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Looking to get into a 3.5 Eberron game [UN]

Started by Kunoichi, November 11, 2009, 12:41:33 AM

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Ixy

Quote from: The Great Triangle on November 23, 2009, 05:49:35 PM
If you'd like, you can apply the effects of both the drow and half giant races.  Actually, I'd prefer you did it that way, since I find it strange that you're a half giant with no mechanical differentiation from a drow. 

How devout is your charater?  The local temples of the Mockery would probobly accomidate your character's religious sensibilities, although temples to the Shadow might also work.  Given the Llolth esque nature of the religion, Blood of Vol might also appeal to your character.  If you'd rather not piss off the local preist of the soverigns, of course, you could always claim to worship one of the host.  (Probobly Dol Dorn, or whatever the Thor alike in the pantheon is.)

Honestly, I'm pretty good with playing a full-blooded Drow at this point without the psionics, strength and con buffs, and size rules.  No need to incorporate a half-giant background at this point-- I'll just stick with Drow if you approve. 

I think my character would be generally devoted to Vulkoor and would be very skeptical of anyone who tries to correlate him with the Mockery.  She comes from a world where the Drow are fighting for their lives aboveground AND below, and for someone to tell her that her god is a conniving evil bastard who wants to overthrow the balance would make her a little confused... she believes he's the source of the overthrow of tyrrany and that he loves his chosen people for their fierce spirits and indominatable will.

I agree, it would be good to have a "public" religion for her, and she'd have learned to hide her devotion to Vulkoor out of trial and error.  She has no wish to be a martyr; she'd rather be free.
______________________
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The Great Triangle

I'd really rather that you at least gave your character large size, +2 constitution, and either -2 charisma or -2 intelligenct to reflect your giant heritage.  Nothing on your character sheet so far reflects the idea that you are a half giant, which makes your race selection a little strange.  It would take about two seconds to revise your character to just being a drow.  :-)   

If your character doesn't want to publically worship Vulkoor, she'd probobly be well off simply not wearing a holy symbol and avoiding the subject of religion.  That should generally keep her from any trouble, and Karrnath as a whole tolerates secularism.  (mostly as a reaction against the excesses of the church of Vol.)
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Kunoichi

Technically speaking, the Blood of Vol as a religion isn't really prone to excess. ^^; The Order of the Emerald Claw is, but as far as most people know, that's a knightly order-turned-terrorist group with no relation to the Blood of Vol whatsoever.

PhantomPistoleer

Triangle, can I get a yay or nay on my factorum?  I'd like to know whether or not I'll be char-building tonight. :o
Always seeking 5E games.
O/O

Ixy

I apologize for the confusion.  I want to play a drow.  I didn't make a half-giant this time at all, nor incorporate half-giant into this character concept in the least.  I want this character to be all giant-hating, 5 foot-tall ball of meanness drow, through and through.  What I said about the half giant in my most recent posts was just speculation.  I like this character, a plain drow, but will revise it if you want.
______________________
The big print giveth, the small print taketh away.

The Great Triangle

Quote from: Ixy on November 23, 2009, 08:02:55 PM
I apologize for the confusion.  I want to play a drow.  I didn't make a half-giant this time at all, nor incorporate half-giant into this character concept in the least.  I want this character to be all giant-hating, 5 foot-tall ball of meanness drow, through and through.  What I said about the half giant in my most recent posts was just speculation.  I like this character, a plain drow, but will revise it if you want.

That's just fine.  :-)  Must have made a mistake in filling out your character sheet.


And phantom, I'll go ahead and approve your character concept, pending any dispute from other players. 

Quote from: Kunoichi on November 23, 2009, 07:11:47 PM
Technically speaking, the Blood of Vol as a religion isn't really prone to excess. ^^; The Order of the Emerald Claw is, but as far as most people know, that's a knightly order-turned-terrorist group with no relation to the Blood of Vol whatsoever.

