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Author Topic: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?  (Read 7465 times)

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Offline TheGlyphstone

Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #50 on: December 04, 2015, 01:44:33 PM »
I’ve never considered one race’s skin to be more beautiful than the others. This idea of some sort skin beauty pecking order has eluded me even in my more closed minded days. I’ve never had a issue with my roleplay partners playing different races than my own. So the idea that someone would not play with a character specifically because of their skin color is very alien to me.

As far as the real life BDSM communities, I belong to the Master/slave community and I am proud that we are a devise community. I’am proud to know Mama Vi, Master Taino, Sir Guy, Lady D and the men of ONXY and have them in my community.

If I might take the moment to brag, getting the chance to actually meet and talk to Mama Vi has been one of the highlights of my life. She is one of the most well known and respected women in Leather and if you are lucky enough to meet her you will understand why. The work that she and her wife are doing with the Carter Johnson Library is, I think, one of the most important projects currently being done in the BDSM community and is something that will benefit all of us.

One a side but important note, here is a link to SirGuy’s speech at the 2015 Master/slave Conference about the history of African Americans in the M/s community.
https://fetlife.com/users/33478/posts/3230080

Can you quote/excerpt it for those of us who don't have a FetLife account?

Offline ThePrince

Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #51 on: December 04, 2015, 02:00:24 PM »
Sure, keep in mind it is a lot.
Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
This Labor Day weekend, Master Taino, MTTA and the Master slave Conference 2015 extended to me the privilege of speaking briefly about the history of African Americans in M/s and on the 20th anniversary of ONYX, a Leather brotherhood geared toward Men of Color. The following is that speech.

Building Community is the theme of this year’s Master/slave Conference and it is an important thing. The analogy of building is an apt one. When we think of building we think of construction and, particularly in the Master/slave community, we think of structure. The best structures have a firm foundation. When the foundation is weak, then it doesn’t make a difference how much time, money or effort is put into the building. It makes no difference how unique or diverse the materials put into the edifice, if the foundation is not sound, it will not stand.

Along these lines, if we are to build community, we have to start with a strong foundation. In the case of the M/s and Leather communities, our history is where we get our foundation. Without that history we would be unable to stand. And without knowledge of that history, we as a community and as houses and families and relationships will be standing on shaky ground.

“If you don't know history, then you don't know anything. You are a leaf that doesn't know it is part of a tree. ” ― Michael Crichton

One of the key aspects of Leather tradition is the preservation of history. Whether it be the history of organizations, of clubs, families or our own individual histories, keeping account of the people who make up the many groups that are known collectively as “community” is vital to our future survival. Indeed, not only can we learn from past mistakes, we also learn from past successes and, if we are smart, we can build upon them. Expounding upon what Mr. Crichton said, some of us have branch knowledge, but we don’t have root knowledge.

This is one reason why the Carter Johnson Leather Library and Collection and the Leather Archives and Museum have proved to be so vital. They are a living, breathing history of all that we value as people of Leather, as members of the BDSM community and as a part of the Master slave community. We can see art, literature and memorabilia, true, but we may also see the struggles of individuals as well as groups of us, the obstacles that were overcome and the progress that was made. In addition, it allows us to see what progress we must still make.

In creating a foundation, one must use care in its construction. We cannot ignore any elements of its composition or it will not be strong enough to support anything built upon it. The same is true when we look at our community history. If we ignore one element of it, then we are bound to weaken all of it and what comes after will not succeed. For a very long time, the history of People of Color in the M/s and Leather communities have been ignored, or simply not known. However, if this edifice we call community is to stand, and more importantly, if we are going to be able to build it into something stronger, we have to pay attention to all of the elements upon which it stands. George Orwell stated this in his book 1984, when he said, “The most effective way to destroy people is to deny and obliterate their own understanding of their history.”

People of Color have long been an integral part of our Leather and M/s history. The people for whom the Carter Johnson Leather Library are named are examples of this. In addition to being the catalyst for the library which bears their names, Jill Carter became the first African-American International Ms. Leather in 1996 and used the platform afforded to her by the title to collect memorabilia and money that ultimately led to the opening of the Leather Archives & Museum – which you will hear more about soon. Ms. Carter was the recipient of the Pantheon of Leather Woman of the Year Award 1998 and 2001, The National Leather Association International Order of Merit and Lifetime Achievement Awards, and many other awards for her devotion and care in building long-lasting parts of the foundation upon which we all sit today. Her partner of over 40 years, Viola Johnson, affectionately known as “Mama Vi”, is also iconic in the community as an activist, author, archivist, mentor and educator and has a lengthy resume of contributions to our communities that are almost too numerous to list including helping countless women figure out that only when you consider breathing optional can you properly wear a corset. Her effort in building our foundation has been recognized as well with the NLA and Pantheon of Leather Lifetime Achievement Awards, a Lifetime Achievement Award from Black BEAT, and even an award here at MsC – the slave heart award. Both of these women continue to give of themselves to ensure that those who are here today building additions to our community understand the materials they are building with and we would do well to honor that work.

