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Author Topic: No FFXIII Thread Yet?  (Read 1242 times)

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Offline Niki315Topic starter

No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« on: March 15, 2010, 04:05:16 PM »
Final Fantasy XIII anyone?  I've been playing it recently and it is a lot of fun so far.  The most impressive thing about it so far is just how gorgeous the graphics are.  Occasionally I just move the camera around and hold back tears.  It's really a beautiful game. 

What do you guys think about it?

Offline Silk

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2010, 04:30:23 PM »
Seems to be a fairly average game so far, graphics are great, voice acting could be better (But HUGELY better than 12) Combat is ok would be nice to control everyone rather than one person, Story alough engaged is a bit too linier for my taste. And the characters themselves just don't strike me as people. Their personalities go beyond anything you would otherwise expect from someone.

Offline Jude

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2010, 04:53:10 PM »
I'm really liking it.  I'll admit it doesn't have the best story in existence, but I like Sazh and Lightning, only Hope really really annoys me.

Crystarium is cool, the game gets better as you go as far as linearity and sidequests go.

It's not for everyone though, some people won't be able to handle no exploration until 25 hours and the lack of traditional towns.

Offline Niki315Topic starter

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2010, 05:26:56 PM »
I was having issues with how overly dramatic and personified the characters are.  Every single one seems to be the epitome of a specific archetype, but slowly they seem to mellow out and I found myself really getting into the characters as much as I have in other games.  I've never played XII myself, but everyone who has tells me that XIII is far and away better. 

The storyline actually kind of feels like a novel or a movie rather than a video game.  It seems to progress at a pace that I'm more comfortable with when reading a book, but instead there's a whole bunch of battles in between.  I can't really say I don't like it, but it feels a little strange to me. 

At first I really didn't see myself getting so attached, but after a while I'm finding myself clinging to it like I do with most of my other favorites.  I think Lightning really makes this game for me.  Every time the game shifts to someone else's perspective I'm antsy waiting for the next chance to follow Lightning again.  And though I disliked Hope at first, I'm really starting to like him now.  The character that I warmed up to last was actually Snow, but that might have to do with how little time they focus on him.

As for the battle system, I originally resisted it and tried my hardest to play it like older games, but then I found that it is actually really fun to shift paradigms.  I find the rating and timers for every battle kind of exciting since I'm trying to take on enemies that are exceptionally difficult for characters of my level, but complete it in enough time to get a decent rating.  The battles that I dislike tend to be the ones where you're forced to switch someone to Sentinel mode to survive.  I really don't like being forced into that strategy, but for some reason they set up enemies that do more than your party's accumulated HP in one spray, so you have no choice.  But other than being hammered into unsatisfying attack roles, the system has become very entertaining.

The Crystarium leveling thing is reminiscent of the Sphere Grid from X, but more limiting.  I kind of like that they don't let you become more powerful than a specific benchmark for a scene.  This is kind of the opposite of most RPGs where you can just grind until you're strong enough to defeat the enemy, but it's my preferred method.  I don't like being stronger than my enemy.  I prefer needing to devise an attack plan and time my attacks just right to win the day.  So, while others may not like this aspect, I find it to be a great improvement.

Offline KieraHaroden

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2010, 05:28:22 PM »
I brought the xbox version for my partner the day it got released in the UK. He loves it - is on it daily! Although I think he's a bit unhappy with the storyline, and the fact that it is so completely different from the other FF's. That isn't a bad thing, of course... at least 13 isn't boring. But, he gets annoyed by how hard it is to make money, as the monsters apparently don't drop gil like in the other FF's. The graphics are absolutely amazing, from what I have seen by watching him play. And oh so pretty!

Mixed feelings on this one, I'm afraid to say. 'Tis a shame, as some of the other FF's are absolutely amazing (7 and 9, of course!) :D

Offline TheWriter

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2010, 09:48:58 PM »
I can't believe no one's made a post about how badly they want Vanille to jump off a cliff yet.  A FF character hasn't annoyed me this much since Rinoa.

That said, like 8, I can look past one bad character.  New battle engine is superb, I like the idea of staggering enemies, especially all the cool stuff it opens up for a Commando, like launching and juggling, but that is coming from a fighting game tragic.  I got used to Paradigms fairly quickly as well.  The Crystarium system isn't restrictive in and of itself; that falls more on the lack of resources available to the player.  Slow CP gain, very low income and inconvenient parties early on in the game were the main problems for me.  A fun game, but not easy to compare to other FF games.

And to everyone saying it's better than XII... wow.  As far as I'm concerned, XII is at least the third best ever.