It's true that the Blood of Vol didn't slaughter people in the street, but they did arrange a majority of mairrages, turn people into vampires, put the population into virtual slavery as undead snacks, and send those creepy undead legions marching from place to place.  That's generally a pretty bad list of things to happen in a country, even if they're not the kinds of cartoonish super villainy that the Dark Six would perpetrate if their religion ever got control of an entire major country.
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Katina Tarask

Quote from: The Great Triangle on November 22, 2009, 10:18:21 PM(It doen's particularly look like I'll need to make a lot of rulings in your case though, since what you're going for is fairly modest.  It's the somewhat wacky ability doom combos and methods of making a character that can literally do anything I'm more nervous about.)
I don't suppose this would be a good time to mention that Rin can grant a +12 to charisma for six hours (twelve or twenty-four at the cost of some ability damage, and +18 if I decide to pick up Empower Spell later).  Though we don't have anyone who could really take advantage of it, unless our robot has some nice save-or-blahs.  [This being through Transmitting Kiss used to cast Beauty's Caress in conjunction with the maximize rod.  Added bonus; the subject becomes superhumanly hot.  Sexy robo a go-go!]

Though that doesn't compare to some of the crazy stuff I could pull with the higher two Transmitting feats.  Geas as a third-level spell through Transmitting Orgasm.  Oi.  Yeah, that's a gamebreaker.

Though as Rin currently stands, there are some interesting constraints.  Transmitting Kiss is relatively tame, and using that for her better support spells means no self-casting, and even self-healing becomes more difficult, while Metaphysical Metamagic means taking ability damage to pull off some of the bigger stunts, making it a rather self-sacrificing build.  Good for support.  That first-level Suggestion is just a bonus, if not as worthy of maniacal laughter as third-level Geas.

By the way, is there any way to advance skills from here on in?  Like, buying 'em at a hundred XP a pop or something?

Kunoichi

I don't know anything about the arranging of marriages part, but from what I've read, the Blood of Vol views undead as martyrs who've sacrificed their chance at true divinity in order to act as champions in the fight against death.  Likewise, Karrnathi Undead Regiments are viewed by the population at large as national heroes who fight on for the sake of the country even in death.

As for the undead snacks part, blood for the vampires to drink is freely given by volunteers.  I don't recall ever reading anything about anyone ever being forced to give blood, or anything involving slavery in Karrnath.  Well, except where Warforged are concerned, anyway. ^^;

*can give a link to where Keith Baker himself has given out information on the Blood of Vol, if you'd like*

The Great Triangle

Quote from: Kunoichi on November 23, 2009, 09:08:51 PM
I don't know anything about the arranging of marriages part, but from what I've read, the Blood of Vol views undead as martyrs who've sacrificed their chance at true divinity in order to act as champions in the fight against death.  Likewise, Karrnathi Undead Regiments are viewed by the population at large as national heroes who fight on for the sake of the country even in death.

As for the undead snacks part, blood for the vampires to drink is freely given by volunteers.  I don't recall ever reading anything about anyone ever being forced to give blood, or anything involving slavery in Karrnath.  Well, except where Warforged are concerned, anyway. ^^;

*can give a link to where Keith Baker himself has given out information on the Blood of Vol, if you'd like*

I view the idea of undead as Bodhisattvas as a contradiction to the original description of the Blood of Vol in the Eberron campaign setting, where the religion is characterized as seeking "undeath as a path to immortality, using negative energy instead of positive energy to seek it"  This interpretation is supported by some of the early adventures, which feature, among other things, a cleric impersonating a vampire to impress his Emerald Claw henchmen, and give him the power trip of the exalted undead state he hopes to acheive.   That's the Blood of Vol I view as cannon, rather than the psuedo humanist Blood of Vol Faiths of Eberron gave us.  (which might be a sect the propagandists put together, but has nothing to do with the real religion not followed by the rubes.)

As for the undead snacks thing, perhaps I'm being a little dramatic, but I can totally see King Kaius spreading a whole lot of propaganda against the Blood of Vol after outlawing the religion, including telling its members where their sacrements of blood were going.  Therefore, the average Kaarnathi knows most of the secrets of the Blood of Vol, except that it's controlled by Vol, which Kaius deemed to sensitive to reveal to the people.  The crimson covenant is common knowledge though, in the sense that Xenu is common knowledge among Americans.  An individual caught trying to join the Blood of Vol in Kaarnath will likely receive a long talk by the local civil authorities about the abusive nature of the cult, then be placed under observation.  Only those who keep on trying to join the religion have formal charges brought against them.  (assuming the authorities don't try to use them to hit the local cult cell from the inside.)


