New game makes my PC overheat...

[Beorning]

So, here's a question for all you people savvy with making PC games work...

One of the presents I got for Christmas was a new PC RPG, Tyranny. I tried playing it yesterday and I noticed something troublesome: the game makes my PC overheat. Seriously, after only a few minutes of playing, the CPU temperature went from 40 C to 80 C...

Initially, I thought it was a matter of me running the game with the highest graphics settings. See, another present I got for Christmas was a new monitor with default resolution of 1920 x 1080. When I ran the game, it automatically conformed to the monitor and set its resolution to 1920 x 1080, too. So, at first I thought: sure, I'll just downscale the graphics quality and the game will play okay.

It... didn't help.

Seriously: I set the graphics to 1280 x 720, the lowest setting possible. I also lowered the FPS rate to 60. And it doesn't help! The PC keeps overheating.

For the record, my PC is Intel Core i5 2300 (2.80 GHz), 4 GB RAM, Radeon HD 6700 graphics card. The game's minimum systems requirements are Intel Core 2 Quad Q9505 (2.80 GHz), 4 GB RAM, Radeon HD 5770. The recommended system is Intel Core i3-2100 (3.10 GHz), 4 GB RAM, Radeon HD 6850. So, it seems to me that the game should run without much trouble... And yet, it seems to overtax my PC. What the heck?

Any ideas on how to solve this problem?

[The Dark Raven]

Honestly, I would say you need more memory and a better graphics card.  The game wants 4gb, but your 4gb has to run everything else on your system as well.  The graphics card upgrade would be helpful to lower the chug on your system when the game is rendering, which is probably what is making your card/system thrash.

[AmberStarfire]

My guess would be that you have a graphics card good enough to run it, but a power supply that isn't adequately supporting the graphics card. I had a similar problem playing a game on a laptop of mine in the past (it had a good graphics card, but it took about 30 seconds to overheat).

Maybe there's an additional way to cool your computer down? (or maybe there's another problem that is causing it to cool insufficiently).

[Cassandra LeMay]

My guess would be that you have a graphics card good enough to run it, but a power supply that isn't adequately supporting the graphics card. I had a similar problem playing a game on a laptop of mine in the past (it had a good graphics card, but it took about 30 seconds to overheat).

I have a similar problem with my computer. It handles everything fine - until I start playing games on it. And I know my graphics card isn't connected to the power supply as well as it could be. When I got my current graphics card installed there wasn't quite the right cable at hand to connect it as it should have been, so it was cobbled together a bit (and please don't ask me for details - it was a long time ago in a cable salad no man has seen before).

Long story short: I think it could, indeed well be a hardware thingy about the power supply. Could be as simple as rerouting a few cables, but I wouldn't know how.

[Beorning]

Hm. The PC has no trouble running other games, including Skyrim. I really don't think it's the power supply problem...

If it's about the graphics card and / or memory not being good enough - drat. I don't have money to upgrade my PC right now... So, I'm stuck with a game I can't run? :(

[AmberStarfire]

Skyrim's fairly old at this stage, so there may be big differences there.

What operating system are you running it under? Maybe it's possible to free up some memory and minimise features on the game so that it doesn't need as much. Is it just a matter of viewing quality with the game or can you personalise different features that are graphics intensive?

[Beorning]

I'm running the game under Windows 7...

As for the graphics features, there aren't that many options. There's resolution, the anti-aliasing thing, V-Sync, FPS rate... I think that I set everything as low as possible - the game still causes problems, though...

[AmberStarfire]

Have you tried running it in safe mode + networking?

If there's something else interfering with it or hogging the memory, you might have more luck with that.

[Beorning]

Could you remind me how do I do that on Windows 7?

[AmberStarfire]

There are directions here:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2851718/windows-8-and-windows-7-safe-modes-how-to-enter-and-when-to-use-them.html

[Life in Color]

If it's overheating, it could also just be a cooling problem (Sometimes the obvious solution can be a fix!).

What's your cooling system set-up like?

[The Dark Raven]

If it's overheating, it could also just be a cooling problem (Sometimes the obvious solution can be a fix!).

