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Author Topic: Christianity  (Read 8474 times)

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Offline Sherona

Re: Christianity
« Reply #50 on: January 29, 2008, 05:32:52 PM »
Well stated CG, I myself have met some pretty intolerant atheist in my time as well :)

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #51 on: January 29, 2008, 06:33:08 PM »
Assholes are assholes, regardless of their religious beliefs, or lack of them  :)

Offline Sherona

Re: Christianity
« Reply #52 on: January 29, 2008, 06:34:51 PM »
Assholes are assholes, regardless of their religious beliefs, or lack of them  :)

lol that so should go on someone's Sig :P

Offline Rydia

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #53 on: January 30, 2008, 06:01:02 AM »
As for myself, I would tend to apply the word "Christian" in the broadest possible sense, so as to include as many people as possible that refer to themselves as Christian without excluding on the basis of dogma in the Bible, Pauline traditions, or papacy. 

Let me steal Bertrand Russell's definition of a Christian, since it's the one I use myself.  "I think, however, that there are two different items which are quite essential to anybody calling himself a Christian.  The first is one of a dogmatic nature -- namely, that you must believe in God and immortality.

...

"Then, further than that, as the name implies, you must have some kind of belief about Christ.  I think you must have at the very lowest the belief that Christ was, if not divine, at least the best and wisest of men."

Offline Sabby

Re: Christianity
« Reply #54 on: March 09, 2008, 06:17:55 PM »
My brother has a theory that Jesus Christ was simply a very gifted con man and was cursing his own grifting skills when on that cross.

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #55 on: April 29, 2008, 02:04:46 PM »
Ok, me, I'm not christian AND I really do see big problems with the christian faith.  I really don't think that books should be banned either.  BUT why should parents be allowed to brain wash their kids in the first place. . .in response to your comment about telling them what to think about what they read.  Maybe sit down and have a conversation but I want my daughter to be able to take in the world as a whole, be able to come to me with questions, and believe what she feels right believing.  That's how I moderate it. 

Offline Sherona

Re: Christianity
« Reply #56 on: May 05, 2008, 07:32:33 AM »
Wow at the thread necromancy. All these rather old topics coming back up on my lists. That being said, people rather like to stereotype christians into the nice little nitch that they have in their mind...particularly because the only christians the media shows on air are the bible thumpers, or those who are particularly apocalyptic...those are the ones that make the best "news" because of the controversy.

Most christians dont "Brainwash" their children. Most do not sit there and bomb abortion buildings, in fact when that was happening and the bombers were claiming to be christians, the entire christian community shuddered..Just I always have to be amused at the rhetoric that is constantly spouted against christianity when its no differentthen any other organized religion :)

Disclaimer: I no longer identify myself as christian, I am agnostic, so no I am not defending my "faith" though I was raised in a strict baptiste home. Nope no brainwashing going on...its called teaching..just like Muslim parents teach their children about Allah, Jewish parents teach theirs about Judiasm...*shrugs* Like I said..you got fringe cults like the Branch Davidian's underneath David Koresh, and suddenly everyone who calls themself 'christian' is forced to defend themselves constantly..its rather sad...I just wish the Media would try to show the WHOLE religion, rather then just excerpts of the stereotypical southern preacher "Andah! Weah, going toah, burn inah, Hellfireah..." Then perhaps people would not have such a narrow view on the religion.


Edit: I am not saying that ALL christians are these peaceful "just want to be left alone" type people...just like any faction be it religion or politics, will have all sorts of different types of people. I am fairly sure just like there are Terrorists out there that identify with the muslim faith causing people to wrongly assume all muslims condone the bombing of buildings and what not, there are sects to the people who identify themselves as christians that are not a nice bit.



A good example of the media's biasness toward the religion. I have seen about 20,000 articles about those churches who refuse to let homosexuals join. Have read 1000000 articles about the protestors of homosexual marriage who claim to be christian "But conviently forgetting the call to "Do not judge lest ye be judged." tenet. But not once have I seen an article about a church that did not ban homosexuals...in fact my mother-in-law has a female life partner AND pastors a christian church..so no, not all christianity is the pit of intolerant evil :P
« Last Edit: May 05, 2008, 07:43:00 AM by Sherona »

Offline robitusinz

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #57 on: May 05, 2008, 06:08:50 PM »
<insert noun describing a group of people>, like all <insert noun describing a group of people> have their good eggs and bad eggs.

No one should have to defend their <insert noun describing group of people>.

Consider all of the different nouns that describe groups of people, and you'll soon see how ridiculous it is to talk about any one demographic in particular.  Wanna talk about faiths?  Races?  Country club memberships?  Social standing (hey, I'm a geek!)?  Music sub-culture?  It's all the same crap.

