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Author Topic: Who's going to play SW: TOR?  (Read 3223 times)

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Offline AllieCatTopic starter

Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« on: October 21, 2011, 12:13:29 AM »
I am, I didn't splurge for any of the super special editions, but there has to be at least SOME of us willing to try the next iteration of a jedi game :D

Offline Xanatos

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2011, 12:56:51 AM »
I've thought about it, but I watched some of the game play and it looks like its going to be a even playing field which just ruins it. Military soldiers would be toting much more advanced and deadly tech than a bounty hunter or smuggler. Jedi are better than everyone: intelligence, agility, combat training, wisdom, knowledge, and the Force all combined into one. Everyone else can just eat their hearts out.

Being even may be more "fair" but what fun is that? Games are much more fun when victory is achieved through strategy and tactics, not an even playing field. In Space flight simulators (for me, FPS perhaps for others), I have the most fun when in an inferior ship against superior opponents. It forces me to rely on piloting skill and tactics to beat their superior weapons/armor/shielding.

Having said that, I may very well play it just for the story. Who knows. If I do play it, it won't be right away. I'll want to take the wait and see approach.

Offline ofDelusions

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2011, 05:28:19 AM »
I've thought about it, but I watched some of the game play and it looks like its going to be a even playing field which just ruins it. Military soldiers would be toting much more advanced and deadly tech than a bounty hunter or smuggler. Jedi are better than everyone: intelligence, agility, combat training, wisdom, knowledge, and the Force all combined into one. Everyone else can just eat their hearts out.

Being even may be more "fair" but what fun is that? Games are much more fun when victory is achieved through strategy and tactics, not an even playing field. In Space flight simulators (for me, FPS perhaps for others), I have the most fun when in an inferior ship against superior opponents. It forces me to rely on piloting skill and tactics to beat their superior weapons/armor/shielding.

Having said that, I may very well play it just for the story. Who knows. If I do play it, it won't be right away. I'll want to take the wait and see approach.

I respectfully disagree. While it sounds fine in theory, and could be fine for first month or two, eventually it would become really really boring playing a class that is intentionally UP. Especially as you would never get to dungeon or raid groups. Heck you would most likely get people whine at you for picking say smuggler when in battlegrounds (or whatever SWtor calls them), because you are intentionally gimping your whole team. I for one don't really want to feel that I am holding my full team back just because of my class choice.

I will most likely try it if there is a free trial, but will most likely go for GW2 instead (no monthly fee etc).

Offline Ryven

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Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #3 on: October 21, 2011, 06:08:14 AM »
I've thought about it, but I watched some of the game play and it looks like its going to be a even playing field which just ruins it. Military soldiers would be toting much more advanced and deadly tech than a bounty hunter or smuggler. Jedi are better than everyone: intelligence, agility, combat training, wisdom, knowledge, and the Force all combined into one. Everyone else can just eat their hearts out.

Being even may be more "fair" but what fun is that? Games are much more fun when victory is achieved through strategy and tactics, not an even playing field. In Space flight simulators (for me, FPS perhaps for others), I have the most fun when in an inferior ship against superior opponents. It forces me to rely on piloting skill and tactics to beat their superior weapons/armor/shielding.

Having said that, I may very well play it just for the story. Who knows. If I do play it, it won't be right away. I'll want to take the wait and see approach.

You're assuming that each player has the exact same skill set, the exact same way of thinking, the exact same parameters to work with, and the exact same reaction to every situation.  If, in fact, the classes turn out to be even (which I highly doubt), each player is not the same.  In addition, classes will become more specialized as the characters level up.  I cannot believe that every class will have the exact same difficulty with defeating every other class.  If they add in class customization, this becomes even more unlikely because your abilities become even more specialized.  For example, a sith inquisitor choosing to go down the healing path (I cannot remember right now what the class is called) would not do the same in a fight as a sith sorcerer.  I'd imagine each would have their fortes, but neither would be having the exact same troubles.

You're also only talking about PvP.  There is going to be a fair amount of PvE as well which I am looking forward to.  After spending several months playing Warhammer Online which is 80% PvP, I think I will enjoy the change of pace.

Offline Anyalyss

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #4 on: October 21, 2011, 06:48:41 AM »
I won't unless they invite me to the beta to see what is like, and I signed up the very first day but still nothing. I'm tired of over-hyped MMOs that end up failing really bad. If they don't invite me then I guess that I will try it some months after launch when they release the typical trial and the like.

Offline Brandon

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #5 on: October 21, 2011, 08:22:57 AM »
Im going to give it a try. If people want to get together to form a group or even elliquiy guild Ill be on it often. I will probably be playing sith (sith juggernaught) although the trooper looks very interesting too.

Offline Avis habilis

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #6 on: October 21, 2011, 09:00:32 AM »
I had the chance to play the beta for a few hours a while back. It was a reasonably good time, but not very Star Wars. You're one character running through a chaotic world of other characters running around on their own missions, hunting for level-appropriate missions while dashing right past situations that you're not ready for yet. It seemed a whole lot more like World of Warcraft with sci-fi trappings than playing a part in a Star Wars adventure.

