You are either not logged in or not registered with our community. Click here to register.
 
December 06, 2016, 04:18:34 AM

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length

Click here if you are having problems.
Default Wide Screen Beige Lilac Rainbow Black & Blue October Send us your theme!

Hark!  The Herald!
Holiday Issue 2016

Wiki Blogs Dicebot

Author Topic: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era  (Read 722 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline HairyHereticTopic starter

  • Lei varai barbu - The true bearded one
  • Knight
  • Addict
  • *
  • Join Date: Dec 2006
  • Location: Ireland
  • Gender: Male
  • And the Scorpion said "Little frog .. I can swim."
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 1
Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« on: February 07, 2014, 01:23:50 PM »
It is a time of legend.


Mighty heroes battle for the right to rule the galaxy. The vast armies of the Emperor of Earth have conquered the galaxy in a Great Crusade - the myriad alien races have been smashed by the Emperor's elite warriors and wiped from the face of history.

The dawn of a new age of supremacy for humanity beckons.

Gleaming citadels of marble and gold celebrate the many victories of the Emperor. Triumphs are raised on a million worlds to record the epic deeds of his most powerful and deadly warriors.

First and foremost amongst these are the Primarchs, superheroic beings who have led the Emperor's armies of Space Marines in victory after victory. They are unstoppable and magnificent, the pinnacle of the Emperor's genetic experimentation. The Space Marines are the mightiest human warriors the galaxy has ever known, each capable of besting a hundred normal men or more in combat.

Organised into vast armies of tens of thousands called Legions, the Space Marines and their Primarch leaders conquer the galaxy in the name of the Emperor.

Chief amongst the primarchs is Horus, called the Glorious, the Brightest Star, favourite of the Emperor, and like a son unto him. He is the Warmaster, the commander-in-chief of the Emperor's military might, subjugator of a thousand thousand worlds and conqueror of the galaxy. He is a warrior without peer, a diplomat supreme.

As the galaxy is plunged into the fires of war the mightiest heroes must make a choice: to remain loyal to the immortal Emperor or to tread the path of darkness.

So, I've been rereading my Horus Heresy novels, and browsing the Dorian Heresy wiki stuff (a 'what if' timeline where most of the Loyalist and Traitor legions change sides, with Dorn being corrupted by Chaos, rather than Horus) and it got me to thinking, could we do a Heresy era game here?

What I was thinking was a little monkeying with the canon setting, and having The Sigilite set up a prototype Deathwatch organisation ... drawing marines from the different Legions, having them fight together to see how their various strenghts could complement each other in combat at a squad level.

I know the Legions worked together in some campaigns, and there is reference made to inter-Legion exchanges, so this sort of plays to the same idea.

Squads of Marines would be assembled and placed with Rogue Trader / Explorator fleets, scouting ahead of the main fleets in search of new worlds to bring to compliance, or sent to perform specialised tasks that, while important, do not warrant the retasking of main fleet elements to accomplish. I could see it include elements from Deathwatch and Rogue Trader easily enough.

Could be done freeform or using Deathwatch core rules I think.

Would anyone find this of interest?

Offline Darrow Huck

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2014, 06:24:42 PM »
What I was thinking was a little monkeying with the canon setting, and having The Sigilite set up a prototype Deathwatch organisation ... drawing marines from the different Legions, having them fight together to see how their various strenghts could complement each other in combat at a squad level.

Actually, that's pretty much canon. Malachor mentions in The Flight of the Eisenstein that they're going to need men of an "inquisitive" nature, and we see Nathaniel Garro in one of latter stories (I forget which) as part of the new prototype inquisition.

Offline IrishWolf

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2014, 09:59:48 PM »
Warhammer 30k, you have my interest but Space Marines, not so much. Imperial Army on the other hand, I would be all over that.

Offline Ace Flyer

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2014, 10:16:38 PM »
Actually, that's pretty much canon. Malachor mentions in The Flight of the Eisenstein that they're going to need men of an "inquisitive" nature, and we see Nathaniel Garro in one of latter stories (I forget which) as part of the new prototype inquisition.