Offline Inkidu

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Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2010, 10:05:33 PM »
I read somewhere, "A brain-dead monkey could operate FF 13's battle system.".

Apparently you can auto-battle your way through nearly every encounter and come out smelling like roses. I haven't played it myself, and I want to like it but I'm not going to fool myself into trying to think its awesome (Twelve). I can see 13 being the death of the series for me and it will go silently into the night.
Renting it this weekend.

It got a 7.6 on GameFaq's Reader Review Average. A little disheartening for the pedigree.

Offline Tsenta

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2010, 10:13:39 PM »
Wherever you read that they've never made it far in the game, later on you're basically forced to pick abilities, shift between roles, etc just to even have a CHANCE at surviving. Those who do the "FF13 isn't FF" or "FF13 is all automated" Probably only played a few hours in.

It ticks me off, if someone's going to judge a game play through it first. Not just what one experiences the first few hours in! :/

Offline Archivist

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2010, 11:43:54 PM »
I will be the first to say "Vanille, go jump off a cliff"

According to my friend who is more versed in Japanese culture then I am, her little squeaks and grunts are supposed to be cute, to make her more adorable. Which I can see, and maybe it's just lost in translation, but damn.. half the time the girl sounds like a whoopee cushion and I just want to slap the shit outta her.

Hope's my fav so far, but his single-minded "punish Snow" mindset is kind of annoying. Lightening, little too stoic but I'm only a couple hours in. I hope the Crystarium takes a turn for the better, because right now I have almost everything available maxed out across all roles, but it's just so damn linear.. I hate that I might have two Ravagers, but only one knows Thunder. And then they get split up. And every... damn.. enemy.. has a Thunder weakness. *facepalm*

That having been said, I'm completely enjoying it and don't intend to stop playing for, oh, the next year or so :D

Offline Niki315Topic starter

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2010, 11:39:29 AM »
I've definitely noticed money being a lot harder to come by, but in the same regard, items aren't as necessary as they used to be.  Maybe you only get 2000 gil throughout a chapter, but you don't need to heal out of battle, you don't need to recover MP or anything, and character deaths are few and far between once you get the Paradigm system down.  As long as you're quick enough on the draw, you can switch to a healer any time the HP bar goes red.  The only thing I found money useful for was buying upgrade items, which you can collect as you would money in the other games.  The drops are just harder to come by than a steady amount of gil after every battle.  To be honest, I think that being able to reliably grind out money just makes things too easy.

At first I was more annoyed by Vanille's half-accent.  It shifted from strong to non-existent frequently, and it was driving me insane.  Her being extremely bubbly was kind of weird too.  I can only really say I dislike her because she's taking away play time from Lightning, who is my fave.  I'm probably gong to have to cosplay her; she's such a badass.

There were a couple parts early on that were frustrating for me also.  Since I rely on staggering the enemy, when I have a 2-char party without a commando, it takes serious timing to raise the chain gauge and forces you to rely on the second character to actually do the majority of the work.  Also, as I mentioned before, I really don't like the Sentinel play style.  For such a high-action battle system, waiting to cause damage until the enemy hits you is a severe drop in entertainment.  Maybe I'll unlock an ability, that makes it better later, but so far, it's not very fun for me.

Not to get off subject with XII but I have never met anyone who liked it o.o()  I haven't played it, but my circle has a lot of issues with it.

I've been hearing a lot of reviews about the game and almost all of them are negative, but after playing it for a while I really do find the game to be entertaining.  Maybe it can be a little easy at times, but in every game since IV there were points where you could just walk through the game spamming the attack button.  You'd get to a boss or a hard mob, and then have to work a little, but it wasn't hard by any stretch of the imagination.  XIII just automated a lot of the menu flipping and stuff and let you focus on switching paradigms instead of waiting for the character with cure spells to be ready.  It diverted your attention from the non-perspective character and let you focus on the enemy.  I find every battle to be kind of like a time trial, which has become a lot of fun for me. And Tsenta has it right when it comes to surviving battles later on.  You have to pay attention to what you're doing and switch your paradigms or you will die because every once in a while, they throw in an encounter which is much tougher than most of the rest of the fodder.  These aren't even necessarily bosses, but there's enough HP that you can't just take'em out easily, and they do enough damage that you can't just go all out on damage.  So auto-battling through those is pretty much impossible.  As for what a brain-dead monkey can do... what can't they do?

The party-splitting thing is just to give you play-time with each character and let them all have their moment as the perspective character.  It also forces you into using certain Paradigms that you otherwise probably wouldn't use.  But having been forced into them, I actually found out how useful they are.  Every role has a use, and the combinations you can make can be extremely useful if done right.