Quote from: The Tarrasque on November 23, 2009, 09:01:31 PM
I don't suppose this would be a good time to mention that Rin can grant a +12 to charisma for six hours (twelve or twenty-four at the cost of some ability damage, and +18 if I decide to pick up Empower Spell later).  Though we don't have anyone who could really take advantage of it, unless our robot has some nice save-or-blahs.  [This being through Transmitting Kiss used to cast Beauty's Caress in conjunction with the maximize rod.  Added bonus; the subject becomes superhumanly hot.  Sexy robo a go-go!]

By the way, is there any way to advance skills from here on in?  Like, buying 'em at a hundred XP a pop or something?

Your characters combos sound fairly reasonable, for the sort of campaign we're playing.  Obviously, even a 24 hour charisma boost doesn't lead to preparing more spells, and while +9 to saving throw DCs is impressive, I doubt that E6 characters can get any save or die spells without using rituals, which base their saving throw DC on spell level and ritual difficulty anyway. 

As for skills, your only way of advancing is to take skill boosting feats.  You can make up more "+2 to two skills" feats as you advance, provided the essential feat concept is reasonable.  (a feat that grants +2 to Jump and +2 to Decipher Script, to pick an example I will never see, probobly can't be rationalized)  You can also retrain into a class with more skill points, although that's a somewhat more expensive path.
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Kunoichi

Ah, I see.  Alright then, it's good to have that sort of clarification. ^^;

Katina Tarask

Quote from: The Great Triangle on November 23, 2009, 09:32:17 PMAs for skills, your only way of advancing is to take skill boosting feats.  You can make up more "+2 to two skills" feats as you advance, provided the essential feat concept is reasonable.  (a feat that grants +2 to Jump and +2 to Decipher Script, to pick an example I will never see, probobly can't be rationalized)  You can also retrain into a class with more skill points, although that's a somewhat more expensive path.
Unfortunate.  Well.  A thousand points a skill point it is, then.  Steep, but it might be worth it eventually.  Open Minded turns into the going rate, I suppose, though at 5,000XP for every extra feat, 'tis harsh.

Ixy

Quote from: The Great Triangle on November 23, 2009, 08:48:06 PM
That's just fine.  :-)  Must have made a mistake in filling out your character sheet.

god fucking damnit.  I spent all this damn time on the character sheet trying to make sure it was all copasthetic and cool, and what do I do?  I leave the wrong race after I finally decide. 

Well, if that's any indication of how this is going to go, then I'm going to need more alcohol.
______________________
The big print giveth, the small print taketh away.

The Great Triangle

Quote from: Ixy on November 23, 2009, 09:53:25 PM
god fucking damnit.  I spent all this damn time on the character sheet trying to make sure it was all copasthetic and cool, and what do I do?  I leave the wrong race after I finally decide. 

Well, if that's any indication of how this is going to go, then I'm going to need more alcohol.

*hugs*  We all make mistakes from time to time.  :-) 


A note about the Blood of Vol in my E6 version of the setting:  The Blood of Vol is an attractive choice for those who seek power above all else, since undead can progress to the 12 level.   However, once they attain 12th level, undead find they cannot advance, being unable to gain feats.  Even retraining is excruciating for the undead, costing 25,000xp a level.  Hence, most undead remain static and stagnant, a feature which, combined with their poor ability to use ritual magic, occasionally leaves them weaker than they would be had they remained mortal.  For warriors however, the benefits of being undead tend to outweigh the costs.  Until one meets a dragon cleric of the soverign host.   
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PhantomPistoleer

Since the Factotum is allowed every and any skill, would it be possible to get the Iajutsu skill from Oriental Adventures?
Always seeking 5E games.
O/O

Tagan

Oh, I've been watching this thread for days, hoping I'd be approved before it closed.

How does a female Catfolk Monk sound?  I've got a character sheet on mythweavers I can post if you like the concept.

The Great Triangle

Quote from: PhantomPistoleer on November 24, 2009, 08:21:16 AM
Since the Factotum is allowed every and any skill, would it be possible to get the Iajutsu skill from Oriental Adventures?

No, no, and NO!!!!!!   :-)   You can take autohypnosis though. 


Quote from: Tagan on November 24, 2009, 11:40:54 AM
Oh, I've been watching this thread for days, hoping I'd be approved before it closed.

