Tipping Etiquette

[Fae Brin]

It's-- sort of educational?

For anyone with vague or concrete travel plans, anyway...

Tipping Etiquette Around the World

[RubySlippers]

I generally refuse to tip, its simple they get a wage and that wage should be what they get. I know in the US that is not good for wait staff but they could demand a wage that was higher and they put up with it. It would be different if it was an add on for extra good service and they didn't seem to make it part of their wages, I would tip 5-10% for really good service. I usually do also its what I feel like giving for such service and they should be grateful to get it. But I paid for my meal, your paid to serve me so that is your job. Then trying to make me feel bad for not having you pick my pocket for an extra 20% on top of the meal? I know the IRS assumes they get 20% if they are tipped is that my fault they could push to change so its based on actual extra monies taken in.

If someone only gets tips a sidewalk performer or something and that is their income and they are working for themselves while pleasing me as the audience so in those cases sure I can see it, but people should get a proper wage for their work if employed.

Just shows the sham is worldwide but I did noticed in some nations a much smaller tip is expected, makes you wonder what a waiter makes in those nations as far as wages and benefits.

[Trieste]

Well, hopefully you don't rant about it to them, Ruby. Given your tendency toward entitlement, I wouldn't be surprised if a few bodily fluids end up in your food and drink. Service workers are taking care of things that you eat and drink. It is pretty well unwise to piss them off or tell them how they 'should' treat their jobs. Not to mention that it's annoying to be pontificated at by strangers anyhow.

Thanks for sharing, Fae. I found it very interesting.

[Beguile's Mistress]

Thanks, Fae. 

Ruby Slippers I'd like to remind you that higher wages for servers, cooks and those who buss tables would result in higher prices for the menu items.  You would end up paying anyway.  It all comes down to whether people are gracious and appreciative or not.

[Oniya]

The U.K. entry is confusing.  I'm not sure if the word 'excepted' is a typo, or means that in those instances a tip is not the rule. 

[Martee]

That's interesting, although not entirely surprising. The only thing that bugs me is the automatic service fee, because there's no guarantee it goes to the staff.  I understand why it's in place though, especially for larger parties.

I, myself, never worked in a position where I depended on tips as part of my income, thank the gods. This is not to say I haven't done my time in the trenches in the service industry, but I was fortunate (or, maybe, unfortunate) enough to be management - we didn't share in the tips.  Those long, horrific years serving the general public helped forge a deep camaraderie with the folks who now serve me and my family when we go out.  No matter how bad the service, I always leave a tip, at least 20% of the bill.  Always.  At the very least, I'm not the one having to clean the dishes or sweep up the crumbs.  This mentality led to many tense arguments between my husband and I early in our courtship, since resolved by giving all tipping responsibility over to me. What he doesn't know won't aggravate him.

As a teenager and into my early twenties, I spent most of my time at greek cafes, and quickly picked up the habit of tipping as we went (a night at the cafe could easily run 4-5 hours).  I realize that is not the norm, nor is it always economically feasible, but we sure were treated like kings and queens by the staff ;) The same at bars - first round gets a good tip, and usually every other round at least. My father drilled into us if we couldn't afford to take care of our servers, we couldn't afford to eat or drink out.  Good advice, I think.

[Malefique]

I'm in the UK and I don't tend to leave a tip unless I've had exceptional service.  At my local Starbucks (yes, I do frequent the place, I have a passion for any coffee that isn't supermarket cheapo instant served at boiling temperature with a dash of non-dairy whitener which tends to limit the outlets) there's a tip jar and I don't use it unless really, really pleased (though I do give the staff a big box of Thorntons chocolates to share at Christmas and Easter).  I use taxis at lot as well, and I don't tip them unless they've gone out of their way to be helpful, like helping lug my bags up my front steps.  Maybe it's mean of me, but I don't have a lot of money myself and I reckon I'm paying for acceptable service in the price of anything.  A tip is only called for if they've gone out of the way for me, like when I was taken ill in Starbucks and the staff found me a more private and comfortable seat, got me water and helped me get my medication and take it, and kept things quiet around me till the pain wore off. 

[Lilias]

Since Greece is not included in the map, and it's still an affordable place to vacation, I'll throw in a couple of guidelines.

Generally, tips are included in the prices. Extras are welcome for exceptional service, or for keeping up with exceptional demands. If your waitperson needs to come to your table more than the three necessary times (order, serving, bill), you'd better leave a 10-15%. In bars, as well, judicious tipping can get you perks like free shots.

The only other place where tips are customary is at the hairdresser's. It's quite common for customers, especially long-standing ones, to wander back into the main floor after paying their bill, in order to find the junior who washed their hair and slip her a little something. I personally find it adorable.

You don't tip taxi drivers. Ever. There is an extra charge for luggage, and they will get it into the car and out of it for you (and they can give you a receipt if you ask for it, as well).

Whatever you have to pay for, it's euros only.

[Fae Brin]

Thank you! Greece is definitely a place to vacation to!

[Lord Mayerling]

*laughs* If you're interested in saving on tips on vacation, don't come to New York City.

Restaurants - 25-35%
Cabs - 15% plus $1 for each piece of luggage
Hotel maid - $5-$10 per night
Delivery of food - 15%
Bartender $1-$2 per drink
If the super fixes something in your apartment - $20
The parking attendent - $5
The guy that pumps your gas - $5
Towel guy at the gym - $1/visit
Hairstylist - up to $5 for men, about $50 for women
Anything non-mail-related delivered to the house: groceries, laundry, furniture, plumbing, extermination - $10
I tip my postman $50 between Thanksgiving and Christmas, and give $5 for every package delivered by UPS or FedEx over that same timeframe.

[Fae Brin]

People pump other people's gas?

[Maxwell Malamute]

Most wait staff in the US make about $2.13 an hour, and don't get any benefits, no healthcare, nada, nothing. They depend on tips to make a living.

My mate might make $80 to $140 a night in tips, but they are taxed, so the pay-check is always zero. So he might clear $2,200 a month on average, but generally owes on taxes, and then health insurance is not cheap.

If restaurants had to pay $7.25 (or more) in the US, you would instead pay higher menu prices, plain and simple, and the wait staff would have less incentive to provide excellent service. I waited tables for many years, and, believe me, non-tipping customers are noted, and get slower service, and I have seen people even spit in their food. Which is rude, but it's a stressful job, and if it is the only thing you can find in an economy like the one we have now, it can really be frustrating not to be tipped. You might 'demand' a better wage, but you are more likely to be shown the door by the owners.

Not to mention, you are taxed on your implied tips, on your total sales. Say you give a table a checkfor $50. You will be taxed as if they left you 10%, or $5, even if they leave you nothing. So by not tipping, you are actually taking money from them.

If you can afford to eat out, you should also be able to afford to tip.

Oh, and I heard from this voice in the heavens that there's a special place in Hell reserved for non-tippers, where it is twice as hot!

Kidding, on that last one.

[Fae Brin]

2.13 an hour???

[Maxwell Malamute]

In many states, yes.

http://www.dol.gov/whd/state/tipped.htm

Actually, it did go up here in Maryland, to $3.63, but remains low in many states.

Now, if at the end of the pay period, your tips and wage combined do not meet minimum wage, the employer technically has to make up the difference, though this seldom seems to happen, either because you do hit minimum, or they just gloss over that rule.

As you can see, it is complex...but not tipping means you are raising the amount a person is taxed on, or their tax liability, which is one reason non-tippers are so universally disliked by waitstaff.

[Lord Mayerling]

People pump other people's gas?

Yes. It's called a full-service station. Not all gas stations in New York are full-service, but when they are, you have to tip the guy. He usually washes your windows and checks your oil and fluids, too.

[Fae Brin]

Is it optional? or is it just a matter of going to a not full-service station? and are they clearly marked?

I like pumping my own gas thanks.. >< : P

[Beguile's Mistress]

Some of it has to do with local laws and regulations.  There are some communities around her that prohibit pumping your own gas but most stations are self-service.

[HockeyGod]

What a great resource - thank you for posting! I tend to tip 20% all the time and even more if it was great service. Those people work hard and don't make as much as I do. I give my hair stylist an extra $10 and if I'm at a bar a long time, sitting at a table, and don't drink much I give the waiter or bartender extra. He/she could have been serving more drinks to others.

As for full-service...they used to be really popular here in Minnesota, but are very few and far between now.

[Lord Mayerling]

Is it optional? or is it just a matter of going to a not full-service station? and are they clearly marked?

I like pumping my own gas thanks.. >< : P

There are full-service, and self-service stations. There's signage that says what's going on. Some stations have both self-service and full-service fuel islands. Usually the gas as the full-service station is about 10 cents more per gallon. It gets even more complicated, as the price is also different whether you pay with cash or a credit card. Either way, you tip the guy in cash.

[Fae Brin]

I'd only heard of people pumping your gas for you in movies. I didn't know it was legit. @.@

Why would there be a prohibition against pumping your own gas?

It gets even more complicated, as the price is also different whether you pay with cash or a credit card.

WHYY???

[Lord Mayerling]

Two reasons:  1) when you pay with a credit card, the credit card issue takes 3% of the sale, so the merchant makes you, the consumer pay it. 2) Cash sales aren't reported as income, so the merchant doesn't pay taxes on it (illegally).

Aint New York great?

[Oniya]

I'd only heard of people pumping your gas for you in movies. I didn't know it was legit. @.@

Why would there be a prohibition against pumping your own gas?

I don't know, but all of New Jersey is full service.  Never heard of tipping the service attendant though (makes notes for next time through NJ).

[HockeyGod]

Aint New York great?

yes, they have gay marriage.

I don't know, but all of New Jersey is full service.  Never heard of tipping the service attendant though (makes notes for next time through NJ).

I think they're afraid of drive aways.  ::)

[Oniya]

yes, they have gay marriage.

I think they're afraid of drive aways.  ::)

It was true even before gas went up to over $3 a gallon.