And the enemy weaknesses change over time, like all the other games.  You start out in an area weak to lightning, then find a place weak to fire, and so on and so forth.  Some things never change.


Offline TheWriter

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2010, 12:13:24 PM »
Not to get off subject with XII but I have never met anyone who liked it o.o()  I haven't played it, but my circle has a lot of issues with it.
Last post I'll make on it, but about XII for a second.  Personally, I thought it had the best battle engine of any FF game to date, including XIII.  Monsters roamed around a huge play area, and if they attacked you were always straight in the action; no battle swirl, no loading time between battles.  Not only that, the later monsters got smart; ambushes, pack hunting, same field of vision as the XIII enemies have...  The Gambit system essentially let you write your own Paradigm for each character; you could make it as simple or as intricate as you liked.  You could turn them on and off mid battle as well, change them on the fly.  On top of that the game was gorgeous for PS2 graphics, and the world was fleshed out to a great degree.  It's probably an acquired taste, but I hope to see more like it.  And if you're lucky enough to have a mod chip, there's an English patch available for the Japanese-only International version, which is even better.  Only VIII and IX top XII of the ones I've played.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2010, 12:16:17 PM by TheWriter »

Offline Jude

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2010, 01:21:30 PM »
The whole auto-battle thing is true for the beginning of the game.  All you really need to do is attack and use potions.  However, even then you're rewarded for finishing the battle quicker (which you will do if you input commands manually well).

After about 2 hours in, using paradigm shifts effectively is not only a good idea, but absolutely necessary to win many fights.

People regularly get stuck on bosses and have to ask for help, they game really is difficult.

Battle system/difficult is what it does best, I'd say.

Offline Inkidu

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Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2010, 08:54:23 PM »
Wherever you read that they've never made it far in the game, later on you're basically forced to pick abilities, shift between roles, etc just to even have a CHANCE at surviving. Those who do the "FF13 isn't FF" or "FF13 is all automated" Probably only played a few hours in.

It ticks me off, if someone's going to judge a game play through it first. Not just what one experiences the first few hours in! :/
I know where you're coming from, but I know where he is too. Yes you should judge it pretty far in, but if it was like twelve, I couldn't make it six hours in without saying, "I quit." Both legitimate points. I'm going to have to see for myself I know.

Person A says the battle system is the flaw.
Person B says the story is the flaw.
I personally am not liking the idea of extremely archetype characters. Though that is Japan to a T. I think I can manage if some other things pull the weight.

Offline Will

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2010, 11:56:45 AM »
Wherever you read that they've never made it far in the game, later on you're basically forced to pick abilities, shift between roles, etc just to even have a CHANCE at surviving. Those who do the "FF13 isn't FF" or "FF13 is all automated" Probably only played a few hours in.

It ticks me off, if someone's going to judge a game play through it first. Not just what one experiences the first few hours in! :/

And yet, if the first few hours of the game are no fun, I think that's a legitimate beef.

Offline Lady Annabelle

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #14 on: March 17, 2010, 12:57:26 PM »
And yet, if the first few hours of the game are no fun, I think that's a legitimate beef.

I have to disagree with you there.

Is a movie bad because the first 30 minutes are bad?
Is an album(Yes, I'm old) bad because the first two songs are not listenable?
Is a TV show unwatchable because the first few episodes are terrible?

When it comes to RPG's, you have to digest the whole journey before you can make some sort of opinion.  RPG's aren't throwaway games that last 10 hours.  Most of them take 40-60 hours, so if the first 2 hours are terrible, then that is such a small amount of time.

To be honest, anybody who makes a snap judgment on a game without playing it all the way through is kind of short sighted.  I can't tell you how many games I have played that started off terrible and then ended up as a great game.  (Suikoden III)  Or games that started great and then kind of dissipated over time.  (Final Fantasy VIII)

Offline Will

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2010, 01:05:01 PM »
Is anything bad because one part of it is bad?  Not usually.  But is that one thing/part still bad?  Yes.  And sometimes it IS bad enough to ruin the whole deal. If not for you, then for someone else.

Also, how many bad hours are we talking?  I've seen someone say 6, then 3, and now 2.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2010, 01:08:09 PM by Will »

Offline Niki315Topic starter

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #16 on: March 17, 2010, 01:37:48 PM »
I can kind of agree and disagree with how you feel about digesting the whole rather than a few minutes.

