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Author Topic: The World of Darkness Thread  (Read 11125 times)

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Offline Moraline

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #150 on: December 13, 2012, 04:22:46 PM »
*Takes SilverFyre's arm and heads off to go play V:tM with him*

Offline Avis habilis

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #151 on: December 13, 2012, 04:25:56 PM »
I really don't see where the idea that PvP is so ingrained into V:tM is coming from.

Me neither. We played V:tM for years & the general attitude among the PCs was that "we're all noobs, so we had better stick together or we'll get played, enslaved, killed, or all three at once".

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #152 on: December 13, 2012, 04:43:57 PM »
Different playstyles then, I guess. I really don't like Vampire that much specifically because of its PvP focus, I've never known anyone who played it differently.

Offline Silverfyre

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Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #153 on: December 13, 2012, 05:14:36 PM »
*Takes SilverFyre's arm and heads off to go play V:tM with him*
Dibs on the Brujah!

Offline Outsider

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #154 on: December 13, 2012, 05:50:07 PM »
I always wanted to re-buy V:tM, my original discs broke ages ago and I'm not a fan of internetware. I guess I have to put it on my santa list.

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #155 on: December 13, 2012, 05:55:43 PM »
I always wanted to re-buy V:tM, my original discs broke ages ago and I'm not a fan of internetware. I guess I have to put it on my santa list.

Do you mean the computer game Bloodlines, or the tabletop book? The former you can get off Steam. The latter, you'll want to get the V20 edition, which is $45 for a softcover book from DrivethruRPG.

Offline Chris Brady

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #156 on: December 13, 2012, 05:56:43 PM »
Different playstyles then, I guess. I really don't like Vampire that much specifically because of its PvP focus, I've never known anyone who played it differently.
Around here, most people who played V:tM, the first thing they did was discard any hint of PvP versus each other.  The game was still politically centered, but the Players in the various groups I heard about here focused mainly against the NPCs.  The political focus is still heavy in the game, and it's supposed to be 'clan vs. clan', but a lot of local players disliked that.

LARPs on the other hand, much different situation.  The horror stories I could tell you of a couple, now defunct, groupings...

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #157 on: December 13, 2012, 06:10:17 PM »
Around here, most people who played V:tM, the first thing they did was discard any hint of PvP versus each other.  The game was still politically centered, but the Players in the various groups I heard about here focused mainly against the NPCs.  The political focus is still heavy in the game, and it's supposed to be 'clan vs. clan', but a lot of local players disliked that.

LARPs on the other hand, much different situation.  The horror stories I could tell you of a couple, now defunct, groupings...

Maybe that's the root cause. All of the VtM players I know also play in the MES LARP chronicle, and they're quite proud of how dedicated to PvP they are there, so it's possible they just take the same attitude on tabletop.

Offline Silverfyre

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Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #158 on: December 13, 2012, 06:38:48 PM »
Again, it depends on the players involved but MES? Yrah, totally kill box happy. It was half the reason we left. The other half being bullshit politics of course.

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #159 on: December 13, 2012, 06:45:40 PM »
Maybe the culture's changed. The politics are still as ugly as ever, but around here the people I hang around with in the club whine about how they're part of a distinct minority in the club who are actually willing to box people, and everyone else lacks the guts for it.

Offline Braioch

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Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #160 on: December 13, 2012, 08:18:20 PM »
In regards to actually boxing someone, allow me to draw attention to a true Vampires thoughts on the matter.

"Fight them? Why do that, when I can just have another idiot fight that idiot while I'm NOT getting covered in blood and blame, works much better."

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #161 on: December 13, 2012, 08:24:10 PM »
Though the commensurate counter-perspective would be "when you want a job done right, do it yourself". A subordinate competent enough to take out a rival is a subordinate potentially competent enough to take out you as well if your rival gets control of them, so they become as much liability as benefit.

Offline LunarSage

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #162 on: December 13, 2012, 08:24:53 PM »
In regards to actually boxing someone, allow me to draw attention to a true Vampires thoughts on the matter.

"Fight them? Why do that, when I can just have another idiot fight that idiot while I'm NOT getting covered in blood and blame, works much better."

"Especially when I can arrange things so that Vampire A and Vampire B fight and neither has any idea I was involved."

Offline Braioch

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Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #163 on: December 13, 2012, 08:26:43 PM »
Though the commensurate counter-perspective would be "when you want a job done right, do it yourself". A subordinate competent enough to take out a rival is a subordinate potentially competent enough to take out you as well if your rival gets control of them, so they become as much liability as benefit.

This is why you send the one who gets himself killed or badly blamed in the process without them ever knowing you sent them in the first place. Especially if the one you sent is going to represent one of your rivals by being busted or killed.

Come on Glyph, why do it yourself when other people screwing it up and having it blow up in other faces is what the good stuff is made of.

