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Author Topic: Fred Phelps Is Dying  (Read 2424 times)

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Offline Iniquitous

Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #50 on: March 20, 2014, 07:11:43 PM »
I think it goes without saying that I never liked the message Fred Phelps preached. I certainly did not like his antics and the hate that he spread.

With that said…

I do not believe in holding anger, hate, or animosity towards anyone.  I believe in forgiveness and love. Not because I am forgiving and loving the other person, rather, because I have learned that to forgive and love others allows me to grow as a person. Holding onto my negative emotions and wishing ill on others stunts my growth as a person.

And it is that belief of mine that allows me to say this. I hope he passed with minimal pain and I hope he found some kind of peace in his soul since it is obvious that he did not have it while he was alive.

Offline Ephiral

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Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #51 on: March 21, 2014, 12:01:17 AM »
A note of tragic irony: According to at least one source, he was excommunicated in part for preaching kindness. (They claim to have gotten this info from Nate Phelps on Facebook, but damned if I can find it.)

Offline Hades

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Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #52 on: March 21, 2014, 02:39:41 AM »
I think in the end, the Westboro legacy will be that it hastened equality more than it ever hindered it.  The fact that they preached against homosexuality from a biblical perspective is not that uncommon, but their willingness to go beyond the pale in order to gain attention by protesting soldier's funerals (and the media dutifully doing it's part to give them that attention) rendered them isolated from more maintstream anti-equality groups.

In regards to the man himself, I was reminded of a quote from Mark Twain when I first heard he had died: 
I've never wished a man dead, but I have read some obituaries with great pleasure.

Offline TaintedAndDelish

Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #53 on: March 21, 2014, 04:05:10 AM »
Out of respect, I won't specifically mention which musical number from a certain classic movie involving witches and tornadoes I'm listening to at the moment.

That said, I do suppose I feel a smidgen of sadness at just how wasted this man's life was. I can't even imagine living my entire life consumed with that kind of hatred.



OK, so maybe I lake maturity or something... shoot me. *shrugs*

Offline vtboy

Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #54 on: March 22, 2014, 07:40:31 AM »
I will reserve my compassion for the worms that gag on his degenerate corpse.

Offline Ironwolf85

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Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #55 on: March 24, 2014, 04:06:11 PM »


better than I could say

Offline Mathim

Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #56 on: March 24, 2014, 04:16:28 PM »
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/16/fred-phelps-dying-death-westboro-baptist_n_4974584.html

I... have to admit, my opinions on this matter may not be the most 'respectful'. As much as I understand this man is a human being (technically, at least, until scientists prove otherwise), and he has family and loved ones and he is dying. But when you do nothing but spew vitriolic, disgusting hate; disrespect dead soldiers and harass their families at their funerals... I can't really bring myself to feel any compassion for this disgusting man and the equally disgusting people he surrounded himself with. I feel the worst will only be better for his passing, and that apart from perhaps his personal friends and family, no one will truly mourn his death.

I really can feel nothing but joy at the knowledge that there will be one less hate mongering bigot in the world after this man's death and that SOMEHOW, gay people managed to not murder him long enough for him to die naturally; so at least he won't become a martyr for his cause. Maybe I'm heartless but I'm just really unable to feel sorry for people who have harassed others while they themselves were mourning deaths of loved ones.

I would not advocate people picketing his funeral, as I sincerely believe that we need to prove we're better than them. That's a line I don't think we should cost, because its what really pushed them over the line from 'bigots' to 'disgusting monsters'. That said, if his funeral IS picketed, I admit, I'll probably laugh a little.

At any rate, E. I'd like to know what you think. Should we feel compassion in this man's final hours, perhaps mourning the life that could have been, rather than the one that was? Or is it okay in this instance to simply be glad that there will soon be a tiny bit less evil in the world?

Agree about one less hatemongering bigot in the world point, but I have plenty of gay friends who would raise their eyebrows at the insinuation of any assassination attempts at their hands against him. Especially since you commented about needing to prove we're all 'better than him and his kind', that kind of seems like an odd mixture of things to say. I'll give you a do-over on that if you want to rephrase things in a less sanctimonious way.