[Lord Mayerling]

I know that in Oregon the whole state is full-service by law, and they did it to keep more people employed. In NJ, only the turnpike and garden state are full-service, and yes, you're supposed to tip them. Well, New Yorkers tip them.

yes, they have gay marriage.

I forgot. We also tipped our marriage officiant.

[Fae Brin]

I guess I understand the job -reasoning and the prevention of drive aways reasoning,

I guess I just think it's silly. Pumping gas is something that takes about two minutes. What does the driver do while they're waiting??


And I didn't think about the credit card company charging-- that makes vague sense...

I'd never want to live in New York..

[Maxwell Malamute]

That is odd, when you head up to NYC from Maryland: The gas is cheaper in New Jersey, and they pump it for you, but you have to pay to use the roads :P

[Fae Brin]

All of the roads or just the toll roads?

@.@

[Maxwell Malamute]

Just the toll roads, but also the bridges...I was trying to recall all the tolls if you take 95 to the NJ turnpike, from here...it comes to something like $20 in tolls, by the time you hit NYC.

Better to take a train, or bus.

[DudelRok]

If you brought me food in some manner of fashion, you get tipped provided you also don't have your hand out. I tip fairly high (20-25%) as long as there isn't an outwardly assumption that I'll give you a tip.

I also go by the 1, 2, 5 rule for extra services like valet, grocery delivery, whatever etc.

The main reason I'm a pretty good tipper, though, is I've done that crap and tips are a LIVE SAVER. Well I've not waited tables (mostly due to not disliking people too much) but they, really, don't get paid anything. They rely on tips to live and not tipping them is like stealing from the poor, in my ethical book. However, the more I frequent a place the more likely I'm to be handed tips back. If they don't want it (or can't have it) it ain't my problem.

I don't tip the people who cut my hair, though. I always found that to be very odd.

[Oniya]

I don't tip the people who cut my hair, though. I always found that to be very odd.

I like to make sure that the people in charge of sharp objects within two feet of my neck are happy.  :o

[Trieste]

By the same token, tipping your tattoo artist is good practice, esp. in cases of a multi-step tattoo. :P

[Vekseid]

Two reasons:  1) when you pay with a credit card, the credit card issue takes 3% of the sale, so the merchant makes you, the consumer pay it. 2) Cash sales aren't reported as income, so the merchant doesn't pay taxes on it (illegally).

Aint New York great?

Cash also can't bounce, or have a chargeback applied. There are gas stations here in MN that offer 5% off for cash transactions every now and then (Bill's Superette).

[Will]

My father drilled into us if we couldn't afford to take care of our servers, we couldn't afford to eat or drink out.  Good advice, I think.

I think this was already repeated in the thread, but it just can't be said enough.  People in the service industry have to deal with the most amazingly rude and infuriating individuals imaginable.  Many individuals go out of their way to cause a scene, just because they know company policy is that the customer is always right, and they know they'll get free meals, gift cards, etc, etc.  People come in after a bad day and think that the entire staff is their verbal punching bag.  It's truly, truly awful, and it's an everyday occurrence.

These employees deserve your tips.  Even if they didn't do a good job, they deserve the bare minimum 10%. 

[Caela]

I tip the standard 15% for mediocre service, excellent service it depends but have tipped as much as 50% for just beyond exceptional service before. Truly poor service doesn't get a tip. I understand that a lot of service industry folks count on their tips to help them live, but there are times when you simple aren't performing your job in an adequate manner and do NOT deserve any extra money out of someone's pocket. It's rare for me not to leave something, but it does happen.

Honestly, I'd rather pay the higher prices for them to make (at least) minimum wage and then only tip the truly good servers out there.

[Trieste]

I personally have to wonder, myself, whether it's honestly true that prices would go up so incredibly much if restaurants paid their waitstaff a decent wage. They pay their busboys, cooks, bartenders and often the hostesses a decent wage, so it wouldn't be the whole staff. And given that Wendy's, McDonald's, BK, etc, must pay all their employees at least minimum wage and yet still seem to turn out food at cheaper prices than sit-down restaurants (with huge profit margins, I might add), I'm skeptical. I'm sure there would be an increase. Would it be catastrophic? Not really. And if you figure the tip itself into the cost of the meal right now, then I sincerely doubt that the prices would go up very much at all.

I have my suspicions that the restaurant industry has told us this in order to keep their waitstaff from getting proper support. It's not as if restaurant workers are known for their math savvy, so it's not as if they think their employees are going to crunch the numbers. And if they did? They're not going to get a whole lot of outside support due to the belief that dining out will become astronomical if we support them.

After all, it's not as if people in countries where waitstaff make decent wage can afford to eat out very often. Oh wait...

[Imogen]

I tip in restaurants unless it's specified on the menu that tips are included. I am rather happy with this system because it lets me reward exceptional service and show my dislike in a polite fashion for mediocre service. My tips are usually by the book, sometimes extra if there was a good reason to cheer about either food, service, atmosphere, etc.

When I'm travelling I tip more generously, especially in countries with poverty. If you know that one person with a good job has to pay for the food, shelter, clothing and education for his own family plus that of his brothers and sisters, you tend to toss in a little extra. Being opportunistic I also tip extra when I expect to return to the restaurant in the near future, rewarding good service now and laying a foundation for exceptional treatment later.

[Question Mark]

Reservoir Dogs - Tipping Scene
WARNING: NSFW (language)

Felt this was appropriate.  I'm on the fence about tipping; Mr. Pink makes a good case, but then again, I've always been a generous person who's never been good holding onto his money.

[ChrisDay]

Tipping is a tricky subject.

If I have good,or ok or not horrible service I tip 15%.
If I have bad service...and by 'bad' I mean:
--Rude
--inattentive (ie drinks being unfilled, wait person walking past multiple times without checking)
--poor food WITHOUT an offer by the waiter to fix it (I realize the waiter doesn't cook the food, but cold is cold)

bad service I won't leave a tip.  Period.

If I have good service:
--Attentive wait person
--Friendly
--Attention to detail
--Attractive (yes, I said it....sue me)

I'll leave 25%. 

True story...I was eating at a Houlihans with a group of 3 others.  I asked for a burger no tomatoe.   I noticed the waitress was talking to the table next to us, sitting down for 5-10 minutes several times.  My co-workers got their food and were almost done by the time I got my burger with the tomatoe.  I threw the tomatoe on the floor (yes, I'm a jerk) and ate the burger, the waitress gave us a non-itemized bill which seemed high (we asked for one check), I asked for an itemized version.  She replied "it'll be a wait..I need to get the manager for that" and I told her "I had to wait 20 mintues for my burger, I'll wait for the itemized check".  10 minutes later she leave the bill and runs off, and lo and behold there's a 5th item on the bill, a salad (which I'm almost positive was the table next to us).   

Long story short, I left a penny tip after she took the item off.  I wanted to cause a scene, but my buddy didn't want to get her fired.  However,  I did leave her a penny for the tip.

[bubby]

If I get good service, I will tip. If I get exceptionaly service, I'll tip big.

Tip the gas guy? Of screw that. I live in Oregon, it's your JOB.

UPS and FedEx? Those people are getting paid better then me so, no.

Deliver me food in any capacity, yup.

I work for a place where there are 6 different food places within a small market, all around a general eating area. (NOT a mall btw) Each food place has a tip jar, but those food places are not the people who clean up the dishes, or keep the eating area clean. WE do. There might be a dollar tip once a month on a table.

I'm a poor lady, and if I am able to go out to each, it's generally a major treat for myself, so if only a $5 tip ends up on the table, and trust me that's if you've given me great service, it's because it's all I have to give.

Try and appreciate it?

[Oniya]

A $5 tip would be 18% on a $30 tab and reasonably close to 15% on a $35 tab.  I'm pretty sure you can still get a decent sit-down meal for two under that cap.

(Meaning I don't see a major cause for someone not appreciating it.)

[Oreo]

I was a waitress for many years and the tips were the rent portion of my wages. Without them I would not have been able to support my family. As a rule I tip big for great service. If the restaurant is packed I still tip well if it is obvious the waitress has her hands full. Receiving poor service on a slow night always grants a mere penny.

For those that might not be in the 'know', (unless it has fallen out of fashion in the past 20 years), if you received good service, but cannot afford a tip, two pennies is a compliment.

[Callie Del Noire]

Worse service I ever had was in the Uno's restaurant in Chula Vista Mall. I and four other guys in my gaming group got together and went out to see a movie and a meal. We got our tickets an hour and a half before the show and figured we'd grab a lunch before the movie rather than wander around the mall. So we go into Uno's because two of us wanted pasta.

We were seated and waited THIRTY minutes to be waited on. We were the only people in the section, and we could see our waitress at the bar counter chatting with the other waitresses (all of whom wandered off from time to time to wait on folks in their section), finally she comes up and gets our orders and drinks. Twenty minutes pass while all of us signal her for a drink (We had finished doing some early morning PT and were thirsty) without success till one of others came over to help us out.

Another twenty minutes go by while we wait for our food. Which arrived cold, and two of them weren't the RIGHT thing. One of my buddies asked for a dish without mushrooms which was ignored while ANOTHER order was completely screwed up. The second order was taken back while my other buddy picked out the mushrooms.

Twenty minutes later the other order was brought out.. ironically it was cold.  Ten minutes later she presented the bill, which had a gratuity added on to it despite the fact that the receipt said the automatic gratuity was for eight or more AND my friend's mistake was added to our bill (yes, he was supposed to pay for both the mistake and the late meal). We called the manager and she told him that three friends who walked up to talk with us were part of the group and had 'sneaked out' to avoid the gratuity.

We pointed the manager to them, they were in another section, and got that cleared up. The check was taken back and brought back fixed. Typically we each chip in six bucks regardless of our cost on the bill (that is like 30 bucks or so easy) but this time we left two pennies behind with our bill.

I have yet to return to a Uno's again.

[Caela]

Best service EVER was at an Olga's in one the local malls near me. I was taking my cousin Christmas shopping to get a present for her mom and we stopped for lunch. The place was wall to wall people and as soon as a table cleared it was filled again. I go in fully expecting to not get the best service simply because of how packed the place is.