While many of us know of Jill Carter and Mama Vi, the foundation of our community is filled with many People of Color upon whom this structure has rested. The late Jack Jackson was the only president ever of, The Eulenspiegel Society, or TES, the oldest BDSM support and education group in the country, for almost ten years until he passed away in 1983. He was a Leatherman and a Master and was among the first to utilize the media to demystify and destigmatize BDSM back in the late 1970s and early 1980s. His interviews and photographs appeared in media outlets like Hustler magazine and the Columbia University newsletter. He was a trailblazer in this regard, speaking freely about power exchange relationships at a time when it was very taboo. He was even called upon by NYPD detectives in sex crime cases involving rope bondage to testify as an expert witness as to whether the perpetrator was an amateur or someone intricately familiar with rope. Morgan HMQ (Her Majesty the Queen) is a member of the Imperial Court and was a board member of The Eulenspiegel Society for 27 years, earning emeritus status. In the 80s, HMQ was central to the founding of the Dominant Women’s/submissive men’s group that still meets at TES and she was instrumental in building the foundation for the TES parties which many of us still enjoy monthly. There is also Graylin Thornton, Mr. Drummer 1993, and the only African-American to ever hold the original title. Thornton has spent decades speaking out about People of Color in the community and encouraging their involvement. He also produced the first Ebony in Leather Contest in 1991 and serves as an Emeritus National Board Member for the Leather Leadership Conference.

Many of us are most aware of our M/s traditions and structures dating back to the 1970s and though we often don’t think about it, People of Color have always been a part of that structure. Way back in the late 1960s there was a society called OBEAH, which was a BDSM related Black supremacy group. They did not allow Black subs or dominant whites. In the late 1970s they published a magazine that included images of Black domination and white submission called OBEAH: Society of Black Masters and Mistresses preaching the “natural superiority” of Black men and women. Images of Blacks in power exchange relationships appeared at that time, with the fabulous Mistress Mir among a select few. Also, The Ohio Players were well known for their imagery of women and men in chains and in domination and submission scenarios on their album covers. These sensuous photographs and their sexually charged lyrics made it alright for Black people to enjoy that side of their persona. Marvin Gaye’s Masochistic Beauty from 1985, sings about an M/s relationship, wherein he utters the tender lyrics, ““Shut up...You nasty little slave, kiss my feet. Put your face right here and start to eat.” These are a few bricks in that foundation that helped to build this community.

Our Leather title holders have in many cases been seen as leaders in our community based upon their stands on issues and the causes they represent. In 1984, International Mr. Leather, one of the preeminent Leather contests crowned its first Black titleholder, Ron Moore. Unfortunately, it would be exactly 30 years before it was to happen again, when Ramien Pierre became International Mr. Leather in 2014. Because of the lack of representation of Men of Color in the Leather contests, in 1991, the aforementioned Graylin Thornton and Gregory Adams started the Ebony in Leather contest which later became “Mr. Ebony Leather” in Chicago, produced by Cain Berlinger. It lasted until 2003. In 2004, Mufasa Ali organized the Leatherman of Color contest which was won by Jack Tatum. Back in 1999, in the New York/New Jersey/Connecticut tristate area, a group was formed for Leather men of color and those who wished to learn more about the Leather lifestyle and BDSM. It was called The New York Panther club. The website Dark Connections which contains information on Black groups, munches and Black BDSM history started in 2003, as did the group Black BEAT (which stands for Black Expression Alternate Tastes) which included an educational component. International Master and slave 2010 titleholders Master Obsidian and slave namaste have proven a force as authors and educators, mentors and leaders, not just in the M/s community but in the greater community as well. These are all just a few more of the many building blocks securing diversity in the structure of the foundation that was to build a representative community.

Black-Boricua Taíno, queer performance artist, activist, filmmaker, lecturer and sex educator Ignacio Rivera once said that the term “inclusion” implies that you weren’t thought of in the beginning, thus the need to be included. It says that we weren’t a part of the original concept. While People of Color have always been a part of this broad foundation, it is easy to see how some could think otherwise.

