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Author Topic: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.  (Read 3255 times)

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Offline Torch

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Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #25 on: October 04, 2011, 03:51:34 PM »
There are, unfortunately, people out there who have an obsessive nature.  It would be nice if we could believe that handing someone a restraining order would be the end of it, have a nice life, but it's actually often a trigger for escalation.

Approximately 1 in 12 women will be stalked in her lifetime.

Approximately one-half of the restraining orders obtained by women against intimate partners who physically assaulted them were violated.

More than two-thirds of the restraining orders against intimate partners who raped or stalked the victim were violated.

A piece of paper does very little to ward off a former partner with a propensity for violence.


Offline Bayushi

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #26 on: October 04, 2011, 06:21:44 PM »
Approximately 1 in 12 women will be stalked in her lifetime.

Approximately one-half of the restraining orders obtained by women against intimate partners who physically assaulted them were violated.

More than two-thirds of the restraining orders against intimate partners who raped or stalked the victim were violated.

A piece of paper does very little to ward off a former partner with a propensity for violence.
Straw Man.

Even ONE life lost, or ONE incident of violence or harm caused by the actions of LulzSec (let's get the groups correct, folks. Anon goes after lawbreakers. Lulz is simply in it for "the lulz"). is one too many.

These people have already made it pretty clear that they'd be happy to share classified military data with everyone, because "information should be free".

Really? If all information was made "free" to anyone, then many MANY people would die. I'm surprised more people haven't died due to that moron Assange yet, as among the information stolen (yes, stolen) were names of confidential informants in nations not friendly to our own. People who are likely being hunted or are now in captivity.

ACTIONS HAVE CONSEQUENCES! Just because it doesn't affect you directly does not imply that someone else won't be imprisoned, tortured, and/or murdered because you couldn't keep your mental hardon for so-called justice in your damned pants.

I have family members in the service. One of whom is a Recon Marine, currently serving his fifth tour in Iraq. So help me, if you fucksticks find a way to get him hurt or killed with your "information should be free" bullshit, I'll make it my life's work to ruin Lulzsec's lives.

Online Oniya

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Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #27 on: October 04, 2011, 06:39:14 PM »
I'm not sure why you said it was a straw man, when it basically agrees with what you just posted ???  At least, I saw Torch as agreeing with me, and I was using it as an example of how some information doesn't 'need to be free'.

As for the difference between Anon and LulzSec - sometimes the line is rather fuzzy.  Anon recently announced that they were going to take down the servers on Wall Street with a DDOS.  (I can find a link to the video if you'd like.)  Someone in there might think this is some profound political statement, but it reeks of both Orwellian paranoia and an old Matthew Broderick movie.

Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
Quote
FBI Agent George Wigan: He does fit the profile perfectly. He's intelligent, but an under-achiever; alienated from his parents; has few friends. Classic case for recruitment by the Soviets.
Lyle Watson: Now what does this say about the state of our country, hmm?
[General Beringer rolls his eyes]
Lyle Watson: I mean have you gotten any insight as to why a, a bright boy like this would jeopardize the lives of millions?
FBI Agent George Wigan: No sir. He says he does this sort of thing for fun.

Offline Torch

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Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #28 on: October 05, 2011, 06:22:44 AM »
I'm not sure why you said it was a straw man, when it basically agrees with what you just posted ???  At least, I saw Torch as agreeing with me, and I was using it as an example of how some information doesn't 'need to be free'.

Thank you. I thought it was plainly obvious I was in total agreement, but alas......   ::)


Offline Torch

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Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #29 on: October 05, 2011, 06:26:50 AM »
Straw Man.

Even ONE life lost, or ONE incident of violence or harm caused by the actions of LulzSec (let's get the groups correct, folks. Anon goes after lawbreakers. Lulz is simply in it for "the lulz"). is one too many.

ACTIONS HAVE CONSEQUENCES!

You have misinterpreted the intent of my post.

I quite agree with your argument, which is why I provided some statistics on why a woman who has been the victim of domestic violence would want to keep her personal information private, and not for public consumption.

Offline RubySlippers

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #30 on: October 05, 2011, 07:05:10 AM »
My father is former MI up to the highest warrant officer grade and serious security clearances so I asked him about this. Frankly he blames the intelligence services, military and others for the breeches not so much the hackers. Its simple math its better they get it then say terrorists proper or enemies of the nation they should use this as an excuse to improve their security. Wikileaks was related he said he often leaked information on orders but no one should get information from the top without proper channels someone dropped the ball or the government wanted information leaked.

On other fronts the civilian ones it just shows how soft some targets are and they need to improve but hiring white hat hackers to fix the security up.

He always thought this nation was to lax on such security and wrote more than a few papers on it and pushed for proper efforts, but he also noted we have the best adaptive hackers in the world and enough are not black hats to assure our cyberwarfare ability.

Is it wrong to do this well they have a simple view there needs to be a free internet and no secrets it seems to me, the simple solution would be don't put anything sensitive near a computer if they used paper records only for certain things, they couldn't hack them. My father recommended that in fact to keep all sensitive military records on old paper files with human couriers only but no one wants to do that.

Offline Jude

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #31 on: October 05, 2011, 10:52:23 AM »
You know what's information?  Your PIN number.  Your password.  Your list of contacts... Every email you've ever seen and received.  All the files on your computer.  Your PMs in your inbox on E.  Your credit card number.

