So... Mitt Romney

[Oniya]

Yeah, like I said, the other people wouldn't play with them. :p

Strange thing is though. IIRC Utah still has a pretty large number of polygynists right?

Personally, I have nothing against polygyny or polyandry. I'd love to see both of them become legal in my country. But not in the forced marriage kind of way like some Mormon or mashriq cultures have it.

The polygynists splintered off into the FLDS, which is mostly down near the Texas/Arizona border, as I recall.  Google up Warren Jeffs for the gory details.

[Tamhansen]

The polygynists splintered off into the FLDS, which is mostly down near the Texas/Arizona border, as I recall.  Google up Warren Jeffs for the gory details.

Says on there FLDS has two main compounds. Hilldale Utah and Colorado city Arizona.

[Oniya]

I'd forgotten the Hilldale complex.  The Colorado City one was in the news a lot in the past year (before Jeffs finally got arrested and put in jail.)

[Tamhansen]

I'm only going to pop in briefly, as an ex-mormon myself. (I just don't care about organized religion at all.)

The official stance of the LDS church is that they shouldn't have anything to do with government. Considering some of the furor with Prop 8, you can tell it doesn't work sometimes. And I knew many, many mormons who were absolutely disgusted with that support.

But, honestly...if I wasn't absolutely horrified by his VP pick, and questionable about some of his policies...I'd be all for him winning the election, if only to get someone who wasn't mainstream Christian in the White House for once.

Wait, does that just go for the church officials or it's congregation too?

Either way, let's elect an Amish president. They'd solve the unemployment in no time.

[Oniya]

Wait, does that just go for the church officials or it's congregation too?

Either way, let's elect an Amish president. They'd solve the unemployment in no time.

Maybe, but I'd hate to witness the effects of a nationwide Rumspringa. 

[Tamhansen]

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=lOfZLb33uCg&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DlOfZLb33uCg

[Myrleena]

The oath that people take to get/maintain their temple recommend comes to mind.

Excuse me? What oath? I've been into a temple, and gotten a temple recommend, before I voluntarily left the church. There is no 'oath' whatsoever as I recall.

Wait, does that just go for the church officials or it's congregation too?

They are supposed to leave secular matters alone, as a religious organization. Now, what individuals do? That's a whole different matter. I know plenty of bishops flat out told their congregations to contribute. It happened. Which is why the fact that pretty much any member of the mormon church can become a bishop pretty much at the drop of a hat can be a problem. It's a lay-priesthood, unlike most other religions, and they have, by and large, no training beforehand. Which makes it even worse when you're talking about people who you're supposed to go to for guidance.

Anyway, I'm getting to the point of rambling, so I'm not going to say anything more. There were more comments I have, but unfortunately they're things I found out from other people in the LDS church, and I don't have any evidence. So, I won't try and push that out there.

[Missy]

On Oaths:

Information is a tricky thing. You have to bear in mind that while there are honest expatriates of different groups there are also malicious malcontents. If you don't know what I mean then I believe last year there was that controversy pertinent to that American citizen who had revoked his citizenship when he ran off to join the terrorists. Some people are honest expatriates, others malicious malcontents. I've known Mormons my entire life and still get along with some of them, occasionally I hear some story or rumor of some such or something or other and it, in all honesty, sounds rather out of character in accordance with my understanding and perception of Mormonism.

On Tithing and Expenditure

Supposedly there is a third party transparent audit of church expenditures performed on a yearly basis. I do not know by whom it is performed or how to find information pertinent to as much however. It's actually a bit funny really, they just had their General Conference this past weekend I probably could have found out at least the name of the company for merely attending the first saturday session.