We're barely seated and the waitress comes and asks for our drinks. Busy as she is she is polite and sweet, not the least bit harried or rushed. Impressed right from the get go I kept an eye on her and watched her work her other tables. She hit all of us frequently, never stopping to chit chat with co-workers, and our water glasses were never empty. Our food was exactly what we ordered and still hot (and I'd have cut serious slack in that crowd!) and she came around about every three minutes or so to check and see if we were doing all right and needed anything else. And she was hitting all her tables that way.

It's not an expensive place and the meal, for both of us, was only about 14$ total but that girl got a 7$ tip. 5$ from me and I made my cousin put in 2$ as well to help teach her (she was only 14 at the time) to reward such excellent service from ANYONE. That girl earned every penny of her money that day and, to this day, I hope her managers knew what a great employee they had in her and rewarded her accordingly as well.

[Lilias]

Back in Athens, I used to play a VtM LARP on Friday nights, and almost every time (unless it was the dead of winter) after the game broke, at midnight, a few of us would pile into one or two cars (depending on how many had made it to the session) and drive to Glyfada for a very late supper.

The place we picked was a real fusion eatery: decorated in classic English pub style, at least inside, but it specialised in Mexican food and the waitstaff were predominantly Eastern European. The drive meant we were there closer to 1am, and I still think we used to be the last batch of customers to be served before the kitchen closed for the night. Still, no matter the late hour, no matter how busy the place had been (it had a wallscreen, so big sports events meant lots of business) or how tired the cooking and serving staff had been, food and service both were never anything short of excellent. We pooled our money for tips, and kept wishing we could leave more, cash-strapped students and wage slaves that we were.

I haven't been back in six years or so, and I can only pray it has survived these hard times...

[Callie Del Noire]

I miss Pedro O'Mally's in Brunswick.. Mexican/Irish Pub/Resturant. Great place. :d

[Foxy DeVille]

My favorite waiter was a guy named Nate at a Denny's we'd go to after a night of booty shaking at the clubs. He was the most patient person ever. No matter how crazy we got he was the picture of poise. One night these two women were just ripping into him for no reason and when he came by our table we asked why he put up with that. He just shrugged and said they were drunk. I told him "But Nate, we're drunk and we don't treat you like that." He simply smiled. We always tipped him well because we knew he most likely got stiffed a lot by people like those two women. 

[RubySlippers]

Its not about service to me its about this - they should get a decent wage if they work for someone and if they set a fee for their own service should charge what they have to to make a go of it. Unless one only makes tips then fine tipping is more acceptable as a gratuity for services rendered if not asked for then its a fee.

Bathroom Attendents (that work at it): yes.

Buskers: yes.

Person with the sign will pick up your dog doo - donations welcome: yes.

Ministers (if you attend that worship center for a wedding say or the spouse), wait staff, barbers, bell hops, maids in hotels etc. etc.: NO.

It might be different if they got a decent wage as an employee and then its optional to tip, I get great service then I might be willing to leave something. But because they are not happy with their wages and everyone tries to blackmail me into being a good sheep I agree with the video above he makes good points they should move for better wages or ending taxing of tips on assumptions they are getting 20%. Then make tipping OPTIONAL for those working for someone or themselves, if just making tips then they have to be happy with what they get.

Before you say I'm not aware of this I am a Busker and do lots of work on a tip only basis, its how life is and I do okay but never expect a tip I go do my best job and hope its appreciated.

[dakabn]

I generally refuse to tip, its simple they get a wage and that wage should be what they get.

Their wage is usually very low because they are expected to get tips.

I really am disgusted at how people treat people who are serving them. Sometimes, there is obvious incompetence and laziness, but look around. Could YOU do their job? Even if you could (or do) have a little respect and sympathy. Maybe if you give them a smile and a thank you (and a tip) regardless, that might give them them encouragement to be better at their job.

All I'm gonna say on this. Have a good day and at least THANK people who do things for you. You didn't have to. :) Think on that.

[Will]

I personally have to wonder, myself, whether it's honestly true that prices would go up so incredibly much if restaurants paid their waitstaff a decent wage. They pay their busboys, cooks, bartenders and often the hostesses a decent wage, so it wouldn't be the whole staff. And given that Wendy's, McDonald's, BK, etc, must pay all their employees at least minimum wage and yet still seem to turn out food at cheaper prices than sit-down restaurants (with huge profit margins, I might add), I'm skeptical. I'm sure there would be an increase. Would it be catastrophic? Not really. And if you figure the tip itself into the cost of the meal right now, then I sincerely doubt that the prices would go up very much at all.

I have my suspicions that the restaurant industry has told us this in order to keep their waitstaff from getting proper support. It's not as if restaurant workers are known for their math savvy, so it's not as if they think their employees are going to crunch the numbers. And if they did? They're not going to get a whole lot of outside support due to the belief that dining out will become astronomical if we support them.

After all, it's not as if people in countries where waitstaff make decent wage can afford to eat out very often. Oh wait...

That's a very fair point, but it doesn't mean that higher wages wouldn't mean price hikes.  Businesses would just be bullshitting customers then, instead of employees.  "We're paying our wait staff a decent wage now, but we have to pass the cost onto you!"  Whether or not it's true is not as important as whether or not people will accept it.

[TheGlyphstone]

It might be different if they got a decent wage as an employee and then its optional to tip, I get great service then I might be willing to leave something.

As dkabn said, they don't get a decent wage. Waitstaff, or any other hospitality workers who recieve tips, can legally be paid less than minimum wage, as long as their pay wage + average tips bring them up to the minimum wage.

[Envious]

I don't tip unless the service is good. When I do tip, it's a big tip.

[Jag]

We rarely have a bill over $30 because we chose to spend as little as we can. Generally we have the rule of $10 a person. If the service is bad, they get $1. If the service was decent, but a little slow with no apparently good reason (it not being busy or the waitress just sitting there chatting instead of doing their job), they get $3. If it was good service, they get $5.

If the bill is more than $30, then all those go up by $2 (bad service = $3, decent service = $5, and good service = $7). If the bill is, for some insane reason, more than $70...then it all goes up by $4 (bad service = $5 though if it's really bad then they only get $1, decent service = $7, and good service = $9).

That's the system I've always used and plan on continuing to use. *shrugs* Though there have been times that the service was so bad that I only left a quarter and times that it's been so good that I leave them 50%.

[Caela]

All I'm gonna say on this. Have a good day and at least THANK people who do things for you. You didn't have to. :) Think on that.

I bolded the section of this I wanted to ask about. Did you mean that they didn't have to do something for you? If so then my response to that is that yes they DID. We're talking about employees in the service industry, doing for you (as the customer) is their JOB. I do agree with thanking people for their service and always try to give waitstaff a smile and to treat them kindly (my bad day is not their fault) and to be polite but make no mistake, they do have to do for you.

My other issue is that it's called a "gratuity", it's meant to show gratitude for a job well done. If someone isn't doing their job well they don't deserve extra money and I will not feel obligated to give it to them. Yes their wages suck, but they chose that job (maybe through circumstances but they did choose to apply for it) and it is their obligation to do it to the best of their ability. For good service I tip well, for poor service I won't tip at all and I won't lose any sleep over it.

[RubySlippers]

As dkabn said, they don't get a decent wage. Waitstaff, or any other hospitality workers who recieve tips, can legally be paid less than minimum wage, as long as their pay wage + average tips bring them up to the minimum wage.

Woody Guthrie "Vigilante Man"

My simple response if they want better wages its up to the workers to get them, not ask me to make up what they are not getting. Form a PAC, form a lobby group, form unions, strike and do what they can to get better wages and better laws on taxes. Then tipping could be elective I could say keep the change on a $5.35 check and that would be a tip I would likely do that since I did that when traveling with my military father in other countries. But its principle for me the first thing that has to be there is a proper wage and living conditions first and that is up to the workers to get.

I simply state if you get a wage, set a fee for service or get a salary then you don't need tips the wage should be enough the fee set for your time enough or the salary enough on its own. The modest exception I have is if you only make tips and its my choice to tip - buskers, bathroom attendents, homeless people do some service for me then a small gratuity is fine these groups don't set fees or get a wage or salary.

[jj]

I over tip by way to much and i know i do it. I had a waitress job as a teenager it lasted one day , i could not stand it. I have never done any thing so hard for  me since i was not cut out for it. the only time i don't tip is is the service was just plain awful.

[eternalnight]

I noticed that some people said that in some places the minimum wage for serves is around $3/hr. Where I live (Which is somewhere in America), it's been raised to $4.29/hr. If you think about it, that is literally nothing. Can you imagine working all day, working your butt off and end up only making only $30? That's a bit on the extreme side and would happen if the person didn't get any tip whatsoever. It's not like all the people in the service industry choose to be in that industry. The fact that the potential for tip is there because it allows people to make more than the average person who works only on the state minimum wage outside of the service industry.

I have been working in the service industry for the past couple of years and let me tell you, it's not fun. I've dealt with all sorts of people during this time and it can get a bit frustrating. It's not our fault that the government decides to have the minimum wage for servers to be a certain amount and then expect us to receive a certain percentage of tip. But many of us do try to work hard for that tip. Even when I provide the best service I can to earn the tip. But when I do work hard and then receive nothing to only 10% for my efforts, it can get extremely frustrating. The job is how I make a living, is it really my fault that I only get paid a certain amount of money hourly? Sure, people could form unions, form strikes, but what good would that do in the long run? During that period, people wouldn't be working, only making it harder on themselves. And on the other hand, someone also mentioned that at the expense of raising the wages for people in the service industry, menu items will be raised in order to make up for the labor costs of the company.

It's a business and those people will do whatever they can to assure that they can get the most profits. So even if you feel like the tipping system is ridiculous and you feel like you have no obligation to tip the person who just provided the service to you, just think of the fact that they are trying to make a living and that you very well could have been in the same position that they are in. When it comes to earning money, serving is one of the jobs that would earn you more money that being a retail associate or working part-time at a gas station.

