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Author Topic: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]  (Read 258616 times)

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Offline LunarSage

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4950 on: February 16, 2012, 06:38:17 AM »
For the piracy thing... that only applies to PC games, right?  I'm not even sure it's possible to pirate a console game.  You'd have to have an official disk, right?

Offline Capone

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Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4951 on: February 16, 2012, 06:42:32 AM »
You can pirate console games, but it requires you to modify your game console. The Wii is the easiest of the consoles to mod, partly because Microsoft hired an actual team of modders to continually mod the 360 so they knew how to update it to be unmoddable. Sony was easier to mod when it had Linux on their, but they removed that, which caused a whole shit storm last year (and possibly what led to the hack in general).

However, on the console side, companies are more worried about Used Games. I have a whole argument for both sides on that. I think Used Games as they currently are, well, they're fucking terrible, but the companies are treating the problem incredibly wrong.

Offline SabbyTopic starter

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4952 on: February 16, 2012, 06:44:03 AM »
Nah, Xbox piracy is as big as PC piracy, and it's usually more accessible if you have the right equipment. Basically, all it takes is one worker sneaking a disc out from the factory and boom, the games online, weeks before release, and you don't even need to burn it to a disc to use it, just load it on a hard drive and attach it to the modded 360.

Offline LunarSage

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4953 on: February 16, 2012, 07:04:36 AM »
You can load entire games onto your console's hard drive?!  Wow.  Unbelievable.  I guess coming from the NES generation I never expected consoles to have turned into actual computers.  I'm a damn relic of the past.   :-(

Wait... what is wrong with used games?  o.O

Not everyone has 70 bucks to casually drop on a video game.  If used game sales were outlawed, companies like Gamestop would likely go under.  I'd be willing to bet most of their sales are used games.  Who wants to pay new price for a game when they can pay significantly less for a used one?

Offline SabbyTopic starter

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4954 on: February 16, 2012, 07:16:42 AM »
Used games sale are coming under fire more and more for the same reasons this SOPA rot is getting support. Because an intellectual property is floating around out there and there's no way to track whose looked at it or touched it and so can't charge them appropriately. It's a symptom of industry struggling to adapt to changes in the market, and the things they are trying to implement to 'fix' the problem is just poorly thought out to say the least.

Things like online passes, exclusive content that can only be unlocked with a fee, or making you sign up for the companies own special online service. All this serves to do is punish honest consumers, and drives them to piracy. Being made to pay an additional 10 bucks because you had the gall to buy anything other then a vacuum sealed copy of the companies newly printed game is just stupid, and locking off access to the full game and forcing a subscription, paid or otherwise, to play it online and off... you get what I mean.

Basically, when a game hits the store, the company loses it. It's gone. Whether it's returned and resold, ends up in the trash or gets traded between a few friends, the company has lost it. They sold it to the store and that's all they will see of it. And this rubs them all kinds of ways, all of them wrong.

Offline LunarSage

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4955 on: February 16, 2012, 07:37:40 AM »
That's fucked up.  You don't see Home Depot trying to continue to make money off of the toilet they just sold you.  Why do the video game manufacturers think they're somehow special?

Offline Sel Nar

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4956 on: February 16, 2012, 08:30:34 AM »
Because the largest culprit in that 'battle', Activision-Blizzard, has as its president a former 4Kids Entertainment Executive.

Offline SabbyTopic starter

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4957 on: February 16, 2012, 09:21:53 AM »
This way, anyone who wants Catwoman in Arkham City, or to play the multiplayer past level 10 in Homefront, has only two ways to get at it. Use the code that comes in the box, or pay for it. So, they see some kind of money after the initial sale, but this isn't like DLC >.< Ideal paid content after sale is something along the lines of Fallout 3, an extension to the game with a certain amount of original content. This, on the other hand, is holding core parts of the game for ransom. I was especially peeved with that Catwoman thing, as that was a central character who had an important role in the story, and if you didn't get the content, her appearances often didn't make sense.

