WoW- Pandaria beta live

[Chris Brady]

I'm not whining.. but there is a difference from challenging.. to making it to the point of simple beyond words. I mean.. I regained over half my tool bar in beta.. I like some of the changes (5 slots of holy power is VERY nice for tanking) but why get rid of the Ancient Kings? Why eliminate stamina buffing? Get rid of all the blessings? (I liked having Kings, Sanctuary and others)

I'm sorry, I wasn't implying you were whining.  I was thinking mostly the WoW Forums.  I apologize, Callie.  Unlike over there you've been quite reasonable in your complaints.

And I found out why Pallies don't get Stamina buffage.  That's now the Warrior purview.

I gotta say, in the limited time I played the beta, I'm not too sure on the changes, and I sure as hell do NOT like the monk.  Too fiddly in a game where they still use Auto attacks.

[Callie Del Noire]

I'm sorry, I wasn't implying you were whining.  I was thinking mostly the WoW Forums.  I apologize, Callie.  Unlike over there you've been quite reasonable in your complaints.

And I found out why Pallies don't get Stamina buffage.  That's now the Warrior purview.

I gotta say, in the limited time I played the beta, I'm not too sure on the changes, and I sure as hell do NOT like the monk.  Too fiddly in a game where they still use Auto attacks.

They got the autoattack back.

[Chris Brady]

They need to reword Jab then.  But over all, don't like the Monk.

The Warrior changes are...  Intriguing.  Not sure where I sit with those.

[Callie Del Noire]

They need to reword Jab then.  But over all, don't like the Monk.

The Warrior changes are...  Intriguing.  Not sure where I sit with those.

Due to a personal mistake on servers.. I don't have access to my 72ish warrior in beta. I goofed and put two toons on a PVP server.. so, I am playing my rogue and a pali and a few other toons. The Monk is okay so far (13ish) but I've peeped in the revamped Scholo and I like it.. curious to see how a lowbie party does it.. looks challenging and intersting. (I like the behemoths with 'meat grafts' you have to kill to have it literally bleed out)

[Shjade]

They're redesigning combat, and I'm seriously not sure what the plan is.  I mean, yest, Rupture for Combat Rogues was kind of important, for Arms Warriors it was the same.  Especially during raiding.  Rend was our primary attack.  Every Mortal Strike kept it going or extended it.  The only thing I can think of would be to make armour debuffs built into the various attacks.  Which would increase attack damage.

Personally, I WISH they allowed the Melee classes to as much damage as the Mage classes.  What irritates me is that whenever someone brings that up, Mage fans always complain that this would mean that they are making the mage useless, because that's all they have.

Uh, no it's not.  In fact, Mages have the best crowd control.  Even Warlocks have some as well, by way of the their pets (in PvP) and against some targets (in PvE.)  Even Rogues gets some in stun effects.  Hunters get pets and slow effects.  Warriors?  Nothing that the other classes don't get better at.  So what's left?  Damage.  And we don't get that.

Mages have some of the best crowd control, but crowd control doesn't mean much on about a lot of raid boss encounters. Damage and sustainability are pretty much your major factors there. Yes, there are some where you need to control X spawns while you're fighting the boss, but you tend to not need mages specifically for that - a rogue throwing a blind or a gouge out there until the offtank picks up whatever it is can often do just as well in a pinch.

I'm not sure I understand your statement, though, since rogues have done as much/more damage than mage classes since BC. Rogues, warlocks, hunters and mages have jockeyed for #1 dps for as long as I can remember (with DKs getting into the mix later on). It's usually just a question of how high the burst gets: mages tend to shoot bigger numbers, melee tends to stab smaller numbers but more of them in the same period of time. Which classes are the "top dps" changes from expansion to expansion and patch to patch. Rogues were bar none the best at the very end of BC, but warlocks were better than rogues prior to the Shattered Sun patch addition. DW frost DK's rocked the charts through early LK, then got nerfed out of favor. And so on. If you just mean warriors specifically, yeah, they haven't really been damage dominance for quite some time. I do recall some Fury awesomeness going on somewhere around mid-LK, but I never paid much attention to warriors since I didn't play one seriously.

The trouble with turning bleeds into armor reduction is that that only provides a damage boost until the target's armor hits 0, which happens pretty fast with standard raid debuffs anyway. Wouldn't be comparable at all, at least using the current combat system.