Offline Sherona

Re: Christianity
« Reply #58 on: May 05, 2008, 07:46:00 PM »
I am all for healthy discussions :D In fact I have been known to play devils advocate just to spark debate and intelligent discussion :)


I just do not like when it goes from a Philosophical discussion to a "All <insert group of people>" or "Those <insert group of people>" as its stereotyping :) Whether its the "popular thing to do" or not :) Today its popular to be agnostic or atheist, while 30 years ago it was Popular to be Christian, 100 years ago it was Popular to be Catholic and anti-protestant...ok yes my years are probably wrong ont eh 100 years ago, but I am too much in a hurry to look it up, will look it up to see exact dates a little later. :D

I akin it to that people used to KNOW that the world was flat, KNOW that the sun orbited the earth and that the earth was the center ofthe universe. they used to KNOW that comets were not stars, but literal manifestation of some gods or the other wrath. Mankinds view on things have always been spoken in terms of constant and absolute...I believe it was one philosopher who said there is no ABSOLUTE truth, only the perception of Truth. :)

Offline The Great Triangle

Re: Christianity
« Reply #59 on: May 06, 2008, 01:19:08 AM »
As far as your dates go, about 50 years ago it was popular to be Christian in America because of the threat from "godless communists" which made Americans identify more strongly with their religious roots.  Since about 250 years ago, being nonreligious has gone from being merely accepted to actively popular by the middle of the nineteenth century.  Anti Protestentaism was popular about 400-450 years ago, and anti catholocism has been popular in the United States for about 150 years, although in some circles it's still quite popular.


(is a history major)

Offline robitusinz

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #60 on: May 06, 2008, 10:40:40 AM »
I just do not like when it goes from a Philosophical discussion to a "All <insert group of people>" or "Those <insert group of people>" as its stereotyping :)

That was my point.  All that this thread's served to do is stereotype Christians as ultra-conservative bible-thumpers who brainwash their kids.  Is the stereotype true?  Of course it is.  There are plenty of Christians who fit into that stereotype perfectly, else the stereotype wouldn't exist.  However, the fact remains that not all Christians are like that.  In fact, the vast majority of them aren't.

The reason why I used the generic <insert group here> tag in my post is because this thread could easily be about "white people", or "black people", or "geeky people", or "stupid people", or "middle class people", or "rich people", or "handicapped people", or "athletic people", or "fat people", or "people who love ice cream", or "blonde people", or "women with big boobs", or "men with small feet", or "women named Joe"....  It's just formula.  You go, "Let's talk about X", and then you have a bunch of people who consider themselves experts on X throw out a few things about X, a bunch of people who are completely misinformed about X retort, then people who identify with X get offended, then the experts come back to "clarify" their positions after they realize how many people they pissed off, then the misinformed come back and go "I was right", then there's another wave of offense...etc. etc. etc. and the pendulum continues to swing.

Maybe if this thread narrowed things down to, say, "Liberal interpretation of the Bible vs. Strict interpretation of the Bible, which do you adhere to or agree with?", then you'd have a discussion on your hands, but just "Christians"?  I mean, c'mon...whoever doesn't like em will speak negatively, whoever is Christian will get offended, and whoever sympathizes will try to "ameliorate" the situation but fail to appease either side.  What kinds of facts can you bring into a topic like that?  Just go back and look at this thread...lots of conjecture and opinions, maybe some synthesis and extrapolation, but how many facts, or at least "expert opinions" are there?  Who can consider themselves an "expert" on Christianity, when there are thousands upon thousands of different sects out there claiming to be Christian?  Heck, there even exists a liberal Christian Swingers group (which the wife and I considered joining).

So, really, the end-all, be-all of a discussion on such a broad topic can only be the same as any discussion of any subsection of the world's population:  Some of them suck, some of them are cool.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2008, 10:43:30 AM by robitusinz »

Offline Sherona

Re: Christianity
« Reply #61 on: May 06, 2008, 11:34:54 AM »
Oh I know you were saying what I was saying Robi, I just wanted to make sure I was clear that I was not trying to squash any sort of actual discussion :) Very nice post.

Offline robitusinz

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #62 on: May 06, 2008, 12:20:50 PM »
Oh I know you were saying what I was saying Robi, I just wanted to make sure I was clear that I was not trying to squash any sort of actual discussion :) Very nice post.

lol, ok, we're on the same page then.

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #63 on: May 22, 2008, 03:12:44 PM »
Most christians dont "Brainwash" their children.

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I meant any religion. . .parents shouldn't be aloud to brianwash them into believeing anything they say just because they way it.