Offline Hemingway

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4958 on: February 16, 2012, 10:14:13 AM »
This trend we're seeing against the sale of used games really has only one explanation, and that is greed. That may be a very unoriginal observation, but I suspect many people will actually defend it, saying it's not greed, but rather companies getting the money they deserve.

But as LunarSage said, why are games special? A lot of games today simply aren't worth holding on to, no more than a movie or a book. So obviously some are - I wouldn't dream of parting with my Hemingway novels ( who would've thought? ), and I wouldn't dream of parting with my copy of, say, Mass Effect. But a game like, say, the Darkness 2, that's very linear and has limited replay value and no multiplayer to speak of? You can't possibly justify taking away peoples' ability to pass that on. Better to admit that you want the money of consumers who have too much money to spend anyway.

The great tragedy, of course, is that the consumers could affect the industry, if they just cared enough.

Offline Capone

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Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4959 on: February 16, 2012, 08:36:27 PM »
That's fucked up.  You don't see Home Depot trying to continue to make money off of the toilet they just sold you.  Why do the video game manufacturers think they're somehow special?

Home Depot gets to put more than $5 mark-up on that toilet which earns them more profit. No matter what, people always need toilets. People always need toilet seats. People always need toilet handles, and all those jiggers inside that make it work.

It's like used car sales. Yeah, the car company makes money off of the car once, but that car company is also cashing in on every replacement part required to fix it, and especially makes money if you happen to use one of their licensed mechanics who probably has a financial deal with them in order to get first party parts.

Video games...don't have that advantage. The studio gets to sell one copy of that game and that's it.

My biggest problem with it is how GameStop is so incredibly aggressive with it. I bought Gears of War 3 new on day one of release, and inside was a flyer telling me to trade it in for $30 credit (50% of what I paid just that day, which honestly don't seem like a fair trade to me). GameStop doesn't care what condition you keep that game in (Hell, they don't care the condition THEY keep it in), as long as they can sell it for $25 mark up. They're making a killing.

They also have the industry duped with all this reservation jargon. Reserve a copy of the game and get this bonus content, guaranteeing you buy it new! Yeah, okay, and guess what? That $5 you just dropped to reserve that game? GameStop has it sitting in a bank accruing interest.

GameStop is seriously friggin' evil, and they have no interest in the companies or the employees that work for them. Bobby Kotick may be a cock mongler, but there's a lot of good developers out there trying to feed their families, and are stressing out 80 hours a week to do it. And in the end, even if they make a rock solid game, their studio might go under. Perfect example: while it wasn't perfect, I actually liked Pandemic's The Saboteur. It was fun. But, before the game even hit store shelves, the studio was shut down.

The games industry IS struggling, and it deserves what money I can toss my way.

BUT!

At the same time, I really think the industry needs to consider other options.

1) No other entertainment medium costs this much. It should be $30 for a new game instead of $60, but because old SNES and N64 games sold at upwards of $70 (no joke, games didn't get more expensive, they actually cost less to buy as inflation went up), they are deciding to keep the old way. As a result, their market on release day is limited to the enthusiasts, the smallest possible market they could cater to.

2) Moichandising. Guess how much money Rovio makes off of all those Angry Birds plushes, pillows and back packs? A shit ton. What about video games? If you're lucky, you get a t-shirt at Hot Topic. If you're more lucky, you get a McFarlane action figure. If you're Microsoft or Valve, your merchandise the shit out of Halo and Portal and realize that making money is easy as shit when you can license products and put your stuff up on ThinkGeek. Hell, I bought the fucking Resident Evil Deck Building Game on a whim because it was $30 and had Resident Evil on there. Now it's become an excuse for my friends and I to hang out more often because it's fun as Hell.

3) Release multiple prints. The thing that pisses me off most about companies hating on Used Games is there's no alternative most of the time. The biggest AAA games get multiple prints and shipments, sure, but I bet you'd be hard pressed to find the first Bioshock, Dead Rising or Darksiders brand spanking new on store shelves. Is it really that expensive to print a fucking disc and ship it?

Of course, this is going to be null and void soon enough. Digital Downloads are on the rise, and Steam has made the most money by putting games on sale. So, yeah, hopefully soon enough this won't be worth bitching about.