Well, that was a special case, as Malcador had been commissioned by the Emperor to find those that would be the core the Grey Knights would be built upon. As far as I know, there were very few other cases where teams were made of members of separate Legions. In fact, the only other group similar to that I know of were the Outcast Dead, and that wasn't exactly an official, organized group, as much as it was a prison break. Well, I suppose the Crusader Host, which the Dead had come from, are similar to this idea as well...

Anyway, count me interested. Like Irish, though, I'm hesitant on playing a Space Marine. I've just...never had much fun playing them (I talked my group into letting me play a Dark Heresy character in our Deathwatch game). So, if possible to play some Imperial Army veteran, or the Rogue Trader or captain of the ship the team will be on, I'd be set.

If not, though, well...I'll bite the bullet. I'd probably pick a Night Lords or Alpha Legion marine. :)

Offline BenedictWolfe

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2014, 02:16:44 PM »
This does sound pretty damn interesting, Hairy. I've only had little experience with 40k's role playing ruleset, but I might be able to adjust. Otherwise, freeform is fine.

Myself, I would like to play a World Eater Rampager.

Offline HairyHereticTopic starter

  • Lei varai barbu - The true bearded one
  • Knight
  • Addict
  • *
  • Join Date: Dec 2006
  • Location: Ireland
  • Gender: Male
  • And the Scorpion said "Little frog .. I can swim."
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 1
Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2014, 02:42:59 PM »
IIRC both the Inquisition and the Grey Knights were created either late in the Heresy or shortly after the Battle for Terra. I would be aiming to play prior to that.

The problem with mixing the likes of Imperial Guard and Marines is one of power level. No Guardsman, no matter how good, should be a match for a Marine, which means that in a mixed group, will that non Marine get a chance to shine, or will they be constantly in the shadows of the others? While that isn't a huge deal in a book, when you're playing a game, I don't think any player would want to play constant second tier character, you know?

That being said, the Black Crusade rulebook does allow for the mixing of both Marine and non Marine characters in the one group. Non Marines are certainly less intrusive, and able to go places 'openly', where a Marine would stand out like a sore thumb, and operate in more social settings.

Hmmmm ....

A mixed group might be viable after all, come to think about it.


Offline Ace Flyer

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2014, 06:38:27 PM »
You're right, the Grey Knights and Inquisition were created at the end of the Heresy. Malcador finished his quest to find those that would be the basis for those two organizations shortly before the Battle of Tera. Garro and the Space Marines he gathered left to Titan, where sorcery locked it away in time and space, so the Grey Knights could build, while the others laid the foundations of what would be the Inquisition. Malcador wouldn't see much of this though, as he had to take the Emperor's place in the Golden Throne and, well...We know how that ended for him.

His quest to find Garro and the other Space Marines that would be the first Grey Knights, I just meant, are similar to what you have in mind. As far as I know, there's no real precedent before the Heresy for Deathwatch-like teams of Marines from different Legions...But perhaps the success of this experiment you're proposing Malcador puts forth is what inspires the Emperor to do the same, when he asks him to do so again at the end of the Heresy?

Anywho...

Personally, I have no problem playing a character considered "second tier" to a Space Marine. It's true that for the most part, no Guardsman should be a match for a Space Marine. Half the fun of RPing, though, is finding those rare example of human that can stand on a Marine's level, if not exceed it in some cases. My Inquisitor that I play in Deathwatch, for instance, can hold his own against just about anything the DM throws at him, because while he is human and weaker than the Space Marines, he has enough psychic might to protect himself. In a separate game, we had a guest player that brought in a Vindicare Assassin into the Deathwatch campaign that the kill-team ultimately had to try and kill. It was hard, as the Vindicare's weapons and his sheer agility and dodging rolls made him quite hard to pin down and actually kill.

I have a commissar in Only War that (albeit, very, very luckily) won a close combat with three Space Marines. Of course, I had a power fist with a mounted inferno pistol, and a power sword in the other hand, and the DM made unfortunate rolls for the Marines. Such is the luck of the dice, though...And I'm starting to realize that my DM wants my characters dead. Huh...