One organization that has sought to correct this misconception is ONYX. In 1995, the year of the Million Man March, the O.J. Simpson trial and a record breaking heatwave in Chicago, five bold Leathermen who were men of color got together for a noble purpose. Maybe they were the reason for the heatwave in Chicago that year! Mufasa Ali, Stephen Bailous, David, Nate and Wes got together to form a group to establish a safe space for men of color to explore, be educated and thrive as kinky people. The group was not started to be separate from the Leather community but to help men of color ease comfortably into the Leather community. These forward thinking men were concerned that many men of color in the Chicago area were not connected to nor familiar with other men of color who were into BDSM or the Leather lifestyle and they sought to remedy that. Since their inception in Chicago twenty years ago they have been at the forefront in the Leather community, providing guidance and leadership, not just to their core group of Leather men of color and their admirers, but to the entire community. From their small beginnings in the Windy City with the original Midwest chapter, we have seen them expand to the New York/Northeast region, the Mid-Atlantic region, the Southeast region, with new chapters building in the Northwest and Southwest. Everywhere you see the men of ONYX they are conscious of their commitment to People of Color in the Leather community, and to the broader community as well. The Men of Onyx have organized fundraisers for Leather and other alternative charitable organizations. They have volunteered as a group to feed the homeless. You will see them prominently at volunteer posts at the various Leather Pride Nights, Folsom Street East, The Imperial Court’s “Night of a Thousand Gowns”, at contests like IML, MAL and IMsL. In addition to their charity and volunteer work, ONYX is deeply committed to education of the history and traditions of the life we live. With their combination of learning and fellowship at events like the upcoming Blackout, and in their chapters, they help contribute to the building of community. It’s not just at ONYX venues that you will see this at play. ONYX members have recently been on panels and presentations at the Woodhull Sexual Freedom Summit, Black BEAT Conference, the BDSM Writers’ Conference, and the Leather Leadership Conference and of course, right here at the Master/slave Conference. So while many will laud their parties, which are fabulous, by the way, what is more important is that for two decades, ONYX has reached out to take an active role to take those who may have felt marginalized from the Leather and M/s community and to give them camaraderie, education, guidance, a sense of tradition, and a sense of pride in who they are. They help create leaders and that is an important part of building community. This is why we celebrate this beautiful part of our community that has been building community for 20 years and shows no sign of slowing down.

The people and organizations I mentioned are only a very small sampling of the myriad of People of Color who have been building blocks for this community. I could stand here for hours naming names and their accomplishments and I would only scratch the surface of their vast contributions. They illustrate the need for us to expand our view of community. As these members of our family have proven through outreach, education, leadership, mentoring and the preservation of traditions and values, a strong structure of community that transcends race, culture, sexual preference, and gender identity can be built. We have a wonderfully diverse foundation upon which to build. Only by honoring ALL of the foundation builders and ALL of our collective histories can we truly make our house as strong as possible and build a community that lasts.

Offline la dame en noirTopic starter

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #52 on: December 04, 2015, 02:09:14 PM »
I read a little from my account on my lunch. Thank you :3

Offline Wolfling72

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #53 on: December 04, 2015, 02:21:36 PM »
*snippage*

So I ask you E, do you play in interracial pairings?

Are you curious?

How do you feel about this interaction and have you seen it before?

*snippage*

For the masses I am a DFAB multi-ethnic personage. What that means is I am cinnamon shaded with dark curly hair, full lips and a booty. (We won't talk about the bits that mark me as inherently female *BLECH*) I snipped most of your initial post so that I could respond to your queries:

1. I do NOT look for "interracial" pairings though MOST of my R/P's tend to end up that way (IF I am writing a romantic story or what have you). I prefer to write characters of color not necessarily BLACK but they have to have something about them that marks them as tan/brown/other than WHITE. For the most part? The race or ethnicity of my characters is never really brought up outside of a general description or picture. Why would it be? People are people and I have spent far too many years relishing my own preferences (brown skinned or dark skinned females, light skinned or white men) to really care about what other's prefer. My real world relationships are not fetishes, they are relationships. It works the same way (for me) when I write. I don't care to discuss why skin tones look better (or worse). I care more about why cultural differences exist and how hard it is for two disparate people to click if they come from two different worlds (And that is basically classism NOT ethnic play) The only time I consider something interracial is IF I am writing historical fiction based around the attitudes of the early twentieth century OR around the Civil War and even THOSE stories have to have more than racial differences to be interesting to me. (And THIS is STATED just the same way in my O/O's)

2. Therefore I am NOT curious in the least. I am the product of a mixed family, my preferences stem from that same mixed family and I don't understand the urge to break humanity down to skin tone and preconceived notions. That is just ME, your mileage may vary.