[Chris Brady]

Well, right now, in the beta the Arms Warrior still have a bleed DoT but it no longer requires an activation.  I prefer it.

As you might have guessed, I'm going to focus my Beta time primarily on the Warrior.

Also, I personally believe that if you spec your class for DPS, whether Rogue, Warrior, Mage, Warlock, Paladin, Priest, whatever, you should have a chance to be top DPS.  It's not the class that makes you a badass.  It's how you use it.

* Chris Brady adjusts his pants.

Anyway.

I have issue with the talent system.  The level 70(?) choices are all defensive stance based, but there's also a severe lack of defense based talents for the other levels.  They need to spread them out.

[Shjade]

While nice in theory, it's not good in practice: if all classes had the ability to reach the same level of DPS, raids would likely just end up stacking one or two classes that allow for maximum performance/buff/support abilities since they wouldn't need other classes to do heavier damage. This was what happened at the end of BC with rogue/warlock-stacking and is why they broke up the specs those classes would use to achieve untouchable status compared to other damage-oriented classes/specs.

Basically, the Blizzard philosophy states that if your raid is most successful with 5 or more of one class, they're doing it wrong and need to fix something. Thus, not all classes do the most damage, but the ones that don't usually bring something else that helps out the raid in some other way.

[Chris Brady]

It's already that way in WoW.  And the thing is, Warriors have nothing else other than Tanking.  Every other class can do the DPS thing better.

[Saerrael]

It's already that way in WoW.  And the thing is, Warriors have nothing else other than Tanking.  Every other class can do the DPS thing better.

*used to play SP (BC) and is very sceptic*


Anyway.... I don't think I have too much right to talk any more, as I think Pandoria will be the death sentence to my account. I've already been thinking of quitting ever since Wrath went life and the game just keeps on getting easier.
*sighs*
I hope you guys have fun. I am not too certain I will any more.

[Callie Del Noire]

*used to play SP (BC) and is very sceptic*


Anyway.... I don't think I have too much right to talk any more, as I think Pandoria will be the death sentence to my account. I've already been thinking of quitting ever since Wrath went life and the game just keeps on getting easier.
*sighs*
I hope you guys have fun. I am not too certain I will any more.

With me it's been the people in the game..otherswise I'd already be gone.

[Wolfy]

Do do do..can't wait to be a monk.

Also  can't wait to have Pokemon with my WoW.

It's like Chocolate and Jelly.

It's good...sometimes.

[Saerrael]

With me it's been the people in the game..otherswise I'd already be gone.

Played for so long all the people I know have already quit. *shrugs*
Just need a tank, to be honest, and some derps to keep going. But I will not keep playing this game when the community keeps declining like it has been since the game became so simple every guy and his cat could play it.

[Shjade]

It was never really that complicated. Just time-consuming. It wasn't hard to grind rep and get into raids and etc., it just took hours and hours and hours and hours of doing the same shit over and over again. I actually liked the direction they were taking the game in terms of the way they were restructuring a lot of abilities and grinds and travel and stuff (warlock changes notwithstanding); I just ran out of things to do.

The only raid encounters I recall actually feeling difficult for reasons other than "half of my raid is derps" were at the Sunwell. Pretty much everything before and after that, eh, just had to gear up for it and not stand in fire, more or less.

[Saerrael]

It was never really that complicated. Just time-consuming. It wasn't hard to grind rep and get into raids and etc., it just took hours and hours and hours and hours of doing the same shit over and over again. I actually liked the direction they were taking the game in terms of the way they were restructuring a lot of abilities and grinds and travel and stuff (warlock changes notwithstanding); I just ran out of things to do.

The only raid encounters I recall actually feeling difficult for reasons other than "half of my raid is derps" were at the Sunwell. Pretty much everything before and after that, eh, just had to gear up for it and not stand in fire, more or less.

Healing was hard. Mp5 versus hps. You actually needed a bit of theorycrafting to keep your raid up.
Now? Hell no..

[Callie Del Noire]

Do do do..can't wait to be a monk.

Also  can't wait to have Pokemon with my WoW.

It's like Chocolate and Jelly.

It's good...sometimes.

Still no pet battles in beta..

so I can't tell anything about it.

