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Author Topic: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o  (Read 20430 times)

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Offline Aiden

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #425 on: January 19, 2011, 10:02:52 PM »
Raiding is like...getting a blowjob, but from a girl who does not know what she is doing.

The thought and idea of it is amazing, you will enjoy the very first few moments but then you realize it is not as great as you imagined then you just suffer through it till the end until you are so frustrated you quit.

Offline Saerrael

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Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #426 on: January 19, 2011, 10:04:32 PM »
...bad experiences, Aiden? *chuckles*

Offline LunarSage

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #427 on: January 19, 2011, 10:06:30 PM »
So why do it at all then?

All I really want is to do quests.  I've never been at cap and at this rate I likely never will be.  Since no one wants to do below cap raids, I doubt I'll ever experience any of the vanilla, BC or Lich King stuff unfortunately.

Offline Aiden

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #428 on: January 19, 2011, 10:07:35 PM »
A few...

because raids can be really fun with the right people, like REALLY fun, some of the best times I have had in the game but if you are in a guild of people you hate it is not fun at all.

Offline Saerrael

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Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #429 on: January 19, 2011, 10:08:34 PM »
So why do it at all then?

All I really want is to do quests.  I've never been at cap and at this rate I likely never will be.  Since no one wants to do below cap raids, I doubt I'll ever experience any of the vanilla, BC or Lich King stuff unfortunately.

That's not true. At least, not on my server. I retroraid, too. Though, I must say, TBC and lower. More recent is too fresh in my memory. (Though.. some group recently retrod LK *laughs*)

A few...

because raids can be really fun with the right people, like REALLY fun, some of the best times I have had in the game but if you are in a guild of people you hate it is not fun at all.

+1

It's all about the people you raid with.

Offline Xillen

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #430 on: January 20, 2011, 12:26:37 AM »
Still, raiding old content will never be the same as raiding it back when it was endgame content.

Raiding is making a group of 10 or 25 people to run specific raid instances that are intended to support these larger groups. There are more mobs, the bosses hit a lot harder, making errors usually means you'll die rather than the healer needs to heal you a little more, and there's more tactics to think about all around. Since you're running with 10 or 25 people, you no longer have just 1 tank and 1 healer. There are several tanks that need to work together on aggro control, and the healers need to sort out who heals what.

Because of the increase in complexity, raids are often ran in guild-only groups that can take several evenings wiping on a boss just to learn the encounter. When more and more people get accustomed to a raid instance, it'll eventually be pugged, but pugs are just there to loot, not to learn the fight, so after a few wipes, pugs disband.

You won't find a group for an old content raid where everyone is the right level. You might find a group of at least partially level 85s that want to run it, but that won't give you the feeling of a raid, as you most likely will be running after the other people as they zerg stuff down. Then there's the obvious loot drama when only half the raid is level 85 and the other half is lower level.

If you can enter a raid with a group of 9 or 24 (or back in the days, 39) friends or friendly guildies, raiding can be a blast. If you wipe a lot and/or have raid leaders like the one in the Onyxia movie, that experience could totally chance.

Offline Vincent

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #431 on: January 20, 2011, 07:26:13 AM »
It also depends if you have a havily accented jamacian guy explaining the boss fights.... now that one is fun ^.^ On thw note of retro raiding, Rp guilds run them for specific gear peices, or old sets, things like that.

Offline Chris Brady

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #432 on: January 20, 2011, 09:09:55 PM »
I remember a time when WoW was fun.  It wasn't that long ago, really.

During Burning Crusades, actually...

I hate the new dungeons...  And I hate the new attitude it brought with them.  No one's having fun anymore.  It's all rush, rush, rush.  Do the Raids.  Or Heroics.  And the planning required... 

I don't want to coast through the fights, but this? This isn't fun.

Offline Xillen

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #433 on: January 20, 2011, 11:59:37 PM »
I hate the new dungeons...  And I hate the new attitude it brought with them.  No one's having fun anymore.  It's all rush, rush, rush.  Do the Raids.  Or Heroics.  And the planning required...

This has always been the case, depending on the group of people you play with. WotLK and Cataclysm can be played at least as casual as TBC, if not more.