On Polygamy

Pressured by the government to call it quits sounds about right, that's how it was always told to me. Church Doctrine states that god has also commanded to 'obey the law of the land' so their not actually giving up on polygamy and doctrine also states polygamy will come back one day, along with the law of consecration for example although that's a bit different. The general doctrinally predicted trend in Mormonism is that it will get harder to follow the precepts of the Mormon faith and not easier, I remember some 'raising the bar' stuff on missionary work from when I was a child, so that might actually be an accurate prediction. Individual attitudes on polygamy tends to vary from Mormon to Mormon, mostly dependent upon age. The more elderly members who've spent a lifetime in monogamic relationships will tend to say they think it would be much harder to adopt polygamy on account that your bringing a new person into the relationship, while the younger members who are either still single or who've only more recently been married tend to be more willing to adopt polygamy again, ay least in theory.

On Leadership

What she said, there isn't really any criteria for any calling. Gender plays a role in some callings, but that's about it.

I feel leadership  has a habit for thinking they know more than they do on account they posses the 'power of the spirit of discernment' for example one of the gifts of god. It's funny the way a religious person can say he absolutely knows something to be the facts of the matter and have a thesis which is in complete denial of all other facts as verified by a third party altogether . . . but that's just my feeling on the matter.

[Sabby]

Mitt Romney Caught in Multitudes of Lies

This guy must be a thin rubbery set of open footwear. Because he sure does flipflop!

...

... =D

g-get it? Because he's indecisive?

I'll go...

[Callie Del Noire]

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/mitt-romney-s-tax-dodge-20121012

Interesting article. Makes me wonder just HOW rich he really is.

[Ironwolf85]

Ran into one of the few young romney supporters, he seemed to be in an opinion of "electing my guy will fix everything because I just know he's telling the truth on his plans"

[elone]

I'm in Virginia and we are inundated with political adds. I wonder why the Democrats don't run a video like the one above with all his lies and flipflops exposed. It is very effective seeing the changes coming from the horses mouth.

[Ironwolf85]

I hate the fact that the democratic team has gone instead for using big bird after romney's gaffe during the debate

Reason for Edit: sleepy causes mistypingz

[Callie Del Noire]

Ran into one of the few young romney supporters, he seemed to be in an opinion of "electing my guy will fix everything because I just know he's telling the truth on his plans"

Annndd.. the young kids four years ago thought the President would wave a magic wand and make the problems go away. It's hard NOT to dissillusion the young voter that it takes time for changes to have an effect on something as big as a country. A LOT of things might not really hit from a president's reforms till after he's been voted out of office.

[Ironwolf85]

Annndd.. the young kids four years ago thought the President would wave a magic wand and make the problems go away. It's hard NOT to dissillusion the young voter that it takes time for changes to have an effect on something as big as a country. A LOT of things might not really hit from a president's reforms till after he's been voted out of office.

Exactly, I got swept up in that current before so I can kinda "smell it" if that makes any sense.

[Callie Del Noire]

Exactly, I got swept up in that current before so I can kinda "smell it" if that makes any sense.

It made a difference.. That election had the highest turn out in decades.. it takes time, continued support and the understanding it took nearly 50 years to get this hard in the hole.. it's not going to be by the President by March 1st. Anyone who tells you it would be.. is lying to you.

[Ironwolf85]

It made a difference.. That election had the highest turn out in decades.. it takes time, continued support and the understanding it took nearly 50 years to get this hard in the hole.. it's not going to be by the President by March 1st. Anyone who tells you it would be.. is lying to you.

Also I saw the VP debate.
Biden beat Ryans I believe even if fox dares not admit it, and is jumping through hoops to avoid saying "our guy lost" like MSNBC and CNN did.
But the moderator beat them both, I want her to moderate the next presidental debate, that was good journalisim, and not pundetry.

[Oniya]

The next presidential debate is going to be moderated by Candy Crowley, the first woman to moderate a presidential debate since Carole Simpson back in 1992.  I know nothing about her political or journalistic leanings, but I have to say it's about f-ing time.

[Trieste]

From what I've read, she has both campaigns in a flutter because she has made statements indicating that she doesn't intend to be passive. The debate tonight is supposed to address questions from the (carefully selected *eyeroll*) audience and she has indicated that she intends to ask follow-ups if the statements are inconsistent with themselves or what has been said before.

I tell ya, it may have both campaigns in a tizzy, but I really hope she goes for it.

