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Author Topic: What's in the news?  (Read 176428 times)

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Offline IntensePlayer

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1275 on: June 15, 2015, 12:09:10 PM »
Beorning, I think this is just one of those situations where the commercial most likely doesn't promote the feminist agenda, so there is some kind of feminist backlash.  The truth is that feminists should support pretty much anything a woman wants to do despite their agenda.  I don't think there is anything wrong with that commercial.  There ARE some women who have successful lives yet they chose to not have a family, and as such they feel some sadness in life.  That is a perfectly reasonable response.  Just like some women choose to be housewives, choose to stay at home and have kids. You are right in part though, there is a lot of political correctness, not just in Feminism but basically anyone who has an agenda.  While there are definitely feminists out there who support the choices of ALL women despite what those choices are, as a whole you won't really see feminism boast about a woman who chooses to stay at home and be a housewife.

Offline Caehlim

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1276 on: June 16, 2015, 02:25:05 AM »
Basically, the makers' goal is to promote parenthood (especially motherhood).

Or as they describe it themselves,
"We want this campaign to embed hormonal contraception in the context in which rarely appears in public discourse. Not as a source of freedom, but as a tool of oppression against the desire to be a mom." - Source.

Although personally I'm a little more concerned about the fact that this group, "Fundacja Mamy i Taty" or the Mum and Dad Foundation, campaigns against LGBT rights.

Note: I don't speak Polish, so this is all very dependent on Google Translate.

Offline BeorningTopic starter

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1277 on: June 16, 2015, 08:22:02 AM »
Or as they describe it themselves,
"We want this campaign to embed hormonal contraception in the context in which rarely appears in public discourse. Not as a source of freedom, but as a tool of oppression against the desire to be a mom." - Source.

Although personally I'm a little more concerned about the fact that this group, "Fundacja Mamy i Taty" or the Mum and Dad Foundation, campaigns against LGBT rights.

These are valid points - I'm not saying that I agree with everything (or even anything) what this foundation promotes. Also, I don't even agree with what this campaign seems to say: that we have a low birthrate here because of selfish women who want only to make money. The reasons for lack of children is different, IMHO: low wages offered to young people, extremely expensive housing etc.

Still, I'd like to note that the campaign itself says nothing about contraception etc. Also, it does make an interesting point: I do agree that, among my generation, at least some young people tend to put careers, fun etc. before family and parenthood - not taking into account that some things cannot be forestalled indefinitely.

I don't know - I think all of this is an interesting issue worth of debating. Meanwhile, what we are getting is the kneejerk reaction of some feminists, who seem to consider the promotion of parenthood as somehow sexist and offensive toward single women...

Offline Oniya

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Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1278 on: June 16, 2015, 12:16:33 PM »
Still, I'd like to note that the campaign itself says nothing about contraception etc. Also, it does make an interesting point: I do agree that, among my generation, at least some young people tend to put careers, fun etc. before family and parenthood - not taking into account that some things cannot be forestalled indefinitely.

The campaign may not say it directly, but it's not too different from the tactics of some of the groups around here who run 'Crisis Pregnancy Centers'

Offline Ironwolf85

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Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1279 on: June 17, 2015, 06:46:41 AM »
*Facedesk*
ya'know if they dropped the hate part some of these groups could be the good guys...

For example the folks who are anti-abortion, (including myself actually) would be better basing their argument on the sanctity of potential life, and the actual horror of the act performed. (Snapping the spine of a 3 month old fetus with the flick of a wrist is chilling to watch.) Leave it up to the families, but instead of shaming folks and berating them. Maybe offer guidance and counseling for young couples and single parents, help them get on their feet, and if they can't keep the kid, run an adoption center.

Because "we gotta stop the gays, transsexuals, people of a different lifestyle and tradition from destroying america... BUT OH GOD SAVE THE FETUSES" just... doesn't work...

Offline BeorningTopic starter

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1280 on: June 17, 2015, 01:57:20 PM »
The campaign may not say it directly, but it's not too different from the tactics of some of the groups around here who run 'Crisis Pregnancy Centers'

I don't know. I mean, the stuff this webpage says about the CPCs sounds awful... but this webpage itself is hardly impartial, either. I admit that when I read this webpage's authors condemn CPCs for providing "misleading" information, I wonder what exactly they consider "misleading". And if "misleading" doesn't really stand for "any opinion not fully in support of abortion"...

Anyway...

A curious news bit from today (one for which I cannot provide an English-language link, sadly) is that Robert Biedroń, Poland's first openly-gay mayor, didn't allow a circus to come into the town he governs. Biedroń says that he's opposed to animal cruelty, he consider circus performances to involve animal cruelty, so he won't allow things like that to happen in "his town".