This is just my take on it, coming from personal experience. I don't expect everybody to agree with me, just that they take it into consideration. I don't want to start an argument or anything like that, either. This is just my take and nobody is obligated to see things the way that I do.

[Maeven]

This is a subject near and dear to my heart since I spent about 10 years in the service industry working various levels, low end diners, big cooperate mid to upper end chains and high-boutique establishments.  I was even a cocktail waitress at a big club for a few months.

I think it was Trieste that mentioned that restaurants pay their bussers, hostesses and bartenders a regular salary so why not their wait staff. In all of the businesses I worked (where those persons were employed) this was not the case. The wait staff pay those folks out of their tips. In the case of the higher end establishments, it was a set fee of 3% of the persons total sales. Bartenders also are only paid the reduced wage and generally it was customary to tip them out as well. Same with places that had food runners. So... Say you are lucky enough to clear 20% of your sales in cash tips, you're giving 3-4% to the other staff that makes it happen.

It really makes sense though.  You go to restaurant partly because you wish to be served.  The service fee is automatically added in some cases (large parties, hotels, etc). A majority of the time however, the set price is for the product, the food. That price covers the cost of the chef, the management and the general overhead. It does not include the experience which depends on the quality of the service. An entertaining and attentive server can make your meal. Even if the steak sucks, they can make it all better by providing excellent service.

As to the suggestion that it would be better if they "fought" for higher wages... The more incentive (remuneration above the "standard" 15%) there is for that server to provide quality service, the better your overall experience. If the wage were set and the pay was the same no matter what service they provide, you can be certain that in most cases you are going to be provided the bare minimum to get by (cruise lines are
a perfect example - you aren't getting exemplary service because there's not that additional incentive.) and
frankly, do you really want to go out for a nice meal and have your $30 dollar steak served with the same care that you get from the drive through attendant?




I am posting from a mobile so pardon my mistakes. It's difficult to edit.

[Kate]

give them a card with your phone number

Doesnt cost you anything and its very flattering :)

[Lilias]

Flattery doesn't pay the bills. Phone numbers bring all the stalkers to the yard, though. ;)

[Kate]

then you can blackmail them for stalking you.

gimme cash or ...

[Lilias]

Isn't that a tad too much work to save a few bob?

[Kate]

hmm good point ... probably giving them 20 dollars makes more sense.

[Beguile's Mistress]

I went out to dinner one night a week ago with my nephews.  They are 13 and 15 and eat like lumberjacks.  Our bill came to approximately $60.00.  The boys are also used to having their mother cater to all their quirks such as a plate of spaghetti with the sauce on the side.  Among all of the dishes that were ordered two came from the kitchen incorrect.  Our fault?  The kitchen's?  Hers?  Who knows.  She cheerfully returned the dishes and came back with them done to our liking.  She overheard a conversation between the boys about wanting to share two dishes and brought extra plates that weren't asked for.  Drinks were kept filled as was the bread basked without our asking.  She treated the boys as respectfully as she treated me, even calling them sir which puffed them up immensely.  All in all she went the extra mile that made a nice dinner out a fun experience.  The boys checked out the name of the place and told me they want to come back again on their next visit.

20% of $60.00 would be $12.00 or the cost of an entree but I felt the extra serving of professionalism and personal treatment merited more so I left $20.00, nearly 35% of the total.  I was pleased to do it and when I saw the older car and heard the two squeals of "Mommy" when I saw her being picked up I was glad I did.

[TheGlyphstone]

I went out to dinner one night a week ago with my nephews.  They are 13 and 15 and eat like lumberjacks.  Our bill came to approximately $60.00.  The boys are also used to having their mother cater to all their quirks such as a plate of spaghetti with the sauce on the side.  Among all of the dishes that were ordered two came from the kitchen incorrect.  Our fault?  The kitchen's?  Hers?  Who knows.  She cheerfully returned the dishes and came back with them done to our liking.  She overheard a conversation between the boys about wanting to share two dishes and brought extra plates that weren't asked for.  Drinks were kept filled as was the bread basked without our asking.  She treated the boys as respectfully as she treated me, even calling them sir which puffed them up immensely.  All in all she went the extra mile that made a nice dinner out a fun experience.  The boys checked out the name of the place and told me they want to come back again on their next visit.

20% of $60.00 would be $12.00 or the cost of an entree but I felt the extra serving of professionalism and personal treatment merited more so I left $20.00, nearly 35% of the total.  I was pleased to do it and when I saw the older car and heard the two squeals of "Mommy" when I saw her being picked up I was glad I did.

+1 faith in humanity.

[Beguile's Mistress]

*smiles*  Thank you.

Your remark make me think of something.  How often does the bad service or attitude we might receive from a server follow the a less than proper tip?  Even a simple thank you given sincerely can make the experience better for the next person, too.

[Star Safyre]

Given that Mr. Fyre's mom worked as a waitress as a single mom for much of his childhood and my own stint in food service, we tip every time.  Even if the service is bad, we tip.  Even if the order is messed up, we tip.  Even if we just ordered a coffee just to be able to sit down, we tip.

Once we were eating a complimentary breakfast at a restaurant for which the attached hotel gave out free meals with the stay.  It was a chain restaurant, so most of the customers were paying.  The free breakfast was a sort of a la carte deal with a certain number of items for free.  When we were done, we had no idea how to tip the server, who had actually been very nice and accommodating.  On top of that, we were traveling so we had zero cash on us.  We dug around in our wallets for change, and we had no coins on us except for a Sacagawea dollar that he had gotten as a souvenir on another trip.  He's walk around with that coin in his pocket for years.  We left it for the server because we couldn't bear the idea of just getting up and walking out without giving something to the server.

[Maeven]

One of the most memorable, if not THE most memorable, experiences I had waiting tables was a table of twenty-something's that were super high maintenance and the tip they left was either non-existent or so minimal as to be non-existent.  About an hour and a half after they'd gone, one of the people from the party taps me on the shoulder. He offered profuse apolpgies for his rude dining companions and handed me a 20 dollar bill.

It was so incredibly sweet! I was blown away.

(Then there was the time the drunk lady puked all over my table. That was pretty memorable too, but another thread entirely!)

[TheGlyphstone]

Heh. I've actually started accumulating a few Sacagawea dollars and including one as part of tips I leave at restaurants. I know they're just money, but I think they're nifty.

[Beguile's Mistress]

That's a cool idea.

*heads of to find the few stashed away SOMEWHERE*

[Lilias]

I hope my mum has kept some of the 2004 Olympics euro coins for such purposes...

[Kate]

Well i think 1/3 of the cost of everything else seems to be the outcome that puts smiles on peoples faces and makes sense.

100 dollar meal for two ... tip them 30 or so, anything less than a solid note 20 really is insulting (unless its a lunch or something then really just stick to 30 percent),

being known as a good tipper I am sure opens some doors in your next incarnation, you just feel like shit if you don;t and feel good if you do (the difference is worth it)

[Cecilia]

My simple response if they want better wages its up to the workers to get them, not ask me to make up what they are not getting.But its principle for me the first thing that has to be there is a proper wage and living conditions first and that is up to the workers to get.

I wonder if your "simple response" is making any effective change in the world.  Do you stop to explain your particular stance so you don't just come across as a being completely unappreciative of other's hard work or worse?     Though, I'm not entirely sure how I'd take it if I'd just busted my ass to serve you a plate of hot delicious food to be told, "I'm not tipping you because I'm thinking you need to work harder at standing up for your own wages.  But, thanks for the great service anyway, it was awesome."



On another note...

My brother took his company out to dinner for their holiday party.  It was an excellent meal and there were plenty of servers for his party of thirty or so.  WHen the time came to sign the bill and add the tip, he handed it to his wife and asked her to fill in the tip and sign on the line.  A little while later, the host of the restaurant came by with a very concerned look on his face and asked if everything was okay.  My brother was confused and said that he was very pleased, that everything was terrific.  Then, the host handed him the slip and asked if maybe they had offended him in some other way as the tip was a bit less than he had expected.  My sister-in-law never even looked at the total amount but simply put in a tip that seemed "like enough" of $50.  On a $3,500 bill.    My brother pulled out his glasses and looked at it closely and fixed it. 

[Trieste]

>.> $50 times seven would still be a crappy tip on that bill, percentage-wise. Good on the manager to stand up for his employees' tips, though!

[Cecilia]

Yeah. If he hadn't said anything, my brother would never have known, and, actually, it would maybe have been bad for the business.  "That company came over and they only tipped $35 when we had ten people running around like crazy all night long!"   My brother took it up to 30% and they seemed happy with that. 

[RubySlippers]

I did act in a positive way I voted for the state higher minimum wage which sets the state wage for tipped workers at a generous $4.29 an hour and everyone else a generous $7.31 an hour as of June 2011.

That is over the $2.13 National Minimum Wage [about 50% less than the state minimum wage] if one does the math on this. And if they bother to post an amendment to raise this again I will vote for it again. But lets see the other laws apply if they don't get tips and salary to match the state minimum wage the employee must get the minimum wage paid. So I don't see how I'm hurting anyone if they get no tips at all they are assured $7.31 per hour for their work so if no one ever tipped a tipped employee they would get that - right?

Since they get the higher state minimum wage I voted giving them a 49+% wage increase I'm so generous and no restaurants closed down over this as far as I can tell. I consider that adequete then if I decide to tip then a small tip of 5-10% should be acceptable its supposed to be extra for ones service but they don't calculate the windfall of the minimum wage in Florida we generously offer. Other states have a higher minimum wage some over Floridas and this includes tipped employees in most cases so I consider that as a factor in tipping.

No one is entitled to tips either one should have a service charge for everyone advertised and notified to the patron or take what tips one decides to freely give and be happy with it. As for the etiquette of tipping just because everyone else does somthing doesn't make it a good practice and you know this as well as I do.