You just have to be careful with a mixed group. If there are two Space Marine players, and four normal humans, and the humans are staying toe-to-toe with the Marines, that could be a problem. One normal guy proving to be a badass, earning the respect of a team of Marines, there's nothing much wrong with. A group of them though, well, that's stretching things a bit. If I played a non-Marine anyway, I'd prefer playing someone who wouldn't exactly share duties with them. The captain of the ship, the pilot for their transport, someone close enough to be interacting with them and excelling and helping them in his own way, without necessarily being as good as them in combat, where the Marines should shine.

Offline SGTDan

  • Redneck, Gentleman, Lore's Cowboy, The Shifters Outlaw
  • Permabanned
  • Seducer
  • *
  • Join Date: Aug 2012
  • Location: B.C. Canada
  • Gender: Male
  • Blood,Sweat and Beer
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 0
Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2014, 08:35:39 PM »
Space Marines are boring? Never met my Space Marine character then

Offline Kevben Battleheart

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2014, 08:36:53 PM »
I think I'll toss my hat into this so long as Hairy allows it.

Offline Primarch

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2014, 09:36:28 PM »
I do tend to enjoy playing as a Space Marine.

Offline HairyHereticTopic starter

  • Lei varai barbu - The true bearded one
  • Knight
  • Addict
  • *
  • Join Date: Dec 2006
  • Location: Ireland
  • Gender: Male
  • And the Scorpion said "Little frog .. I can swim."
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 1
Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2014, 07:54:37 AM »
So, thinking about this, I'm thinking this could be The Sigilites prototype program that leads to the formation of the Inquisition.  It would draw on both normal humans, and marines.

Normal humans (or close enough):
Rogue Trader / Smuggler captain / Navigator (Psyker) - Someone has to get the group from A to B, and if that occasionally means operating outside of the law, then the ends justify the means
Adept - I'd include the likes of the Iterators here (http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Iterator)
Arbitrator/Scum - Someone having a knowledge of the criminal underworld, and associated skills, would likely be of use
Assassin - The Assassin temples were active during the Heresy, and I could see the likes of a Calidus being particularly useful
Guardsman - With Marines available to draw on for combat ability, the Guardsman would probably fall into a covert support role .. provide combat expertise in those situations where Marines would be too obvious.
Sister of Silence (psychic null) / Psyker - Being able to counter an opposing psyker, or have one of your own along, can give a group an edge
Techpriest

At this point the Ministorum and Ecclesiarchy do not exist, though any non Marine PC could be fledgling members of the Lectitio Divinitatus. The Imperium is currently one of rational, scientific thought.

Of course, the PCs may encounter things that defy that rational belief.

Marines:
Apothicary
Assault
Devastator
Librarian/Chaplain
Tactical
Techmarine

Prior to the Council of Nikea, Chaplains I think are pretty much exclusive to the Word Bearers. After the Council, the only psykers allowed were Astropaths and Navigators, and Chaplains became widespread in the Legions. During the Council, there was a proposal made that psykers could be trained by the Imperial forces, and used for the good of the Imperium. I think I could see The Sigilite quietly adopting that here.

Offline Ace Flyer

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2014, 06:18:10 PM »
Can I be the Rogue Trader? :) I can pick up other characters too, if we need them. I've no problem playing multiples.

The only reservation I'd have about psykers, though, would be that if this was set after Nikea...If there are any Marines in the team from Legions that were anti-psyker, and fought for the banning of their use, I'm not sure how they would react. The Emperor out-right banned psykers in the Legions from using their powers. A Space Wolf, for example, that's part of the team would probably take seeking another member of the team using psyker powers quite offensively. Maybe even slay them as a heretic? Or try to?

Of course, such would be an interesting point to see happen in game.

Offline IrishWolf

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2014, 07:54:47 PM »
Well, I can provide scum. I had a hive ganger from Escape From Hadrian IV I never really got to use.

Offline Barenmarder

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2014, 09:46:58 PM »
If you're still recruiting I'd like to toss my hat into the ring...

My very first thought is a Space Marine/Tactical Marine who has served with Destroyer Squads and Breaching/Boarding units. Most likely from the Death Guard/Dusk Raiders or Iron Warriors Legions, though the Night Lords or Alpha Legion would also fit nicely into the concept. An Adeptus Astartes skilled in close, ugly assaults and the reduction and capture of the very worst and most heavily defended fortresses and strong points.

