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Author Topic: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950  (Read 3837 times)

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Online TheGlyphstone

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #25 on: January 18, 2012, 05:49:35 PM »
I should be fine, now that I know the PL starting point. A variant on the Construct archetype as a base, probably using Electricity-based ranged attacks (Direct Current, naturally).

Offline The Great TriangleTopic starter

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #26 on: January 18, 2012, 07:43:05 PM »
Of course, but an Alternating current force field to restrain foes next to you would be awesome too!  (If prohibitively expensive to actually add to your character)

Offline Aoife

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #27 on: January 19, 2012, 02:33:28 AM »
I'm somewhat interested in this concept.  Could someone explain to me how Mutants and Masterminds works?  Quite simply, I'm curious as to whether it's a system worth picking up, as I keep hearing it mentioned.

Offline eavatar

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #28 on: January 19, 2012, 10:13:54 AM »
I am interested play a Captain Marvel like. Before the transformation he is a great governament agent, fully capable to take some villains by himself, but after the change he is an unbeatable amazon princess. He still doesn't know how he got tied to the amazon, but it seems both have a good deal about their life out of action.

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #29 on: January 19, 2012, 11:20:19 AM »
I'm somewhat interested in this concept.  Could someone explain to me how Mutants and Masterminds works?  Quite simply, I'm curious as to whether it's a system worth picking up, as I keep hearing it mentioned.

Basically, it's a d20 entirely modular point-based system. Rather than choosing a race or class or spells, you are allocated a set amount of Power Points used to buy everything. Stats cost points, feats and skills cost points, powers and abilities cost points, etc. The more points invested in any one skill/stat/power, the better it becomes, with a flat cap on the power of any one ability that scales against the points you were awarded at the start.

Online ShadowFox89

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #30 on: January 19, 2012, 11:29:54 AM »
 I'm looking at Psychic or Energy Controller right now.... I don't think I've got the points to fit in Triangle's Spirit Form.

Offline Aoife

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #31 on: January 19, 2012, 11:44:14 AM »
Thanks for the summary Glyph, I'll pick up the core tomorrow and sketch out a character.

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #32 on: January 19, 2012, 12:15:04 PM »
Since you're new, what would be a good/better idea is picking up the book and looking over the Sample Archtypes. They're basically pregenerated characters each conforming to a particular type of comic book hero (the Battlesuit wearer, the Detective, the Mage, the SupermanParagon, etc.) - take the one closest to your character concept, then tweak it.

As an example, I'm playing a sentient robot built by Thomas Edison. I used the Construct archetype as a baseline, lowered some of my physical stats to boost mental stats, and changed my Ranged Electrical attack into a Melee attack to free up some points (which I then spent on an extra disabling effect tied to my electrical touch).

Offline The Great TriangleTopic starter

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #33 on: January 19, 2012, 01:28:22 PM »
Glyphstone's  advice is pretty good, though I have a personal preference for only using the archetypes as a guide to create characters from scratch. 

In my opinion, the Archtypes serve more to show off the system then they do to provide good quality starting characters. 

For some baseline recommendations, I do believe that every character, unless their concept VERY strongly calls for being weak in some area, should max out their offensive and defensive capabilities, save perhaps for fortitude and will, which are a bit expensive to max out.  When designing powers, a very important thing to keep in mind is that if you never imagine using two powers at the same time, you should think very hard before ever paying more than one point for the second power.  Alternate power arrays exist for an important reason, and they're a great way to pick up required secondary powers and things you'll only use from time to time.

On that note, when designing a power, I find it's best to work "top down" and think up the power in comic book terms before you try to put stats to it.  When you design your power, try to look at the extras that would logically apply to it, and see what flaws you can put on it.  Remember that if you reduce the cost of a power to 0 points per rank, the power is half price, and so on, which can enable you to pick up amazingly effective, if quirky, powers. 

So, for some advice on picking up the spirit form power, I suggest figuring out your power that costs closest to 40 points, then upgrading the power to cost 40 points and making it into an alternate power of spirit form.  This has the advantage of giving you an easy transition into corporeal form, and also gives you ample justification to add limitation, activation time, and quirk flaws to both powers to reduce the cost even further.  (a limited spirit form is only 22 points, after all)  A dynamic power array could theoretically be an alternate power of your spirit form, which could be a very handy power for a trickster archetype.