3. Finally, I never worry about the character's RACE or ethnicity when I am reading stories on E. My assumption is that people are writing about what they like...and a goodly portion of that is paler skinned peoples. If the story is well written? Any ethnicity can be easily inserted and STILL have the same feeling. IF it is sexualized or fetishized? Then I won't make it past the initial page and will never care about the people involved. *shrugs* Again, this is just me. Your mileage may vary.

As a side note: I am in my forties. Just about ANY racist thing that could be said, has been said, in my hearing. I've heard every single excuse as to why I don't fit what they meant or what the were trying to say...and at the end of the day, it matters NOT at all. Some people have never learned the idea that their preferences are not everyone's cup of tea and in the world of writing? Especially erotic writing? One has to accept that sometimes~ color, culture, sexual identity will be fetishized.

You then decide whether or not you can stomach it.

I can not. I won't do it to another and I will not allow any story I take part in (outside of the tropes I stated earlier) to devolve into that crap. I don't knock other people's JOY but for me it wouldn't be joyful and would only work to piss me off, so why involve myself?


Offline la dame en noirTopic starter

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #54 on: December 04, 2015, 02:34:50 PM »
I hope my words weren't taken offense. I probably should've been more concise about what I was getting at, but I was very frustrated. I do not rp interracial lay couples for the sake of kink. I do this to have a variety because of the demographic on E.

Offline Oniya

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #55 on: December 04, 2015, 02:45:33 PM »
I don't play outside my race for fear of getting it horribly wrong (fictional races notwithstanding).  'I know that I know not', as some philosopher once said.  However, I would not take it amiss if a partner suggested that their character was of a specific ethnic background, and would try to keep their personal descriptions in mind as I wrote.

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #56 on: December 04, 2015, 02:49:21 PM »
I don't play outside my race for fear of getting it horribly wrong (fictional races notwithstanding).  'I know that I know not', as some philosopher once said.  However, I would not take it amiss if a partner suggested that their character was of a specific ethnic background, and would try to keep their personal descriptions in mind as I wrote.

This is one of my biggest worries as well. It's only very occasionally I will play outside my race, and usually only because I feel extremely confident about how I want to portray them. Hell, I've had ideas that would require an interracial couple as the focus that I've not posted on E because I worry that I'm going to end up offending someone. It's not often, but I tend to like more extreme content in my rps, which means playing with darker aspects of humanity (content wise, obvi, not skin color-dark) and the things people get up to/do to each other and I worry that people will think that because I picture the couple being interracial, that I think all people of that race behave that way.

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #57 on: December 04, 2015, 02:53:32 PM »
I hope my words weren't taken offense. I probably should've been more concise about what I was getting at, but I was very frustrated. I do not rp interracial lay couples for the sake of kink. I do this to have a variety because of the demographic on E.

No darlin'. I knew what you meant and understood why you would be frustrated and bothered enough to start this thread. Basically I was answering your queries with regards to myself. *shrugs* Since I am particular about who I write with (and because I don't think of interracial stories as inherently interracial) I was just trying to explain WHY I feel the way I do.

(And I r/p kink for kink's sake but ethnicity has never been a kink for me. Making a male or female whimper because I am a bad boi is kink for me. That was the main thrust of my answers, I guess...and the main reason why I don't read many stories that are marked as interracial)

I don't play outside my race for fear of getting it horribly wrong (fictional races notwithstanding).  'I know that I know not', as some philosopher once said.  However, I would not take it amiss if a partner suggested that their character was of a specific ethnic background, and would try to keep their personal descriptions in mind as I wrote.

This is one of my biggest worries as well. It's only very occasionally I will play outside my race, and usually only because I feel extremely confident about how I want to portray them. Hell, I've had ideas that would require an interracial couple as the focus that I've not posted on E because I worry that I'm going to end up offending someone. It's not often, but I tend to like more extreme content in my rps, which means playing with darker aspects of humanity (content wise, obvi, not skin color-dark) and the things people get up to/do to each other and I worry that people will think that because I picture the couple being interracial, that I think all people of that race behave that way.

And this is the attitude I usually notice on E (which has been lacking on other sites) and thus why I enjoy writing here as much as I do...because at the end of the day, it's story and character building, NOT kink. The fact that you worry about coming across "Wrong" means that you think about it. Most places I've written? That was as far from being the case as to be non-existent.

