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Author Topic: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?  (Read 26753 times)

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Offline Kythia

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Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #225 on: March 31, 2016, 11:42:31 PM »
          I admit I did not read the thread, but I'm generally against the term "homophobia" as such, or at least the way it's often used. If someone has a crippling fear of members of their own sex because they fear they would force themselves on them, or they collapse in a panic attack from seeing a gay couple, then *that* is actual homophobia. Phobia is a medical condition, a pathological, irrational, crippling fear response, and I feel that "broadening" the term to include who are essentially just a bunch of assholes is beneficial to none.

         What most people seem to mean when using the word is bigotry, homointolerance, and a bunch of other things, but not phobia.

That's not all phobia means. See xenophobia, for example. Words can mean more than one thing and I think you're just going to have to learn to live with that. Sorry.

Offline Aethereal

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #226 on: April 01, 2016, 01:40:41 AM »
That's not all phobia means. See xenophobia, for example. Words can mean more than one thing and I think you're just going to have to learn to live with that. Sorry.
      I do not approve of that word, either, and I retain the right to not use it and promote alternatives. I am also of the opinion that language should move towards more nuances and stricter meanings rather than the opposite way around - having a dozen different words that mean the exact same thing in one use case but completely different things in other contexts only causes unintentional ambiguity and hinders people's ability to understand one another as intended.
       But that's a topic for another thread.

Offline Renegade Vile

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #227 on: April 05, 2016, 03:07:51 AM »
As many others seem to have stated, I don't think her stance on homosexuality immediately makes her homophobic. Homophobia is either a pathological disorder that, like many other phobias, are irrational and rooted in something that's not wired correctly upstairs; or it's an outright, personal aversion that can manifest in intolerance, discrimination or aggression. Neither of these I'm going to guess are what your mother exhibits or seems willing to, so I don't think she's homophobic. If she doesn't like homosexuality, she's well within her rights; so long as she does not attack people on the other end of the spectrum. You can't and shouldn't expect everyone to like everything, after all.

Offline Far eyes

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #228 on: April 05, 2016, 04:48:52 PM »
I dont think that is homophobic for that, but you could make the argument that she is on the way to it? Thing is if she is against it based on her religious beliefs then well thats just kind of a thing. Because thats a whole nother can of worms depending on how serious she is about it and what her flavor of it is. 

I would say she would make the step into homophobic if she actively did something against people, like say those idiots with the signs. I think the real question would be how she would react if say somebody of her family or close friends came out, that to me would actually be the point of 'decision' if you want to put it like that.

   

Offline Anteros

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #229 on: April 05, 2016, 06:39:38 PM »
I'll admit I don't even really understand the OP's question, perhaps because I don't associate the same ideas to the terms used as he does.
To me being against homosexuality involves an opposition, a condemnation, or a rejection of either the sexual orientation, the sexual identity, or the sexual behavior of gay people.

If my understanding of the idea is correct, then I don't see how it cannot be homophobic.
If I have a negative opinion of a core component of someone's identity, then I have a negative opinion of that person, don't I? Unless the trait I dislike is a harmful one, how is my negative opinion not prejudiced? And if my prejudice is against homosexuality, how is not homophobia?

Offline Renegade Vile

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #230 on: April 06, 2016, 02:45:31 AM »
I'll admit I don't even really understand the OP's question, perhaps because I don't associate the same ideas to the terms used as he does.
To me being against homosexuality involves an opposition, a condemnation, or a rejection of either the sexual orientation, the sexual identity, or the sexual behavior of gay people.

Those three things are in ever-increasing order of severity and precisely why it does not automatically imply homophobia. Opposition does not imply condemnation or rejection, in fact, it doesn't even mean she is opposed to it. I believe the original poster just said she doesn't like it. Without any more information, that might be all it is.

If my understanding of the idea is correct, then I don't see how it cannot be homophobic.
If I have a negative opinion of a core component of someone's identity, then I have a negative opinion of that person, don't I? Unless the trait I dislike is a harmful one, how is my negative opinion not prejudiced? And if my prejudice is against homosexuality, how is not homophobia?

Having a negative opinion does not instantly mean prejudice. It would be if she saw gay people in and of themselves as people to be reviled because of their homosexuality; meaning she would pass judgement on them based solely on their sexual orientation. Once again, we lack information so all we can assume is that she doesn't like homosexuality, but says nothing about the people themselves, just their orientation.

Offline Anteros

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #231 on: April 06, 2016, 03:04:53 PM »
Those three things are in ever-increasing order of severity and precisely why it does not automatically imply homophobia. Opposition does not imply condemnation or rejection, in fact, it doesn't even mean she is opposed to it. I believe the original poster just said she doesn't like it. Without any more information, that might be all it is.

Having a negative opinion does not instantly mean prejudice. It would be if she saw gay people in and of themselves as people to be reviled because of their homosexuality; meaning she would pass judgement on them based solely on their sexual orientation. Once again, we lack information so all we can assume is that she doesn't like homosexuality, but says nothing about the people themselves, just their orientation.

If it's merely not liking homosexuality, then there was indeed a lack of understanding of the meaning of the terms on my part. It's just that I see a difference when someone says "I don't like something" and "I'm against something". The second proposition seems to me implying going beyond merely feeling, and heading into ideology.
Nobody can ask someone else to like something or someone and as long as it is a matter of personal tastes and sensibilities without going as far as opposition, and if it doesn't result in harmful speech or acts it's probably not homophobia.