There is a bug that lets hunter pets stay full sized.. there are some HUGE critters in stormwind all the time.

[Shjade]

Healing was hard. Mp5 versus hps. You actually needed a bit of theorycrafting to keep your raid up.
Now? Hell no..

To do it optimally, sure. Did you need to do optimally to succeed at most content? Not really.

[Saerrael]

To do it optimally, sure. Did you need to do optimally to succeed at most content? Not really.

*shrugs* I am not going to ask you if you just asked me if I was a noob or not. I'm just going to leave the thread.

[Tiberius]

But the problem is the overall mechanics are so easy a chimp could figure them out. There aren't any complex things you need to look out for, possibly the only real challenging fights in the current raid is Madness of Deathwing and Commander Blackthorn, they're the only truely challenging ones because they actually require you to move further then five feet.

The first and second tier raids were probably harder. Blizzard is losing me as well, i'm getting bored with how mind-numbingly boring/easy content is becoming. I thought when Cata came out they were finally taking the game back in the right direction with the heroics, they were a great level of difficulty then they broke them with the completly needless nerfs.

I guess the 10% minority of kiddy screamers are more important then the majority of their playerbase, and thats what is going to cost them they have lost over 1 million subs mainly because A) The community is rapidly degrading into a cesspit of chan-ness and B) game is so easy you can almost faceroll the keyboard and win.

[Saerrael]

But the problem is the overall mechanics are so easy a chimp could figure them out. There aren't any complex things you need to look out for, possibly the only real challenging fights in the current raid is Madness of Deathwing and Commander Blackthorn, they're the only truely challenging ones because they actually require you to move further then five feet.

The first and second tier raids were probably harder. Blizzard is losing me as well, i'm getting bored with how mind-numbingly boring/easy content is becoming. I thought when Cata came out they were finally taking the game back in the right direction with the heroics, they were a great level of difficulty then they broke them with the completly needless nerfs.

I guess the 10% minority of kiddy screamers are more important then the majority of their playerbase, and thats what is going to cost them they have lost over 1 million subs mainly because A) The community is rapidly degrading into a cesspit of chan-ness and B) game is so easy you can almost faceroll the keyboard and win.

The community is dying because the game is now too easy to play. >.>

[Tiberius]

Yeah I have a habit at being long-winded sometimes lol, that is what I was getting at. People still need to be challenged and there is always going to be those losers that want everything handed to them, Blizzard just doesn't have the balls to stand up to the shits and keep the quality. Most people say BC was the best, it had the right balance of casual and hardcore content, but now all you got is shit. Most guilds on my server have already mostly finished the hardmode of DS

[Saerrael]

Yeah I have a habit at being long-winded sometimes lol, that is what I was getting at. People still need to be challenged and there is always going to be those losers that want everything handed to them, Blizzard just doesn't have the balls to stand up to the shits and keep the quality. Most people say BC was the best, it had the right balance of casual and hardcore content, but now all you got is shit. Most guilds on my server have already mostly finished the hardmode of DS

I've not played since Januari, because.. well, I'm bored. I only played the Ironman challenge. But failed at that due to some errors of judgement. Might pick that up again, but may not... it's.. even too easy to play that way. Which is utterly ridiculous >.>;
(Highest Iron was a lvl 44 Paladin, by the way.)

WTF is is the Ironman challenge?!?

[Tiberius]

Its why I prefer Age of Conan really, to bad its not managed by a decent company that actually knows what they are doing

[Shjade]

*shrugs* I am not going to ask you if you just asked me if I was a noob or not. I'm just going to leave the thread.

I...what?

I was just pointing out raids have never needed perfect optimization to be beaten. I don't know why you think it had anything to do with you. O.o

[Tiberius]

True they have never been omg! MUST BE THIS OR WE FAIL! Its just been a matter of getting the right combination not right down to 0.00001% but more like 1-2% on the most difficult fights

[Wolfy]

Still no pet battles in beta..

so I can't tell anything about it.

There is a bug that lets hunter pets stay full sized.. there are some HUGE critters in stormwind all the time.

As long as it's in the full release, I don't care about Beta.

I'm going to make a Female Pandaren Monk who will be the very best, like no one ever was.

To catch them is her test, to train them is her cause.

CRITTER-MON!