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Author Topic: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."  (Read 2280 times)

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Offline IniquitousTopic starter

"If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« on: May 09, 2012, 03:55:25 PM »

I had this posted by a friend on my FB and thought I’d share it here to see what everyone else thinks.

Call me a conspiracy theorist but I do believe the things this guy says in this video. I do believe that the situation we are in now started a long time ago by the elite and that it we are the frog that was put in cold water to boil to death as the water heats up.

I also believe that the population is being dumb down. People are more interested in Snooki and the Real Housewives of whatever city than what is happening in the government. I do believe that anyone who speaks out is labeled ‘conspiracy theorist’ and ‘crazy’.

I also believe it is going to get a lot worse.

Offline Oniya

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Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2012, 04:00:37 PM »
Panem et circenses.  It worked for Rome, and it's working here.  At least, until they started running out of panem.

Offline Shjade

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2012, 04:11:40 PM »
Most of this sounds like it tracks fairly well, regardless of whether it's a real conspiracy or just theorycrafting. The bit in the middle about the slow-kill water and causing autism, though? That seems a little far out there.

Offline IniquitousTopic starter

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2012, 04:17:03 PM »
Research the flouride they put in our water. It is a neurotoxin and it is slowly doing harm to our bodies. Research aspartame - it is a neurotoxin as well and the FDA knew it and still approved it.

Do I believe vaccines are bad? I am honestly not sure. My kids were vaccinated though I willingly admit that it was because I did not question anything I was told then. Doctors said it was needed, I did it. I've heard many different things on the subject but I honestly do not know enough to make a decision. However, with that said, I've also read a lot of things about population reduction being something the global elite want and slow poisoning is one of the tools in their arsenal.

Offline Oniya

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Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2012, 05:24:18 PM »
I researched the vaccine thing after a friend's daughter developed autism.  Perhaps it was coincidence, but it was shortly after getting the MMR cocktail.  After finding out that Thimersol (the mercury-based preservative) is no longer used, we still exercised caution - no more than two needles at a time, and a period of observation between vaccinations.

Offline Trieste

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Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2012, 11:13:33 PM »
Okay, the doctor who originally published the vaccine-autism crap is in jail. It is a medical fraud perpetuated by a greedy asshole who was up to his ears in conflicts of interest.

Fluoride being a slow-kill agent is about as plausible as the chemtrail theory, which is to say not very.

My research is in the toxic and mutagenic properties of everyday pesticides used widely in agriculture, so I'm no stranger to what lurks in the food supply, but this is some serious tinfoil hat shit. Considering how crappy the little science mentioned in the video is, I question the validity of the rest of the video. I will say that I have yet to see a reputable analysis from a forensic engineer or accident reconstruction specialist that verifies controlled demolition of the buildings in NYC on 9/11. I will also say that the idea of the government monitoring social media for any signs of dissent is not only ludicrous, but impossible. Anti-government news/propaganda is spread through Twitter, Facebook, Tumblr, StumbleUpon, and a million other sites daily.

In short, this video is pure fiction as far as I'm concerned. It reminds me of the script writer that specializes in working famous events into movie scripts (e.g. Forrest Gump).

Offline Serephino

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2012, 01:29:01 AM »
The video had some good points, but was a little too extreme.

I'm fairly certain the twin towers were hit by planes.  The most logical theory I've heard on that is Bush knew it was going to happen, and did nothing to stop it.  Whether it's true, I don't know.  I've been told the very same thing was tried while Clinton was in office 9 times, but his people caught them.  And gee, they didn't didn't need all this ridiculous security.  Maybe he just had other priorities and paid no attention to national security.  But then of course after the attack he took full advantage of it, didn't he?

It's also very true that people are more engrossed in the lives of celebs than what's going on around them.  My one friend talks about celeb gossip all the time, cuz I guess she thinks I care, but I doubt she could find Iraq on a map.  My boyfriend went to school with seniors who couldn't read.  Education funding keeps being gutted.  That part of the video I do agree with.  Undereducated people tend to be complacent.  A disturbingly large part of the population is quite content to sit in front of the TV and get into all of these reality shows.  How many people know what the Bill of Rights is, and what's in it?