Offline Nachtmahr

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Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #232 on: April 06, 2016, 09:25:42 PM »
First of all, I think it's kind of interesting that this thread is now active after around 4 years.

Anyways, in literal terms, no. Being opposed to homosexuality for other reasons than an irrational fear of discomfort doesn't make you homophobic. The term has been adopted by many and is nowadays used as synonymous with anti-gay sentiments of any kind though.

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Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #233 on: April 06, 2016, 10:18:51 PM »
What's also kind of encouraging is the fact that since it was last active, this quote at least:

Well then, if advocates for homosexual rights are the dominant party, why is gay marriage still disallowed in a majority of places? 

has become obsolete.  Yay, progress!

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Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #234 on: April 06, 2016, 10:36:44 PM »
has become obsolete.  Yay, progress!

YAY 'Murrica! :P

Offline Far eyes


Offline Renegade Vile

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #236 on: April 07, 2016, 03:52:57 AM »
http://satwcomic.com/red-white-and-rainbow-stripes

Thats the only thing i have :P

Kind of a good way of illustrating how a lot of us Belgians, and possibly other Europeans, sometimes look at America...

Offline Far eyes

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #237 on: April 07, 2016, 04:29:08 AM »
Kind of a good way of illustrating how a lot of us Belgians, and possibly other Europeans, sometimes look at America...

America has this tendency of thinking it is the world, its partially what irks me about the brand of SJ thats cropping up it seems to willfully ignore and not want to deal with actual situations and instead spends its time going ballistic about bathrooms.
 

Offline Renegade Vile

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #238 on: April 07, 2016, 04:31:20 AM »
America has this tendency of thinking it is the world, its partially what irks me about the brand of SJ thats cropping up it seems to willfully ignore and not want to deal with actual situations and instead spends its time going ballistic about bathrooms.

Plenty of channels on YouTube discuss SJW activities far more elloquently than I ever could (Sargon of Akkad comes to mind), but indeed. More often than not, they are some of the most entitled nitpickers the world has ever seen, who actively seems to want us to take steps -back- in social development with their nonsense. But, that is entirely off-topic.
We just usually find it more funny how the US is rather boisterous when compared to Belgium, which tends to be low-key, as in the one guy waving the one flag.

Offline TaintedAndDelish

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #239 on: April 07, 2016, 04:51:44 AM »
America has this tendency of thinking it is the world, its partially what irks me about the brand of SJ thats cropping up it seems to willfully ignore and not want to deal with actual situations and instead spends its time going ballistic about bathrooms.
 

Ehm. Not all Americans are like that. That's a pretty broad brush and stinks of Donald Trump, Obama and some other embarrassingly outspoken Americans who do not represent the rest of us. We are diverse and come from many different countries. The only "native Americans" would be your native Indian tribes and they are certainly not the majority either.

Offline Renegade Vile

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #240 on: April 07, 2016, 04:59:24 AM »
Ehm. Not all Americans are like that. That's a pretty broad brush and stinks of Donald Trump, Obama and some other embarrassingly outspoken Americans who do not represent the rest of us. We are diverse and come from many different countries. The only "native Americans" would be your native Indian tribes and they are certainly not the majority either.

We know you're not all like that, they are most likely even a minority, but it's a public image that's caused some significant problems in the relations between Europe and the US, sadly.

Offline Far eyes

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #241 on: April 07, 2016, 06:52:47 AM »
We know you're not all like that, they are most likely even a minority, but it's a public image that's caused some significant problems in the relations between Europe and the US, sadly.

This prty much, its the prevailing image its a distorted one and i have enough friends in the US to know. But it is one that gets projected out a lot, sometimes by some well meaning people i am sure.

Offline TheGlyphstone

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #242 on: April 07, 2016, 11:45:57 AM »
I believe TVTropes would refer to this image as Eagleland Type 2.

Offline Renegade Vile

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #243 on: April 07, 2016, 02:33:07 PM »
I believe TVTropes would refer to this image as Eagleland Type 2.

In all fairness, a lot of Americans I've met are pretty lousy at geography *smirks teasingly*.

Offline Far eyes

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #244 on: April 07, 2016, 03:19:27 PM »
In all fairness, a lot of Americans I've met are pretty lousy at geography *smirks teasingly*.

There was a running joke here for a while that Serbia did not get bombed because nobody could find it

Offline Kythia

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Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #245 on: April 07, 2016, 03:21:00 PM »
In fairness, I'm European and if asked to point to Serbia on a map my answer would be preceded with finger circling and a "It's about....kinda...round here...ah, there we go"

Offline Far eyes

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #246 on: April 07, 2016, 03:38:09 PM »
In fairness, I'm European and if asked to point to Serbia on a map my answer would be preceded with finger circling and a "It's about....kinda...round here...ah, there we go"

Its a trick, we are making it smaller and more difficult to find. AHA! its a cunning plan!

Offline TaintedAndDelish

Re: Being against homosexuality is homophobic?
« Reply #247 on: April 07, 2016, 05:30:00 PM »
In all fairness, a lot of Americans I've met are pretty lousy at geography *smirks teasingly*.

lol