Offline Emjay

Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #58 on: December 04, 2015, 08:56:47 PM »
As a visible minority and a TCK (Third Culture Kid) I write all sorts of characters from all different walks of life. I have always found it easy to connect with people from a wide range of cultures and religions and so I have always felt confident enough to write characters from all over the world. At the same time I haven't really experienced this sort of discrimination that some of you are describing. I may have experienced some ignorance but I always found that people were simply curious and when I answered their question they walked away knowing something that they hadn't beforehand.

When it comes to writing interracial relationships and those sorts of things, I personally am not attracted to a particular race or ethnicity and the same can be said of my characters. I do not seek out these pairings but they happen all the time because my characters happen to like someone of this or that race.


I don't play outside my race for fear of getting it horribly wrong (fictional races notwithstanding).  'I know that I know not', as some philosopher once said.  However, I would not take it amiss if a partner suggested that their character was of a specific ethnic background, and would try to keep their personal descriptions in mind as I wrote.

This is one of my biggest worries as well. It's only very occasionally I will play outside my race, and usually only because I feel extremely confident about how I want to portray them. Hell, I've had ideas that would require an interracial couple as the focus that I've not posted on E because I worry that I'm going to end up offending someone. It's not often, but I tend to like more extreme content in my rps, which means playing with darker aspects of humanity (content wise, obvi, not skin color-dark) and the things people get up to/do to each other and I worry that people will think that because I picture the couple being interracial, that I think all people of that race behave that way.

I can see where your coming from regarding culture. For example, playing a character from Beijing if you happen to be from Seattle but let's say you are American or British or whatever. Those countries have significant populations of minorities but just because someone's parents immigrated from India or they are African-American, doesn't mean that they aren't still American or British or whatever. The culture is still the same. A bit of research is all you need in that case.

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #59 on: December 05, 2015, 02:55:45 PM »
One of her peeves in Cosplay was "black-facing", where non-black cosplayers would basically do what it sounds like if they were going to cosplay as a character that happens to be Black (Mace Windu, Jacob from Mass Effect 2, etc). Her stance on it was that the race of the character shouldn't be what defines the character. And they way she said it was perfect. It pretty much embodies how I feel about roleplaying with characters of different races. Granted it is not quite the same, but the same concept and ideology was something I took to heart and embraced.

Ohh...ive actually seen that first hand in Baltimore at a small comicon they had there and I was left completely stunned when I saw it....I get what the guy was going for but goddamn its like this person didn't have that little voice in the back of their head that says "This is a very bad idea, don't do it." . He had painted himself up as the character John Blacksad, from the graphic novel Blacksad.

Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide

I think I  kind of get what he was sort of going for since John is a black cat, and in his world hes also sort 'Black'....*unsure how to explain it since they are all animals..the only humans are statues of angels.*......uhh the animal and such that they are is supposed to be like an allegory for their real world counterparts.

But anyway when I saw it I was just open mouth stunned and I just wanted to go around apologizing to everyone who saw this guy, and I didn't even know him.

It was just horrible to look at. And that wasn't even the worst part of that convention, when we got back to the hotel (though a 'motel' might be a better name for it)  we got questioned by the cops upon returning because while we were out someone there got shot in a robbery...ugh never going to a comicon in Baltimore again.

Looking back I think I was the only one who actually noticed the guy doing it so....I don't know...
« Last Edit: December 05, 2015, 03:00:22 PM by Lustful Bride »

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #60 on: December 05, 2015, 07:16:37 PM »
I find being from outside the US, I'm unsure of what terms are socially acceptable to use with people from the US relating to other races. I'm not even sure if it's socially-acceptable in the US to use the word 'black' if you're not, but I'll assume so since other people are.

I've written erotica with a black woman and hispanic men, but not black men or hispanic women, nor with anybody asian as far as I'm aware. I feel comfortable around black women, but I haven't known any black men closely. I would write with someone regardless of their race or gender if I wanted to write with them, but I also think I have a tendency to stick with the types of people I'm familiar with and feel I understand.


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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #61 on: December 05, 2015, 08:14:34 PM »
I find being from outside the US, I'm unsure of what terms are socially acceptable to use with people from the US relating to other races. I'm not even sure if it's socially-acceptable in the US to use the word 'black' if you're not, but I'll assume so since other people are.

I've written erotica with a black woman and hispanic men, but not black men or hispanic women, nor with anybody asian as far as I'm aware. I feel comfortable around black women, but I haven't known any black men closely. I would write with someone regardless of their race or gender if I wanted to write with them, but I also think I have a tendency to stick with the types of people I'm familiar with and feel I understand.

I grew up with some African Americans who didn't care and were fine with being called black. (Then again I grew up on a military base mostly surrounded by soldiers and they insulted each other for fun all the time so..maybe ive made a mistake.)