In TBC, if you wanted to raid, you had to farm instances before you could even do the heroic versions for reputation, and then run the heroic instances (which were very hard before 2.1), sometimes even on a timer, just so you could attune yourself to raid instances. Gold was not as easy to come by, meaning you'd have to spend time just on farming money. Yes, there were those dailies around the dragonmaw clan, but you needed to have an epic mount to even start those dailies, while dailies were something you wanted to run for the money.

You don't want to rush for raiding, don't rush for raiding. Play it at your own casual pace.

Offline Chris Brady

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #434 on: January 21, 2011, 07:03:53 AM »
No, I was having fun during BC.  The raids were tough, yes.  And the Heroics could be tricky and required memorizing the boss patterns, but we could handle it.  And I'm a casual player, not anywhere near the hardcore required it seems for Cata Dungeons.  Not Heroics, the BASIC dungeons.

I've been kicked out of about 3 groups.  One of which, after I topped the DPS chart, for being an Arms Warrior.  the other two saw my Server name, called me a Failmooner and dumped me.  Of the other 11 I've run, only ONE was fun, and that was because I was filler for an all Guild group from another RP server.  And worse, of those eight, people keep dropping at the sign of a bad run, usually mid-fight with a Boss.

I'm literally terrified of trying the Heroics.  But what else is there to do at 85?  Tol Barad is a waste, as it's so geared to the Defenders it's not fun.  And Blizzard mentioned that the 90% win cycle was not what they had planned for it.  Only reason it switches hands on my server is because one side has more players asleep, so they can have half a chance.

Offline Vincent

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #435 on: January 21, 2011, 07:09:07 AM »
Chrisc... moon guardian or feathermoon?

Offline Lyell

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #436 on: January 21, 2011, 09:37:51 PM »
I thought Tol Barad was a different kind of zone battle than wintergrasp in that it only allowed as many defenders to queue as offenders. Was I misinformed?

Offline Vincent

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #437 on: January 21, 2011, 09:52:32 PM »
Nope. numbers are within 10 or so i think.

Offline Lyell

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #438 on: January 21, 2011, 11:15:21 PM »
I suppose that's not horribly imbalanced except with a coordinated group on the larger force. ...maybe.

Offline Zaer Darkwail

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #439 on: January 22, 2011, 03:43:23 AM »
Tol Barad itself is broken atm. It strongly favors defender so that so long there is no retards in defender group you cannot loose Tol Barad. As attacker needs capture all three bases to win the game. Easiest way prevent is that zerg group attacks one captured bases, then once foes defeated they then move zerg next location and leave regiment of 'hold back' defenders to delay return capture. Then keep repeating the cycle until 20 minutes have passed (as your supposed to ignore siege engines which destroy towers and give attacker +5 minutes each extra time cap 3 bases).

Upcoming patch fix is that if you got 2 bases capped the capping the third will be much more faster and easier. But I would suggest that instead make bases harder to attack so they cannot be zerged so fast in first place. Perhaps add npc's or siege weapons to help defenders hold back force which is egual to their or only 1 1/2 bigger. Or add spawning gates which need be nuked down by siege engines (would add further purpose to them besides destroy the three extra time for towers).

As note using siege engine batter gate down is automatic, you just need 'park' the siege engine to front of the gate which is meant to be breaken down and there are 3 gates. So if only one gate down the defenders can focus block the leak but if all three gates down; then easier to zerg the place.

Offline Esoteric Myobi

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Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #440 on: January 22, 2011, 09:04:43 PM »
I just started playing WoW again recently since a friend had gifted Cata to me for Christmas. Sadly, he's rarely on lately so I was wondering if anyone else here plays on the server Eldre'thalas? Probably unlikely but I figured it wouldn't hurt to ask and see. =)

Offline LunarSage

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #441 on: January 22, 2011, 09:52:28 PM »
Sorry, Thunderhorn here...

Offline Saerrael

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Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #442 on: January 22, 2011, 09:53:32 PM »
Sha'tar (EU), here.
'sides that, I'm kind of a loner >.> <.<

Offline Zaer Darkwail

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #443 on: January 23, 2011, 04:12:52 AM »
Ravenholdt (EU) here.