Offline LunarSage

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #164 on: December 13, 2012, 08:27:29 PM »
"It is a world of darkness.

The Sin of Caine has spawned the cursed horror that stalks the Night in search of Living Blood.

The Kindred have long been a secret influence through all ages of human History, plotting against each other in a never-ending Jyhad.

Their Immortal progeny are among us to this day ...hidden from the eyes of Humanity by an elaborate Masquerade."




First time I saw that intro I had a geekgasm.

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #165 on: December 13, 2012, 08:34:58 PM »
This is why you send the one who gets himself killed or badly blamed in the process without them ever knowing you sent them in the first place. Especially if the one you sent is going to represent one of your rivals by being busted or killed.

Come on Glyph, why do it yourself when other people screwing it up and having it blow up in other faces is what the good stuff is made of.

That's the tricky part there. If you don't cover your tracks right, their screwup will blow up in your face, and you won't know it's coming because you weren't there to oversee the hit. If they succeed you're home free, but the number of ways to pull off a traceless hit like that are rather small, and tend to be very complicated, especially if the intended scapegoat is taken alive. Always better to act through pawns, yes, but sometimes getting your hands dirty is unavoidable

This does also vary by clan, of course. A Brujah or Gangrel's much more likely to take direct action and just murderize any potential witnesses than a Ventrue or Toreador.

Offline LunarSage

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #166 on: December 13, 2012, 08:37:14 PM »
My elder Lasombra arranged for the death of a 5th generation Cardinal who unwittingly crossed him with clever uses of Influence and Dominate.  No one was the wiser until some unfortunate metagaming occurred.

Online SkynetTopic starter

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #167 on: December 13, 2012, 10:01:41 PM »
I got the V20 book in hardcover format.  I'm a newbie to Masquerade, but I figured that this volume is a goldmine of material compiled over the years, so I got it.  And the Vampire Translation Guide if I want to adopt mechanics for the New system.

It's a very enjoyable read so far.  Just wondering, but are the Lasombra and Tzimisce almost always Sabbat?  It comes off that way, but I can't see what's preventing them from defecting.

Offline LunarSage

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #168 on: December 13, 2012, 10:06:51 PM »
They are almost always Sabbat because those two clans are the leaders of the Sabbat; the Lasombra for their leadership and the Tzimisce to lead their spiritual ways.

They are very unlikely to defect because the Camarilla are probably not going to accept them, suspecting (often rightly so) that the "defector" is in fact a Sabbat spy.

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #169 on: December 13, 2012, 10:07:02 PM »
I got the V20 book in hardcover format.  I'm a newbie to Masquerade, but I figured that this volume is a goldmine of material compiled over the years, so I got it.  And the Vampire Translation Guide if I want to adopt mechanics for the New system.

It's a very enjoyable read so far.  Just wondering, but are the Lasombra and Tzimisce almost always Sabbat?  It comes off that way, but I can't see what's preventing them from defecting.

The rest of their clan - like, all of them - would hunt the defectors down and murderface them in an indescribably horrific fashion. The Lasombra and Tzimisce effectively founded the Sabbat, they're the two most singularly respected clans in the Sword and the antithesis of pretty much anything that the Camarilla stands for. The only non-Sabbat Tzimisce are the independent Old Clan members who live in Eastern Europe and basically tell both sides to bugger off and leave them alone.

Offline LunarSage

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #170 on: December 13, 2012, 10:17:31 PM »
Admittedly, you're far more likely to see a Lasombra Antitribu (Camarilla aligned) than you are a Tzimisce Antitribu.

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #171 on: December 13, 2012, 10:27:56 PM »
True, but I'd figure that would be because the Lasombra have no where else to run. The Tzimisce at least can go back to the old country as independents, and if they're low enough gen to make hunting them not worth the cost, the rest of the clan will let them go. A Lasombra who leaves the Sabbat is pretty much forced to run to the Camarilla due to a total lack of other options, particularly since he'll almost certainly be Wild Hunted and have not just the entire Lasombra clan, but the entire Sword of Caine after his blood.

Offline Lilias

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #172 on: December 14, 2012, 01:33:03 AM »
Lucita managed to stall for a few centuries, but even she had to join the Sabbat in the end. ;)

Offline Hellis

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #173 on: December 14, 2012, 04:24:43 AM »
Much more of a VT:R fan myself. I like the more balanced approach i feel it have. The less "two sides" and more of a political hotbed rife with the worst kind of back stabbery.

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: The World of Darkness Thread
« Reply #174 on: December 14, 2012, 04:43:18 AM »
I love Requiem mechanically, and my GMing style leans more towards sandboxes anyways, so its lack of a metaplot never bothered me. There are a lot of people who whom the huge and intricate metaplot is the entire point, though.