The chemical thing I don't know about.  Vaccines I'm on the fence about.  The preservatives can't be good for us.  I know we have livers that are meant to deal with toxins, but they're everywhere.  Autism is a problem now, and it wasn't before.  Whether or not vaccines have anything to do with it we'll probably never know.  There's enough money at stake to really make me wonder about the scientist who swear up and down the guy who said they were is a crackpot.  After all, studies generally come out in favor of whoever funded it.  I swear, two different groups on different sides of an issue could do the exact same study, and both come up with results that prove their point. 

I do know that after being given the MMR vaccine as a baby I had a seizure hours later.  My parents decided not to give me the rest of them, and I haven't had one since.  I think all the requirements that kids have to have now to go to school is just bullshit.  It should be up to the parents.  If people are so worried about public health, well, the vaccinated kids are safe, unless vaccinations don't work...  But chickenpox?  I had it. It sucked, but I survived.  The secret to a healthy immune system is using it.  My doctor had to lie on my physical form because I didn't have my MMR booster shots since we're pretty sure the first one is what gave me the seizure. 

The things is the elite do rule the country.  They are the new nobility.  Of course, we got out from under British rule, so we can knock the 1% down a notch, it'll just take a lot of people getting angry enough.  We're well on our way.     

Offline Shjade

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2012, 01:52:22 AM »
My research is in the toxic and mutagenic properties of everyday pesticides used widely in agriculture

Aha, so you're in on it! Of course you'd claim it's harmless! @.@

As for knocking the 1% down a notch, um...the situation isn't exactly comparable to overthrowing British rule. Our 1% isn't overseas, and they have much better tech. If this takes people getting angry enough to act violently against the government, it's going to either going to get very messy, or it's going to be over very fast. :|

Offline Serephino

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2012, 02:17:05 AM »
My point was just that change is possible.  Violence isn't the only answer, though it is usually the most effective.  What needs to happen is for people to quit caring so much about Snooki, pay attention to what Congress is doing, and quit drinking the kool aid and use their own brains. 

Offline Oniya

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Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2012, 02:18:14 AM »
To be clear, the main points that I agree with are that 1) Americans in general are more interested in the celebs than the issues, and 2) the situation has been getting bad for a while, but slowly (boiling frogs).  My attitude to vaccines was a combination of caution (if there's going to be a reaction, better to minimize the variables) and a vague discomfort at the idea of a <1-year-old getting half a dozen injections at one go.  I don't care if it's sterile saline at that point.  It's a person, not a pincushion!

Offline Sure

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2012, 02:41:09 AM »
Panem et circenses.  It worked for Rome, and it's working here.  At least, until they started running out of panem.

On the note of the dumbing down of America, you've failed to properly assimilate the Latin words. Panem et circenses is accusative but you should have used it as a nominative the first time and an ablative the second. More to the point, you're quoting Juvenal's satires, which are sometimes taken to be the mocking of the stodgy and conservative elements of upper class Rome. If not, and his sentiments are genuine, they are very conservative and reactionary.

So I very well have grounds to say you care more about your own little pet causes than having a proper education. Which I say not to point that out, because frankly Latin is just a like of mine, but to point out that anyone can (and often does) create a standard by which they are on the 'right' and 'smart' side from which they can look down on those who aren't with them on the right/smart side. It's a very common behavior and one that isn't likely to change, but it's also in part what these conspiracy theories appeal to. Likewise it's the appeal for those who believe that people need to change more to their own approval. It's also the cause of a good deal of factionalism: The other side is just stupid or ignorant or dumb or lazy, they can't possibly have a point, they just need to be educated/converted/pick your term here.

Though, of course, when I say something it's objectively correct and you all need to submit to my superior judgement. :P

Offline Etah dna Evol

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Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2012, 06:16:32 AM »
9/11 Truthism is silly and every generation has predicted the collapse of society and the world as we know it, but humans are adaptable creatures and we adapt our society with it. Also, 9/11 Trusthism is silly.

One thing I will give this guy, is that he doesn't have a polarized political agenda, he was equally critical of both Bush and Obama.

