even the mighty clan Bloodtide would dare risk it.  The elegant spires of Jadress city are siege weapons that fire bolts of arcane energy and can be quickly attuned by their dark elf artificiers to be particularly deadly to the specific type of foe they face. Many of the dark elf nobility are also powerful divine spellcasters. Magical constructs patrol their walls and a ring of undead monsters surrounds the border. Their magic controls the land, air, and sea, which is how it's always like the pleasant temperature of an early summer sunset there. Consequently clothing is worn to show off, not protect one's body. A Dragon that has no interest in mingling with elves and humans, particularly, their men, would find Jadress very queer indeed.

   You'd never know that there were a nearly equal number of male and female slaves in Jadress. At least half the female slave population is kept in ghettos and used strictly for breeding. Humans and half elves are very *fecund* one male can breed with many females and be back to serving his master's in only a couple days. More visible males means more males being promoted and kept as decorative status symbols. This doesn't apply to the dark elf nobility and dragons themselves who supposedly have no gender bias but seem to be slightly female dominated. Jadress is also known for decadent galas and orgies. The dark elf nobility show off their status through the luxurious and magical extravagances they shower upon their draconic guests.  Even dragon visitors can usually receive a very rich welcome from the dark elves as long as their business is legitimate. Jadress also stands out as being one of the only chromatic settlements where the dragon population is frequently in the form of the two legged races. All kinds of elves, particularly.  Thus Jadress isn't well suited for Dragons of extreme size.

   Perhaps most noteworthy is on top of the Orb Jadress possessed for their spot on The Council they also have received a personal gift from Falazure called The Nightwell. The Sun never shines in Jadress.  Most of the Dark Elf priests worship him over other deities. He is a fitting patron for Jadress as he is more subtle and manipulative than Tiamat and is known to frequently take the form of a very beautiful elf but his beauty is fueled by death and corruption. If he fails to receive enough power at the expense of others his illusions of regal beauty wither away to reveal the rot beneath. I'm sure I do not need to explain the analogy to you, little one.  The Nightwell's true powers are known only to the council itself. It's probably capable of more malicious things than it's used for. I know that it empowers the magic of dragons who accept it's gifts and often increases the majesty of their presence, but it makes them sensitive to sunlight and dependent on The Nightwell's energy.  Pitty the Jadress dragon trapped far away from their magical city it's a very wretched sight."
« Last Edit: December 12, 2016, 11:46:56 PM by PaleEnchantress »