If the gameplay is so awful that I can't make it through 4 hours without being frustrated, then there's no way I can enjoy the story.  I think most gamers will give a storyline a shot if the gameplay is acceptable, but if they can't stomach the mechanics of the game, then the story won't necessarily force them to stick around.  Games have a different standard to hold than movies or books.  The active roles in video games force an engaging experience in more ways than passive roles in any other form of media.  Games (well maybe not sports or fighting games) need an enjoyable interface and an enjoyable storyline to be considered good.  A great story can be overlooked simply because the game is too hard or too complex or too annoying.  A great interface might be overlooked if the plot is the same ol' same ol' story that's been done a million times. 

FFXIII's system isn't awful, or difficult, or complex.  Many people might find the game to be a little too easy, but that at least allows people to enjoy the story.  It gives a more action feel than an RPG feel, but it's not something I can say is a bad thing.  I haven't completed the game yet, so I can't make a final decision on the story.  It's a little rocky at the start, but it definitely feels like a Japanese RPG.  Will the story be better than other FF games in the end? I don't know, but if it is, then it would definitely kick the game up a notch.  I could seriously see a reviewer giving it a 7-8 rating based on less than 15 hours of play time, but I think there might be some bias based on the Final Fantasy name.  Because it is a Final Fantasy game it's expected to be a certain way, so trying something new usually upsets the masses.  If this game were released without Square Enix's name, and the advertising it got, people would be raving about it being a great new style.  It would receive excellent ratings and might even be a real hit.  But then again, a lot of people wouldn't be so focused on playing it without the Final Fantasy name, so you gotta take what you can get.

And as for about how long it's bad, it kind of depends.  I think the first four hours all feel like a tutorial to an experienced gamer.  The game really starts to shine in the tenth hour or so, mostly because the story picks up the pace.  But it is about 4-6 hours of the main characters feeling awkwardly stiff.  Usually though, this is offset by the fact that there's a few characters you do like and the time is split up between all of those characters.  So probability-wise, you're looking at 1.5-2.5 accumulated hours depending on which characters you don't like.

As far as challenging gameplay, it's not consistently challenging.  It kind of has a wave to it.  There's really easy, easy, then moderate, then a tough battle.  Sometimes that tough battle is actually a really tough battle if you don't set up your paradigms right.  The boss battles vary.  Some are actually really easy, others take a lot of paradigm management to make it through.  Others, you won't be able to make it through at all without specific paradigms.  Mostly, those battles require you to use a Sentinel for the DR and provoke, otherwise you can't survive certain attacks.  I've even tried specifically waiting for the second the attack is about to hit and have my medic cure and my main use potions (with the Doctor's Code accessory) and it's just not enough. 

Offline Inkidu

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Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #17 on: March 17, 2010, 04:20:02 PM »
I have to disagree with you there.

Is a movie bad because the first 30 minutes are bad?
Is an album(Yes, I'm old) bad because the first two songs are not listenable?
Is a TV show unwatchable because the first few episodes are terrible?

When it comes to RPG's, you have to digest the whole journey before you can make some sort of opinion.  RPG's aren't throwaway games that last 10 hours.  Most of them take 40-60 hours, so if the first 2 hours are terrible, then that is such a small amount of time.

To be honest, anybody who makes a snap judgment on a game without playing it all the way through is kind of short sighted.  I can't tell you how many games I have played that started off terrible and then ended up as a great game.  (Suikoden III)  Or games that started great and then kind of dissipated over time.  (Final Fantasy VIII)
I'm going to have to disagree.

A movie is two to four hours long.
An album can be skipped to the good songs.
And typically if you're watching more than five episodes of a show you don't like you actually do like it.

You can't really make a comparison when a game is asking you to invest 40 plus hours into it. No matter how relative the time played is in comparison to the work. I think people have the right to make "snap" judgments when they have sincerely tried to play the game. I tried on seven different occasions with and without the strategy guide to play Twelve. I found it honestly unpalatable as a Final Fantasy game. It was boring and uninspired when you compare it to its predecessors.

I think people who have actually tried to play a game and just can make it through it have as much an opinion, and as valid a one as anyone else.

Edit: Square-Enix knows as well as any other media company that  you need to hook your consumer. You have to make them want to turn that page. What Square-Enix gets to do is rely on its die-hard, never-hear-otherwise fan-base to play through whatever they want; don't say it isn't true.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2010, 04:32:47 PM by Inkidu »

Offline pleaseteaseme

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #18 on: March 18, 2010, 09:37:10 AM »
Some of the dialogue is so cheesey in this...."Mom's are tough!" " Here comes your hero!".  XD

Even so I'm throughly enjoying it.

The battle system takes a little while to get used to (not as good as XII's in my personal opinion), but I've never felt bored playing it. I'm up to Chapter 9 now and the story is starting to go into full swing, for sure it lacked a little around the early chapters, but looking back they have a much different meaning now other things are known.