Anyway, the minute I read the thread title, I heard an angelic choir going 'Hallelujah' like in the movies when a miracle or something like that happens. It's like the whole Jerry Falwell thing with guys like Christopher Hitchens dishonoring his memory since according to many atheists, there's not a shred of good accomplished by guys like the outspoken 'men of god'. I just wish more people of faith took a good long look at guys like Phelps and realized that you can't possibly claim to be serious about your religion if you capriciously cherry-pick what bits to believe and not to believe and yet still claim the entire book is divinely inspired and infallible.

Oh, and has anyone seen video clips of his family? Fucking freaks. His daughter is supposedly a lawyer and is a certifiable sociopath (and monstrously ugly) with his tainted blood very clearly flowing in her shriveled veins. The only real tragedy about this impending death is that it isn't some kind of industrial or traffic accident befalling the entire clan and erase those poisonous beliefs from the earth. Guess I'll just watch the trailer for God Bless America again, where Bobcat Goldthwait directs his main characters to teach the haters to play nice or see what it's like to be on the opposite end of their venom-spewing.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2014, 04:31:46 PM by Mathim »

Offline Oniya

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Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #57 on: March 24, 2014, 04:38:04 PM »
Oh, and has anyone seen video clips of his family? Fucking freaks. His daughter is supposedly a lawyer and is a certifiable sociopath (and monstrously ugly) with his tainted blood very clearly flowing in her shriveled veins. The only real tragedy about this impending death is that it isn't some kind of industrial or traffic accident befalling the entire clan and erase those poisonous beliefs from the earth. Guess I'll just watch the trailer for God Bless America again, where Bobcat Goldthwait directs his main characters to teach the haters to play nice or see what it's like to be on the opposite end of their venom-spewing.

What does her level of attractiveness (or lack thereof) have to do with anything?

And if 'haters' should play nice, does that mean the rest of us are allowed to wish that an industrial or traffic accident strikes anyone (or find it a 'tragedy' that it doesn't)?

Offline Mathim

Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #58 on: March 24, 2014, 04:52:36 PM »
What does her level of attractiveness (or lack thereof) have to do with anything?

And if 'haters' should play nice, does that mean the rest of us are allowed to wish that an industrial or traffic accident strikes anyone (or find it a 'tragedy' that it doesn't)?

I'm not the one who made the movie, I just thought it was rather poetic. And I forgot to mention, it just makes her look quite literally like the wicked witch of the west, just like someone provided a reference picture of a few posts ago, which reminded me of it. Someone asks her if she was happy during a news interview, since she seemed to be so full of hate and anger, and she just laughed out loud like she was the most high-and-mighty authority on everything and proclaimed that indeed, she was happy. It's like every movie where the villain is convinced of the justification of their scheme and it physically twists them into something gross, like Malekith from Thor: The Dark World. Hatred like theirs must really do a number on their physiology; I never used to believe that, like Roald Dahl's book The Twits where people who have bad thoughts will start to suffer physical effects and those who have many bad thoughts will suffer them exponentially, but some people do give me pause.

Offline Ephiral

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Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #59 on: March 25, 2014, 01:55:11 AM »
At times like this, I think it's important to remember that the Enemy is not an evil mutant. Nobody acts purely to make the world a worse place. Nobody is the villain in their own story; they're doing the best they can in their circumstances. In particular, the still-true-believer Phelps clan members are more than just not-villains - they are victims. The difference between them and you is not that they have an inborn capacity for hatred, but that they were raised in the shadow of the Westboro Baptist Church, while you got a better deal (as evidenced by the fact that you're classy enough to be on E.) This is why I won't celebrate Fred Phelps' death, or sneer at his survivors. I'm glad there's a little less hate in the world; I'm glad that the WBC, as an entity, seems to be in the slow process of eating itself. But we won't eliminate hatred by pretending we're not capable of it, that only some evil mutant Other could ever be like that - we will simply lose the capacity to notice when we're being hateful.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2014, 01:57:40 AM by Ephiral »