 But ive seen and met some who only use the term "African American" so...it sometimes slips out and I don't even realize it. But I never use it in an offensive sense. If anyone finds it offensive just let me know and I will edit my previous post.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2015, 08:16:03 PM by Lustful Bride »

Offline Dallas

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #62 on: December 05, 2015, 09:41:45 PM »
I typically don't like using the <Minority> American combo descriptor, but that's a completely different topic for me altogether.

Offline Caehlim

Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #63 on: December 05, 2015, 09:53:32 PM »
I find being from outside the US, I'm unsure of what terms are socially acceptable to use with people from the US relating to other races. I'm not even sure if it's socially-acceptable in the US to use the word 'black' if you're not, but I'll assume so since other people are.

I'm not really qualified to answer this myself, but just as a suggestion from my own personal experience. Even if you don't know the right terms, most people won't be as offended if you're sincerely making the effort to be polite and take people seriously if they tell you that they don't like a particular term being used.

Offline Dallas

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #64 on: December 05, 2015, 10:05:54 PM »
^ That's pretty much the gist. I was pretty much the only white guy in a Job Corps dormitory. People liked me because I was generally kind, I didn't poke my nose into other people's business and I didn't put on airs. I generally waited and felt my crowd out and picked up on what was acceptable and what was not. Turns out, a lot of people that aren't white also like to be treated like people first rather than a "special/different group" of people. Hence why I just never clung to the politically correct terminology. The only exception to this is the Native American. Because... well, "Indians" isn't the correct term for them. And simply saying "Native" doesn't make things very clear when trying to identify the ethnicity itself.

The only thing that drives me nuts with that is that it feels very inconsistent. Not only in terms of bundling ethnicities into one as if it were the exact same thing, but also it's like the equivalent of saying the Chinese and the Japanese are the same. Due to that inconsistency, I typically avoid those kind of phrases like the plague. ;D

The funny thing is, you can also be Black and live in this country as an immigrant from England (born and raised)... and people would still dub them "African American". I once new this guy from the Dominican Republic that actually got offended at being called African American, despite it being very easy for our culture to make the assumption due to the color of his skin.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2015, 10:17:06 PM by Dallas »

Online AmberStarfire

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #65 on: December 05, 2015, 10:35:01 PM »
Yeah I wondered that because not everyone coloured is from America. A lot of people aren't, and I'm not from America, so it's hard to know for sure without knowing someone's background and where they're from. I find it easier just to leave off discussion of race entirely for the most part and play whatever character takes my fancy.

Offline Wyatt

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #66 on: December 05, 2015, 11:05:17 PM »
I play and write interracial RP's with some frequency.  There is the forbidden lust/love part of things that entices me, as well as the aesthetic of contrasting tones of flesh.  I have written with partners who were Hispanic and  routinely played Hispanic characters, which was a wonderful fit since I am incredibly attracted to pretty much all women of Mediterranean ethnic backgrounds.  I GM a game outside of E which is based on a very 70's set of books, which makes sense since they were written then, which in canon form is all-white, but I tend to modernize the versions I run so that they are very multicultural, not for politically correct reasons, but because the books were written at a time that made them realistically incorrect.

On E I have had two experiences where interracial play has bothered me.  The first, and it is more of a class of experiences, has been potential writing partners who wish to write interracial, but want to make it derogatorily racist for fetishized reasons that make no plot sense.  A racist element to a US Civil War era forbidden love story makes a ton of sense and great writing, adding that element just to make the proposed story feel 'dirtier', no, that's not the kind of dirty I enjoy.  Have had to end discussions of RP's several times on that account.

The more bothersome experience was writing with a partner who experienced some of the same issues that caused this thread to be started.  She is a lady of color herself, but due primarily to those early experiences where partners turned her down when she played or proposed characters of color, she would only write white characters.  Her experiences were years ago and with people whom I do not feel represent the vast majority of writers on E, but I still found it quite upsetting that a writer was less willing to write characters who were black or brown because of it.

I don't think I have ever written an E tale with a partner who played a black female character, though I would certainly love to do so whether race was an element of the story or simply because that was who my partner chose as their character and inspiration for reasons unrelated to color/race as a major story element. 

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #67 on: December 06, 2015, 04:52:45 PM »
I've played and played opposite characters of different ethnicity's. I simply see it as one more facet of the character. While I might have a preference for particular characteristics, I certainly wouldn't turn someone down for not having the same ones. If the character is interesting, if the story has potential, then it's all good.