As for designing a character who turns into an amazon, simply create a non-powered hero of about PL 8, then add a bunch of powers to raise your character to PL 10 using the remaining 30 points, getting a 2 flat point discount for the standard action you have to spend transforming.  (though since you change gender, you'll probably have to buy the alternate identity advantage as a power.)  If you need extra points, you could always lock a few more of your powers behind successive anime style transformation sequences or attack calls, though  30 points should just about pay for super strength, invulnerability, and fighting skills.  (with the fighting skills possibly tied to a magic sword or headband)


Here's another example power suggested for Glyphstone's character:

Edison's Phonograph

Variable 1, Activation (Standard Action), Limited (skills only), Removable, Uncontrollable   (1 point)

This drastically upgraded phonograph contains all of the death recordings and final will and testament of Thomas Edison.  By spending a standard action putting the phonograph on, and a second standard action listening to Edison speak for a few minutes, the listener temporarily gains up to 10 ranks in a skill chosen by Thomas Edison's recording from his advice.  The phonograph will often grant skill in technology, but it frequently grants the following skills also:

Expertise: Science
Expertise: The Evils of Communism
Expertise: Concrete Furniture
Expertise: Copyright Law
Expertise: Tesla Sucks
« Last Edit: January 19, 2012, 01:47:45 PM by The Great Triangle »

Offline Callie Del Noire

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #34 on: January 19, 2012, 01:29:44 PM »
Hmm.. I might have alter my speedster a bit.. make her more like Northstar than the Flash.


Online TheGlyphstone

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #35 on: January 19, 2012, 05:33:48 PM »
 Are there any changes to the default skill list?

Offline The Great TriangleTopic starter

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #36 on: January 19, 2012, 07:04:49 PM »
The only change to the skill system is that Expertise: Superhumans would properly be called Expertise: Atomic Heroes, and cover heroes without superpowers as well.  Expertise: Superpowers would remain the same, though.  You can more or less define your own areas of Expertise, and then use the defaulting rules to suss out what it covers.  I doubt that very many PCs will pick areas of expertise that are excessively narrow.

Edison's Phonograph tends to give you limited expertise skills as part of its variable function.  It's a quirk I forgot to list.  (Also, more fun than writing up say, Expertise: Atomic Heroes, limited to how much Tesla sucks.)  An improved version of the phonograph, with two ranks of variable to be able to bestow 20 ranks in a skill would cost 5 points.  (Which, to be fair, would be a lot to pay for a removable power that gives you 20 ranks in Expertise: Lightbulbs)

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #37 on: January 19, 2012, 07:08:11 PM »
What's Edison's Phonograph?


EDIT: Something I do need clarification on is how powers work with cost reductions. If I have, say, Quickness at the cost of 1 point per rank, but the Limitation/Flaw of Mental Only at -1 point per rank, why don't ranks for me cost 0 points each? They don't because the Mystic archetype shows me, but what rule am I missing?
« Last Edit: January 19, 2012, 07:14:57 PM by TheGlyphstone »

Offline The Great TriangleTopic starter

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #38 on: January 19, 2012, 07:43:49 PM »
The method for calculating the cost of powers below 1 point per rank done by the ratio of power points to ranks.  Normally, this will be multiple power points for one rank, so if a power cost 3 points per rank, it could be expressed by the ratio 3:1.  When you lower the cost per rank below 1 point, each subtraction increases the opposite side of the ratio, so a 1 point per rank power with a 1 point discount grants 2 ranks per point, like a skill, an effective ratio of 1:2.

This means:

0 points per rank = 2 ranks per point  (1:2)
-1 points per rank = 3 ranks per point (1:3)
-2 points per rank = 4 ranks per point (1:4)
-3 points per rank = 5 ranks per point (1:5)

It is not acceptable to get a power above rank 5 for 1 point, since that would just be silly.  Similarly, powers that cost 0 points are allowed only in very specific circumstances (that is, when it's logically impossible for you to NOT have the power)  No matter what, a power can never cost less than 0 points.