Though I could also play a Seneschal/Sidekick to the group's rogue trader/shipmaster if there is need or desire for one.

Offline Lirliel

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2014, 12:31:47 AM »
Uhm.. could I perhaps play a Loyalist Word Bearer, after all not everyone in the Legion saw the 'goodness' in Chaos and not everybody willingly followed Lorgar down the path of damnation.

Perhaps, like Nathaniel, he escaped with a small cadre of loyalists, then became lost in the Warp before arriving just after the Heresy was revealed. Or before, perhaps he was the one who told Malcador what Lorgar was up to, then as he's trying to wrap his head around how to deal with it Nathaniel shows up and is all like, "Horus just went traitor!" at which point he figures it might be handy to set some sort of kill-team idea up.

Offline Ace Flyer

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2014, 12:40:44 AM »
Well, wasn't this going to be set before the Heresy? So, we wouldn't particularly need to worry about reasons why Marines from a Legion that will go Traitor, stay Loyal. A Word Bearer's Marine would be pulled from his Legion by Malcador before the razing of Khur. Or shortly after. Either way, before Lorgar takes them all down the path of Chaos.

Offline TheGlyphstone

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2014, 12:42:06 AM »
I've got a Navigator character I played eons ago in a E-based 40K game that I could dust off and recreate for this.

Is this going to be a system game, or a freeform? I wasn't clear.

Offline HairyHereticTopic starter

  • Lei varai barbu - The true bearded one
  • Knight
  • Addict
  • *
  • Join Date: Dec 2006
  • Location: Ireland
  • Gender: Male
  • And the Scorpion said "Little frog .. I can swim."
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 1
Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2014, 07:57:46 AM »
At the moment its still in the kicking ideas around phase. Are there any strong preferences for system or freeform?

Offline Lirliel

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2014, 08:40:33 AM »
System would be my preference.

Offline Kevben Battleheart

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2014, 08:55:33 AM »
I know this won't quite be a useful answer but I can go either way...though I am leaning more towards a system I feel.

Offline TheGlyphstone

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #20 on: February 10, 2014, 09:36:14 AM »
I always have a preference for system games, I just like monkeying around with numbers. Though I do have (very) mild worries about the systems here...a Dark Heresy character given enough XP to match a starting-level Deathwatch Space Marine will be ridiculously skilled and powerful, quite possibly more dangerous than the Marine himself.

Offline HairyHereticTopic starter

  • Lei varai barbu - The true bearded one
  • Knight
  • Addict
  • *
  • Join Date: Dec 2006
  • Location: Ireland
  • Gender: Male
  • And the Scorpion said "Little frog .. I can swim."
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 1
Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2014, 10:01:11 AM »
Which is exactly the issue I'm looking at at the moment. Black Crusade allows for marine and regular humans to work together in one group, so it might provide the best system, mechanically speaking. Of course, I'd have to see how well it allowed to play Imperial characters though.

Offline TheGlyphstone

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #22 on: February 10, 2014, 10:06:40 AM »
Here's a thread on the FFG boards with some ideas you could mine:
http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/52534-loyalist-game/

So possible, but difficult.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2014, 10:10:39 AM by TheGlyphstone »

Offline HairyHereticTopic starter

  • Lei varai barbu - The true bearded one
  • Knight
  • Addict
  • *
  • Join Date: Dec 2006
  • Location: Ireland
  • Gender: Male
  • And the Scorpion said "Little frog .. I can swim."
  • My Role Play Preferences
  • View My Rolls
  • Referrals: 1
Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #23 on: February 10, 2014, 10:11:13 AM »
Cheers, I'll have a look at it.

Offline Barenmarder

Re: Interest check - Warhammer 40k - 30k Heresy era
« Reply #24 on: February 10, 2014, 10:44:30 AM »
I CAN work with a system and I have the various FFG games available to work from, but I'm a storyteller first and foremost so I prefer a freeform or rules lite environment.
Not a dealbreaker or anything, but I much prefer the freedom to tell a story. AND it neatly avoids the game balance difficulties by removing the problems.