Offline IniquitousTopic starter

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2012, 07:40:33 AM »
I don’t have time for a full research on fluoride at the moment as I have to log into work very soon (I’ll do more once I get my mid shift break), however, this is taken from the EPA’s website.

“What are fluoride's health effects?
Exposure to excessive consumption of fluoride over a lifetime may lead to increased likelihood of bone fractures in adults, and may result in effects on bone leading to pain and tenderness. Children aged 8 years and younger exposed to excessive amounts of fluoride have an increased chance of developing pits in the tooth enamel, along with a range of cosmetic effects to teeth.
This health effects language is not intended to catalog all possible health effects for fluoride. Rather, it is intended to inform consumers of some of the possible health effects associated with fluoride in drinking water.”

Source: http://water.epa.gov/drink/contaminants/basicinformation/fluoride.cfm


This is from the US National Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health

“Fluoride (F) is known to affect mineralizing tissues, but effects upon the developing brain have not been previously considered. This study in Sprague-Dawley rats compares behavior, body weight, plasma and brain F levels after sodium fluoride (NaF) exposures during late gestation, at weaning or in adults. For prenatal exposures, dams received injections (SC) of 0.13 mg/kg NaF or saline on gestational days 14-18 or 17-19. Weanlings received drinking water containing 0, 75, 100, or 125 ppm F for 6 or 20 weeks, and 3 month-old adults received water containing 100 ppm F for 6 weeks. Behavior was tested in a computer pattern recognition system that classified acts in a novel environment and quantified act initiations, total times and time structures. Fluoride exposures caused sex- and dose-specific behavioral deficits with a common pattern. Males were most sensitive to prenatal day 17-19 exposure, whereas females were more sensitive to weanling and adult exposures. After fluoride ingestion, the severity of the effect on behavior increased directly with plasma F levels and F concentrations in specific brain regions. Such association is important considering that plasma levels in this rat model (0.059 to 0.640 ppm F) are similar to those reported in humans exposed to high levels of fluoride. “

Source: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7760776

To make this simple since I do not have time to go through everything at this moment, below is the link to the City of Fairbanks, Alaska. They started collecting research papers on fluoride and posted it. Again, I have not went through each and every link to read the research, have not had the time.

I’ll also add that my mother is a dental assistant, has been all of her adult life, and when discussing fluoride and it’s effects on humans, she does say that it is a neurotoxin and that it does cause problems in humans after a lifetime of exposure.

Source: http://www.fairbanksalaska.us/fluoride-task-force/fluoride-reference-materials/fluoride-effects/


More to come when I can sit down and research more.

ADD: Serephino - Yes, the twin towers were hit by planes. Building 7 was not and yet it collapsed. That is what the video was talking about.

Offline Trieste

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Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2012, 09:33:54 AM »
And what counts as excessive? And how many young children are given water in excess rather than, say, juice, milk, and soda? I could go on and on, but I'm not going to. Suffice to say that I have looked at the literature, and I find it absolutely frustrating that people are being warned away from drinking water due to some questionable health threat - when the health threat of things like sugary juices and sodas are very, very real. We should be encouraging young children to drink more water rather than less. Or, rather, encouraging their parents to give it to them. Additionally, in my particular township the water wasn't fluoridated until recently. They began adding fluoride only within the last few years - when the town residents voted for it. That's hardly a conspiracy of the rich against the poor.

I've said my piece about the vaccine bullshit. It's junk science and that's about all I have to say on that one.

To be clear, the main points that I agree with are that 1) Americans in general are more interested in the celebs than the issues, and 2) the situation has been getting bad for a while, but slowly (boiling frogs).

This, however, I do agree with. Sometimes, trying to get other people in my age group to care about politics feels like catching pebbles in a landslide.

Offline Oniya

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Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #14 on: May 10, 2012, 09:38:23 AM »
On the note of the dumbing down of America, you've failed to properly assimilate the Latin words. Panem et circenses is accusative but you should have used it as a nominative the first time and an ablative the second. More to the point, you're quoting Juvenal's satires, which are sometimes taken to be the mocking of the stodgy and conservative elements of upper class Rome. If not, and his sentiments are genuine, they are very conservative and reactionary.