An example of the principle:  Say that you have the Flight 4 power to represent your ability to telekinetically hurl yourself through the air at 30 miles per hour, and you have a secondary power to use your telekinesis on objects, a move object power with the damaging and subtle extras, each costing 1 additional point per rank, meaning that your move object power costs 4 points per rank.  (therefore your secondary power is rank 4).  This secondary effect costs 1 point, increasing the cost of your Flight power to 9 points.  (from 8) 

Next, you give yourself an additional secondary effect to create a telekinetic force field to protect yourself.  This counts as a sustained protection effect, which requires a free action to use, but enables you to use extra effort to enhance your power.  Since your other secondary effects require actions to use, it would make sense for your force field to require a move action to activate, so you give it the increased action flaw, reducing its cost per rank by 1.   The increased action flaw means that, when you use a move action to activate your telekinetic force field, you gain your protection effect until the start of your next turn, at which point you must take another move action to continue to benefit from the shield.  This enables you to buy 16 ranks of protection, which would be very difficult to make a balanced character from, given the limits imposed by your power level!  Therefore, you take the distracting flaw as well, halving your active defenses while your force field is in use, and letting you squeeze more utility out of the power, adjusting your fighting style for dealing well with high accuracy, low damage foes.  The additional cost reduction from the distracting flaw means that each power point invested in your protection effect grants 3 ranks of protection, enabling you to buy an insane 24 levels of protection!  You would have to be PL 12 to even have that many levels of  protection, so you'll need an additional extra to better pay down the power.

Impervious is a perfect choice, since it enables you to raise a defensive field which deflects all small arms fire, and most melee weapons wielded by human beings.  (The strongest man in the world, wielding a claymore, could threaten you a little, but he couldn't even daze you in a single blow.)  This grants you the power "Sustained Impervious Protection 16, Distracting, Increased Action (Move)"  With this power, your active defenses (dodge and parry) will be limited to a level of 8, since using the power will halve them to 4, keeping you within power level defensive limits.  This assumes you have a native toughness of 0, which is perfectly reasonable for a psychic character with telekinesis like that.  Your character will likely want some kind of sustained protection effect at level 12 to provide protection when he doesn't want to spend a move action, but that sounds like a good idea for another power.  With this second alternate power complete, your telekinesis power now costs 10 points, as an 8 point power with 2 alternate powers.



Anyway, Edison's Phonograph is the example power I explained in the last post of mine to show an example of a power with multiple flaws.


Edison's Phonograph

Variable 1, Activation (Standard Action), Limited (skills only), Quirk (Grants limited skills), Removable, Uncontrollable   (1 point)

This drastically upgraded phonograph contains all of the death recordings and final will and testament of Thomas Edison.  By spending a standard action putting the phonograph on, and a second standard action listening to Edison speak for a few moments, the listener temporarily gains up to 10 ranks in a skill chosen by Thomas Edison's recording from his advice.  The phonograph will often grant skill in technology, but it frequently grants the following skills also:

Expertise: Science
Expertise: The Evils of Communism
Expertise: Concrete Furniture
Expertise: Copyright Law
Expertise: Tesla Sucks
« Last Edit: January 19, 2012, 08:15:35 PM by The Great Triangle »

Online ShadowFox89

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #39 on: January 19, 2012, 07:59:37 PM »
So, for some advice on picking up the spirit form power, I suggest figuring out your power that costs closest to 40 points, then upgrading the power to cost 40 points and making it into an alternate power of spirit form.  This has the advantage of giving you an easy transition into corporeal form, and also gives you ample justification to add limitation, activation time, and quirk flaws to both powers to reduce the cost even further.  (a limited spirit form is only 22 points, after all)  A dynamic power array could theoretically be an alternate power of your spirit form, which could be a very handy power for a trickster archetype.

 Hmm... The most expensive power for the Energy Controller is, well, energy control. Which is 24 points, plus 3 points for alternate powers. I might drop flight down a bit to make up the points, but I would need a way to get Energy Control (possibly Cold Energy but as 'cold fire') up to costing 40pts.... Without breaking the power level caps >.>

 Time to go look for some modifiers to stick onto it.

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #40 on: January 19, 2012, 08:19:45 PM »
How did I miss that? I'm totally buying Edison's Phonograph, particularly if it only costs 1 point.

Offline The Great TriangleTopic starter

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #41 on: January 19, 2012, 08:24:24 PM »
Hmm... The most expensive power for the Energy Controller is, well, energy control. Which is 24 points, plus 3 points for alternate powers. I might drop flight down a bit to make up the points, but I would need a way to get Energy Control (possibly Cold Energy but as 'cold fire') up to costing 40pts.... Without breaking the power level caps >.>

 Time to go look for some modifiers to stick onto it.