[Trieste]

Put quite simply: You have no idea what you're talking about. Your posts on this subject (and a few others, I might add) reflect a sense of entitlement that is astounding and an ignorance that is abhorrent in its seeming wilfulness. You have never struggled knowing that you have no way of making ends meet. You use your wheelchair 20 hours a week to soak people out of money that they have spent twice that earning, and then you turn around and look down on the same people for not being as politically active as you think they should be. Did it ever occur to you that the squishy lifestyle you lead on 20 hours of work a week (or was that a month? Doesn't matter, I guess) is partially funded by tip-money? More than likely at least some of the people who contribute money to you because of your wheelchair are funded by tips, and the only reason they will have extra to give you is because other people were much more generous, understanding, and kind than you have been.

I also hope that you don't proselytize to your servers with this self-indulgent "I voted for a $4 minimum wage" diatribe. There is very little more annoying than someone deciding that you personally are responsible for something they don't like, and lecturing to you about it. Waitstaff are not your slaves, to work for you for - oooh, goodie! - $4 an hour, and they are not your servants to be grateful for whatever table scraps you deem appropriate. If you don't like the system, don't bring your inflated sense of entitlement into the eateries that you enjoy because someone busts their ass. If you don't like the system, don't patronize it. But if you're going to patronize it, then respect the people that make the experience nice for you, and pay them properly.

And that's about all I have to say about that.

[Beguile's Mistress]

That was very generous of your brother.  20% would have been proper and most establishments would have added that to the bill leaving it up to the guest to add more.  A tip of more than $1,000 for that size and nature of a party was wonderful. 

[Linwood Badr]

I gotta say I agree with everyone who went with I normally always tip. After working as a busboy for almost two years (Which I want to say was worse than what the waiters had to deal with just because we were treated as their lapdogs) I always tip, and I try to be nice to the waiters/servicemen/woman as much as possible. I figure that if I can't remember what assholes I had to serve than I'm no better.

Also, my parents always get a lecture from me whenever they tip less than ten to fifteen percent. The first time I realized they did that I was really annoyed at them, and I don't think they approve of how many times I sometimes go over the 15%.

[Kate]

Better yet

Add 30 => 50 percent to the cost of everything - and no tipping is necessary (but still permitted) - and the waitresses / waiters get that difference in their base rate

[RubySlippers]

I'm not opposed to tipping its the cultural expectation in the United States that it automatically is given and must be 15% and more likely 20% everytime for people doing their jobs. In a basic fact I'm not the persons employer I'm the customer its not my job to pay the worker its the employers job so why look to me for more money. Same if you set a fee for a service say a massage therapist charging $50 your fee is your pay, if you need more money ask for a bigger fee. 

If you don't get a wage or set a fee ,I tip bathroom attendents and homeless people doing a service for me well, since like me only get a gratuity for a service if that is a clean bathroom at a busy place or picking up after my dog for me or performing and I like it yes they get a dollar at least. But they aren't employed by someone or can set a fee so its fair they get a modest gratuity.

But no one has a right to a gratuity and if I do give one for good service its never over 10% I just think anyone is worth an 15 to 20%+ tip for doing their jobs in a case where they have a base income or set a fee. Just my opinion and choice naturally.

[Silverfyre]

Put quite simply: You have no idea what you're talking about. Your posts on this subject (and a few others, I might add) reflect a sense of entitlement that is astounding and an ignorance that is abhorrent in its seeming wilfulness. You have never struggled knowing that you have no way of making ends meet. You use your wheelchair 20 hours a week to soak people out of money that they have spent twice that earning, and then you turn around and look down on the same people for not being as politically active as you think they should be. Did it ever occur to you that the squishy lifestyle you lead on 20 hours of work a week (or was that a month? Doesn't matter, I guess) is partially funded by tip-money? More than likely at least some of the people who contribute money to you because of your wheelchair are funded by tips, and the only reason they will have extra to give you is because other people were much more generous, understanding, and kind than you have been.

I also hope that you don't proselytize to your servers with this self-indulgent "I voted for a $4 minimum wage" diatribe. There is very little more annoying than someone deciding that you personally are responsible for something they don't like, and lecturing to you about it. Waitstaff are not your slaves, to work for you for - oooh, goodie! - $4 an hour, and they are not your servants to be grateful for whatever table scraps you deem appropriate. If you don't like the system, don't bring your inflated sense of entitlement into the eateries that you enjoy because someone busts their ass. If you don't like the system, don't patronize it. But if you're going to patronize it, then respect the people that make the experience nice for you, and pay them properly.

And that's about all I have to say about that.

+1.

I always found it ironic when a person who is using social services and other government assistance decides to look down on folks who work for tips.  "I get money for free!  You don't deserve a tip even though you work for a shit wage!"

Ignorance, plain and simple.

[Oreo]

I have to agree. I have been on both sides of that fence; a waitress and now disabled. I still leave a 15 - 20% tip on the rare occasion when I can afford to eat out. I also leave a dollar tip in places where someone has to come bus my table after I leave, like a buffet diner.

It actually bothers me to no end that I eat better on disability than I did when I was working. Ain't that a kick in the pants?

[Blitzy]

Put quite simply: You have no idea what you're talking about. Your posts on this subject (and a few others, I might add) reflect a sense of entitlement that is astounding and an ignorance that is abhorrent in its seeming wilfulness. You have never struggled knowing that you have no way of making ends meet. You use your wheelchair 20 hours a week to soak people out of money that they have spent twice that earning, and then you turn around and look down on the same people for not being as politically active as you think they should be. Did it ever occur to you that the squishy lifestyle you lead on 20 hours of work a week (or was that a month? Doesn't matter, I guess) is partially funded by tip-money? More than likely at least some of the people who contribute money to you because of your wheelchair are funded by tips, and the only reason they will have extra to give you is because other people were much more generous, understanding, and kind than you have been.

I also hope that you don't proselytize to your servers with this self-indulgent "I voted for a $4 minimum wage" diatribe. There is very little more annoying than someone deciding that you personally are responsible for something they don't like, and lecturing to you about it. Waitstaff are not your slaves, to work for you for - oooh, goodie! - $4 an hour, and they are not your servants to be grateful for whatever table scraps you deem appropriate. If you don't like the system, don't bring your inflated sense of entitlement into the eateries that you enjoy because someone busts their ass. If you don't like the system, don't patronize it. But if you're going to patronize it, then respect the people that make the experience nice for you, and pay them properly.

And that's about all I have to say about that.

Fully and totally agree.

[Kate]

Actually I have a much better idea.

If any have read the Culture Series by Ian M Banks.... the would know its a utopia that is somewhat feasible - although in the distant future.

AI is awesome => Machines and computers are all programmed with a bias of being pleased making people happy - but not at the expense of other peoples happiness or other options - they run and do everything ... and mainly are designed to create utopia for people, and all people do is do whatever they want, if they like killing people => Fine machines / computers etc simulate whatever the like.

If they WANT to work - they can overseeing directions of some robots somewhere - even if its less efficient, most people just run around trying to see to romantic and artistic endevours.... wanna be in command of something ... as long as most of it is robots ... or those who WANT to be under you ... no problem.

Project Utopia

[Silverfyre]

Actually I have a much better idea.

If any have read the Culture Series by Ian M Banks.... the would know its a utopia that is somewhat feasible - although in the distant future.

AI is awesome => Machines and computers are all programmed with a bias of being pleased making people happy - but not at the expense of other peoples happiness or other options - they run and do everything ... and mainly are designed to create utopia for people, and all people do is do whatever they want, if they like killing people => Fine machines / computers etc simulate whatever the like.

If they WANT to work - they can overseeing directions of some robots somewhere - even if its less efficient, most people just run around trying to see to romantic and artistic endevours.... wanna be in command of something ... as long as most of it is robots ... or those who WANT to be under you ... no problem.

Project Utopia

This hardly solves the current problem of people not using proper taxing etiquette.  Robots and utopian futures are nice, but that's a whole other discussion.

[Kate]

Well with THAT attitude its a different topic ...

oh if people only knew such views are part of the problem :) lol :P

[Silverfyre]

Soooooooo, because I don't think that robots and utopians societies are going to happen overnight, my attitude is a problem that affects how I tip?  Sorry, you are offering solutions that are both unrealistic at the moment with our current levels of technology and a long way off.  Tipping etiquette deals more with the human element and the discussion on what would be the proper amount and the reasoning behind each person's opinion on what they feel is reasonable to give/not to give, is it not?

[Kate]

This hardly solves the current problem of people not using proper taxing etiquette.  Robots and utopian futures are nice, but that's a whole other discussion.

Ok silver-seriousness :)

My intention wasn't to solve a current problem over night

It's-- sort of educational?

For anyone with vague or concrete travel plans, anyway...

Tipping Etiquette Around the World

"for anyone with a vague OR concrete plan" .. as in concrete OR vague.

My "vague" futuristic utopian injection wasn't intending to offend - it was light hearted but yes related.

If my perspective is something you want to be irrelevant - then ignore it.

[Silverfyre]

I apologize if you think I'm calling it "irrelevant" in general: I meant it in the sense that it is hardly a plausible solution to the current discussion.  While utopian theory is something I personally find fascinating, a world full of robots that do our bidding is a long, long way off from a scientific stand point and hardly contributes to how we should handle tipping.  Again, my opinion.

[Kate]

What is plausible / relevant / subjective vs objectively "topical", who was mis-interpreted - it doesn't matter lets drop it - all cool :)

[Haloriel]

I've never stiffed a person in service, and I always give at least 10%, usually 20%.  I've also never had a rude server -- not ever.  For catering events I will give a hundred to divide between the staff, depending upon number.  When I married, my officiant did not charge us.  We tipped her two hundred dollars.  Things like taxes and tips do not bother me, and tolls.  Most countries pay much more for their social services. 

Personally, if there was a way to raise the minimum wage to that of a living wage for every worker in the country, I would love that, and I wouldn't care if my taxes were high as a result, or I had to pay more for goods.  I still would be a tipper, even then. :)  Service is a hard job, that is unappreciated, like teachers.  It's ridiculous that we give millions to entertainers, but those that ensure our society remains, those that educate our children have so little.

