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Author Topic: It's Labor Day in the US  (Read 296 times)

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Offline OniyaTopic starter

It's Labor Day in the US
« on: September 03, 2018, 11:30:18 AM »
Many people don't think much about Labor Day.  It's a day for back-to-school sales, last-backyard-barbecues of summer, and someone's probably running a big sale on mattresses.

Many people have no idea why it exists, other than these reasons.

Stonekettle can give you some back-story.

On your days off, on your lunch breaks, when you are sending your kid off to middle school instead of to a factory, when you get paid in something that can be spent outside the company - remember the people who fought for this.  This is what Labor Day is for. 

And some people will probably never understand.

Offline RedPhoenix

Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #1 on: September 04, 2018, 01:29:42 PM »
It's sad how labor unions and the labor movement has been so vilified in our country. People seem to think that praying for the benevolence of oligarchs is the only way to avoid misery anymore.

Offline RedRose

Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2018, 03:57:46 AM »
Very interesting. I'm so confused about all the days, boxing days, labor day, awareness of ____ day, chocolate day LOL. We basically have mother day, father day, and that's it.

Offline stormwyrm

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Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2018, 04:49:39 AM »
Most of the rest of the world celebrates Labour Day on May 1st. I wonder why the US doesn't follow suit.

Offline Deamonbane

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Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2018, 05:55:06 PM »
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_Day#Labor_Day_vs._May_Day

Short story appears to be because it's a socialist holiday.

Offline HannibalBarca

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Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2018, 10:56:14 PM »
Quote
Short story appears to be because it's a socialist holiday.

Educating other Americans about what the word socialism actually means, and how much of it we already have here and take for granted, is one of the things I gladly do.  Things are changing.  The younger generation is much more accepting of it.  By the time my son is my age, things may be very different, and in a good way.

Offline Lustful Bride

Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2018, 12:15:19 PM »
Educating other Americans about what the word socialism actually means, and how much of it we already have here and take for granted, is one of the things I gladly do.  Things are changing.  The younger generation is much more accepting of it.  By the time my son is my age, things may be very different, and in a good way.

Haven't the meanings and realities of Socialism, Communism and Capitalism actually changed overtime? I swear I saw a discussion once about how these three systems have changed from what they once were but people treat them as if they are the same as they were a hundred years ago.

Offline HannibalBarca

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Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2018, 10:07:41 PM »
As human societies have evolved, so have economic systems.  At their core, they're still the same things.  There are more varieties of them, though.  People continue to mislabel them out of ignorance or deception.  Most Western economies are mixed--some combination of socialism and capitalism, and economists know this, but most Americans don't even know what a mixed economy is. 

I mean, even the USSR admitted they weren't really communist--they were headed in that direction...supposedly.  It's hard to say they were even trying to be socialist when they had an elite in their country, which, ironically, was the 10% of the population that had membership in the Communist Party.  They were certainly a command economy, combined with a dictatorship as far as a political system.

Offline RedRose

Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2018, 06:23:22 AM »
I have noticed online that MANY Americans seem to think socialism = communism and/or = close to dictatorship. I may not vote socialist, I cannot understand this. I have never seen anything scary about socialism. It has nothing to do with gulags and Stalin. I've lived under a socialist President. As I expected there was no big change lol.
There are some who go as far as opposing social security and stuff. I'm not saying the state owes you Chanel glasses. I'm just saying if your country can afford it you shouldn't pay for blood or life saving meds or lose your home for surgery. If you can get more than that, good too. Not even touching on fake news that "Europe" (using that words is a tell-tale sign often the person has zero clue) re-use bandaids and needles or that "there is socialism in national socialism so it's the same".  ::)

Offline Lustful Bride

Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2018, 09:23:05 AM »
I have noticed online that MANY Americans seem to think socialism = communism and/or = close to dictatorship. I may not vote socialist, I cannot understand this. I have never seen anything scary about socialism. It has nothing to do with gulags and Stalin. I've lived under a socialist President. As I expected there was no big change lol.
There are some who go as far as opposing social security and stuff. I'm not saying the state owes you Chanel glasses. I'm just saying if your country can afford it you shouldn't pay for blood or life saving meds or lose your home for surgery. If you can get more than that, good too. Not even touching on fake news that "Europe" (using that words is a tell-tale sign often the person has zero clue) re-use bandaids and needles or that "there is socialism in national socialism so it's the same".  ::)

I think part of the issue is because the most famous examples of those systems tended to be very bad people who proudly proclaimed that they were Socialist and Communist. So it left a stain upon those ideas that always force them to be remembered alongside some very bad people, and it leads into a sort of feedback loop where the stereotype is that only horrible people use those systems, and everytime some cruel dictator comes from a country that is primarily Communist or Socialist it reinforces the stereotype.

I had a good example of how this works but I lost it... I hope what I explained makes some kind of sense.

Offline OniyaTopic starter

Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2018, 09:39:42 AM »
I think part of the issue is because the most famous examples of those systems tended to be very bad people who proudly proclaimed that they were Socialist and Communist. So it left a stain upon those ideas that always force them to be remembered alongside some very bad people, and it leads into a sort of feedback loop where the stereotype is that only horrible people use those systems, and everytime some cruel dictator comes from a country that is primarily Communist or Socialist it reinforces the stereotype.

I had a good example of how this works but I lost it... I hope what I explained makes some kind of sense.

The former 'Union of Soviet Socialist Republics' would probably be the best.  After all, anyone who grew up during Cold War I had it drilled into their head that 'USSR = Russia' and 'Russia = Bad Guys'.

I like to remind people of the DPRK and former DDR. (North Korea and East Germany, respectively, both of which feature 'Democratic' in their names.)

Offline stormwyrm

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Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2018, 09:42:23 AM »
The difference between a republic and a democratic republic is like the difference between a jacket and a straitjacket.

Offline OniyaTopic starter

Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2018, 09:54:33 AM »
Yes - but this is probably the only context in which 90% of that generation heard the word 'socialist/socialism'.  Just because a dictator claims their country is [descriptor] doesn't mean that it is.  (Odds are,  it isn't at all.)

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2018, 10:51:01 AM »
Or as TV Tropes calls it, aPeople's Republic of Tyranny (Fire in the hole!)

Quote
the more words implying freedom the name of this "republic" sports, the more oppressive and generally un-free it is likely to be.

Offline RedRose

Re: It's Labor Day in the US
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2018, 07:08:46 AM »
OK I see. If you asked a random French guy about Stalin's politics, he would say "communist", not socialist. About Hitler, he'd say "extreme right wing" or out of the system. I personally do not see those exemples as socialism, even if they use the name, or if it's in their name (nazi). I actually lived, gasp, in a communist city for a while. I didn't know until someone told me. I checked and yes, communist mayor. I mostly really found him great and wondered what made him "communist". I think anyone can use any word, and especially nowadays labels are blurred. I DO understand that communism can scare, though I don't understand those still living in the cold war.