Offline Brandon

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2011, 09:07:42 AM »
I had the chance to play the beta for a few hours a while back. It was a reasonably good time, but not very Star Wars. You're one character running through a chaotic world of other characters running around on their own missions, hunting for level-appropriate missions while dashing right past situations that you're not ready for yet. It seemed a whole lot more like World of Warcraft with sci-fi trappings than playing a part in a Star Wars adventure.

Out of curiousity did you get a chance to try any of the story missions? For me, there are two ways to play the game. The first is any MMORPG but the other way, and the way I intend to play it, is as KOTOR 3. So while Im interested in what others think I have often seen that people didnt get to play much besides just snipets of the game and is usually not enough to make an informed opinion

Offline Avis habilis

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2011, 09:39:27 AM »
Out of curiousity did you get a chance to try any of the story missions? For me, there are two ways to play the game. The first is any MMORPG but the other way, and the way I intend to play it, is as KOTOR 3. So while Im interested in what others think I have often seen that people didnt get to play much besides just snipets of the game and is usually not enough to make an informed opinion

Darned if I know. I'm a complete n00b, so I wandered up to the people marked as mission-assigners on the map & did what they said. There was no continuity between them that I could see, although there was a sort of thread linking my progress from landing on planet whatever-it-was to the Republic stronghold in the town. I was only at it for three or so hours, so I may barely have scratched the surface.

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Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2011, 10:09:31 AM »
Believe me, three hours is barely scratching the surface alright.

Offline Avis habilis

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2011, 10:33:17 AM »
Yeah, I got the impression that this was meant to play out over weeks, maybe months.

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Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2011, 01:09:53 PM »
Yep.

Offline meikle

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2011, 01:16:54 PM »
I respectfully disagree. While it sounds fine in theory, and could be fine for first month or two, eventually it would become really really boring playing a class that is intentionally UP. Especially as you would never get to dungeon or raid groups. Heck you would most likely get people whine at you for picking say smuggler when in battlegrounds (or whatever SWtor calls them), because you are intentionally gimping your whole team. I for one don't really want to feel that I am holding my full team back just because of my class choice.

Yeah... I'd like my games to be fun, not misery simulators.

Also I don't think the idea that Jedis > Soldiers > Bounty Hunters is really at all supported by the Star Wars setting.

Offline Shjade

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2011, 01:18:19 PM »
Jedi are better than everyone: intelligence, agility, combat training, wisdom, knowledge, and the Force all combined into one.

If you think Jedi are more intelligent, wise and knowledgeable than everyone else just by being Jedi, I have to wonder if you're actually familiar with Star Wars.

Seriously, have you seen some of the decisions Jedi have made? Or just listened to some of their dialogue? "I have the high ground" indeed!

Jedi are people, too. Some of them are very bright and capable. Some are...well, just dudes who happen to be more in tune with the universe (or, even less special, just dudes who happen to have more midichlorians than your average bear, but that's even less fun to consider).

Offline Chris Brady

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2011, 01:20:17 PM »
Most previews claim that it plays like a Star Wars clothed WoW clone.  I'll pass thanks.

Offline Brandon

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #15 on: October 22, 2011, 01:02:12 AM »
Believe me, three hours is barely scratching the surface alright.

As I understand it each class is supposed to have over 100 hours of content purely for them. Much of it with multiple choice and outcome.

Problem is, when we only know about 20% of a game our mind makes it sound awesome. I admit it could be pretty bad but it has two things going for it. 1. Its star wars and everyone loves star wars in some way and 2. Its Bioware, arguably the most popular video game company in business today

From what Ive seen (which isnt a lot) I think anyone that dismisses the game as a "wow clone" has already made their mind up without giving the game a real chance. Similar to how most MMORPGs started out

Offline Shjade

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #16 on: October 22, 2011, 01:27:32 AM »
Its Bioware, arguably the most popular video game company in business today

wat

Offline meikle

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #17 on: October 22, 2011, 01:57:28 AM »
the emphasis is on 'arguably', i imagine

Offline Shjade

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #18 on: October 22, 2011, 02:14:42 AM »
I would have to think so.

This aside from the fact that "popular" in no way relates to "quality."

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Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2011, 02:19:46 AM »

Also I don't think the idea that Jedis > Soldiers > Bounty Hunters is really at all supported by the Star Wars setting.

I would have to disagree.  Every Star Wars movie and most of the expanded universe fiction focuses on Jedi or Sith or some sort of Force Wielder in general.  They are always the central characters.  The Jedi and the Force has always hogged the limelight in the canonical Star Wars universe and I think it is going to happen here with SW:TOR... which is unfortunate.  I will continue to hope that other classes and character types will have their moment to shine for once and break away from the very tiresome tropes. 

Offline meikle

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #20 on: October 22, 2011, 03:58:27 AM »
Yes, Jedi have always been the protagonists.