What's your cooling system set-up like?

This reminds me...have you blown out your fans lately?  Canned air is cheaper than a graphics card upgrade. ;)

[Beorning]

Hmm. I have no idea how my cooling system is set up... What do you mean, exactly?

I realize that, maybe, cleaning the fans might be needed... Somehow, though, I feel it won't be enough :(

I asked about the situation at the game producer's forum and got the surprising info: supposedly, the minimum memory for this game is 6 GB, not 4 GB. Even though it's 4 GB in the official requirements... Not fun :(

[RedPhoenix]

I don't know anything about gaming and graphic cards, but I do have a lot of experience trying to run stuff on old computers, and I can tell you that minimum system requirement usually translates to "you might be able to open the program." If you're 2GB under the minimum, yeah, you're in pipe dream territory. Memory is one of the cheaper things to get more of though, and really easy to install. You might wanna reattach your heat sink while you do it if it's an older model, but I suspect memory is your real culprit.

[Beorning]

Well, if I'm really 2 GB under the minimum, then it's obvious that the game could not be running properly. The thing is, according to the official requirements, I should have enough memory. I wouldn't even consider buying this game, if it wasn't the case...

[Blythe]

The minimum memory to run the PC game Tyranny is 6 GB; I checked the official Steam store page of it to confirm that. The recommended memory is 8 GB, though. If your computer has only got 4 GB, the game's not going to run right, if at all.

[Beorning]

Well, another official page for the game says otherwise:

https://www.paradoxplaza.com/tyranny

So, does the producer not know what the actual system requirements are? *groan*

[Inkidu]

Well, another official page for the game says otherwise:

https://www.paradoxplaza.com/tyranny

So, does the producer not know what the actual system requirements are? *groan*

Well you've got two options:

Upgrade your PC with about four gigs of ram (RAM's cheap).

If you got the game through Steam, request a refund.

[Beorning]

Unfortunately, I've got the game on DVD through a stationary shop. And they don't want the game back, as it's been opened! :(

Regarding the upgrade: 4 GB RAM would cost $40, I don't have that money now... Drat.

[AmberStarfire]

If it says 4GB on the box but other places say 6GB (and 4 simply won't run it), you could contact their customer support about it and explain the situation. They could perhaps send you another game in is place that you could play if your query is escalated enough (to someone who'll do something).

[Beorning]

I've been talking to various customer support services regarding this game... So far:

1. The CS at Paradox (the game's original publisher / manufacturer) forum says that 6 GB is the memory minimum. Also, he advices cleaning the cooling fans.

2. The CS at Cenega (the game's Polish publisher) says 2 GB of memory is not that big difference (huh?). Also, he advices cleaning the fans... He says that the PC shouldn't be overheating because of not enough memory.

2. The CS at Empik (the shop the game has been actually bought at) says that if the game box is opened, they won't take the game back. Even in the case of system requirements description on the game box being inaccurate...

What's your opinion, guys? Could the memory be a problem? Also, how one goes about buying and installing more memory..?

[AmberStarfire]

I'd constructively hassle Paradox a bit more, personally.

2GB RAM probably would make a difference. If the game's not running then there's a good chance that's why.

As for RAM, if you want to 'build on' what RAM you have, don't buy 2GB. You need to buy another 4GB and keep the chips the same (or just buy 8 and change it over, though buying 4GB and adding to it may be cheaper).  If the chips aren't equivalent you're likely to run into problems.

That was a really old link I posted. Here's a more recent one:
http://www.howtogeek.com/199070/would-using-unequal-amounts-of-ram-in-each-slot-decrease-performance/

[Inkidu]

I've been talking to various customer support services regarding this game... So far:

1. The CS at Paradox (the game's original publisher / manufacturer) forum says that 6 GB is the memory minimum. Also, he advices cleaning the cooling fans.

2. The CS at Cenega (the game's Polish publisher) says 2 GB of memory is not that big difference (huh?). Also, he advices cleaning the fans... He says that the PC shouldn't be overheating because of not enough memory.