Offline LIAR

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #19 on: March 18, 2010, 05:09:12 PM »
I like the characters for the most part. They're kind of extreme, but who would care what they have to say if they were boring? Certainly not me.

The battle system is pretty 'meh.' I dislike not being able to control the actions of everyone. I dislike how speed is rewarded (though I'm 5 shining stars 90% of the time.) I dislike the paragidim system. It's not hard, but it certainly isn't interesting. I prefer micro-managing, I suppose.

Love the graphics. Voice acting isn't terrible. Kinda disappointing so far that it's 90% movie, 10% walk through mobs, but I love to watch it. I'm deinitely engaged.

I'd say I'm enjoying my play time.

Offline Inkidu

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Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #20 on: March 19, 2010, 03:29:20 PM »
I've rented it and am about five hours in. So here's my opinion:

Better than 12 in every possible conceivable way. That's not hard.

The battle system is engaging but I wish they gave you a kind of wait option. Just to slow it down a tiny bit. It's hard to think of the strategy you need sometimes so you end up switching into medic mode and botching your time. I looked in the settings menu and didn't see anything like that.

Characters, dialogue. Not the worst. In fact the characters in Infinite Undiscovery were much, much worse. I have actually no problem with any of them not even Hope or that other chick I can't be bothered to spell. Sahz is by far my favorite.

The story isn't hard to get you just have to be willing to read a few datalog entries here and there.

EDIT: In light of new evidence, I am very close to declaring this the second-worst Final Fantasy there is. I have fought Odin twenty times, and lost half of the fights within what would constitute a first turn. Making a game ridiculously hard does not make it good. I'm going to go strategy hunting now I suppose. Cheap-ass Norseman.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2010, 07:25:36 PM by Inkidu »

Offline Archivist

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #21 on: March 21, 2010, 12:55:13 PM »
The Eidolons are definitely frustrating as all get out.. it feels like they took all skill out of those battles and substituted finding the one thing that makes them happy and doing it. Highly disappointing..

Well I have no idea how many hours in I am, but I made to to Pulse and have some new gripes. Number 1, chiefly, that there are a number of enemies both boss and normal, that use AOE spells... how easy would it be to station up a Sentinel, then walk the other two away from him and keep clear of that damage? Noooo, there is NO way to move your characters within the battlefield to avoid that AOE damage. Really Square? By the same token, there are a number of attacks and spells on your side of the fence that provide AOE damage or heals... yet there is no clear indication of when enemies are within that area. I usually leave it up to the computer with Auto-Attack to determine if Blitz or Fira is more effective then Fire, but that just frustrates me that I can't control my own characters.

Next, stupid AI... why, I ask you, would you continue to use Cura, something that is healing 250-400 health on two people, when the only person who needs healing is my poor Sentinel standing over there with 1,000 points of damage on you? Stop healing my Commando, and fricking get some Cures on that boy!

And finally... Pulse. WTF.. can I get an amen here? The fights to this point were easy to middling, decent amounts of CP, and overall.. doable. Enter Pulse. Everything here is stacked to the gills, armored, or nigh on unkillable. I fought one fight that took me six minutes, and when I finished I saw that it had 13 budgeted for the fight. There are brontosaurus-like things (I don't know the name because they scare the living s**t out of me) that look like they'll stomp me and I'm done. There's giant Juggernauts squirreled away in side-passages that one-shotted my entire team. And then, on top of all that, the Crystarium took a nasty turn where everything is taking 6,000 - 10,000 CP just for one square. I suddenly feel like a bug under a magnifying glass :(

Overall... eh, I'm still playing it. I want to see where this goes, and I gotta say that despite all those rants, the challenge has me single-mindedly focused on it.

Damn you Square...

Offline pleaseteaseme

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #22 on: March 21, 2010, 02:09:44 PM »
One thing I would of liked in the battle system is to see the ATB charge gauge for the other members of your party, would make it a little easier. The number of times I've switched in my medic in desperation, and had to then wait for their bar to fill....knowing how far it is would help with strategy!

Offline Braioch

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Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #23 on: March 21, 2010, 04:28:14 PM »
I'm trading mine back in, screw this game, it has done pissed me off to no end and I don't want to finish it >.<

Offline Archivist

Re: No FFXIII Thread Yet?
« Reply #24 on: March 21, 2010, 09:33:50 PM »
Another complaint.. why is it the first time you switch Paradigms in a battle, they have to show each of your characters changing colors, WHILE the bad guys are still attacking? I can't count the number of times I've switched from an offensive to defensive Paradigm, and had my healer/party leader die in that 5 seconds. Every other time, quick little announcement and on your way.... wtf....