How does a female Catfolk Monk sound?  I've got a character sheet on mythweavers I can post if you like the concept.

Catfolk monk is acceptable, though your character will be treated as a foreigner, so you may want to consider being a changeling who likes catgirl forms.  As a monk, your main consideration will be what monastic tradition you operate from.   The main monastic traditions of Eberron are the cult of Dol Dorn (strength of body, strength at arms), the cult of the mockery (empower the self, destroy the lie of flesh), the Dakhaani Monk/Rogues of Darguun (practical combat for the restoration of the hobgoblin empire), and the monk/soulknives of the Kalashtar Path of Light.  (perfection of mind and perfection of self)
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Katina Tarask

And as a Catfolk Monk, I'd suggest multiclassing to Swordsage (Tome of Battle, preferably the unarmed variant) for at least two levels (to avoid BAB loss) to pick up Shadow Blade and get dexterity to your unarmed damage, alongside other toys.

Combining Superior Unarmed Strike (Tome of Battle), Capstone Training: Unarmed Strike, and Improved Natural Attack can get your unarmed damage to 3d6, though considering Weapon Finesse is a must and if you're multiclassing Swordsage, Shadow Blade is essential, that means all your feats are tied up and it may be a bit much for this point in the game.

How much should we worry about incidentals like how many arrows we have, or bedrolls, or flint and tinder?  And how important is encumbrance?

Ixy

Hey Tarrasque-- any such suggestions for me?  When you said "unarmed damage to 3d6", I realized that I am not worthy when it comes to character-stacking.

Oh, and-- welcome, Tagan.  Hope you like it here :)
______________________
The big print giveth, the small print taketh away.

PhantomPistoleer

I'm glad Ixy asked first!  Whaddabout me?  How can I make my go-getting-journalist more awesome?

Ideally, how can I make that +5 Intelligence and +5 Charisma work better for me?  I already have it so that I use my Int + Cha on most skills, and I use my INT bonus instead of my CON for HP and DEX for Reflex. :o
Always seeking 5E games.
O/O

Tagan

Ok then, how about a female Changeling Kalashtir Monk/Psychic Warrior do?

Unfortunatly I don't have the ToB.

I can have the sheet ready tonight with these changes.

PhantomPistoleer

I think one way I can optimize my character is by making him be a half-nymph or other race.  It works to my advantage by three points to do that.  ::thinks::
Always seeking 5E games.
O/O

PhantomPistoleer

Looking over some of the templates, I see "Base Skill Points are now (6+Int mod) * (Racial HD+3)."  What exactly does that mean?
Always seeking 5E games.
O/O

Katina Tarask

#122
E6 gestalt would be pretty cool. [/notsosubtlefishing]
Quote from: Ixy on November 24, 2009, 02:45:06 PM
Hey Tarrasque-- any such suggestions for me?  When you said "unarmed damage to 3d6", I realized that I am not worthy when it comes to character-stacking.
Mind, you still have another couple level 6 feats (one for hitting level 6, one for 20,000 XP, one for 25,000 XP).

Lessee... *Looks up Drow Skirmisher.*  *Looks up drow longknife.*  Looks like the longknife's just a shortsword that can be thrown.  And Drow Skirmisher seems to be a fairly petty benefit.  It's essentially exotic weapon proficiency to weapons you either don't use or can't make very good use of, and a conditional modifier that you really can't put to very good use.

Normally, I'd suggest Swift Hunter, but Greater Manyshot is just out of reach.  So instead, I suggest rearranging to Rogue4/Ranger2.  Endurance and a first-level animal companion don't do much for you.  Unfortunately, Rogue5 would cost you a feat and a point of BAB, but you can advance Sneak Attack with Capstone Training.

For damage, one good way to get off a lot of attacks for piling on Sneak Attack is Master Thrower.  This would be through Prestige Training, mind, but the keys here are Palm Throw, which doubles the number of small thrown weapons you can throw (but you don't apply that strength bonus you don't have) and Weak Spot, the class's capstone, which requires Ultimate Mastery, but is totally worth it since it turns your thrown weapon attacks (which are already doubled) into touch attacks.  With two-weapon fighting and rapid shot in the mix, that comes out to six attacks a round, easily, all of which can have Sneak Attack applied.  Mind, Quick Draw is essential here.  You may want Rogue3/Fighter1/Ranger2 for this one.

