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Most annoying historical myths?

Started by Cyrano Johnson, July 12, 2013, 01:57:45 PM

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Kythia

Quote from: TheBlackRider on March 13, 2014, 03:06:08 PM
Right you are, I'd gotten confused because he's in the 9th Bolgia of the 8th circle.

Yeah.  It's always bugged me he's in 8 to be honest.  If we're going with him being a Cardinal surely he should be in 6 with the heretics or 7 with the blasphemers.  But meh.  Probably a bit late to do anything about it.
242037

Lux12

#476
Weirdly enough there are some people who think sub-Saharan  African peoples never worked with metal or metal objects before Europeans showed up. Well the Zande, Zulu, Akan, Oromo, Amharic, Fon, Yoruba, Igbo, Dinka, Hausa, and Somali peoples would disagree. Just to name a few.

Hemingway

I know I'm late to the katana party, but 'crossroads killings', where a samurai would use a newly acquired sword to kill some hapless innocent who happened to be passing by, apparently actually did occur.

I don't know, maybe there needs to be a thread for myth-sounding events that actually happened. ;D

Quote from: TheGlyphstone on February 20, 2014, 01:33:22 PM
That is all.

Also, that's brilliant.

gaggedLouise

Quote from: Hemingway on March 22, 2014, 09:56:43 AM
I know I'm late to the katana party, but 'crossroads killings', where a samurai would use a newly acquired sword to kill some hapless innocent who happened to be passing by, apparently actually did occur.

I don't know, maybe there needs to be a thread for myth-sounding events that actually happened. ;D



Potlatch? - the custom among some Red Indian tribes where two rival chiefs would give each other more and more expensive and ostentatious gifts, trying to outdo each other - and finally destroying the lot by burning it or hacking it up. The antithesis of capitalist efficiency.

Good girl but bad  -- Proud sister of the amazing, blackberry-sweet Violet Girl

Sometimes bound and cuntrolled, sometimes free and easy 

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Come up to my kitchen, I'll show you my best recipes"

Hemingway

#479
I saw an excellent video on the role of gifts in 'primitive' economies a while back. I can't find it now, though. It's really interesting stuff.

Edit: I think I found it! Here's part one.

Lux12

#480
Some people  think Australian aboriginal peoples are all the same. They may have a number of extremely similar or shared cultural traits, but no they are not. Saying that would be like saying a Hopi is the same as a Navajo person. They may be related but they are certainly not the same people.

Ephiral

To be fair, most people think of "Native culture" as pretty monolithic in North America, too. Which also fits here.

Wayfarer

The most annoying historical myth for me is the "there were no WMD's found in Iraq" myth that most people accept as fact. The earliest efforts to clandestinely remove Iraqi WMD's were not declassified until 2009. Most of them are still classified today. I guess it just goes to prove the old adage " If you tell a lie often enough..."

Lux12

Quote from: Wayfarer on March 28, 2014, 05:59:16 PM
The most annoying historical myth for me is the "there were no WMD's found in Iraq" myth that most people accept as fact. The earliest efforts to clandestinely remove Iraqi WMD's were not declassified until 2009. Most of them are still classified today. I guess it just goes to prove the old adage " If you tell a lie often enough..."
Tell that to all the investigators and information out there.

Now for a myth. We know what Christopher Columbus looks like. Actually all the portraits of Columbus that exist are the imaginings of the artists who made them. Columbus never sat down for an official portrait of any kind.

Ironwolf85

Quote from: Wayfarer on March 28, 2014, 05:59:16 PM
The most annoying historical myth for me is the "there were no WMD's found in Iraq" myth that most people accept as fact. The earliest efforts to clandestinely remove Iraqi WMD's were not declassified until 2009. Most of them are still classified today. I guess it just goes to prove the old adage " If you tell a lie often enough..."
Truth is they had a bunch of sarin gas canisters, the same kind possessed by Syria. We were looking for atomic or biological weapons, which were completely absent, then the administration at the time turned the entire situation into a massive political clusterfuck, including selling out the troop's safety on a number of occasions so that private companies could continue to profiteer.
They also almost completely abandoned Afganistan, reversing a lot of gains that were made, forcing later commanders to start from scratch when trying to get the place under control.
Prudence, justice, temperance, courage, faith, hope, love...
debate any other aspect of my faith these are the heavenly virtues. this flawed mortal is going to try to adhere to them.

Culture: the ability to carve an intricate and beautiful bowl from the skull of a fallen enemy.
Civilization: the ability to put that psycho in prision for killing people.

IrishWolf

The most annoying historical myth I have ever encountered, is brought to us by the residents of the Great White North or Canada as some call it.