But I'd feel very comfortable wagering that these characters are especially special because they are the protagonists.  Order 66 shows us that they're not all superheroes; they go from intersteller peacekeepers to 'all but extinct' basically overnight.

Also, soldiers are always at the bottom of the pile in Star Wars.  Bounty Hunters are like soldiers But Better.  Compare Jango Fett to a Clone Trooper; Boba Fett to a Stormtrooper; IG-88 to a Battle Droid, etc etc.

Basically, in Star Wars, characters are only as powerful as the narrative demands that they be.  Jedi suck at life when it's time for them to go extinct.  Boba Fett is awesome all of the time except for when it's time for him to die, and suddenly he's incompetent.  We see Jedi protagonists most often, but these are extraordinary characters: not every Jedi is Luke, just like not every smuggler is Han.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2011, 04:02:13 AM by meikle »

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Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #21 on: October 22, 2011, 04:20:54 AM »
I'd like to be able to tell you stuff about the game, but regretably I can't. All the NDA allows you to say is that you're in the beta.

Offline Brandon

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #22 on: October 22, 2011, 06:04:08 AM »
wat

I wanted to say best but thats largely subjective, I think I ended up going with popular purely on the basis that Bioware's popular because they do high quality games with deep engaging storys. The only one that I thought was less then great was DA2 but I dont think it was the bomb that everyone made it out to be

Offline Shjade

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #23 on: October 22, 2011, 02:54:08 PM »
It is subjective, of course. For instance, when I see the phrase "most popular video game company in business today," the word that comes to mind is "Valve." Though honestly given the wider casual/family appeal, it might actually be Nintendo.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2011, 02:55:10 PM by Shjade »

Offline Xanatos

Re: Who's going to play SW: TOR?
« Reply #24 on: October 22, 2011, 09:05:01 PM »
I put my comments in spoilers so as not to disrupt the thread too much. Shjade, I responded to your reply concerning my first post.

Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
If you think Jedi are more intelligent, wise and knowledgeable than everyone else just by being Jedi, I have to wonder if you're actually familiar with Star Wars.

Seriously, have you seen some of the decisions Jedi have made? Or just listened to some of their dialogue? "I have the high ground" indeed!

Jedi are people, too. Some of them are very bright and capable. Some are...well, just dudes who happen to be more in tune with the universe (or, even less special, just dudes who happen to have more midichlorians than your average bear, but that's even less fun to consider).


You actually misinterpreted my statement on the Jedi. I implied better because they (can and often do) combine everything that any other character type can have. Intelligence, Charisma, combat training, etc, etc. Jedi can use guns too (old Order Jedi way before the Ruusan Reformation, actually used weapons other than Lightsabers. Just not very often, admittedly.). Jedi wore armor, thus actually stood a chance taking hits like a regular soldier. Jedi were Chancellors of the Republic for 1000 years+. If they sucked, they would have been ousted long before the Ruusan Reformation.

People get so caught up in the aspect of the Force that they forget Jedi are people and can be very intelligent and entirely kick ass beyond just having Force Lighting and a lightsaber. I in no way said all Jedi are superior. When someone uses a term as a blanket statement, its assumed exceptions exist. What I am doing is comparing averages, like anyone else would. In Star Wars, averages tend be higher, however. Not all Bounty Hunters are kick butt. Not all smugglers are Han. Not all Jedi are Revan. Regardless, the average Jedi is far and away superior to the average Bounty Hunter/Smuggler/Soldier. It would take an exceptional of either three to match up to an average Jedi.

Because of the very reason Jedi have brains and the ability that any soldier or bounty hunter has, means they are automatically better. Its simple logic. Force+smarts+tech=dominance.

For gods sake, a padawan (In Episode 6) killed six (or so) clone troopers before he was finally killed. They did see him coming before he managed to get within melee range, to slice them to ribbons, and he had maybe 6 (max) or so feet to dodge and weave. Give a Jedi an open field and those clone troopers would have been goners without a doubt.

Take into account the average numb skull Jedi's increase in reaction time, perception of events unfolding, ability to act, and so forth, and it doesn't take intelligence to beat even a good bounty hunter. Normal people can't react fast enough to beat a Jedi not even trying to use his abilities to the max. Imagine a Jedi who actually uses his powers. Most Jedi in the movies rarely used anything other than Force Jump. It was pitiful. Force Speed anyone? Precognition? Force Cloak? Force Flight? Force Push? Force Choke? Force Crush? Force Bubble? What about using the Force to lift up someone and just toss them like a rag doll? If Yoda could lift an X-wing then why can't the same concept be applied to a living being? Its mass. Its an object.

If a bounty hunter can use his imagination to utilize the tools at hand, why can't a Jedi do the same to utilize the Force and anything else at hand? Star Wars has stereotyped Bounty Hunters and Smugglers as the ones with brains. Soldiers are dip-wads and Jedi are just there with the Force and not much else. The whole stereotype does not do justice to the Jedi, nor anyone for that matter. Jedi are far more than they are given credit for.