Offline Nachtmahr

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #68 on: December 21, 2015, 10:09:04 PM »
I'm honestly surprised that different races aren't brought up more regularly when looking through requests and what not, but I have seen a few. I guess I didn't realize how hard it could be to find partners for it though, as the (in my experience) vast majority of request threads don't state any specific preference. I guess a lot of people assume that "Generic Caucasian male/female" is just some sort of standard. I have to wonder if that's because it covers a majority of the sites users who have just never really thought about it before.

I like all sorts of people - Male, female, alternative, African, European, Asian, werewolves..

Diversity is fun!

Yeah, I guess I've never really thought about the whole race-thing being an issue before, but perhaps the fact that I'm attracted to all sorts of people has blinded me to this?

From what you're saying, it sounds a lot like the kind of thing us Lieges might run into, where some people are outright unwilling to play with us because they think that we're somehow different to everyone else, or that we require special treatment.

Personally I've been turned away by someone in the middle of planning a story, as they realized I was a Liege and then told me that they would play exclusively with "Bio-Females" so I reckon I know somewhat how you feel when someone looks at you and (perhaps unwittingly) says something that's actually extremely hurtful.

But yeah, all in all I don't mind interracial at all. I have seen some extremely gorgeous black women, and.. Well, this won't be my first time saying this, but I really like myself a big, buff black man. Dark skin in particular has a strong draw for me. Don't ask me why, but when I look at dark skin it just always seems strangely warm and inviting, where pale skin is more sort of.. I honestly don't know where I'm going with that.

Sometimes I think a lot of people are genuinely afraid of coming off as unintentionally racist though. Maybe people are afraid that if they suggest they'd like to see a black person as a Sub in a BDSM or Non-Con story  they'll be misunderstood and thought of as racist.
I think that the only time I sort of chickened out a bit with something like that was when someone requested that my character deliberately use racist slurs. That was a long time ago now, and I'll openly admit that it made me feel so uncomfortable that I just couldn't go through with it. And yes, the main reason for that was that I was afraid that someone else would read the story and assume that I shared the same opinion as my character. Obviously that's stupid, as I'd probably never object to using extremely sexist slurs in the middle of some heated S&M or Non-Con.. But for some reason, racism was just crossing the line for me.

Now, I hope I haven't waffled on for too long! I just kind of wanted to tell the lovely La Dame that I'm sorry that she had to experience something like that, and that if she should ever want to talk (About negative experiences, about life in general, or about the possibilities of working on some stories together) then my inbox is wiiide open!

Offline la dame en noirTopic starter

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #69 on: December 21, 2015, 11:19:57 PM »
I guess its harder for people to think about race if they're not constantly reminded that they're different in some way. Growing up and being told I'm different because of the shade of my skin has made race very apparent to ment. When I don't see characters in media, books, etc I want to put someone in there that can represent a black woman or woman of color. Representation matters a lot.

This is also why I prefer to play black women in roleplays. I've played plenty of European and Asian characters and I never saw anything different. So, I have to specify that I do intend on making my character black and if it offends or if the sight of dark skin and kinky hair is ugly and a turn off

Don't message me

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Offline Drake Valentine

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #70 on: December 22, 2015, 02:20:31 AM »
Quote
So I ask you E, do you play in interracial pairings?
Yes, Interracial, interspecies, all sorts of things really.

Quote
Are you curious?
See above.

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How do you feel about this interaction and have you seen it before?

Quote
I just recently had someone tell me that he didn't want to play alongside my black character because he doesn't like dark girls. He then procceded to ask if I would be willing to play a white or asian character. It struck me right in the heart. Not only do I play black female characters - because I just don't see enough in Literature, especially Fantasy - I am black. It hurt. I have been denied relationships and friendships simply because I do not fit the eurocentric standard of beauty. But in the same breath, I have been told that I am beautiful for a black girl because my skin isn't dark, my nose is small, and my lips are pout and not big. I have been told that I must be mixed because I am too pretty to be just black.

This is the kind of thing I have experienced time and time again. It has hurt my passion for writing and roleplay as well.

I often play in interracial pairings because - why not? I find everyone beautiful and the last thing I care about is what shade they are.

Do not really know what to respond here. I do not delve too deeply in others wishes. In reality, people will always have their various cliques or whatever. On E, there is a limit to such. Of course, anyone has any reason to be friends with whomever on the site or back in the real world; but on site is a more pressing concern given their behavior and how they act towards another as some things aren‘t tolerated here.

 It is a cold fact of life, and that is something that makes everyone human. We are not all perfect, we will not be accepted generally by everyone. The best advice is just to ignore it and go about your business. If this became something hateful or spiteful towards you directly as a writer, it would probably be something that should be informed to Admin/Mods as again, that type of behavior is not tolerated. Otherwise, if it is something light, than dwelling on it doesn’t really change things and some people just can’t be helped given the route they follow in life. If they don’t want to write with you, oh well, just mosey along. If they are a hateful wretch about it, that is another thing formally noted.

