Topic: Monster Girls (D&D 3.5) Grab your Monster Manuals and Savage Species!

[Kunoichi]

Then add it's HD to it Kunoichi. that's the total ECL you need to play one. an erinyes is equal to about a lvl 13=14 character.

Exis: Yes they are. High Base attack, good saves. They specialize in aerial archery though but they also have that rope to grapple and hurl people into their air and turn them into pincushions. I'd call that combat oriented. compared to a succubus.

9 HD + 7 LA adds up to ECL 16 actually.

And archery isn't very well-supported in 3.5, unfortunately. ^^; Admittedly, you can get some pretty good damage with the right bow, though.

[FazzEagle]

Where are you all getting these numbers??

[Snake]

9 HD + 7 LA adds up to ECL 16 actually.

And archery isn't very well-supported in 3.5, unfortunately. ^^; Admittedly, you can get some pretty good damage with the right bow, though.

Erinyes have innate point blank shot, precise shot and shot on the run along with dodge and mobility.  They come with a Flaming Composite mighty longbow +4 too.

and where" Memory. I made an advanced Erinyes for another RP

[ExisD]

Then add it's HD to it Kunoichi. that's the total ECL you need to play one. an erinyes is equal to about a lvl 13=14 character.

Exis: Yes they are. High Base attack, good saves. They specialize in aerial archery though but they also have that rope to grapple and hurl people into their air and turn them into pincushions. I'd call that combat oriented. compared to a succubus.

On how strong they are, I guess I'm too used to high optimization games. I look at them and see a monster that a well built melee character would likely kill with one hasted full attack or knock down to half hp with a charge. It also has a 50% chance to lose any major save from a caster which would also end the fight, though this one also has a 50% chance of failing to affect her thanks to SR.

Rules mechanics aside, I think most of the nice female monsters are rather high level. But if that's too much I'd also be happy playing a half-fiend or dragon. I'd also be fine with being temporarily captures, raped, rape other people, impregnated, and many more such things that don't result in permanent harm.

[Kunoichi]

Where are you all getting these numbers??

There's a convenient listing available online here.  Admittedly, it only has open game content, so there aren't stats for things like Beholders and Mindflayers and so on, but the list still covers a pretty wide amount of monsters.

Erinyes have innate point blank shot, precise shot and shot on the run along with dodge and mobility.  They come with a Flaming Composite mighty longbow +4 too.

Actually, they only get Dodge and Mobility as bonus feats.  The other four are from their 9 outsider HD.  I think the composite longbow is more just 'standard equipment' than any sort of racial ability, for that matter.  Presumably, it would be replaced with equipment costing the standard wealth-by-level amount of gold for a 16th-level character for a PC Erinyes.

[Zaer Darkwail]

Well, there is in savage species how succubi advances up in levels so making erinyes advance in levels would not be far fetch but it would force player play a 'lesser' erinyes for quite while. Depending does our GM want us start low, medium or high levels.

Also it seems most monster girls would be quite powerful. Like look on vampire example; no doubt she would count more closer to vampire lord than normal vampire (and no vampire spawn). Vampire lord is added subtype which increases vampire's CR by +3 (it's still in wizard's site archives I think).

So would monster hunters in return be powerful as well?

[Snake]

Permanent Harm is always bad. I agree with that. I'm going to go with a human half-dragon I think

Example: Epic Erinyes: http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=334888

Zaer: You should remember him. he'sin your Drow Dnd Game :3

[Katina Tarask]

Wow, I was unaware of that... that makes most things with level adjustment even less worth it.

Which is one of the major reasons why, if you want a monster girl game, you're probably better off either playing a different game entirely (such as low-end Mutants & Masterminds) or, instead of using Savage Species rules, using Pathfinder's beta race creation rules to create monster girls as standard PC races.  Far more reasonable and far less limiting, as putting a bunch of heroes side-by-side or a bunch of PC race characters side-by-side works out a lot more smoothly than putting PC-race characters next to a mermaid, a giantess, a succubus, and a vampiress with some combination of level adjustments, racial hit die, and class levels.