Offline Sherona

Re: Christianity
« Reply #64 on: May 22, 2008, 03:59:01 PM »
Sorry if I wasn't clear, I meant any religion. . .parents shouldn't be aloud to brianwash them into believeing anything they say just because they way it.

Its not just religions that a HANDFUL of people do this in. Some Atheist brainwash their children, some psychiatrists, some soccer-moms.


Teaching children religion does not equate Brainwashing. Otherwise I would be brainwashing my kids by teaching them to pick up after themselves, to chew with thier mouths closed, and to try to be respectful when giving one's opinions.

Offline robitusinz

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #65 on: May 22, 2008, 04:01:44 PM »
and to try to be respectful when giving one's opinions.

I'm personally taking a pro-active stance and teaching my kids to be bullies.  Easy life, here we come!

Offline Sherona

Re: Christianity
« Reply #66 on: May 22, 2008, 04:06:40 PM »
I'm personally taking a pro-active stance and teaching my kids to be bullies.  Easy life, here we come!

*laughs* :P

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #67 on: May 22, 2008, 08:33:08 PM »
Its not just religions that a HANDFUL of people do this in. Some Atheist brainwash their children, some psychiatrists, some soccer-moms.


Teaching children religion does not equate Brainwashing. Otherwise I would be brainwashing my kids by teaching them to pick up after themselves, to chew with thier mouths closed, and to try to be respectful when giving one's opinions.

That's not what I meant either. . .Maybe I'm just not clear.  I'm talking about parents who tell their children they HAVE to believe something won't give them the facts and won't let them think for themselves what they feel is right. . .

Offline Trieste

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #68 on: May 22, 2008, 08:42:01 PM »
Parents who tell their children they MUST believe in something end up with angry rebellious children. It's the children whose parents quietly indoctrinated them so fully that it doesn't occur to them to question things that worry me. Questions may sometimes be difficult to answer, or a parent may feel like they need to put the child off ("I'll tell you when you're older") but they should never, ever be discouraged in my opinion ... religion is secondary to parenting style in that regard.

Perhaps, though, that's why I'm not a parent and do not plan to be.

Offline ShrowdedPoet

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Re: Christianity
« Reply #69 on: May 22, 2008, 08:52:38 PM »
Well, I have this thing about explanations.  I give them, for most everything.  I like for people to know why because when I was a kid I never really did.  This is going to be my teaching style (going to be a teacher) and is my parenting style.  I really wish that people would put more emphasis on knowledge than they did on what they THINK.  It just makes so much more sence to me. . .As long as my daughter knows (logic, look up the philosophy definition if you don't know it) about the religion, unless it's like nazis, I am happy for her. . .

And it's not just TELLING them the facts. . .it's teaching them. . .*sighs*  The world has me worried. . .

Offline Sherona

Re: Christianity
« Reply #70 on: May 22, 2008, 09:03:40 PM »
Parenting should be a private thing imo. As long as no mental, physical, sexual, or emotional abuse is occuring. What is brainwashing to some, is simple morality to others. It does not hurt anyone to be told that god is in heaven, and that if you break the rules (which MOST are simply the same rules that we are expected to follow as citizens of most countries) you get punished (typically a form of hell).

I guess my issue is just the fact that deragotory terms are sprinkled liberally lately about lumps of people, I just wish people would exersize their right to speakt heir mind and have their opinions at the same time as trying to be respectful of others :)

Offline BlackRose

Re: Christianity
« Reply #71 on: May 22, 2008, 09:14:22 PM »
Back to the idea on books...

I think this is amusing and should be read before considering that certain series, such as Harry Potter and D&D, are demonic and contain magic spells that could corrupt our youth and turn them into Jesus hating anti-christs

http://www.highdesertinsider.com/html/harrypotter_spellcasting.html

Offline Elvi

Re: Christianity
« Reply #72 on: May 23, 2008, 06:24:00 AM »
If there is to be a discussion on parenting, then perhaps, instead of Grave digging a topic and then going off topic should be replaced by the starting of a new thread?

As a parent, I would be very interested in contributing, but not on a thread about Christanity.
They are, after all, different subjects.

Offline Sherona

Re: Christianity
« Reply #73 on: May 23, 2008, 08:27:45 AM »
the parenting remark was not me grave-digging...that was shrowded again  a week or so ago.

The parenting remark directed directly at people who were claiming religious/Christian people Brainwash their children :)

Offline Elvi

Re: Christianity
« Reply #74 on: May 23, 2008, 08:35:08 AM »
*nods*

You seem to be a little parnoid Sherona honey, it wasn't directed at you.*hugs*

Shrowded resurected the thread and apart from her first comment, nothing else mentioned is really relavent to the topic and it has wandered onto parenting in general.