Offline LunarSage

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4960 on: February 16, 2012, 09:11:52 PM »
I hate the idea of digital games.  I like to have something physical that I can count on.  Programs on your hard drive can get corrupted, erased... any number of bad things can happen.  Then what happens?  They probably make you buy the game again.  I don't trust digital like I trust an actual disk.  I wouldn't buy a download of a PC game that I could have a physical box and disk(s) for either.  I also dislike that digital games require you to be on XBox Live... I'll stay offline with my console (mainly because I don't have an extra $80 laying around to buy a wireless plug in thing for my XBox).

Offline Capone

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Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4961 on: February 16, 2012, 09:26:29 PM »
Well, like it or not, the fate of the future is Netflix Instant: all your media stored on someone else's hard drive that you pay a monthly subscription for.

Of course, that's a bit further down the line to be widespread, but the way I see it everyone's going to subscription based cloud-computing at some point. No one will own the movies, music or games they use. It will all be streamed online, but you'll have a vast library at your fingertips. The only problem will be if you stop paying, you lose access.

For a lot of us that grew up owning physical media, we'll think we're losing something. To the younger folks that grow up with this change, they'll wonder what we were thinking cluttering our homes up with all that space-consuming junk.

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Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4962 on: February 16, 2012, 10:34:13 PM »
Well, like it or not, the fate of the future is Netflix Instant: all your media stored on someone else's hard drive that you pay a monthly subscription for.

Of course, that's a bit further down the line to be widespread, but the way I see it everyone's going to subscription based cloud-computing at some point. No one will own the movies, music or games they use. It will all be streamed online, but you'll have a vast library at your fingertips. The only problem will be if you stop paying, you lose access.

For a lot of us that grew up owning physical media, we'll think we're losing something. To the younger folks that grow up with this change, they'll wonder what we were thinking cluttering our homes up with all that space-consuming junk.
That's probably not going to happen. It's like assuming communism will work; and no I'm not comparing it to communism. The point is that there are too many different kinds of people in the world, but in this case a cloud-based rental company (which you're in essence describing) probably will never catch on to the oldest, most prevalent type of person on the planet: The Owner. Humans have the love of things called property, and believe me, on some level even your Steam junky thinks they own their games.

The owner puts a lot of value on the things they own. It's intrinsic to human nature. The idea of cloud rental is just too insubstantial to a large number of people out there, and this isn't just one generation against another. I could draw back to the communist Vs. capitalist times. The large number of people when they own something want to keep it. It's too ingrained in our nature. From Babylon to Brooklyn, people will want to own stuff, especially stuff they ascribe special value to.

So we might end up with more platforms like Steam that let people buy their games, but as for universal media rental replacing ownership... good luck.

Offline Wyrd

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4963 on: February 16, 2012, 10:36:57 PM »
I'm currently playing Conker's Bad Fur Day... Just... Just thought I'd throw that out there.

Offline SabbyTopic starter

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4964 on: February 17, 2012, 01:23:50 AM »
I got Dear Esther, and I can't play it :( I open it up and the screen turns black. Says I'm out of analogue range. I'm a 60, it's a 74.5. No clue wtf that means, so I google it, and find easy instructions to change my refresh rate, buff it to 75, which makes my computer look like a 3D movie minus the glasses. Turn the game on. No good.

I read somewhere I need to set my monitor to force the refresh rate to stay at 60, but I have no idea how and I've fiddled with the buttons and found no option for it.

Offline Hemingway

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4965 on: February 17, 2012, 04:57:33 PM »
I finally beat Metal Gear Solid 4, and so I've played them all. It was a good game, too, but damn hard. Story-wise, it was a bit lacking compared to some of the other games, though the ending was pretty good. I mean the actual ending, after the credits, with snake standing at Big Boss' grave.

Snake Eater remains the best game of the series, no contest at all. It has the best characters, it has the best story, the gameplay is slightly dated but it's really just a matter of getting used to it. It is one of the best games I've ever played. I'm not even going to bother trying to explain why. It just gets everything right.