[Kunoichi]

Also it seems most monster girls would be quite powerful. Like look on vampire example; no doubt she would count more closer to vampire lord than normal vampire (and no vampire spawn). Vampire lord is added subtype which increases vampire's CR by +3 (it's still in wizard's site archives I think).

So would monster hunters in return be powerful as well?

Actually, the LA cost is often rather disproportionate to the amount of power gained, to be honest. ^^; For example, the vampire seems powerful at first glance... until you take a look at that +8 LA.  2 hit dice at level 10?  Not exactly easy to survive, and even if you stay off the front lines, you're still taking a big hit to things like caster level (for spellcasting classes), saves, hit points, plus you're getting vampiric weaknesses in the bargain...

If the monster hunters get to be powerful, this is going to be rather one-sided.

[ExisD]

I think having both be powerful might just be the answer. Alternatively specialized monster slaying/capturing equipment for the hunters.

[Snake]

Keep in mind you can alway sjust do LA along without factoring the HD into it if you want monsters t obe played without insanely high full level adjustments.

[Katina Tarask]

Keep in mind you can alway sjust do LA along without factoring the HD into it if you want monsters t obe played without insanely high full level adjustments.

The issue there is that level adjustments, particularly in proportion to hit die, tend to be completely arbitrary.  Vampires come with no hit die, +8 level adjustment, and a +2 CR adjustment.  Stone giants bring 14 HD and a +4 level adjustment with huge amounts of brute force.  A Drider has 6th-level casting on +4 level adjustment.

[Zaer Darkwail]

Also note vampire must have 5 HD to be vampire than vampire spawn. So 13 level minimum to be a vampire.

Anyways I do not mind if monster girls start higher level with their LA. So long their racial HD or HD is less or egual to hunters. So example hunters would have 8 HD and each monster girl has 6-10 depending their LA or monster type and so on.

But true BESM or Mutants and Masterminds would make game more balanced but like the DnD rules myself and would like tackle this balance challenge :). Would be willing let girls to be 20 level chars with their racial and LA while hunters like 10.

The catch is; hunters can be 2-4 vs one monster girl so it balances out. But if 2-3 monster girl teams up on hunters....things may turn around their way do things .

[ExisD]

Er, I'd be fine with that idea so long as we don't have primary casters for players. A single one could easily shut down a monster girl with little effort and could probably take a whole group of them especially if racial hit dice were counted as levels.

On the other side the LA makes it so the most powerful spells would never see play.

[ulthakptah]

The point of the game was not to have a discussion about whether or not certain monsters are worth their level adjustment. The point of the game was to allow people to play as monsters in the 3.5 game, you know for fun. If there is a monster girl that you want to play, don't worry about things like will it be useful enough. The game is for fun it's not a competition. Unless you choose the game type which is pretty much a competition. Then I will just have to make fights even with magic items or extras.

[avorae]

Hey I hjust want to be able to actually get to play a pixie for once. the power level matters not to me.

[Kunoichi]

Yeah, that's one of the reasons I'm not in favor of the competitive choice, ulthakptah. ^^; I'd rather try and see what sort of interesting character and build I can come up with, rather than have to worry about being more combat-effective or stealthy.

[ExisD]

Mechanics aside, I'd like to play a demon/devil of temptation. Specifically power/might because succubi are so overdone.

[Kunoichi]

Well, Erinyes into Fiend of Corruption would certainly fit those requirements, I think.  Granted, you'd need a little work to hit the requirements, but it really would fit your concept well, I think.  The Fiend of Corruption prestige class is in the Fiend Folio, if you want to take a look at it yourself. ^^

[ExisD]

I've never really used that book before. I'll take a look.

[Kunoichi]

The Fiend's Favor ability in particular fits the 'power/might' angle of the temptation you want to do. Plus you get abilities that let you tempt in other, entirely non-sexual ways, too.

[ExisD]

That is perfect, exactly what I'd want to be able to do.

[Kunoichi]

Glad to be of help. ^^

[Zaer Darkwail]

Ok, any rules/guidelines regarding monster hunters then? Starting level and gear? I do not ask competitive builds either but overall more fun builds.

[Laughing Hyena]

Im interested as well. And don't worry I tailor this to more fun spells then most. start me off at level 6 and Im good to go.