Honestly asking here - what would be the proper construction?  I resorted to Google to find the spelling this time.  :-[

Offline Torch

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Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #15 on: May 10, 2012, 10:19:09 AM »
I've said my piece about the vaccine bullshit. It's junk science and that's about all I have to say on that one.


Whenever naysayers start railing away on the dangers of vaccination, I refer them to this abstract from the AAP:

An unvaccinated 7-year-old exposes measles to 839 people.

Vaccination is a public health issue, which has deadly consequences many parents choose to ignore.

Offline Valerian

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2012, 11:46:54 AM »
This is from the US National Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health

“Fluoride (F) is known to affect mineralizing tissues, but effects upon the developing brain have not been previously considered. This study in Sprague-Dawley rats compares behavior, body weight, plasma and brain F levels after sodium fluoride (NaF) exposures during late gestation, at weaning or in adults. For prenatal exposures, dams received injections (SC) of 0.13 mg/kg NaF or saline on gestational days 14-18 or 17-19. Weanlings received drinking water containing 0, 75, 100, or 125 ppm F for 6 or 20 weeks, and 3 month-old adults received water containing 100 ppm F for 6 weeks.... “

Quote
Water fluoridation is the process of adding fluoride to the water supply so the level reaches approximately 0.7 ppm, or 0.7 milligrams of fluoride per liter of water; this is the optimal level for preventing tooth decay.

That's from this site: http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/fluoridated-water.  So yes, that experiment involved mega-doses of the stuff, far beyond what's normally found in drinking water.  Even the lowest level used is more than 100 times greater than that in fluoridated water.

Offline Callie Del Noire

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #17 on: May 10, 2012, 12:35:23 PM »
To be clear, the main points that I agree with are that 1) Americans in general are more interested in the celebs than the issues, and 2) the situation has been getting bad for a while, but slowly (boiling frogs).  My attitude to vaccines was a combination of caution (if there's going to be a reaction, better to minimize the variables) and a vague discomfort at the idea of a <1-year-old getting half a dozen injections at one go.  I don't care if it's sterile saline at that point.  It's a person, not a pincushion!

When all you're getting fed is 'Snookie is Pregnant' and such. I watched the news on Fox in the galley one day when we literally couldn't do anything (2 feet of snow makes it hard to pick up recycling) and what did I see? Six hours of 'Will Paris Hilton have to attend her DUI trial in person?' complete with in the air choppers coverage for HOURS.

Same day? In Venezuhala, Chavez was hijacking his countries constitution (following the path laid out by Adolf Hitler.. compare their careers.. there are an AMAZING number of similar actions) and students were being beaten up in front of the capital by men in biker helmets while cops mysterious 'vanished'.

How much was this covered by US media.. It wasn't. Not one damn channel that day covered it, or other actions going on in Venezuela. It was Paris Hilton.. meanwhile 'relevant' news was only found on channels like BBC America or new service websites.

The media isn't about news reporting anymore..hasn't been for nearly the entire 25 years of CNN's existance. Once Ted Turner sold it off.. it went to one thing.

Ratings.

The companies are about ad revenues.. and viewer share. Paris Hilton is a LOT more news worthy than a man hijacking his country and setting up things so he can rule it forever. I understand when he screwed over several European companies (and a few US ones) by nationalizing assets such as the oil industry.. there was as much coverage then. Which is to say damn near none.

Offline Shjade

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #18 on: May 10, 2012, 08:07:47 PM »
Sometimes, trying to get other people in my age group to care about politics feels like catching pebbles in a landslide.

To be fair, I'm equally uncaring about pretty much everything.

Yay depression!

Offline rick957

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #19 on: May 10, 2012, 08:48:09 PM »
Honestly asking here - what would be the proper construction?  I resorted to Google to find the spelling this time.  :-[

It's kinda off-topic but not by too much, I hope; I just want to say that I would like an answer to this question also.  Why should bread be in nominative and circuses in ablative?  Oniya used the form of the phrase as it appeared in the original text; that would seem to me to be appropriate.  I used to be a Latin nerd, so I'm curious.  :)

Offline JZargo

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2012, 09:50:22 AM »
The Video is overly dramatic. What's with the music?

