It is not my intention to sound combative; I couldn’t fine the thread you referred to and wanted to toss my two cents into the basket as it relates to fairness, justice and god. I appreciate your thoughts and hope that your portrayal of god is accurate, He/She sounds nice. I truly like discussing such things but am analytical by nature and it tends to come off harsh…again, it is not my intention.
I also realize that this is an old topic forgive my tardiness, I am new and just poking around
The way we make sense of God is truly amazing and a worthwhile endeavor. What we “believe” about “god” can play a delicate yet powerful roll in who we are, who we become and who we strive to be. Why we do something, anything really, is an intricate knot, much of it, not of our own making. I doubt that we could even begin to answer the question, “Why we believe in God.” Considering how the process seems to have begun in the first place. It seems ironic to even try to answer that question as individuals as it seems that by doing so, we remove tens of thousands of years of context. Don’t get me started on atheists who reject god in the light of modern science.
In the most trivialized sense, it seems that we use the metaphor of “god” to help us make sense of, and explain the world around us, how it should be, how we should treat each other, and what happens after our individual selves cease to exist. I realize there is much more to this but these are some foundations.
Personally, I take issue with beliefs. I take issue with projections from an organism, individual or collective, no matter how intelligent they might think they are that presumes to know the will of a creator being, to know the will of another would require communication on a level that humans have not yet achieved in their deepest personal relationships. Such an exchange with a creator would have to result in a kind of truth that would be absolute. That said, I like what the Nazarene commands. Love God and love your neighbors as yourselves (paraphrased).
Who are we to say that we know a thing? We are organisms that exist on a veritable pebble hurling through space where all things seem to share relativity and relevance. Don’t get me wrong, it is good to ask why, it is even good to imagine and get creative in the process. However, to make what we “believe” synonymous with “truth” results in the kinds of lies that become justification for heresy, war, and the subjugation of others.
God, if there is such a being, surely has not given us free will. Free will is a philosophical construct. We discovered the possibility of Free Will, we discovered the potential which to dat in a post modern age is still a long way from realizing. “Free Will”, is like Socialism or Capitalism, Human Rights or Democracy. It’s a theoretical construct, that given the right environment, a realized consciousness, and a willing collective spirit…can be achieved for an amount of time that solely depends on its relevance and more importantly, it’s results to achieve the practice. The truth is, that many, I personally would suggest most (including myself in the group), that most people in this world do not have wills that are freed.
Will comes at a cost and the cost, so far as I can tell, historically up through the present, comes at the expense of one’s life, integrity, character, and soul (if there is such a thing, I tend to think there is). If we are speaking of free in terms of liberation, I would still reject the notion; we seem to be shaped by our families and friends, societies and surroundings, histories and influences. We have the ability to act within a given circumstance but a “Will” is something altogether different. A Will can stand against that which is wrong and accept death as a price for defeat, in the hopes that, in death, they will succeed where in life they had failed.
Justice and fairness are also philosophical constructs. Mere abilities or capacities found within the human monster that usually fall to the wayside when juxtaposed with such things as desire, want, and need.
All it takes for evil to exist is for good people to do nothing.
I would say, “That all it takes for evil to exist is for good meaning people to exercise their will freely without Truth.”
To suggest that God gives us a gift (a soul) and then places the burden of responsibility upon it is an interesting concept. From my perspective, a gift given with strings attached is no gift at all. I mean, it isn’t as if we asked for a pet and promised to assume the responsibilities. Most of us do not know how this crazy little thing called life works. We didn’t ask for it, it was thrust upon us and we have to deal with it. A free will may actually be the most dangerous thing on the planet, akin to handing nitroglycerin to a baby who likes to play with rattles.
If there is a God, I think it is more honest to say that what this creator has given us is a chance, a chance to live, to make what we would from the opportunity. Those who “believe” in God, who believe they are created by this god, would in fact be …god beings. A God being should know the truth. Not just the truth of a matter but capital “T” Truth and should be able to articulate said Truth and the result should result in some form of redemption, a form of redemption that would transcend belief and personal piety. Redemption is something that I do not see very often and I have yet to meet such a person, though I confess some faith in the Nazarene.