Now in my travels throughout the internet and a few times in real life, I have encountered some Canadians, who claim either in a sort of joking tease or as some sort of nasty counter to any point I'm trying to make, that Canadians burned the White House down. Its usually phases as "We burned the White House and we can do it again."

And it's just not true.

What they are referring to is the Burning of Washington during the War of 1812 and for some reason, Canadians (at least some of them) claim it as a victory. While the Canadian Militia fared well during the war, they had nothing to do with the Chesapeake campaign. The army under Major General Robert Ross, was comprised mostly of veteran regiments from Wellington's Peninsular Army, who had been shipped from Spain. The only "native" force with the British Army in the Chesapeake, was the Corps of Colonial Marines, which was raised in the Caribbean from former slaves.

The rest of the army;
The 85th Regiment of Foot "Bucks Volunteers"
The 4th "King's Own" Regiment of Foot
The 44th "East Essex" Regiment of Foot
The 21st "Royal North British Fusilier" Regiment of Foot
Detachments from the First and Second Royal Marines Battalions

Were all raised in England (or Scotland for the 21st).

Vekseid

Quote from: Ironwolf85 on April 05, 2014, 01:01:48 PM
Truth is they had a bunch of sarin gas canisters, the same kind possessed by Syria. We were looking for atomic or biological weapons, which were completely absent, then the administration at the time turned the entire situation into a massive political clusterfuck, including selling out the troop's safety on a number of occasions so that private companies could continue to profiteer.
They also almost completely abandoned Afganistan, reversing a lot of gains that were made, forcing later commanders to start from scratch when trying to get the place under control.

My favorite response to claims of Iraqi WMDs is "Of course we know Iraq has WMDs, we still have our half of the receipts."

Oniya

Quote from: Vekseid on April 06, 2014, 10:23:05 AM
My favorite response to claims of Iraqi WMDs is "Of course we know Iraq has WMDs, we still have our half of the receipts."

*sporfle*
"Language was invented for one reason, boys - to woo women.~*~*~Don't think it's all been done before
And in that endeavor, laziness will not do." ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~Don't think we're never gonna win this war
Robin Williams-Dead Poets Society ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~Don't think your world's gonna fall apart
I do have a cause, though.  It's obscenity.  I'm for it.  - Tom Lehrer~*~All you need is your beautiful heart
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Ironwolf85

Quote from: Vekseid on April 06, 2014, 10:23:05 AM
My favorite response to claims of Iraqi WMDs is "Of course we know Iraq has WMDs, we still have our half of the receipts."

friggin cold war mentality, screw the morality or future impact, we must stop the spread of anything related to russia...
of course the USSR suffered from the same logic towards the US.
Prudence, justice, temperance, courage, faith, hope, love...
debate any other aspect of my faith these are the heavenly virtues. this flawed mortal is going to try to adhere to them.

Culture: the ability to carve an intricate and beautiful bowl from the skull of a fallen enemy.
Civilization: the ability to put that psycho in prision for killing people.

TheBlackRider

Quote from: Vekseid on April 06, 2014, 10:23:05 AM
My favorite response to claims of Iraqi WMDs is "Of course we know Iraq has WMDs, we still have our half of the receipts."

"But as soon as that check clears, we're going in!"

Man, going back and listening to that, it's a little surreal to think that Bill's talking about the First Gulf War.

Love And Submission

This is a weird one to people who aren't me/NASCAR fans but Dale Earnhardt never said "Rubbin is  racing". That's a line from Days Of Thunder which was a movie.

He might  have been The Intimidatior and may have popularized getting into people on the oval but that line was originally from Days Of Thunder. A movie about NASCAR.



Discord: SouthOfHeaven#3454

Lux12

Here's another one. Ancient people knew nothing of surgery.  Actually the people of India had developed a form of plastic surgery  by 500 B.C. and the Egyptians knew the anatomy of the human body quite well. The actual act of mummification by the Egyptians though post-mortem was  a demonstration of this skill.

Chris Brady

Quote from: IrishWolf on April 06, 2014, 05:51:37 AM
The most annoying historical myth I have ever encountered, is brought to us by the residents of the Great White North or Canada as some call it.

Now in my travels throughout the internet and a few times in real life, I have encountered some Canadians, who claim either in a sort of joking tease or as some sort of nasty counter to any point I'm trying to make, that Canadians burned the White House down. Its usually phases as "We burned the White House and we can do it again."

And it's just not true.

What they are referring to is the Burning of Washington during the War of 1812 and for some reason, Canadians (at least some of them) claim it as a victory. While the Canadian Militia fared well during the war, they had nothing to do with the Chesapeake campaign. The army under Major General Robert Ross, was comprised mostly of veteran regiments from Wellington's Peninsular Army, who had been shipped from Spain. The only "native" force with the British Army in the Chesapeake, was the Corps of Colonial Marines, which was raised in the Caribbean from former slaves.