2. The CS at Empik (the shop the game has been actually bought at) says that if the game box is opened, they won't take the game back. Even in the case of system requirements description on the game box being inaccurate...

What's your opinion, guys? Could the memory be a problem? Also, how one goes about buying and installing more memory..?

I'd actually demand your money back from the shop or Paradox. I'm not sure about how Polish law works, but I'm willing to bet that the nation has false-advertising laws.

Part of your purchase was contingent upon the system requirements (ie. Can I play it?). If the box was misleading and you can't in fact use the product as intended I'd call that grounds for a refund. There's a difference between buyer beware and we're going to outright have bad information that informs your purchasing decision.

[RedPhoenix]

What's your opinion, guys? Could the memory be a problem? Also, how one goes about buying and installing more memory..?

It will seem very simple to you once you've done it. The main thing is making sure the sticks you get will fit on your motherboard before you buy them.

http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/how-to-install-ram/ Here's a tutorial that is actually more in depth than it needs to be and is only a few minutes.

You can buy ram all over, newegg is a good site for parts, amazon sometimes has deals on it, I don't know if anywhere local would do it better where you are.

[Blythe]

I'd actually demand your money back from the shop or Paradox. I'm not sure about how Polish law works, but I'm willing to bet that the nation has false-advertising laws.

Part of your purchase was contingent upon the system requirements (ie. Can I play it?). If the box was misleading and you can't in fact use the product as intended I'd call that grounds for a refund. There's a difference between buyer beware and we're going to outright have bad information that informs your purchasing decision.

I'm with Inkidu about this; the fact two official sources list different information really is a problem.

While I don't know if it'll help future potential purchasers of the game, I've poked Paradox via a support ticket about the conflicting requirements and asked them to clarify & fix whichever page is wrong, their paradox one or the Steam one.

[Oniya]

There's a simple reason that low memory might cause a computer to heat up:  There's a trick called 'Virtual Memory' where a computer uses part of its storage space to hold the things that are normally held in RAM.  When this is over-taxed (as it would be if it's picking up 2-4G of slack on a highly interactive program like a video game), your computer has to access the disk drive a lot.  This is sometimes called 'thrashing'.  This generates extra heat (it's still a physical thing turning, like a CD player, so there is a certain amount of friction.)

[Life in Color]

Hmm. I have no idea how my cooling system is set up... What do you mean, exactly?

Does your graphics card have a dedicated cooling source? Are your fans clean? What's the overall temperature of your case?

That sort of thing. <3

[Beorning]

Does your graphics card have a dedicated cooling source? Are your fans clean? What's the overall temperature of your case?

That sort of thing. <3

Well, the graphics card does have it's own fans (at least one, I think). Are the fans cleans? I don't know, I'll try cleaning them tomorrow. As for the overall temperature, hmmm... the average temperature of the CPU is around 40 - 50 C, usually. I don't have any way of measuring the temperature on the graphics card or in other places inside the PC case...

Do you guys think I should try getting a refund? As I mentioned, I already contacted the shop, but their policy for game is "We don't accept returns of opened games"...

[Beorning]

An update: I cleaned the fans on the CPU and the graphics card as good as I could. Then, I tried running Tyranny again... and there's no difference. Even in the lowest resolution mode, the game overheats the PC in a minute or so.

Also, the guys at the Paradox forum admitted that the technical specs for the game on their site were outdated.  ::)

[Inkidu]

An update: I cleaned the fans on the CPU and the graphics card as good as I could. Then, I tried running Tyranny again... and there's no difference. Even in the lowest resolution mode, the game overheats the PC in a minute or so.

Also, the guys at the Paradox forum admitted that the technical specs for the game on their site were outdated.  ::)

I'd keep insisting that I get reimbursed somehow for the game. You paid good money based on the system specs, and they turned out to be inaccurate. That's not cool. They should have some way of making amends.

[Beorning]

Maybe I could convince them to pay for the necessary memory chips...  ;D

[Inkidu]

They owe you something. I mean would it really kill them to give you some kind of voucher for an equivalent amount on another Paradox published game?