Offline Mathim

Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #60 on: April 22, 2014, 02:36:31 PM »
At times like this, I think it's important to remember that the Enemy is not an evil mutant. Nobody acts purely to make the world a worse place. Nobody is the villain in their own story; they're doing the best they can in their circumstances. In particular, the still-true-believer Phelps clan members are more than just not-villains - they are victims. The difference between them and you is not that they have an inborn capacity for hatred, but that they were raised in the shadow of the Westboro Baptist Church, while you got a better deal (as evidenced by the fact that you're classy enough to be on E.) This is why I won't celebrate Fred Phelps' death, or sneer at his survivors. I'm glad there's a little less hate in the world; I'm glad that the WBC, as an entity, seems to be in the slow process of eating itself. But we won't eliminate hatred by pretending we're not capable of it, that only some evil mutant Other could ever be like that - we will simply lose the capacity to notice when we're being hateful.

Hatred I can deal with, it's this whole irrational, batshit insane source it's coming from. If I hate a man for sleeping with my wife, that's perfectly justifiable and rational. When you claim that a man you can't prove exists died and came back to life which has never been achieved in history and that this man tells you that because he chose to create someone to be attracted to the same sex and that everyone should hate them...that shit won't fly. Hatred from rationality is something you can eventually probably extinguish. Irrational hatred is eternal and rather unfortunately, enormously contagious with lots of other hideous side effects.

Offline Braioch

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Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #61 on: April 22, 2014, 11:58:29 PM »
Personally, I stopped hating that man and his family a long time ago. They honestly became satiric figures to me, so overly done and overdramatic that it seemed, unintentionally I'm sure, like they were just walking, talking exaggerations meant to make fun at all the 'phobes of the world. My heart of course went out to all the people who had to endure these living caricatures at their loved ones funerals, but outside of that particular source, I found them hilarious. I spent an entire documentary laughing because Fred kept popping up to have his say and his language and earnestness had me rolling with sheer amusement.

That said, I felt and still feel an inherent disgust with their mindset but particularly their methods.

As for his death?

Mark Twain said it best, "I've never wished a man dead, but I have read some obituaries with great pleasure."

Offline Saerwen

Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #62 on: April 23, 2014, 02:39:58 PM »
Perhaps I am a bit different, but it isn't anger I look at on Fred Phelps. He makes me so very angry, his church everything they do. Its so very wrong, it is hateful and their words do hurt people. What they do is wrong. I am not by any means condoning what they do. But I do look on him with pity, his life is full of hate, anger, madness. I can not imagine the type of life he has lead that brought him here. It is pity I look on him, and I hope he is now at rest, that he finds the peace he never found in life. Hate breeds hate, and I do not want to be part of that. Instead I wish him and his family peace, and hope they are able to move on from their lose, I also do hope they have better memories of the man then the world has. 

Offline Strident

Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #63 on: April 23, 2014, 05:41:28 PM »
I have a sneaking suspicion the sum total effect on the nation of America as a whole of the "God hates Fags" campaigns WBC run is to make those with more moderate religious/conservative types move their views further to the left/liberal end of the spectrum in order to disassociate themselves from the likes of WBC.

On that basis, perhaps liberal progressives should actually mourn Fred Phelps loss...his visceral irrational hatred of...well..pretty much everybody...but the LGBT community in particular...has probably had a galvanizing effect on getting many softcore conservatives to adopt more liberal views.

Offline Braioch

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Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #64 on: April 25, 2014, 12:12:48 AM »
Not for nothing, but I would think that a figure you point at and go "don't be that guy" is not an individual you should mourn. You just continue to point, now at the grave and go, "don't be that guy." It's like "giving credit" to an ex who broke your heart and made you a stronger person, you don't actually want to give them credit, they were terrible to you, why give any form of credit for that. What you really do is point over and go "yeah...you were a douche, and because of that, I had to toughen up, congrats!" More of an acknowledgement really.

There is the small regret of the moments where I would see their names pop up and my thought would be, "haha, let's see what these asshats have gotten themselves up to now."

But maybe I'm just weird ::)

Offline Callie Del Noire

Re: Fred Phelps Is Dying
« Reply #65 on: April 25, 2014, 12:38:15 PM »
My take..

a moment of internal 'ding dong the wicked witch is dead.' complete with inner dance of munchkins and myself.

Then I moved on. I hope to see the 'church' implode now that the leader/founder is dead. Cults of personaility rarely last long, or well, past the death of their founder.