The lower-end, more expensive version of this trick is the potion-throwing Rogue.  Dual-wielding and throwing acid flasks and alchemist's fire lets you get off those sneak attack touch attacks.

It's also pretty much essential to have a reliable way of applying Sneak Attack.  Even getting people flat-footed by throwing around marbles (Complete Scoundrel) is helpful.  The easiest trick is combining Dark Lantern (Tome of Magic, page 156) and Ring of the Darkhidden (Magic Item Compendium, page 122).  The former provides shadowy illumination, allowing you to hide, and the latter hides you from Darkvision.  The two essentially combine to provide Hide in Plain Sight for only 3,000g.  However, only really works with good stealth skills; you need those to be very high in order to be reliable.  You may have some good items pumping it up, but I'd still advise taking max ranks in Hide and Move Silently as a supplement.

Combining Quick with a Con score of 12 is dangerous.  Particularly since you need to be within 30' to get your Sneak Attack off.  But traits and flaws were prohibited back on page two, making it somewhat moot.
Quote from: PhantomPistoleer on November 24, 2009, 02:57:08 PM
Ideally, how can I make that +5 Intelligence and +5 Charisma work better for me?  I already have it so that I use my Int + Cha on most skills, and I use my INT bonus instead of my CON for HP and DEX for Reflex. :o
My, I am popular.  Though there's really not a whole lot you can do with that charisma without either a lot of class levels (cutting into Factotum) or Iaijutsu Master.  Marshal simply isn't a very good class.  You'd probably be better off with some class that advances your BAB, to keep you viable.  Even if it's just Factotum6.  And you may be better off forgoing that monstrous charisma in favor of simply good charisma, with better stats all around (such as decent dexterity and constitution).  Then again, motivating rituals can be powerful, and Rin has a few knowledge-boosters in her own arsenal.

Mind over Matter isn't any good, if I'm recalling it right; it's only intelligence to HP at level 1, with an additional +1 HP for every metamagic feat you take, so Improved Toughness would be better.  However, as I only have a vague idea of where it's from, and I don't want to go diving through FR stuff, I'm not quite sure what it does.  (Hint: ANNOTATE!)

One of the few good benefits you can get from that charisma with a mostly-Factotum is Charming the Arrow, pending DM approval, if and only if you're a fey.  Which is rare, though half-nymph (wherever it's from- I'm guessing half-fey) probably does that.  Though I've never heard of a male half-nymph.  Though making yourself an archer with this party could be bad; we're short melee presence.

Magic Device Attunement is just flat not a very good feat.  A Wand is DC20 to activate, and you get a +2 bonus if you've ever activated it before.  You have +17.  Activate it once, and you're literally guaranteed success.  Other than that, all you have are scrolls, which are single-use, making Magic Device Attunement pretty unimportant.

Force of Personality (Complete Adventurer) adds charisma to will saves.  It's fairly straightforward.

I have no idea what the Insightful feat is or where it comes from.  (Hint: ANNOTATE!)

Then... there are the Slippers of Battledancing (DMG2, page 272).  This one requires some huge reach.  As in trading in a big stack of experience points for money, as it costs 33,750.  However, so long as you move at least 10' in a round, it lets you apply charisma instead of Dex/Str to attack and damage with a one-handed or light melee weapon.  Approval required, as DMG2 is not a listed sourcebook.

Honorable mention to Self-Aware and Tantric, sexual feats from the Book of Erotic Fantasy that boost charisma and intelligence respectively.

And finally, your skill points are spread thin.  Really thin.  You may want to do some pruning.  And Open-Minded is a fairly pointless feat at this point.
Quote from: PhantomPistoleer on November 24, 2009, 04:31:24 PM
Looking over some of the templates, I see "Base Skill Points are now (6+Int mod) * (Racial HD+3)."  What exactly does that mean?
If you're looking at the half-fey template, that refers to racial hit die.  You don't have those, so you don't have to worry about it.  If you had racial hit die, it would mean a shift from N+ skill points to the fey 6+.  Though mind, Fiend Folio isn't on the approved list, so you'd need to run that by Triangle.