Offline Shjade

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #444 on: January 23, 2011, 11:59:43 AM »
Not difficult.

Open. Mutilate to 4 or 5 combo points. Rupture. If rupture adds a combo point, Slice and Dice; if not, Shiv, Slice and Dice. Mutilate. Arcane torrent for energy to Mutilate to 4 or 5 points before Slice and Dice wears off; Envenom to boost that 1 point Slice and Dice to max duration. Vendetta. Mutilate to 4 or 5 points. Rupture. Mutilate to 5 points. Cold Blood. Envenom. Mutilate to 4 or 5 points. Rupture. Mutilate to 4 or 5 points. Envenom. Mutilate to 4 or... ...at -35% target health, replace Mutilate with Backstab.
Fixed.

On a US RP server, myself. I like the heroic design this time around much more than LK's dungeons, but I have to agree with Chris Brady: player attitudes in the random dungeon finder are shit to deal with a good amount of the time. I doubt I'll still be playing by March, but that's okay, I only came back for a few months to check out the world changes anyway.

@Saerra: raiding really is better if you raid with people of like minds. If you're hardcore, raid with hardcores; if you're more interested in having fun, raid with folks who do it for fun. If you have clashing interests you will be immensely frustrated by raiding. In my case, though, even raiding with people I really got along with well didn't help - I still burned out pretty fast (~6-8 months) on raiding simply because I hate how it turns the game into a job: farm materials for flasks and food, make sure all gear is gemmed/enchanted to the max at all times, study these strategies for bosses to know how to not die, and most importantly dedicate X hours on Y day to Z raid without interruption. That last one was killer. I play the game to have fun; I do not want to be obligated to play it. That defeats the purpose.

But it's unavoidable. You can't just pull together a successful raid "whenever." It takes some time and scheduling to get even 10 people together long enough to make significant progress through a longer raid instance (one-shots like Onyxia, Magtheridon, etc. not so much).

Old raid content, on the other hand, is kinda fun as a challenge to see how small a group you can do it with. For instance, just this week I led three people who had never been inside SSC before through the whole raid. Did you know Vashj can be 4-manned? I sure as hell didn't think so. Oh sure, the two combat phases are a cakewalk, but gathering up the tainted cores from around the rim of that huge platform with only two people (healer and one ranged dps were at the center trying to stem the infinite tide of elementals toward Vashj and manage striders - good lord the striders) was still quite a fun challenge even at 85. And it was kinda fun being the raid leader by default, given I was the only one who'd been through the instance before (back when I was raiding in BC) and had to explain all the fight mechanics. We also got Kael'thas with six and cleared into Hyjal as far as Azgalor with only three, and a healer and my rogue duo'd into BT as far as Teron...of course after that point in raiding you just need more bodies since the mechanics auto-kill people every X seconds. Cheap bastards. *shake fist*

Anyway. Raid instances themselves can be fun, but the things related to raiding - the people, the organization, the upkeep - are what really tend to bog it down.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2011, 12:02:36 PM by Shjade »

Offline Vincent

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #445 on: January 23, 2011, 12:08:39 PM »
Duoed kara at 80 with a prot pally and a shadow priest. we spent 2 hours on opera.. oh lord that was fun.... didn`t do netherspite  tho

curiously enough, what Rp server you on?

Offline Zaer Darkwail

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #446 on: January 23, 2011, 01:22:00 PM »
Ravenholdt (EU) is RPPVP server, altough this case RP occurs only random (rare) occassion or done by specific guilds.

Offline Callie Del Noire

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #447 on: January 23, 2011, 06:34:12 PM »
The upcoming changes look to make some of the procs even lower in outcome. I'm nervous to see what is coming. Of course I've been working on school so much that I get on once a week or so.

Offline Vincent

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #448 on: January 23, 2011, 06:39:38 PM »
Moonguard is a normal Rp realm, but hot damn we PvP! You go into a Bg and see moonguard members with the highest damage, healing.. Kills.. fewest deaths...

Offline cryptkeeper0

Re: WoW: Cataclysm. Can you wait? o3o
« Reply #449 on: January 25, 2011, 06:43:08 PM »
I'm loving my worgen along with playing with my gf worgen character too  I'm a resto druid on farstriders (rp server)