I'm more inclined to give a homeless person a bite to eat, or some money also, before I would send money to some charity -- even though such are also worthy.  There's something about the smile and gratitude when such things are done personally that's amazing.

[Silverfyre]

I've never stiffed a person in service, and I always give at least 10%, usually 20%.  I've also never had a rude server -- not ever.  For catering events I will give a hundred to divide between the staff, depending upon number.  When I married, my officiant did not charge us.  We tipped her two hundred dollars.  Things like taxes and tips do not bother me, and tolls.  Most countries pay much more for their social services. 

Personally, if there was a way to raise the minimum wage to that of a living wage for every worker in the country, I would love that, and I wouldn't care if my taxes were high as a result, or I had to pay more for goods.  I still would be a tipper, even then. :)  Service is a hard job, that is unappreciated, like teachers.  It's ridiculous that we give millions to entertainers, but those that ensure our society remains, those that educate our children have so little.

I'm more inclined to give a homeless person a bite to eat, or some money also, before I would send money to some charity -- even though such are also worthy.  There's something about the smile and gratitude when such things are done personally that's amazing.

Very well said. You captured my own view on the subject matter better than I could have said it. My mother raised three kids as a waitress and while single so I never stiff my servers.  I know how hard that sort of work is and it is just ridiculous not to tip them.

[TheGlyphstone]

Not to mention the staggering level of willful naievity necessary to say 'just strike/unionize for better wages' - the recession is far from over, and the unemployment rate is still at 9.2 percent as of June. There's far too many jobless people who'd be happy to take that waitressing or busboy spot even if it's not enough for them to live on, because that's still more than the nothing they have currently...any tip-worker who gets 'uppity' will just find themselves fired and replaced.

[Haloriel]

I worked in service for sometime myself.  I think the political process stalls in Washington because so few of our government officials are often independently wealthy to at least a small degree.  They haven't a clue what it is like to live from paycheck to paycheck, or perhaps lose a job due to downsizing.

I grew up in a well to do home, yet my father insisted we all get jobs as soon as we could get permits. :)

[Haloriel]

So many are independently wealthy, I mean.  Hurray for typos. :)

[Oniya]

Not to mention the staggering level of willful naievity necessary to say 'just strike/unionize for better wages' - the recession is far from over, and the unemployment rate is still at 9.2 percent as of June. There's far too many jobless people who'd be happy to take that waitressing or busboy spot even if it's not enough for them to live on, because that's still more than the nothing they have currently...any tip-worker who gets 'uppity' will just find themselves fired and replaced.

Not to mention the states that are putting up laws to yank the teeth out of 'collective bargaining'.

[dana eleanor]

I tip servers anything between $5-10, depending on if they were nice and had a smile on their faces, because I have had some bad servers who had fake smiles and they were having bad days, so I only tipped them $5.

[Kate]

Hey guys i know the unemployment rate is higher than figures show as many figures include part time etc - ie below what really can support a person let alone a family.

how bad is it in the usa now ?

[Blitzy]

In my town right now it's god awful. The space center just shut down and we lost something like, 3 thousand people were laid off. That's not including the ones who's jobs had been cut before Atlantis landing, those who's contracts are due to expire very soon, and the fall out from various businesses closing down around our towns because there's less tourism. :( It is bad.

[Craz]

I tend to follow a "double the tax" rule for tipping, in most cases. Granted, I don't go out very often, and when I do it's to cheapo-ish places, but hey, I'm very picky, and I know how stressful life is in general, so I tip something like 18-20%, even at Denny's.

On the contrary, though, I am a wrathful person when people are assholes. I've been known to leave tips for the people who clean our table and skip the waiter, if the waiter was rude or ignoring our table. Though, I haven't done this in over a year, because I tend to avoid places where I'll get bad service, and me and my buddies have tended to weed out the places we don't like.

[sunbeams]

I tip. Not at places like Starbucks or Subway, though (I'm usually broke). Our minimum wage is $8.50 in Oregon, even for waiters and busboys and the like. But, at normal, every day restaurants, I'll tip 20-30 percent. Hell, even 20-30 percent at fine dining restaurants ($100+ for two people).

[meikle]

I tip servers anything between $5-10, depending on if they were nice and had a smile on their faces, because I have had some bad servers who had fake smiles and they were having bad days, so I only tipped them $5.

If I can tell that a server is having a bad day, that's usually a good reason to tip more.

When I go out to eat, 20% is my baseline, and it's hard for a server to get less than that out of me (I think the last time I tipped less, the restaurant was empty except for me and my friend, and our waitress never returned to us after delivering our meal, except to give us our check -- almost fifteen minutes after we asked for it.)

I think the best tip I ever left was like 200% (granted, it was a small bill, like $10 and a $20 tip), because our waitress was putting up with some asshole who kept yelling at her (and said something like "WHY IS THE SERVICE SO BAD?  IS IT BECAUSE YOU KNOW I DON'T TIP?"  Also, it was 2 in the morning, and he was complaining that his pie wasn't made fresh.) 

I did got to the Wisconsin Dells, though, and everyone wants a tip.  You'll go to a candy store and there'll be a tip jar for the cashier.  That kind of drove me crazy.

[dana eleanor]

I do tip at the sushi place I go to because it's always good every single time I go. Plus, I don't go there too often, so it's always a treat to go.

[RubySlippers]

There is a very simple and legal solution to this used in some countries why not just tack on every bill a service charge of 18-20%. I cannot refuse to pay that in many states and its not an uncommon practice in other nations especially in Asia. Then its up to the customer to decide if they care to go to eat out or not.

Seriously why not its pretty much forced on me by what responses are on youtube to bad tippers as they put it the ones that refuse to tip or tip an "unacceptable amount" which seems to be 18-20% so why not cut out the pretense?

If its not a service charge I'm more than happy to tip what I think is fair and by my experience 7-10% for good service is the global norm in civilized nations is modest so I tip accordingly if the servers don't like it then its to bad.

I'm a Busker I don't even get a wage, or taxes paid out of small check and only get spare change what makes servers so special. I make bad money or good money its the lot of my profession and has been for thousands of years of Buskers. Pauper or prince we survive or starve on gratutities the passing people pay us. I suggest servers have a choice take your chances or fight for better wages as a base an option I don't have.

Thats all I have to say.

[Saerrael]

I'd like to thank people who posted here. I never really understood why it was such a big deal to tip in the USA, but now (very clearly) get the point. It's not a very common thing to do in the Netherlands. We have a very strong minimum wage and even waiters nearly always earn above it due to the type of work waiting is. Tipping here is usually only done in the more expensive restaurants, and.. more or less to show off how much money you can spend, more than to provide (additional) income. Tipping jars are not uncommon, but no one thinks twice if you don't tip, here.

Thank you for the information! Though I do not plan to visit the USA any time soon, I'll be sure to tip where appropriate if I ever do.

[Will]

Several people have explained why fighting through normal means to get a better wage isn't really an option, and yet you keep harping on that point.  Sure, give up your job and your livelihood, no matter how meager, in hopes of getting more!  Yeah, that makes sense.

Also, it's been pointed out that making tips mandatory or simply raising prices cuts out the servers' incentive to do a good job for you.

You're kind of just repeating yourself.

[TheGlyphstone]

I'd like to thank people who posted here. I never really understood why it was such a big deal to tip in the USA, but now (very clearly) get the point. It's not a very common thing to do in the Netherlands. We have a very strong minimum wage and even waiters nearly always earn above it due to the type of work waiting is. Tipping here is usually only done in the more expensive restaurants, and.. more or less to show off how much money you can spend, more than to provide (additional) income. Tipping jars are not uncommon, but no one thinks twice if you don't tip, here.

Thank you for the information! Though I do not plan to visit the USA any time soon, I'll be sure to tip where appropriate if I ever do.

Don't they offer university courses in restaurant staffing in Europe? I understand it's a well-respected and well-paid profession there, rather than the minimum-wage work-your-way-through-college crap job it is here.

[Saerrael]

They do, yes, but there are also waiting jobs that do not require you to have certain papers. Those are often popular with students. These jobs do pay less, of course, but still often above minimum wage. The staffing jobs you need papers for pay a lot over minimum wage (obviously).

[Inkidu]

I was taught to tip ten percent.. I usually do this for every service. I just don't carry a lot of cash on me, and if I put it on a card the management usually takes it outright or a huge chunk of it anyway. I mean waiters are given a wage with what they should make on average a week in tips so I feel for them. It's just good manners.

[Cecilia]

For the first time in a very long time, I experienced bad service on Friday night.  Thursday, I went to this Italian place near the conference I was attending and had a terrific experience.  Then, I found some friends on Friday and we went back to the same place because I was so impressed.  We were in a different section than I was the previous night, with a different waiter.  He was slow to bring out the drinks, even though we were clearly in a celebratory mood, and then he didn't tell us the specials on the fresh sheet, took our orders without even prompting us for salads or starters.  He didn't smile, and we had to ask him to repeat himself several times because he spoke softly.  The table next to us got their salads, ate them and got their entrees before ours came--and they were seated after we had been served our drinks.  The night before, my salad was in front of me in five minutes.  I flagged down our guy as he served the table next to us their meals and he looked sort of confused but ran off instead of coming over.  One of my friends said "He forgot to put in our order....has to be it."  he came back over and said,"yours will be right up." and ran away before checking our rather enough glasses or anything.   This is at least 45 minutes....he did come out moments later with our food--except one of the orders was totally wrong--Mussels, not tagliatelle....really wrong.  The food was delicious once we got it, but two of us were halfway done before the correct dish came out. 

The bill came, and it was for full price.  He didn't even comp my friend a glass of wine.  When it came time to tip, we all three had the same response...he gets a bad tip.  So we went with 10%.   Which was still a tip, but none of us felt right leaving nothing.  The waiter I had the previous night came over to collect the check and I said to him,"I wish you'd been our waiter tonight..." he asked what happened, apologized profusely and explained that the other guy was on his second night and offered us free tiramisu.   

[Carver]

I usually tip 20% if the service is good. That usually goes for anything that might require a tip. If the service is awful, well. That depends.