[AmberStarfire]

They owe you something. I mean would it really kill them to give you some kind of voucher for an equivalent amount on another Paradox published game?

I agree. They make computer games. It would cost them very little to even give you an online copy of something to make up for the fact you couldn't run a game of theirs you paid for based on incorrect specs they had published on the box (if I'm reading that right?).

[The Dark Raven]

I've been talking to various customer support services regarding this game... So far:

1. The CS at Paradox (the game's original publisher / manufacturer) forum says that 6 GB is the memory minimum. Also, he advices cleaning the cooling fans.

2. The CS at Cenega (the game's Polish publisher) says 2 GB of memory is not that big difference (huh?). Also, he advices cleaning the fans... He says that the PC shouldn't be overheating because of not enough memory.

2. The CS at Empik (the shop the game has been actually bought at) says that if the game box is opened, they won't take the game back. Even in the case of system requirements description on the game box being inaccurate...

What's your opinion, guys? Could the memory be a problem? Also, how one goes about buying and installing more memory..?

My opinion is that the Cenega guy has no clue what he's talking about.  2 GB of RAM is a huge deal and a computer can fry running overheated like that (I've done it).  If the original publisher says 6 GB is the minimum spec, that's the minimum.  They built the game after all, and should know.

[Beorning]

I agree that the Cenega guy seems quite ignorant.  >:( No big difference betwen 4 GB and 6 GB? Right...

As for the voucher, I would prefer *not* to get something like that in return, as I don't plan on buying any more games right now... I don't need *any* game, I need this particular game. If I can't run it, I'd like my money back... or some memory chips so that I *could* run this game.

Anyway, I'll be pestering both Paradox and Cenega. Paradox gave the wrong specs on their website, while Cenega printed the wrong specs on the Polish game box. One of these publishers really needs to take responsibility for the error...

BTW. Regarding installing more memory - I understand that the new chips should be of the same type (DDR3) and the same capacity (2 GB) as the chips already in place. But what about speed / frequency? I've seen on the web that the current chips might be 1333 Mhz, 1600 Mhz, 1860 Mhz... meanwhile, the chips in my PC are about 600 Mhz (my PC is a few years old). So, what chips should I buy?

[Blythe]

Paradox got back to me about the page of theirs that displayed the 4 GB requirement--I'd emailed them with the link Beorning had and the link from the official Steam page, which had listed different requirements:

Christian Arvidsson (Paradox Interactive)
Jan 3, 08:08 CET

Hey there!

Thank you for the headsup! It seems our page contained the old requirements for the game and we missed updating them once it was released. This has now been corrected :).

Kind regards,

Christian

Looks like at one point the requirements were 4 GB, but it was raised to 6 after release. They mention the wrong page should be fixed now to show the correct specs.

[RedPhoenix]

The speed is limited by the processor. Check what speed your processor supports, there's no reason to go higher than that. It shouldn't affect what you can install, unless I'm picturing totally the wrong thing.

[Beorning]

Paradox got back to me about the page of theirs that displayed the 4 GB requirement--I'd emailed them with the link Beorning had and the link from the official Steam page, which had listed different requirements:

Looks like at one point the requirements were 4 GB, but it was raised to 6 after release. They mention the wrong page should be fixed now to show the correct specs.

Thanks! That's interesting...

The speed is limited by the processor. Check what speed your processor supports, there's no reason to go higher than that. It shouldn't affect what you can install, unless I'm picturing totally the wrong thing.

Hm. And how do I check that?

[RedPhoenix]

If you just google your processor the manufacturer page should tell you its specs.

[Beorning]

The processor or the mainboard?

Meanwhile, the conversation at the Paradox forum continues. The Paradox guy there posted that the lack of 2 GB of memory could be "a minor contribution at best" when it comes to overheating and advised me to clean the air vents at my PC. Or seek the professional assistance, as I might have a thermal paste problem.

Uhm... I actually cleaned the PC thoroughly yesterday. Also, I tried running other games and they don't cause overheating... Technical problem? Don't think so, personally...