[gaggedLouise]

I'd love to see Mitt Romney on HardTalk, it's one slot that near always provides some honest answers, amazing/painful insights and the interviewer/mod is anything but passive and accepting of evasive answers (and I know what you're thinking of Trieste, that kind of softie interviewing and "just let the invited guy do the talking" attitude has become fashionable far outside of the U.S. political circuit)


(yeah, I'd like to see Obama on HT too, but Romney would be more fun and I guess they are both too high up, as for now, to really answer the call. Back in 2007 as Blair was stepping down, they did an infuriatingly funny double interview/summit with Chris Patten and John Bolton (Bolton by video link) about Britain as a world power and the "special relationship", I've rarely seen two top politicians so openly tell each other that they didn't understand the other's perspective or just ignore his questions altogether).

[Sabby]

BEST. TYPO. EVAR!

[Star Safyre]

BEST. TYPO. EVAR!

More like best Photoshoping ever.

Regardless, I would like to give my opinion about Romney, however I had to take advantage of the flexibility of my job to come home and cook dinner.  If only my name had ended up in an unrequested binder full of qualified women , I could have perhaps made enough money to not be one of the people who he doesn't worry about because I assume I am a victim and the government will take care of me.  At least I'm glad I stayed out of poverty because I got married before having kids and didn't want another woman as my spouse.

[Sabby]

Awww, it's shopped? The O and M kids are the same height, so that kind of mix up seems easy to do... why are all the good pictures shop jobs? Dx

In any case, I'm just now finding out about this Binders Full of Women thing. What the hell happened to Memes? o.O This feels really forced.

[Lilias]

This, though, is genuine, and brilliant (no news to regular readers):

http://margaretandhelen.com/2012/10/19/thank-you-ann-for-clarifying-that-your-husband-mitt-is-indeed-a-liar/

[blackcatotaku]

I will try to state as eloquently as possible how much I dislike Mitt Romney and why.

I am not a blind sided liberal who just wants to vote for Obama because he's a democrat. I don't want to vote for Mitt Romney because I honestly believe he is completely out of touch with average people. He has made so many contradictory statements and wants to try and convince people that he is a moderate while still promising everything to his conservative base that he is going to repeal legislature that hasn't even gone fully into affect.  If he were to repeal the health care system that Obama is attempting to put into place it has been proven by many different economic resources that it would end up costing Close to 5.6 million dollars to repeal. Why are people so scared of change? I feel very passionate about health care for all and will share my belief that everyone is just one disaster away from ruin.

Having had family members with major health issues and having had some myself I am thankful that I have a father who is in the navy so I could gain access to good health care but I shudder to think what would have happened to me if I had not been apart of that privileged class that could afford the health care I needed.

Putting aside health care the fact that he made much of his money by downsizing companies and selling them once he had made the profitable again I find despicable. He stated during the first debate that one of the ways he will cut back spending from the government is to down size and combine certain departments of the government which is a scary notion because that meas we go back to departments that are too broad in their duties to maintain their departments purposes. He has not said which departments he would do this to but combining those departments means  cuts meaning loss of jobs. How are you going to create jobs when you are going to take them away?

He showed a clear disrespect for women in the second debate where he said that he had to go to communities to seek out qualified women to join his cabinet with his binder full of women... the ridiculous part was when he was saying that employers need to be more flexible with their hours so that women can go home and cook for their children and be there for their kids... Why because there are no single dads?

Let us also revisit his answer to the violent crimes with guns which was he said that families  aren't  functional without both a mother and father would some how inherently breed troubled children? That's a great blanket generalization about single parents... Also what on earth does that have to do with AK-47 illegal guns getting into the hands of the public and those who would do great harm with it?

I'm sorry if any of my points offended anyone but these are the reasons I will not vote for Romney he doesn't say what he means he doesn't respect women and he doesn't care about reforming health care, on top of that I don't think he can create  jobs because the simple fact is the president does not create jobs. Small business does and when you are choking the middle class with high taxes and not encouraging the wealthy in this country to pay more of their share... I don't know how that will promote economic growth...