Hm. I admit that I'm a little conflicted about this. I oppose needless cruelty to animals, too, and I can see why animal use in circus performances can be seen as controversial. On the other hand, I just... don't like the "my town" attitude. It's exactly the same attitude that, years ago, led the late Lech Kaczyński, then-mayor of Warsaw, to ban LGBT parades. He was a conservative and he honestly considered these parades to be immoral and harmful, so he did everything he could to stop them from taking place in "his town". Now, Biedroń considers circuses to be immoral and harmful, and stops them from coming to "his town", either... Both of these are cases of a mayor making administrative decisions based on his personal views - and I find that iffy.

Offline Oniya

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Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1281 on: June 17, 2015, 02:02:42 PM »
I don't know. I mean, the stuff this webpage says about the CPCs sounds awful... but this webpage itself is hardly impartial, either. I admit that when I read this webpage's authors condemn CPCs for providing "misleading" information, I wonder what exactly they consider "misleading". And if "misleading" doesn't really stand for "any opinion not fully in support of abortion"...

I did a bit of research based on your question here, and discovered this bit rather quickly:

http://www.guttmacher.org/media/inthenews/2006/07/18/

Quote
Of the 23 CPCs contacted by investigators, 20 provided false or misleading information by claiming–contrary to the scientific evidence–that there is a link between abortion and breast cancer, that abortion harms future fertility or that abortion increases a woman’s risk of suffering severe mental health problems.

And while this website is most assuredly pro-choice (and could therefore be considered biased, although they don't hide their affiliation in the slightest), the tactics described are disturbing:

http://www.prochoicemass.org/get-the-facts/cpcmisleading/

Offline eBadger

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1282 on: June 17, 2015, 05:00:33 PM »
Both of these are cases of a mayor making administrative decisions based on his personal views - and I find that iffy.

Attitude aside, I don't feel that disallowing a circus in order to protest animal abuse is very comparable to banning pro-rights LGBT parades. 

Offline gaggedLouise

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Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1283 on: June 17, 2015, 10:17:08 PM »
Donald Trump might be running for president - but he should stay off using the song Rockin' in the Free World as a campaign anthem of some kind, says Mr. Neil Young himself. Trump opened two key events with the song, his announcement of candidacy and his first speech as a candidate in Iowa, later the same night.

Some echoes here of when Reagan's campaign people wanted to use Springsteen's stadium hit Born in the USA as their anthem in the 1984 campaign, and were politely rebuffed by the Boss and his team. Neither of the two songs are an easy-going patriotic cheering piece when it comes to the lyrics.  ;)

Offline Oniya

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Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1284 on: June 17, 2015, 10:53:12 PM »
I love the fact that these people never seem to listen to the lyrics of these songs when they choose them as 'campaign anthems'.  For those unfamiliar with the song, I present:

Rockin' in the Free World
"Rockin' In The Free World"

There's colors on the street
Red, white and blue
People shufflin' their feet
People sleepin' in their shoes
But there's a warnin' sign
on the road ahead
There's a lot of people sayin'
we'd be better off dead
Don't feel like Satan,
but I am to them
So I try to forget it,
any way I can.

Keep on rockin' in the free world,
Keep on rockin' in the free world
Keep on rockin' in the free world,
Keep on rockin' in the free world.

I see a woman in the night
With a baby in her hand
Under an old street light
Near a garbage can
Now she puts the kid away,
and she's gone to get a hit
She hates her life,
and what she's done to it
There's one more kid
that will never go to school
Never get to fall in love,
never get to be cool.

Keep on rockin' in the free world,
Keep on rockin' in the free world
Keep on rockin' in the free world,
Keep on rockin' in the free world.

We got a thousand points of light
For the homeless man
We got a kinder, gentler,
Machine gun hand
We got department stores
and toilet paper
Got styrofoam boxes
for the ozone layer
Got a man of the people,
says keep hope alive
Got fuel to burn,
got roads to drive.

Keep on rockin' in the free world,
Keep on rockin' in the free world
Keep on rockin' in the free world,
Keep on rockin' in the free world.

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Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1285 on: June 17, 2015, 11:03:11 PM »
Hasn't Trump done this like a bunch of times before? It feels like hes just going for attention now  :-\

Offline Dashenka

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1286 on: June 18, 2015, 04:31:10 AM »
Hasn't Trump done this like a bunch of times before? It feels like hes just going for attention now  :-\

He says he'll be a building a wall on the Mexican border and have them pay for it.

If that's not attention, I don't know what it. The guy's a tool.