The "information wants to be free" crowd is perfectly happy with information being stolen and distributed when it's someone else's information, but they're not actually okay with it when it comes down to it.

Offline Zakharra

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #32 on: October 05, 2011, 01:45:57 PM »
You know what's information?  Your PIN number.  Your password.  Your list of contacts... Every email you've ever seen and received.  All the files on your computer.  Your PMs in your inbox on E.  Your credit card number.

The "information wants to be free" crowd is perfectly happy with information being stolen and distributed when it's someone else's information, but they're not actually okay with it when it comes down to it.

 *nods*  It's interesting how it's different when it comes down to it being their personal information. Everyone else is fine. Let that be free, but theirs? Hell no. That's private. 

Offline Callie Del Noire

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #33 on: October 05, 2011, 02:27:35 PM »
*nods*  It's interesting how it's different when it comes down to it being their personal information. Everyone else is fine. Let that be free, but theirs? Hell no. That's private.

Good example is Julian Assange and his refusal to make Wikileaks leadership actions transparent. Despite all his claims.. it's his way or the highway.

Offline Zakharra

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #34 on: October 05, 2011, 03:15:30 PM »
 I wonder what he'd do if someone made all of his personal data and the inner workings of Wikileaks public...  Probably pitch a huge fit.

Offline Callie Del Noire

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #35 on: October 05, 2011, 05:50:53 PM »
I wonder what he'd do if someone made all of his personal data and the inner workings of Wikileaks public...  Probably pitch a huge fit.

It would be a 'US Government conspiracy to hurt his standing as a journalist'. He pretty well managed piss off every one of his media partners in the Diplomatic Cable leaks thing last year. None of them have any trust of him now.

Offline Bayushi

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #36 on: October 05, 2011, 06:57:12 PM »
It would be a 'US Government conspiracy to hurt his standing as a journalist'. He pretty well managed piss off every one of his media partners in the Diplomatic Cable leaks thing last year. None of them have any trust of him now.
The sad part there is that if the US Government had some kind of conspiracy out against him, it would involve his death, not a disclosure of information.

Offline Callie Del Noire

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #37 on: October 05, 2011, 07:43:11 PM »
The sad part there is that if the US Government had some kind of conspiracy out against him, it would involve his death, not a disclosure of information.


Actually at this point, I think that some folks in the Federal Government would LOVE to see him in a small 6x6 cell for a LOOOOONNNG time. Realistically speaking though, everyone (except certain mouthbreathing elected officials) in the Government realize that he didn't break any laws they can hold him on. He broke no laws in the US. He's not a citizen.

Hence..he is free to come and go overseas.

That being said, my personal opinion of him has gone from a grudging respect (back when he first started Wikileaks) to the hard core consideation that he's a total and complete self involved tool.

Offline Kenshin

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #38 on: October 08, 2011, 04:58:18 PM »
I love Anonymous and I believe in a lot of what they do. Political hackers is what they have become basically.

Offline Anberlin

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #39 on: October 10, 2011, 08:19:15 PM »
It's just a fulfillment of Marxism: Which is eventually the working class will say 'enough is enough' and revolt against the capitalists and bash their high heads to the ground.  It's inevitable.

Offline Zakharra

Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #40 on: October 11, 2011, 12:41:22 AM »
 I heard on the radio that some members of Anonymous have said they intend hack and bring down the NYSE.  Do those morons realize the economic damage they could DO if they do that?

It's just a fulfillment of Marxism: Which is eventually the working class will say 'enough is enough' and revolt against the capitalists and bash their high heads to the ground.  It's inevitable.

 And what will those workers want to do? Likely take the place of the ones they took down. There's no such thing as a classless society. Someone will always be on the top and someone will always have more money/wealth than others.

Offline Kenshin

I love Anonymous
« Reply #41 on: October 11, 2011, 12:50:35 AM »
I think the evolution of the hacker group anonymous is amazing, as they are now demanding things in a political manner. They have become something to fear for the oppressors. Most of them I assume are just kids with computers who want to help their cause using the low orbit ion canon, which is a dos attack program, but I assume that there are people in anon that actually know what they are doing. They tried protecting wikileaks, and overall the freedom of information and speech. They even got involved in my area when a Fullerton police officer murdered a kids with excessive force.

    We are Anonymous.
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    Join us.
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    Anonymous delivers.
    We are many, we are one.
    We are reborn.
    Anonymous reborn.
    Our eyes are open.
    We Are Conscious.
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    Information is free.
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    We are the Faceless.
    Voice of the Voiceless.

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Re: Anonymous: Not the lamb but the lion.
« Reply #42 on: October 11, 2011, 01:55:59 AM »
I heard on the radio that some members of Anonymous have said they intend hack and bring down the NYSE.  Do those morons realize the economic damage they could DO if they do that?

 And what will those workers want to do? Likely take the place of the ones they took down. There's no such thing as a classless society. Someone will always be on the top and someone will always have more money/wealth than others.

This is precisely the reason for my first post, and my attitude towards Anonymous in general.  Can they?  Who knows.  Should they?  Hell no!  They may have the 'great power' that they claim, but that's also the reason to exercise the 'great responsibility' in using it - or not using it in this case.  A mask does not make a superhero.