Edit: Wolfenstein is 75% off on Steam.

Guess I know where I'll be getting my next fix.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2012, 05:00:42 PM by Hemingway »

Offline Capone

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Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4966 on: February 17, 2012, 09:50:27 PM »
That's probably not going to happen. It's like assuming communism will work; and no I'm not comparing it to communism. The point is that there are too many different kinds of people in the world, but in this case a cloud-based rental company (which you're in essence describing) probably will never catch on to the oldest, most prevalent type of person on the planet: The Owner. Humans have the love of things called property, and believe me, on some level even your Steam junky thinks they own their games.

The owner puts a lot of value on the things they own. It's intrinsic to human nature. The idea of cloud rental is just too insubstantial to a large number of people out there, and this isn't just one generation against another. I could draw back to the communist Vs. capitalist times. The large number of people when they own something want to keep it. It's too ingrained in our nature. From Babylon to Brooklyn, people will want to own stuff, especially stuff they ascribe special value to.

So we might end up with more platforms like Steam that let people buy their games, but as for universal media rental replacing ownership... good luck.

I think it's more like people will find value in different things, and that entertainment will be viewed more casually. I mean, look at how big services like Pandora, Grooveshark and Spotify even became.

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Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4967 on: February 17, 2012, 11:58:41 PM »
I think it's more like people will find value in different things, and that entertainment will be viewed more casually. I mean, look at how big services like Pandora, Grooveshark and Spotify even became.
As long as people push the big-screen TV and Blu-Ray player, and there are always going to be those kinds of luxury items, subscription-bawed media will never replace the ownership method. People want a return in the investment. :\

I think the trend will move to more downloadable stuff in regard to gaming. The Xbox of tomorrow might simply install games onto its massive hard drive. I'm not saying rental won't become more sophisticated. They might have a rental price or a rent-to-own method, but there will always be people who want to own it, and as far as I can tell they're the majority. They always have been.

Offline Capone

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Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4968 on: February 18, 2012, 07:25:10 AM »
That's the thing, I'm saying as time progresses. First will be digital download services. I know Gabe Newell himself has been quoted saying that subscription based services are the future, and at the time I shook my head and said "no way". Now, however, I'm thinking he may be right. Sure, I like to own movies, but partly because you can't get everything on Netflix Instant yet. Plus, I was raised a collecting geek. That's just what I do.

But I wouldn't be surprised if things start to shift within my lifetime. I just don't know how long it will take. The big problem with changing technology is, even if the technology is ready, the market usually isn't. We could have started doing all digital downloads already, except the market can't wrap their heads around the concept entirely.

Offline Hemingway

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4969 on: February 18, 2012, 09:03:58 AM »
What is this crap. In Wolfenstein, aiming along the x axis is a lot more sensitive than the y axis, and there's no separate sensitivity setting for the two.

This is why the PC Gaming Master Race hates what consoles are doing to gaming. Yeah, that's right, I said it!

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Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4970 on: February 18, 2012, 09:56:07 AM »
That's the thing, I'm saying as time progresses. First will be digital download services. I know Gabe Newell himself has been quoted saying that subscription based services are the future, and at the time I shook my head and said "no way". Now, however, I'm thinking he may be right. Sure, I like to own movies, but partly because you can't get everything on Netflix Instant yet. Plus, I was raised a collecting geek. That's just what I do.

But I wouldn't be surprised if things start to shift within my lifetime. I just don't know how long it will take. The big problem with changing technology is, even if the technology is ready, the market usually isn't. We could have started doing all digital downloads already, except the market can't wrap their heads around the concept entirely.
I'm not really disagreeing, but the market isn't the only problem to consider. Technology itself is also grossly insufficient. It typically is for the stuff like this.

The number one thing technologically speaking is that the infrastructure just isn't there. Even in America there are large rural areas that couldn't support the high demand of data flow needed to make this work. I know that I myself can barely get onto XBL to download my pre-order content sometimes. This probably isn't going to change because of two reasons. Internet is privately serviced. There is no universal internet provider.