The Great Triangle

#123
Quote from: PhantomPistoleer on November 24, 2009, 04:31:24 PM
Looking over some of the templates, I see "Base Skill Points are now (6+Int mod) * (Racial HD+3)."  What exactly does that mean?

It means you're being an asshole for trying to pick your race based on what has the most plusses.   :P  Stick with the damned core races if you don't have a character concept which relies on being outside the core races.  Sorry if I get a little annoyed, but people who pick a completely random race for more plusses annoy the hell out of me.


I understand everyone wants to optomize their characters, but I don't like people making roleplaying decisions for solely mechanical reasons.  It's just silly.  I will be fairly liberal on encumberance and ammunition though, as long as you're not toting around a chunk of iron the size of pluto.  (an actual build that made the rounds 5 years or so ago)


There are 12 recognized monastic traditions in Eberron, as well as the monastic tradition of the Dolgaunt and other aberrations.  Monks in Eberron are not required to be lawful, but very few monastic traditions take chaotic monks.  You can take the favored feats of your monastic tradition as bonus feats at 1st, 2nd, and 6th levels, alongside the usual available selections.  Bonus feats available from a monastic tradition ignore the usual prerequisites.  If your monastic tradition has a favored class, you can multiclass freely into that class without the usual restrictions on multiclass monks.

Warrior's Hammer Style
Affiliation: Cult of Dol Dorn
Alignment: LG, LN, or NG
Favored Feats: Power Attack, Action Surge, Improved Toughness (cw), Robliar's Gambit (phb2, 6th level only)

Twin Gods Style
Affiliation: Cults of Dol Dorn and Dol Arrah
Alignment: LG, LN
Favored Feats: Double Steel Strike, Two Weapon Fighting, Two Weapon Defense, Two Weapon Rend (phb2, 6th level only)

Flensing Blade Style
Affiliation: Cult of the Mockery
Alignment: Any Evil
Favored Feats: Flensing Strike, Versitle Unarmed Strike (phb2), Power Attack, Slashing Flurry (phb2, 6th level only)

Copper Serpent Style
Affiliation: Cult of Boldrei
Alignment: LG, NG, LN
Favored Feats: Serpent Strike, Short Haft (phb2), Spring Attack, Greater Powerful Charge (6th level only)

Whirling Steel Style
Affiliation: The Church of the Silver Flame
Alignment: LG, NG, LN, LE
Favored Feats: Whirling Steel Strike, Melee Weapon Mastery (Slashing) (phb2), Improved Critical (Longswords) (6th level only)
Favored Class: Paladin

Inner Divinity Style
Affiliation: The Blood of Vol
Alignment: LE, LN, N
Favored Feats: Fiery Fist, Fiery Ki Defense, Ki Blast (6th level only)
Favored Class: Necromancer

Alehouse Memory Style
Affiliation: The Trust of Zilargo
Alignment: LN
Favored Feats: Fade Into Violence (phb2), Urban Tracking, Leadership (6th level only)
Favored Class: Bard

Mind Blade Style
Affiliation: The Path of Light
Alignment: LG, LN, NG, N
Favored Feats: Psionic Fist, Psionic Body, Wounding Attack (6th level only) 
Favored Class: Psionic Warrior

Thirteen Moons Style
Affiliation: Shifters and Lycanthropes
Alignment: Any Neutral
Favored Feats: Any Shifter Feat (must meet prerequisites), Improved Unarmed Strike, Multiattack

Sentinel's Wrath Style
Affiliation: House Denieth
Alignment: LG, LN
Favored Feats: Action Boost, Precise Swing, Defensive Sweep (phb2, 6th level only)
Favored Class: Knight

Imperial Martyr Style
Affiliation: Dakhaani Hobgoblins
Alignment: LN, LE
Favored Feats: Arterial Strike (cw), Hamstring (cw), Water Splitting Stone (phb2, 6th level only)
Favored Class: Rogue

Undying Honor Style
Affiliation: The Undying Court
Alignment: LN, LG
Favored Feats: Right of Counsel, Heroic Spirit, Ecclesiarch, Immunity to Poison and Disease (6th level only)
Meow!  I'm a kitty; made of fire.

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The Great Triangle

Also, Tarrasque, I'm giving you 2,500 xp for helping people make their characters.  :-)
Meow!  I'm a kitty; made of fire.

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