Online Cassandra LeMay

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1287 on: June 18, 2015, 04:47:35 AM »
At least we know for certain that Donald Trump is not the son of an orangutan. That's more than I can say for some of the other contenders in the Republican field that leave me with some doubts in this regard.  ;)

Offline BeorningTopic starter

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1288 on: June 18, 2015, 08:35:03 AM »
I did a bit of research based on your question here, and discovered this bit rather quickly:

http://www.guttmacher.org/media/inthenews/2006/07/18/

And while this website is most assuredly pro-choice (and could therefore be considered biased, although they don't hide their affiliation in the slightest), the tactics described are disturbing:

http://www.prochoicemass.org/get-the-facts/cpcmisleading/

Ah, thanks. Yes, I can agree that this information (if true) is infuriariting.

I've long been annoyed by situations when people make up false medical information to bolster they ethical stances. Like, when our conservatives here keep citing untrue information on how - supposedly - children born through in-vitro fertilization are often sick, damaged etc.

Attitude aside, I don't feel that disallowing a circus in order to protest animal abuse is very comparable to banning pro-rights LGBT parades. 

Really? I think it's a similar situation, objectively speaking: in both cases, a mayor decides that something cannot be allowed to take place, because he personally finds it immoral, so he uses his administrative power to stop it.

Offline Oniya

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Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1289 on: June 18, 2015, 11:48:53 AM »
Ah, thanks. Yes, I can agree that this information (if true) is infuriariting.

I've long been annoyed by situations when people make up false medical information to bolster they ethical stances. Like, when our conservatives here keep citing untrue information on how - supposedly - children born through in-vitro fertilization are often sick, damaged etc.

Not meaning to pile on with this, but I was reading Slate this morning and this particular document was basically dumped in my lap.  (I usually read the advice columns and scan the headlines.)  False and Misleading Health Information Provided by Federally Funded Pregnancy Resource Centers - this is an actual Congressional Report made in 2006.

Offline Cycle

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1290 on: June 18, 2015, 12:41:34 PM »
At least we know for certain that Donald Trump is not the son of an orangutan.

Wait.  How do we know this Fred C. Trump is not an orangutan.  I want to see his birth certificate.  And Mary Mac Leod's too.


Offline gaggedLouise

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Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1291 on: June 18, 2015, 05:14:42 PM »
Denmark has gone to the vote - parliamentary elections - and with the count nearly finished it's clear that the country is in for a decided turn to the right and increased polarization. The anti-immigration Christian populists of the Danish People's Party (not quite the Danish Tea Party, but almost) scored a big boost and are set to become the second biggest party after the Social Democrats*; they're also sure to man several chairs in the government. Between 2001 and 2011 they were a supporting partner to the centre-right wing government but didn't hold any cabinet seats; now they have outgrown their earlier masters in terms of vote, and the only reason the next PM won't be the party leader of the DPP is because of the seniority of the Liberals (confusingly called Venstre, "the Left" though there have been a couple of large and vibrant parties to the left of them for the past century or so), both as an established party and in terms of the age and experience of their leader.

It's a no-brainer that their fellow populists here in Sweden, the Sweden Democrats, will look to repeat that feat in 2018.  :-(

Also, Greece is moving closer and closer to a state default on its massive debts...and the dreaded Grexit.

Of course, the senseless Charleston shooting is front-page news around here too.  :-(


*The Social Democrats lived up to expectations in terms of vote numbers, but their "support party" to the left was less successful. Almost no governments in Scandinavia are fully single-party, that's been the rule for a long time. Even when there's been a single-party socialist/labour givernment it has almost always counted on the support of some other party to the centre or to the left to gain a majority.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 05:29:59 PM by gaggedLouise »

Offline Mistyy

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1292 on: June 18, 2015, 07:00:09 PM »
Denmark has gone to the vote - parliamentary elections - and with the count nearly finished it's clear that the country is in for a decided turn to the right and increased polarization. The anti-immigration Christian populists of the Danish People's Party (not quite the Danish Tea Party, but almost) scored a big boost and are set to become the second biggest party after the Social Democrats*; they're also sure to man several chairs in the government. Between 2001 and 2011 they were a supporting partner to the centre-right wing government but didn't hold any cabinet seats; now they have outgrown their earlier masters in terms of vote, and the only reason the next PM won't be the party leader of the DPP is because of the seniority of the Liberals (confusingly called Venstre, "the Left" though there have been a couple of large and vibrant parties to the left of them for the past century or so), both as an established party and in terms of the age and experience of their leader.

It's a no-brainer that their fellow populists here in Sweden, the Sweden Democrats, will look to repeat that feat in 2018.  :-(

Also, Greece is moving closer and closer to a state default on its massive debts...and the dreaded Grexit.