The guy in the video is basicly explaining his views and saying "This leads to dictatorship!" without actually providing any proof of it. He suggests 9/11 was an inside job. It probably wasn't, but in his world it's already settled. He also claims the Bill of Rights should remain unchanged, no matter the circumstances. Very ignorant in my book. Who is he to say that our sentiments won't evolve? He's somehow suggesting we reached our moral, ethical and philosophical peak 200 years ago? Nothing we learned after that matters?

Sorry, but there's nothing new whatsoever in this video, but his speech is built up as if you're supposed to go "Oh my god, that's so true! He's telling it like it is!". Of course he's telling it like it is. He's simply stating facts or recalling history. The only new thing is that he's somehow suggesting this leads to dictatorship. He doesn't really explain why. It "just is that way".

I do believe money rules the world, but this guy has got to go to greater lengths to convince me that The New World Order is coming.

Offline Hemingway

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #21 on: May 28, 2012, 10:38:29 AM »
If I wanted America to be a dictatorship, I'd let people distract themselves with conspiracy theories, while carrying out my real actions in broad daylight. It's much neater that way.

I think there's a lot to be alarmed about in America, but this is ... well, it's quite simply too complicated, and pointless. Why would you poison the water if you wanted to create a dictatorship? That makes absolutely no sense, unless you imagine that it's being run by some sort of comic book villain. The 9/11 conspiracy theories at least make sense, in that it's conceivable that Big Brother could use an attack to spread fear. But what does Big Brother stand to gain from giving 1 out of 84 boys autism?

If you're interested in a less dramatized view of fascism in America, I recommend listening to the talks of Chris Hedges, many of which are available on Youtube. The one titled "FIGHT GOP FASCISM" is a decent place to start, I think. Don't think it solely attacks the GOP, though. Hedges attacks pretty much everyone.

Offline Succubus

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #22 on: May 29, 2012, 02:31:01 PM »
The video lost my interest when it depicted Obama burning the US constitution. I tried to watch for a bit longer to see if it got better, but then it started with the whole 9/11 Truthism thing and I stopped it.
This:
Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
is a dictatorship.
This:
Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
is not.

Offline Sabre

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #23 on: May 29, 2012, 02:49:26 PM »
I would ask: Why would anyone want America to be a dictatorship?  They don't make very good markets for anyone but arms industries, and I've yet to see Christmas sales for Tomahawk cruise missiles.

Offline Callie Del Noire

Re: "If I wanted America to be a dictatorship..."
« Reply #24 on: May 29, 2012, 03:10:16 PM »
This:
Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
is a dictatorship.
This:
Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
is not.

True.. but you also have to look at what is going on behind the scenes. You've got an INTENSELY partisan congress where moderation, compromise and bipartisan are bad words. It has been changed from a congress where you worked to build a consensus and worked through problems and aired the issues and showed the process at work to one where it's increasingly hard to get enough time to discuss upcoming bills. You have folks who have totally rewritten the law making process with an aim of minimizing the other parties input and ability to counter them. You have a senate where the majority rewrote the rules that they THEMSELVES used when they weren't in control that allow for filibusters and discussion to favor their control.

Take a real LONG HARD look at the way the process has changed. Leadership in the GOP (and the Dems when they were in control) has changed the process in law making a lot. Where do you think you can get away with off handedly dismissing ANY female input into an issue covering birth control as 'irrelevant' except when one group totally controls the rules that set up committees and board with no input or counters by the other one?

I would ask: Why would anyone want America to be a dictatorship?  They don't make very good markets for anyone but arms industries, and I've yet to see Christmas sales for Tomahawk cruise missiles.

Because.. to paraphrase Mel Brooks.. "It's good to be the 'party in power'."

Tyranny doesn't come all at once.. it's a death of hundreds of cuts. How many practices do we allow today would have we allowed before 9/11. Fear dictates too many of our political decisions these days..and by using fear..we let our freedoms get cut away.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2012, 03:17:44 PM by Callie Del Noire »