I don’t mind such pairings, as formally mentioned, but I am not the most ‘R’ rated of writers here on the site. I tend to take things to the extreme and always make certain that me and my partner’s are on level footing. I have written racism roleplay. I have written sexism roleplay. Though that is what it is, roleplay, and I generally tend to ensure my partner is fine with it and when in a group environment, give proper red warning labels to content. Hell, I even started doing such in my solo games, in case any wish to stalk me and may not want to come across any material that may rise to offend. Though, the warnings are there and well, I honestly don’t care afterwards if it bothers any other reader.

I personally have nothing against anyone’s ethnicity as in real life I dated various women of different skin tones, including dark. Skin color doesn’t make the person, the person’s character makes them who they are. Unfortunately, most people can’t see it that way. Similar can be thrown towards religion as well, but I will not stray too far off topic. The end subject, it is just how we are brought up and taught and learn as we grow older, at least the latter for the ones that aren’t too ignorant to see things different with age.  But opinions are what they are, opinions and everyone is entitled to theirs.

Offline Samael

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #71 on: December 22, 2015, 05:32:24 AM »
Having grown up in one of the colder European countries, it, at first, never bothered me that pretty much all of my RP was usually interacting with white characters (unless they were an entirely different race, i.e. elves, dwarves, etc), although in the last few years I've become increasingly aware of that fact, and even more of that there is a real limit on diversity available.

It also seems to me that a lot of people, out of fear that their character will not gather an interest, stick with the tried and successful method of just playing a white looking person. Unfortunately, while understandable, it deprives potential storylines of interesting and unique twists that would enrich them greatly.

Not to mention it takes away from making a cast more interesting.
Why can an Amazon in a DnD Campain not be black?
Why can the mighty, mysterious warrior who charges face first in not be Latin or Asian looking?
Why can the guy who goes up against a Lovecraftian tentacle nightmare not be Egyptian?
Why not have a group of South-African monster hunters come and visit the Netherlands in an attempt to hunt a demon?

I mean, simply from the aesthetics, a group of heroes of a diverse background would be a lot more appealing than a group of white people.

That's not even going into how interesting things could come from the cultural differences.
How would a black girl from L.A. react to meeting a Russian Werewolf in Moscow?
Would it be different than if the girl was from Tokyo? Or from Amsterdam?

I feel like there is a lot of untapped potential with the mixing and matching.
Wish it would be played with more.

Offline Lithos

Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #72 on: December 22, 2015, 05:46:05 AM »
I like exotics personally, so non-caucasian ethnicities (as where I live overwhelming  majority is caucasian) and even non human races are a bonus to me, at the same time I can see people wanting to focus only on one sort of ethnic pairing in their RP, some might prefer latinos, others might prefer caucasians, great many seem to prefer asians and so on. We have so many people at E though that I am fairly certain that no matter what one's preference is, there will be partners to play with.

For me personally, it is despite preferences not a reason to reject partner or RP though, it is rather small thing among all the other attributes that make an interesting character.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2015, 05:50:44 AM by Lithos »

Offline HannibalBarca

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #73 on: December 22, 2015, 04:12:01 PM »
Race is a social construct.  Ethnicity is too to an extent.  There's only homo sapiens as far as humans on this planet, and we're all biologically compatible, so there isn't a difference in species.  However, there is a difference between physical appearance and cultural considerations, and I think sometimes people conflate these two.

As far as attractiveness, I believe people tend to lean more physical than cultural when considering attractiveness of individuals who are significantly different than themselves.

Quote
So I ask you E, do you play in interracial pairings?

I have, here on E and elsewhere.  However, I'm primarily a writer, not an RPer.  As an author, I damn well better be able to write as people who differ from me ethnicity-wise, sexuality-wise, and gender-wise.  My writing would suck balls if I only wrote white straight males.

In my personal writing (novel and short stories) I tend to use multiethnic characters now, anyway, particularly science fiction.  By the time we spread out among the stars, there's going to be no discernible ethnic groups anyway.

Offline la dame en noirTopic starter

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Re: Interracial Roleplaying - How do you feel?
« Reply #74 on: December 22, 2015, 05:51:46 PM »
I'm currently working on a fantasy novel where the female is a black woman. I rarely see black female leads in Sci Fi and Fantasy, I want to make this a successful one. The cast will be diverse and skin color won't be an issue.