Two, as it stands now work fills the time allotted. That is to say even if the world gets an extra gillion petabytes, it will be used up nearly instantly leaving some people to go without.

Since the whole of a country isn't going to move to the high-density areas where internet is most prevalent (i.e. New York, Seoul, Tokyo, etc) the groundwork just isn't there, and honestly unless there's some great technological breakthrough in cables or servers I don't see it happening. There's just only so much data that can be moved over so much cable to so many places at any given time.

Honestly though, I'd rather have a jet pack and live on the moon.

Offline Capone

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Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4971 on: February 18, 2012, 10:53:52 AM »
What is this crap. In Wolfenstein, aiming along the x axis is a lot more sensitive than the y axis, and there's no separate sensitivity setting for the two.

This is why the PC Gaming Master Race hates what consoles are doing to gaming. Yeah, that's right, I said it!

As a console gamer, I take offense to that. I hate that particular situation as well, especially when I cannot adjust it, and hate when I can't shut aim assist off.

Then again, I've been playing since I was three to five years old, as opposed to hopping on the band wagon when Call of Duty became cool.

I'm not really disagreeing, but the market isn't the only problem to consider. Technology itself is also grossly insufficient. It typically is for the stuff like this.

The number one thing technologically speaking is that the infrastructure just isn't there. Even in America there are large rural areas that couldn't support the high demand of data flow needed to make this work. I know that I myself can barely get onto XBL to download my pre-order content sometimes. This probably isn't going to change because of two reasons. Internet is privately serviced. There is no universal internet provider.

Two, as it stands now work fills the time allotted. That is to say even if the world gets an extra gillion petabytes, it will be used up nearly instantly leaving some people to go without.

Since the whole of a country isn't going to move to the high-density areas where internet is most prevalent (i.e. New York, Seoul, Tokyo, etc) the groundwork just isn't there, and honestly unless there's some great technological breakthrough in cables or servers I don't see it happening. There's just only so much data that can be moved over so much cable to so many places at any given time.

Honestly though, I'd rather have a jet pack and live on the moon.

This is all true, but I'm not ruling it out as being impossible. Then again, I like to think of a future where I can have an entire touch panel wall in my house.

Offline Chipotle

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4972 on: February 18, 2012, 11:22:35 AM »
As a console gamer, I take offense to that. I hate that particular situation as well, especially when I cannot adjust it, and hate when I can't shut aim assist off.

Then again, I've been playing since I was three to five years old, as opposed to hopping on the band wagon when Call of Duty became cool.

I really enjoyed Nintendo, Sega, N64 and XBox 1 growing up...I never owned any of them, just played at friends' places all the time.  However, I also grew up with a PC in my home and I have become an avid PC gamer along the way.  I just like having my games, web browsing, e-mail, homework, tools etc all in one place.  And Steam is definitely my favorite gaming product.  It's just simple convenience and value.

Anyone play Elder Scrolls III and IV? I loved growing up with these fantastic worlds to explore. I can't afford V yet, but I'll play it a year after everyone else like I do with most games, I suppose...takes the edge off the price.

Offline Hemingway

Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4973 on: February 18, 2012, 01:41:06 PM »
As a console gamer, I take offense to that. I hate that particular situation as well, especially when I cannot adjust it, and hate when I can't shut aim assist off.

Then again, I've been playing since I was three to five years old, as opposed to hopping on the band wagon when Call of Duty became cool.

I'm not sure why it should offend you that I point out that computer games are getting consolized. If I'd said, "I hate console gamers because PC games are bad console ports", I could understand that you'd be offended, but then my statement wouldn't make any sense. I'm upset because they don't even bother adapting the controls to a PC when they turn their little console games into PC games. It's not even difficult, assuming you can find the config files, to change it. There's absolutely no pretense of even trying to make a PC game.

Offline Capone

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Re: What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]
« Reply #4974 on: February 18, 2012, 01:58:14 PM »
Sorry. I've been around so many people that say "consoletards" that I'm used to such remarks always meaning the console version is dumbed down because console gamers are allegedly stupid.

I also meant the "I take offense to that" to sound more like a joke. My bad.