Do you ever get sick of the toxic stuff on forums?

[Moondazed]

I think this thread is an example of reasonable people working through misunderstandings, which is a far cry from toxicity. :) 

It is, however, a great example of the mechanism that can lead to toxic stuff.  It took me a few months to figure out how to negotiate debating or discussing 'hot button' issues on forums because it's a lot different without inflection or body language and I found myself being easily offended and doing pretty much what's happening here.  The trick for me?  Stop.  Take a deep breath.  Now read the words and give the other person the benefit of the doubt, and read your own making a genuine effort to see the other party's viewpoint, and if you still disagree, respond respectfully.

Well said, Paladin101.

[Oniya]

I would also like to direct all newcomers (and old-comers, if they haven't already read them) to the stickies at the top of this forum.  Unlike many politics sections on forums, we do value reasoned debate over fallacious arguments.

[Sabby]

Lost Boy, I think what many are trying to convey is that if you come to a discussion already on the defensive, it tends to make you look like your there expecting a fight. Which means you're making a lot of assumptions about the people your speaking to, and speaking personally, I tend to not appreciate being devalued right out the gate as 'just a potential attacker'. That's like dismissing any potential contribution on my part before I've even opened my mouth.

I guarantee you that if you began your discussions with no preconceptions of the others involved, you'll have a better and more productive time.

[Lost Boy]

Oh Please!!! I would like to point out that I NEVER attacked anyone and I EVEN clarified every point for Miekle.

Now given that and some of you guys are still going on about it I would say I have ample grounds to feel harassed.

As far I am concerned all I did was challenge some people's thought process a little and instead of actually thinking about what I said in a calm manner they decided to do exactly what they accused me of doing which was to become emotional and defensive.

I'm not going to explain myself any further on this topic and I thank the people who posted with common sense and could see that I was being objective with my statements and speaking from a personal experience point of view.

Anyone who wants to take offence where there was no attack intended can go right ahead.

I can't help what you want to feel.

[Beguile's Mistress]

This might a good place to agree to disagree and move on without further comment.

[Lost Boy]

Anyway if this is the sort of thing I can expect from this site than I withdraw my interest.

[Paladin101]

Lost Boy, for someone accusing others of being defensive and emotional...well your response has been nothing but that. My post was in no way emotional, and in no way harassing. I pointed out how what you said was able to be taken in the manner you denied having made it in, showing you how the pattern formed by the presentation of your statements gave the impressions that most people here seem to have walked away with. A debate or discussion are both places meant to be ruled by rational thought and reason, not emotional outbursts or inflammatory wordplay. Accusing us of harassing you and becoming emotional and defensive...well it just doesn't hold water if you look at the content of the posts, so I'll thank you not to level such an accusation my way.

[Beguile's Mistress]

I said we'll agree to disagree and move on.

[Neysha]

Soooo how about that forum toxicity stuff...

[Kythia]

Soooo how about that forum toxicity stuff...

Yeah, I have no idea what is meant by that...

[Valthazar]

Yeah, I have no idea what is meant by that...

It is when one debates too much online, and toxicity builds in the mind.

[Kythia]

Ah that sounds like a rubbish ailment.  Why would people want to do that?  Down with the sickness, I say, down with it.

[Beguile's Mistress]

And it was such a good opportunity to show a newbie the best of Elliquiy.

[Moondazed]

You can lead a horse to water and all of that... Some people aren't capable of seeing the reality of their own flaws through their biases.

[Kythia]

I made a horse drink once.  But, then, it wasn't me who led it to the water.  Maybe those two are mutually exclusive - you can lead a horse to water or you can make it drink.  But lord help you if you try both.

[Beguile's Mistress]

*nods*  Tis why horse herders always work in pairs.

[Blythe]

You an lead a house to water and all of that... Some people aren't capable of seeing the reality of their own flaws through their biases.

I fully support leading houses to water. I've always wondered if my little two bedroom house could use a refreshing beverage. 

*coughs, a little embarrassed, and flees!*

[Beguile's Mistress]

*snickers*

[Neysha]

Yeah, I have no idea what is meant by that...

It's the topic of the thread. 

It is when one debates too much online, and toxicity builds in the mind.

Yeah I went over the Intro thread of our departed applicant and he stated from experience that political discussions were a waste of time. Clearly he must've taken a gander at the OP about how he could share his 'war stories' of flame fests and spoke a bit too candidly. Maybe it was a case of too much debating online. Though I have to compliment you VE, you were disgustingly inoffensive in this thread... just like all of the other ones in PROC despite your often contrary viewpoints. 

[Valthazar]

Though I have to compliment you VE, you were disgustingly inoffensive in this thread... just like all of the other ones in PROC despite your often contrary viewpoints. 

Only because I fear the potential wrath of all of you guys - as evidenced by this thread.  Nah, I'm just kidding, I think. 

[Moondazed]

I fully support leading houses to water. I've always wondered if my little two bedroom house could use a refreshing beverage. 

*coughs, a little embarrassed, and flees!*

F'ing auto-correct!  That's teach me to try to use that stupid little touchpad. :)

[Moondazed]

Only because I fear the potential wrath of all of you guys - as evidenced by this thread.  Nah, I'm just kidding, I think. 

You have nothing to fear as long as you understand how to present factual information and do a bit of self-examination, which you clearly do. :)  It also helps that you only tell us what you think, not what we do.

[meikle]

Now given that and some of you guys are still going on about it I would say I have ample grounds to feel harassed.

There is a staggering amount of hypocrisy in the post that this quote is taken from, isn't there?  I mean, I can't help how you choose to feel, but if you don't like feeling harassed maybe you should just choose to disable that feeling.

[Neysha]

There is a staggering amount of hypocrisy in the post that this quote is taken from, isn't there?  I mean, I can't help how you choose to feel, but if you don't like feeling harassed maybe you should just choose to disable that feeling.

Seriously? 

[meikle]

Seriously? 

Well, I could have gotten in on the horse thing, but I don't really care about horses and they're not really on-topic.  I just think it's funny that our newbie complains that people are harassing him in the same breath that he complains about people choosing to feel offended.  Well, if he believes it's a choice, isn't is his choice to be offended by my posts, not something I've done?  It can't be both; it doesn't really make sense that it's my choice to be offended (I'm not offended, but whatever), but when he's upset, it's not a choice.  How's that work?  We have a sticky about fallacious reasoning, right?

In my case, I mean, I think my posts in this thread have been for the most part pretty reasonable.  I addressed one person in particular because I noticed a kind of weird common thread throughout his posts.  I do agree with the OP that some topic matters aren't given a fair share (elsewhere, I guess, but it's certainly true here as well at times) and there are definitely some people who don't seem to have any intention of arguing (or even discussing) in earnest here in PROC (and I guess the rest of the internet, too).  A lot of the religious threads come to mind; a lot of those tend to look like people with superiority complexes trying to browbeat people who disagree with them.  That's not good for debate.

Neither is storming out of the room and telling people that they should choose to feel less offended when they ask "Why do you want to keep talking about how Nazis weren't so bad?"  Toxicity, right?