The most immediately obvious idea that comes to mind is Ranged Attack 20, or Ranged Attack 13 with secondary effect and extended range (representing your ability to make things suffer painfully by burning from coldfire).  Area Ranged Attack 10 with Secondary effect is a pretty decent ability too, though you might need to jam selective on there so you don't hurt the party, which would lower your damage to 8.

Both of those options would save you a little bit of points with skills, especially ranged attack 20, though you probably don't want to be reliant on perception and area attacks to deal damage for having absolutely no ranged combat skill.  (If you want to having a fighting ability above 0, simply give your powers that actually require attack rolls the inaccurate flaw, in exchange for a few minor bennies, like indirect, ricochet, incurable, extended range, and affects insubstantial.)

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #42 on: January 19, 2012, 08:41:36 PM »
Throwing something out there, since I don't know how to work it:

Currently, I have a Taser Touch power: 20 points invested giving me a Damage 10 (Electric) attack at Close range, Linked to an Affliction 10 (Dazed, Stunned, Incapacitated) effect. If I want an Alternate Effect of this power that instead supercharges my body with electricity, inflicting damage to anyone who hits me at Close Range as a reaction, how would I build it?

Offline The Great TriangleTopic starter

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #43 on: January 19, 2012, 08:46:57 PM »
Depends on if you want to have to make an attack roll or not:

No Attack Roll:

Perception Reaction (hit by a close combat attack) Damage 3, Contagious, Activation (Move), Electricity


Attack Roll:

Reaction (hit by a close combat attack) Damage 5,  Electricity



The Doctor Shock special; it's actually the example used in the reaction extra.  :-)
« Last Edit: January 19, 2012, 08:52:50 PM by The Great Triangle »

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #44 on: January 19, 2012, 08:57:48 PM »
And if I added the Increased Action flaw to make it require a Move action to redirect the charge, would I then be able to have it at Damage 10?


Actually, could you just break down the points spent on each of those two options, so I can tweak?



Here's what I have so far, as an Indestructible Man sort of archtype. He's easy to hit, but almost impossible to injure or disable:

Abilities: 50 points
Strength: 4
Stamina: -
Agility: 4
Dexterity: 6
Intellect: 10
Awareness: 6
Fighting: 2
Presence: -2

Powers: 41 points
Electric Touch (Damage 10) = 10 points
Linked to
Shocking Jolt (Affliction 10) = 10 points

Innate Protection 10 (Impervious 10) = 21 points

Advantages: 6 points
Assessment
Benefit 3 (Wealth)
Fearless
Skill Mastery(Technology)

Skills: 23 points
Close Combat(Unarmed) 8 ranks = 4 points
Technology 10 ranks = 5 points
Perception 14 ranks = 7 points
Insight 14 ranks = 7 points

Defenses: 28 points
Dodge 4
Parry 2
Toughness 10
Will 12
Fortitude 0 (Immune)

148 Points

« Last Edit: January 19, 2012, 09:29:23 PM by TheGlyphstone »

Offline Aoife

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #45 on: January 21, 2012, 06:38:37 AM »
While I like the theme, I think I'm going to watch.  I've been looking through all the rules, and it'll take me at least a couple of weeks to chew my way through.  Enjoy the game everyone ^^

Offline The Great TriangleTopic starter

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #46 on: January 21, 2012, 12:39:41 PM »
Good luck figuring everything out!  If you find you want to create a character, or play a bystander or minor villain, just drop me a PM.  :-)

Offline eavatar

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #47 on: January 23, 2012, 08:58:40 AM »
I am going to build the Amazon as well the secret agent which she is ancored. My idea was make him a PL6 agent, buying him as a sidekick  and them do the PL 10 Amazon. Are there any background restriction?

Online TheGlyphstone

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #48 on: January 23, 2012, 09:11:56 AM »
That only really makes sense if they can fight side-by-side. Or was that the intention?

Offline eavatar

Re: [M&M 3E] Atomic Heroes of 1950
« Reply #49 on: January 23, 2012, 09:20:19 AM »
Well, the basic idea was do a captain marvel swap, but when I was working on the sheet I've got a better idea. Instead do it in a very Shazam like style, why not make it more or less like Marvel's Captain Mar-vell, with the sidekick as an eventual tool, like she can send his "essence" to do some things for her during the fight, like she keep fighting when he is inside the building defusing the bomb