I've worked in customer service before though, so I have a good idea of what customers can be like. :)

[MissMoonchild]

We always over tip but it's because I worked as a waitress for several years in a crap diner where old people would order a cup of coffee, expect you to keep it topped off for hours, then tip you 32 cents. (change after paying for the cup of coffee with a dollar)

One thing that my husband and I always do is if the service is especially good, like the waiter or waitress was really exceptional, we speak with the manager about it. Too many people are quick to bitch to a manager about bad service but not nearly enough people will say something if they get really good service. This has resulted in waiters and waitresses wondering why (with hurt looks on their faces) we're talking to their manager after giving us great service. I'm sure they were thrilled when they found out after we left. hehe

[RubySlippers]

I decided to keep my tipping simple for a service with a fee where tipping is expected or restaurant checks (based on the menue price of items if I use a coupon or discount, not including taxes) a flat to the penny 8% which is the global average including the Canada and USA at 15%. For all other services not with a fee or check 50 Cents (bathroom attendants, maids, bellhops or whatever).

There nice and simple if my check for food is $5.99 I leave a fair 48 Cents including pennies.

I figure any other money for their work should be in the fee or covered by their employer that is fair since I'm only paying a gratuity for the service and I think that is worth 8%. But if I get a drink from the bar I get that myself tipping 8% for the drink seperately.

[Will]

Maybe you're onto something.  Maybe we should calculate the global average for total annual income and just pay that to everyone.  Then we wouldn't have internet, and we wouldn't have this argument to make.  Problem solved.

[TheGlyphstone]

Maybe you're onto something.  Maybe we should calculate the global average for total annual income and just pay that to everyone.  Then we wouldn't have internet, and we wouldn't have this argument to make.  Problem solved.

Good idea. Let's calculate the global average calorie intake as well and limit everyone to eating that much per day. Then we'll all be heavily malnutritioned or dead, and having internet or not is irrelevant.

[Beguile's Mistress]

If you don't tip because you can't afford the money I hope your situation improves.

If you refuse to tip because you don't want to spend the money I hope you don't expect a 'thank you' or appreciation of any kind for doing your job.  After all, you get a pay check and appreciation or any other type of considration from your employer is not warranted. 

I'm sure that if they do say thank you or show appreciation you turn right around and tell them to shove it and put the thanks in your paycheck.  Right?  You remind them that you work for them for money and not appreciation.  Right? 

[Torch]

But if I get a drink from the bar I get that myself tipping 8% for the drink seperately.

Tipping a bartender anything less than $1 per round is just plain rude. I've seen bartenders flip a quarter back at the customer (which is what your measly 8% tip would be on a $3.00 beer).

If you are that poor, buy a six pack and drink it at home. Seriously. If you cannot treat servers with respect, don't eat out.

[Gadifriald]

Me, I live in the capital of tipping here in Las Vegas and thought I'd add a few words to the discussion. There is definitely an etiquette to tipping and the main thrust of that etiquette is that tipping is done to show appreciation to someone who provides you a service! Those tipping jars at the Starbucks counter are ridiculous but slipping your coin change into one after paying for your coffee is a nice thing to do. However you should ALWAYS tip a cocktail waitress/server and your waiter/waitress when you have table service at a restaurant!
If say you're at a casino or a show or a club where the cocktail servers make the rounds always tip at least a dollar a drink and in Vegas where the drinks are free when you gamble the etiquette is the drink is free but the server gets a dollar per drink if you're in a group or two dollars if you're by yourself...those ladies are on their feet constantly after all! Table service tipping really isn't about complex mathematical formulas but about being fair and generous and the more a server busts their butt and the friendlier they are the more generous you should be. Me I never leave less than $3 for a meal and give $5 or more if the server was friendly and attentive and fast and of course as the bill goes higher in dollar terms so does the tip!
Bar servers are another category all their own and it's all about how long you're there and what you order/they gotta bring to you. If you have a couple of drinks a couple of bucks is fine but if your server has to bring you both food and drinks and serves you for hours on end because you're in a place all night $5 or $10 when you settle the bill will be much appreciated! Bartenders are another category and I go with the keep the change method if paying by the round (drinks are $8.75 you give em $10.00 and say keep the change) and if running a tab I'll use the same method and usually toss in a couple extra bucks as well.
I won't go into the whole valets and bellhops and room service and dealers and delivery driver tipping etiquette but the whole thing with tipping is to be fair and generous and have some class when out on the town or when having food delivered to your room or home!
Edit to add a quick note: Tips should also generally be given in cash even if you pay with a credit card, debit card or check!

[meikle]

There is something weird about someone who admits to living by the generosity of others fighting so hard against the idea of being generous to others.

[Silverfyre]

There is something weird about someone who admits to living by the generosity of others fighting so hard against the idea of being generous to others.

+1

Weird and almost ironic.

[TheGlyphstone]

Not unthinkable though - I know someone who was homeless once who flatly refuses to give any homeless/street person so much as a penny, on the grounds that because he was able to use the support system to lift himself out of poverty without taking handouts, so can they. I can follow the logic train, even if I can't condone it in any way.

[didoanna]

I always try and tip after a meal.  I tend to use the same restaurants anyway so the staff get to know you and you get to know the staff.

Also, I tend to drop off a couple of boxes of chocolates for the staff at Christmas and at Easter so hopefully they know that I appreciate them.

[Oreo]

I always try and tip after a meal.  I tend to use the same restaurants anyway so the staff get to know you and you get to know the staff.

Also, I tend to drop off a couple of boxes of chocolates for the staff at Christmas and at Easter so hopefully they know that I appreciate them.

That gesture would have gone a long way with me back in the day. It's true about returning customers too, there was a closer feel and familiarity.

[Chelemar]

When I was a waitress, about 20 years ago, min. wage for waitresses was $2.01 per hour.  My bosses believed that everyone would eat regardless, so they also took a quarter an hour for food.  We could eat whatever we wanted, except for steak. 

So, I made $1.76 cents an hour.  Plus tips.  Now, some days were good and in an 8 hour shift I could make $50.00.  But, I also had bad days where there was little traffic, and would make $5.00. for the whole day.  The good days had to carry the bad so that it would even out to a minimum wage of around $4.00 an hour.

I spoke with a waitress about a week ago.  Minimum wage for waitresses (tipped employees) is now $2.83 an hour.  While Minimum wage for all other employees is $7.25 an hour.  From $2.01 to $2.83.  An $.83 cent raise.  And there are those who begrudge a tip. 

If the food is bad, it's not the server's fault.  It's the cook's.  Do tell the server so that he/she might take the food back to the kitchen, but judge the server on his or her promptness, attention, and service to you.  The food is the responsibility of the kitchen.  The cook makes at least minimum wage, and most likely more.

Thanks for reading. :)

[Reagan]

Like others, I've worked in service so I'm inclined to be generous.  In the UK wait staff get the same minimum wage as everyone else but it's diabolical; £5.93 (for over 21s) and in the UK we pay more back in income tax, council tax and national insurance contributions so our deductions are a lot more than in many other countries.  In addition, meal breaks are unpaid and the legal minimums for down time over long shifts are ridiculous.  If you work 6hrs you get no breaks.  6-12hrs you get between 20 and 40 minutes.  Aside from the physical demands from the job, having such short breaks from people getting in your face and demanding things every 30secs makes the job very stressful.

Then there's the 'customer is always right' mentality.  There are always going to be people who raise hell over petty mistakes because they want a refund or something for free.  Sadly, the deeper the global recession gets, the more asshole customers there are.  People will find fault with anything these days.  People have less money with which to eat out and so they get miserly with it, bitching about every item on their receipt and leaving tips that require a microscope to locate on the table.  I have seen people getting positively gleeful about poor service or incorrect food, because suddenly they have a legitimate reason to summon a manager and demand that items be removed from their bill.

I think that good service should be rewarded and that bad service should be taken in context.  If a place is packed and a server is clearly overwhelmed, the fault lies with the management for not ensuring there are enough staff.  I also know from experience that it only takes one person to call in sick on a busy day to screw an entire shift over, resulting in multiple refunds/complaints and fewer tips for staff that are already in fact working above and beyond but are simply too short-handed to make you feel special.

Mistakes with food orders are just as likely to be the kitchen staff's fault as the server's, so discretion should be used when complaining.  Poorly prepared or cold food is not your waiter's fault, unless they've really been dragging their feet.  Company policy regarding what a waiter can and cannot do in order to rectify things is also not their fault.  If you're still not happy, grow some stones and ask for a manager, don't just stand there berating the poor person at the bottom of the totem pole because you know they have to be polite and it makes you feel vindicated. 

Also, in the UK when paying buy card there is often an option to add a gratuity to the transaction.  This should be avoided because employers then charge a 'handling fee' and help themselves to a percentage of their wait staff's tips.  In some places the staff never see the money.  It either goes towards their minimum wage or gets set aside compulsorily for things like a party at Christmas or other non-monetary ways of ripping them off.

Tipping is kind of strange here in Blighty.  Nobody tips in bars, clubs or places that are self-serve, regardless of how many people are running around clearing.  In restaurants the standard is 10-15%.  People's views on tipping can be quite diverse as wait staff do get the same minimum wage as everyone else.  Some people will tip 20% and others will only leave pocket change.  People are more arbitrary about poor service here, as might be expected but there's less emphasis on rewarding exceptional service, other than with future custom.  Service industries here are rather lacklustre compared with the states (with my own visits to NYC and LA anyway) and also compared with the continent, where service professions have less of a stigma and waiters are paid better and treated with more respect.

[Caela]

If you don't tip because you can't afford the money I hope your situation improves.

If you refuse to tip because you don't want to spend the money I hope you don't expect a 'thank you' or appreciation of any kind for doing your job.  After all, you get a pay check and appreciation or any other type of considration from your employer is not warranted. 

I'm sure that if they do say thank you or show appreciation you turn right around and tell them to shove it and put the thanks in your paycheck.  Right?  You remind them that you work for them for money and not appreciation.  Right?