The rest of the army;
The 85th Regiment of Foot "Bucks Volunteers"
The 4th "King's Own" Regiment of Foot
The 44th "East Essex" Regiment of Foot
The 21st "Royal North British Fusilier" Regiment of Foot
Detachments from the First and Second Royal Marines Battalions

Were all raised in England (or Scotland for the 21st).
What you're forgetting is that a lot of those soldiers never went back to England or Scotland, and became Canadian.  Immigration back then was a lot easier and with a lot less paperwork or security involved.
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IrishWolf

Quote from: Chris Brady on April 07, 2014, 07:40:25 PM
What you're forgetting is that a lot of those soldiers never went back to England or Scotland, and became Canadian.  Immigration back then was a lot easier and with a lot less paperwork or security involved.

No, they didn't.

None of the regiments went to Canada after the war. In fact the 4th, 44th, 85th and the 21st did return to England/Scotland and served in the War of the Seventh Coalition. The only regiment to serve garrison in British North America, was the 85th, in 1836, 21 years after the burning of Washington and only stayed there for 7 years before being sent to the West Indies. How many men do you think there were, still in the ranks, 21 years later, who had served during the War of 1812 and were in Canada when their enlistment was up? Not many.

Lux12

There's this myth that the first "civilization" was in Mespotamia. While it's true that the first long lived widely influential civilization came out of Mesopotamia, the truth is sites like Catalhoyuk tell a very different story.

Rogue

Quote from: Lux12 on April 08, 2014, 04:57:19 PM
There's this myth that the first "civilization" was in Mespotamia. While it's true that the first long lived widely influential civilization came out of Mesopotamia, the truth is sites like Catalhoyuk tell a very different story.

Depends on your definition of civilization Lux. Defining a Civilization as more than one population center working together (which is more likely what is meant), Mesopotamia is indeed the first civilization.

Also, since it's relatively new (only 2012) such sites will likely not be included in common history text books for a couple years at least. Since that was the only site referred to, I don't have any other reference material... >.>

Lux12

Quote from: Rogue of TimeyWimey Stuff on April 08, 2014, 05:04:10 PM
Depends on your definition of civilization Lux. Defining a Civilization as more than one population center working together (which is more likely what is meant), Mesopotamia is indeed the first civilization.

Also, since it's relatively new (only 2012) such sites will likely not be included in common history text books for a couple years at least. Since that was the only site referred to, I don't have any other reference material... >.>

Catalhoyuk was just that according to extensive archaeological endeavors and it predates Mesopotamian city states by thousands of years.

Oniya

I think the second part of Rogue's post - that the site was only discovered recently - is a bit more important in this case.  Up until Catalhoyuk was discovered, Mesopotamia was the earliest known civilization (feel free to provide counterexamples).

"Language was invented for one reason, boys - to woo women.~*~*~Don't think it's all been done before
And in that endeavor, laziness will not do." ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~Don't think we're never gonna win this war
Robin Williams-Dead Poets Society ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~Don't think your world's gonna fall apart
I do have a cause, though.  It's obscenity.  I'm for it.  - Tom Lehrer~*~All you need is your beautiful heart
O/O's Updated 5/11/21 - A/A's - Current Status! - Writing a novel - all draws for Fool of Fire up!
Requests updated March 17

Rhapsody

I don't know if this has been mentioned already -- there are 20 pages, after all -- but the one that peeves me is jus primae noctis. Oh, and that the pyramids were built by slaves. Those two myths share about the same plateau of eyerolling to me.
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Oniya

I'm pretty sure it hadn't been brought up, but I do love Cecil's take on it:

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/1139/did-medieval-lords-have-right-of-the-first-night-with-the-local-brides
QuoteIt's one thing to have your way with the local maidens. It's something else to persuade society as a whole that this is a cool idea. "Sure, honey, we can get married, but first you have to do the rumba with some old guy with bad teeth." Also, once the element of surprise was lost, don't you think this policy would present some risks? Granted women were supposed to be the weaker sex and all, but they knew how to fillet fish.
"Language was invented for one reason, boys - to woo women.~*~*~Don't think it's all been done before
And in that endeavor, laziness will not do." ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~Don't think we're never gonna win this war
Robin Williams-Dead Poets Society ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~Don't think your world's gonna fall apart
I do have a cause, though.  It's obscenity.  I'm for it.  - Tom Lehrer~*~All you need is your beautiful heart
O/O's Updated 5/11/21 - A/A's - Current Status! - Writing a novel - all draws for Fool of Fire up!
Requests updated March 17