Of course, the senseless Charleston shooting is front-page news around here too.  :-(


*The Social Democrats lived up to expectations in terms of vote numbers, but their "support party" to the left was less successful. Almost no governments in Scandinavia are fully single-party, that's been the rule for a long time. Even when there's been a single-party socialist/labour givernment it has almost always counted on the support of some other party to the centre or to the left to gain a majority.

The media labeled right wing "anti-immigration" party also came 2nd here in Finland and now sits in the government. They are anti-immigration in a sense that they harshly oppose certain forms of immigration like taking the immigrants coming from Africa, but when you actually read their party program they clearly state that they are open to immigration where people actually come here for work. I haven't read the Danish party's program as I can't read Danish but I suspect it's the same case here. Many would rather take the highly educated Korean person than immigrants from Africa with no skills and language ability that basically put stress to already weak economy and social security system. I would say that the winds of change are blowing through Europe as a whole, not just Scandinavia. It's a political reality that has to be accepted and not some kind populist joke. The immigration issue is a major reason why Britain is voting for EU exit. I didn't personally vote for that party but I still respect those people that did, their vote is exactly worth as much as mine or anyone else's.

When you live in a larger city like I live in the capital here, you can easily start living in a kind of a bubble with the very liberal people around you and become blind to the rest of the country which is still like 90% of the population here. For example the attitudes in San Francisco are vastly different to those in the rural areas. The situation is Sweden is also completely understandable, the huge intake of immigrants relative to the size of the country is putting strain on the system, thus people want change and they vote the parties who promise to offer that. There is only so much you can do before people actually start to take action, in this case by going to vote. The very generous welfare system combined with lightly controlled immigration is a bad combination.

What comes to the Charleston shooting, the media will probably use that for race bating because that's what sells. Then you get the pro-gun anti-gun debate thing all over again and it kind of goes in a circle. Someone once asked that how will America hold together with all it's racial and social problems? Growing income cap, rampant violence in cities like Detroit and Chicago and various other problems. You don't really even see the Chicago and Detroit types of shooting reported anymore because they are like every day things.

Offline Oniya

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Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1293 on: June 18, 2015, 07:11:53 PM »
The shooter in Charleston specifically said it was racially motivated.

Offline Avis habilis

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1294 on: June 18, 2015, 07:15:03 PM »
While "the media" have, predictably considering the little shit's pallor, dutifully laid out the "disturbed loner with no connection to anything else that ever happened anywhere else ever, no siree bob" line.

Offline Mistyy

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1295 on: June 18, 2015, 07:26:39 PM »
I never argued it wasn't racially motivated. In fact it was and it will not really help the race relations, I just said that it will be used to pit the races against one another. The disturbed loner line can be compared to the "gentle giant" picture that the media tried to give of Michael Brown before the case was even reviewed fully. This is why you should try to watch many news sources and not just one like CNN. If one only looks at the liberal media you tend to solely see their point of view, thus some form of media reading skill is good to have. I don't know whether they teach this in schools in US.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 07:28:03 PM by Mistyy »

Offline Avis habilis

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1296 on: June 18, 2015, 07:38:16 PM »
The disturbed loner line can be compared to the "gentle giant" picture that the media tried to give of Michael Brown before the case was even reviewed fully.

Yeah, do let's compare that.


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Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1297 on: June 18, 2015, 07:42:18 PM »
Is it wrong I just want to see that idiot given the chair? I have no respect for someone who would so willingly slaughter innocents and then stroll off without a care.

And again "This is why we cant have nice things."  Now everywhere on the internet I go for the next 4 months will be "All whites are racists" and "All guns kill people and should be banned", "Its violent media and videogames!" ugh. Its always something, I get so sick of people sometimes.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 07:43:51 PM by Lustful Bride »

Offline TheGlyphstone

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1298 on: June 18, 2015, 07:46:48 PM »
The three great evils of modern society - smoking, drinking, and rapping.

Offline Mistyy

Re: What's in the news?
« Reply #1299 on: June 18, 2015, 07:56:42 PM »
Yeah, do let's compare that.



You can look up the Ferguson riots, the Michael Brown case, and the Freddie Gray case. Ultimately in all these cases before any proper investigation was even done, a rose tinted picture was already painted with the various social media platforms filled with people handing out "justice" When the sentence came out, well we all know what happened then because obviously the sentence was "wrong" and the justice system is corrupted

What does that image even prove, someone telling that Dylann was "as quiet and soft-spoken" maybe he really was like that? These killers aren't usually the loud jock type in high school and outside of school, and yes Michael Brown was no angel indeed. The one who went on a shooting spree in Santa Barbara was also described as "quiet" but so what? The killer have some psychological things in common usually.

The evil white man thing is going to be on the media for quite a long time now + the gun debate that always pops up as the result of these. At least he was caught and will be convicted.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 08:03:17 PM by Mistyy »