I know you meant a good chunk of this as sarcasm, but I do actually agree with it partially. If you are just showing up and doing your job then you really shouldn't be expecting your boss to say "thank you". You're doing what's expected of you. If they do offer their thanks then it should simply be appreciated that they noticed. IF you go above and beyond, then yes the boss should say something but other than that you are doing the job you were hired to do and your check is your reimbursement for your time, thank is nice but shouldn't be expected.

I apply this to tipping as well. If you're barely doing your job, or not doing it well (ignoring our table, food coming out cold etc.) and there's no good reason for it - oddly I seem to get the worst service when a place is slow and the waitstaff just doesn't feel like putting much effort into it - then you are not going to get a 20% tip. I'm not going to show appreciation when you are doing the absolute bare minimum that can be done and still say you're doing your job. If you go above and beyond, as in my example before of great service I've gotten, then you're work WILL be noticed and appreciated and your tip will reflect that.

I'm not going to give you a great tip just because I made you stop flirting with the bartender to bring me my food.

*** You, is a generic you, not meant to anyone in particular. ***

[ShrowdedPoet]

I work in the restaurant business.  I've served and hosted.  Our servers make $2.50 an hour and never pick their checks up because they're always $0.  I've seen girls with families to care for dead on their feet from working 7 doubles a week (That's all day every day people!) in 6 or more table sections because they had to pay the rent.  I've seen girls cry because they worked their asses off and didn't even receive a small tip.  This is because that tip. . .that's their wage.  That's all they get.  And they get 3 or better % taken out of their total sales and given to the kitchen and other floor staff.  It sucks.  If you have 6 tables that seat the max people in Gusano's then you're serving 26 people all at once.  26 drinks, 26 plates, 26 personalities.  26 possible orders.  And some of the 6 table sections have 28 chairs.  And then there are our lounges that have about 12 tables per server each seating at least 4 people.  Servers have to greet you, get your drink order, get your salad order, get your appetizer order, get your entree order, get your desert order, put those in the computer, run the food, make the salads, pour the drinks, bring the plate, refill the drinks, and cater to your every whim while juggling all the other tables.  It's fucking hard!  And hosts while they usually make fairly decent wages. . .they work their asses off and get treated fairly poorly by everyone.  Restaurant jobs are hard and people are heartless!  I always tip at least 20% or more!  Always! 

[Caela]

I work in the restaurant business.  I've served and hosted.  Our servers make $2.50 an hour and never pick their checks up because they're always $0.  I've seen girls with families to care for dead on their feet from working 7 doubles a week (That's all day every day people!) in 6 or more table sections because they had to pay the rent.  I've seen girls cry because they worked their asses off and didn't even receive a small tip.  This is because that tip. . .that's their wage.  That's all they get.  And they get 3 or better % taken out of their total sales and given to the kitchen and other floor staff.  It sucks.  If you have 6 tables that seat the max people in Gusano's then you're serving 26 people all at once.  26 drinks, 26 plates, 26 personalities.  26 possible orders.  And some of the 6 table sections have 28 chairs.  And then there are our lounges that have about 12 tables per server each seating at least 4 people.  Servers have to greet you, get your drink order, get your salad order, get your appetizer order, get your entree order, get your desert order, put those in the computer, run the food, make the salads, pour the drinks, bring the plate, refill the drinks, and cater to your every whim while juggling all the other tables.  It's fucking hard!  And hosts while they usually make fairly decent wages. . .they work their asses off and get treated fairly poorly by everyone.  Restaurant jobs are hard and people are heartless!  I always tip at least 20% or more!  Always!

You're right, if a place is busy it is damned HARD work and I make allowances for that. In a packed restaurant I will tip better because I recognize that the servers are busting ass. As I said before, my worst service has never been when a restaurant was packed though. If I go in and there are only like three tables (including mine) and none of them are full, I damned well expect to be treated better than as if I am just another annoyance in a persons life. Especially when I'm the only table a server is working and the rest of the time she is chatting up the bartender. Yes, I've gotten cold food not because my server was busy with other tables, but because she was too busy chatting up a co-worker to get off her ass and go get my food from the kitchen. When a place isn't busy this is unacceptable.

On the flip side, I went to dinner with my local munch group last night and we almost always have the same server. Crazy as we are he actually requests to be in the private room on our nights to come in. We had a larger than normal group last night and he busted his butt off, taking orders as people came in at differing times, keeping drinks filled, finding time to chat and joke with us etc. Because we're a large group the restaurant automatically adds an 18% tip on onto our bills and a good 90% of us bring in extra cash specifically to put in the little folders to add to that tip. There are nights he's gotten 40-50% tips from some of us easily.

It's called a gratuity for a reason, it's meant to show gratitude. I don't show gratitude when the cute bartender is more important than doing your job but will show it in spades when even a little effort is put forth.

[Oniya]

On the flip side, I went to dinner with my local munch group last night and we almost always have the same server. Crazy as we are he actually requests to be in the private room on our nights to come in. We had a larger than normal group last night and he busted his butt off, taking orders as people came in at differing times, keeping drinks filled, finding time to chat and joke with us etc. Because we're a large group the restaurant automatically adds an 18% tip on onto our bills and a good 90% of us bring in extra cash specifically to put in the little folders to add to that tip. There are nights he's gotten 40-50% tips from some of us easily.

You're surprised that he requests to be your server?  This is why our gaming group ended up with our own 'personal' Chinese Food Man. 

[Caela]

You're surprised that he requests to be your server?  This is why our gaming group ended up with our own 'personal' Chinese Food Man.

lol...With the tips we give him, no not surprised. Though he does earn them believe me. Since we're in a private room we don't censor our conversations and he comes walking in at some rather inopportune moment's at times. Also we do pick on him a bit. He's much the cutey and the first night he was out server we were really rambunctious. We tried to apologize a bit but he just laughed and told us to "bring it". Ever since we've spared him nothing and out conversations range from politics to work to kid to whatever kinkyness is on going on the next weekend.

Last night one of the girls was being a bit loud and (as he's walking out the door but he wasn't quite out it) she made the comment that she'd like to tie him up and there was really not enough people in the room to stop him from hearing it. Later one of the guys asked if he'd heard what she said and he laughed it off while she blushed furiously and looked mortified that he'd heard. Trust me, the boy earns every penny we give him.

[Beguile's Mistress]

I like that.  First, you all treat him as part of the group even though he's there to serve you.  It's so much better than being treated like someone who is there to serve you and nothing else.  He is great because he makes you all feel comfortable around him.  You come back and more people join you and that's great for business.  It's a truly great relationship.

[Caela]

I like that.  First, you all treat him as part of the group even though he's there to serve you.  It's so much better than being treated like someone who is there to serve you and nothing else.  He is great because he makes you all feel comfortable around him.  You come back and more people join you and that's great for business.  It's a truly great relationship.

It really is. The couple of times he hasn't been there with us we ask the server we do get where he is, and make sure he's o.k. He's a sort of unofficial member of the Munch group and has even talked about taking a night off sometime and actually just coming to a Munch as a participant. Cutey that he is, most of us hope he actually does sometime...though there is no doubt the teasing will be over the top but he has told us, more than once, that we can't scare him lol. It just makes us try harder!

[TheGlyphstone]

What's a Munch?

[Oniya]

Typically it's a get-together/meetup at a restaurant, centered around a certain interest group (BDSM and Poly-folk frequently have them, which would explain the flirting and potential of 'scaring' him)

[Gadifriald]

I work in the restaurant business.  I've served and hosted.  Our servers make $2.50 an hour and never pick their checks up because they're always $0.

I really feel for servers who work in states where they have that rediculous Tip-Earner Wage which allows servers to be hosed by their employers who get to pay them less than minumum wage! Here in Nevada servers are garaunteed minimum wage like everyone else, which is only fair and probably the reason all the best servers move to Vegas! :-)

[Caela]

Typically it's a get-together/meetup at a restaurant, centered around a certain interest group (BDSM and Poly-folk frequently have them, which would explain the flirting and potential of 'scaring' him)

Ours is a BDSM Group though we have a number of poly people within our group. And you're right, it does explain the potential for scaring him but he takes it all in stride lol.

[TheGlyphstone]

Just a chat/discussion group then - won't lie, when you said he had considered coming as a participant, my mind immediately did a 20-meter swan dive straight into the gutter (though mainly because I thought you had written "post-Munch group" somewhere, as if the 'Munch' was what you did before going to the restaurant).

[Caela]

Just a chat/discussion group then - won't lie, when you said he had considered coming as a participant, my mind immediately did a 20-meter swan dive straight into the gutter (though mainly because I thought you had written "post-Munch group" somewhere, as if the 'Munch' was what you did before going to the restaurant).

LMAO...yeah just a chat/discussion group. It gives people who are new to BDSM a safe place to come and talk to other kinksters in a non-threatening, non-intimidating, environment and those of us that have been around awhile a chance to just get together with friends, have dinner, talk about anything. There's a core group of us that are at almost every Munch and our talks range over a variety of topics from the utterly mundane to the wicked and dirty. Nothing dirty actually happens AT the Munch but what you do when you go home is up to you lol.

[tsc]

I've never worked in the service industry, but both my brothers and quite a few of my friends have, and my Dad has as well.  I usually tip about 20%, more if the service was exceptional, less if it was poor. 

My first wife and I ate out almost every weeknight -- since I worked the day shift and she worked nights, it was just easier.  As a result, we got to know the staff at our favorite restaurants very well, and they'd often do things like give us free drinks or a free dessert.  Some of them liked us well enough to come by our table and sit down for a bit to talk to us!

When we were given free stuff, we'd tip as if the bill had included the stuff -- after all, just because the drinks were free didn't mean that wait staff spent any effort bringing them, refilling them, etc.  At the one place we went to the most, even the managers knew us, and sometimes they'd give us our whole meal free!

I don't eat out nearly that much any more, but I get lunch out fairly regularly, and the regular staff at my favorite places know me and stop by to say hi, ask how I'm doing, etc.  I think part of it is the tips, and part is just that I'm friendly, smiling, etc.