[Inkidu]

The processor or the mainboard?

Meanwhile, the conversation at the Paradox forum continues. The Paradox guy there posted that the lack of 2 GB of memory could be "a minor contribution at best" when it comes to overheating and advised me to clean the air vents at my PC. Or seek the professional assistance, as I might have a thermal paste problem.

Uhm... I actually cleaned the PC thoroughly yesterday. Also, I tried running other games and they don't cause overheating... Technical problem? Don't think so, personally...

It's not minor. My new comp has 12 gigs, and I would not try to run something with the minimum requirements called for fourteen. I'd honestly start testing the guy with a combination of made up and tech questions I'd know the answer to, just to see if he actually is a tech person.

[Beorning]

Weirdly enough, another Paradox guy joined the conversation and he says that the memory shouldn't be a problem, either.

BTW. Could old graphics drivers be the cause? The second guy looked at my DxDiag report and said that everything's fine aside from the old drivers...

BTW 2. Yesterday I tried running Skyrim to see if it overheats my PC. It doesn't, but there's something wrong with graphics - the image flashes and displays weirdly, as if there were some sort of computing errors... A few years ago the game was running okay.

[AmberStarfire]

Do you have an onboard graphics card working on conjunction with your Radeon one? I think the onboard one is usually disabled when you're using a regular graphics card, but maybe you have both trying to run at the same time or there's a conflict there. I'm fairly sure they should've been able to tell that off your dxdiag though.

[Beorning]

Hm. I don't think I have any onboard graphics card... I certainly can't find it through the Windows device manager.

I have a question: I tried downloading the newest graphics drivers from AMD and I found out that my card's drivers are not longer being supported. There's only a "Beta" driver from a year ago and and "WHQL certified" driver from 2015. Any idea what does it mean? Are "beta" drivers okay to use, or are they unfinished / unstable?

[AmberStarfire]

I really don't know. Maybe the beta ones have something to do with the release of Windows 10? (Unless it specifically says it's for 7). Maybe they had problems and brought out the beta to compensate for them?

You could try both and see if they work better.

[Beorning]

So, I updated the drivers. It did solve the problem with Skyrim I mentioned above, but the Tyranny heat issue persists...

[Inkidu]

So, I updated the drivers. It did solve the problem with Skyrim I mentioned above, but the Tyranny heat issue persists...

That's because two whole gigs of RAM is a big deal.

[The Dark Raven]

That's because two whole gigs of RAM is a big deal.

+1

If Skyrim's issue is fixed with the update, it's not a driver issue.  If you had a thermal paste issue with your mb, -everything- would be messed up/unstable.  If their product page is saying 6gb RAM is needed, it really is.  I have always taken their recommended specs as minimum specs because "minimum" specs are just a lie, pretty much in general, especially when it comes to RAM/processor.  The only thing that I fudge is how up to date my graphics card is.

[Beorning]

Yeah, I suspect that I had a cooling problem, the PC would overheat with other games too, right? Meanwhile, it only heats up somewhat when browsing some animation-intensive sites. For some reason, Photobucket tends of heat my PC a lot... But games? Games aren't a problem at all...

[The Dark Raven]

Yeah, I suspect that I had a cooling problem, the PC would overheat with other games too, right? Meanwhile, it only heats up somewhat when browsing some animation-intensive sites. For some reason, Photobucket tends of heat my PC a lot... But games? Games aren't a problem at all...

If you had a cooling problem, just running things like the internet would overheat your computer.  Photobucket might because it can be graphic intensive.  Same with render-heavy games.

[RedPhoenix]

when you say "heats up" how hot are we talking?

[AmberStarfire]

Hot enough to fry eggs on?  :P

[Beorning]

Hot enough to fry eggs on?  :P

Exactly. 80 C after a few minutes of playing...

[Oniya]

Exactly. 80 C after a few minutes of playing...

And what kind of processor do you have?  (There are a couple that are known to run hot, but that sounds excessive for most.)

[Beorning]

I have Intel i5. It usually stays around 40 - 60 C.

[Oniya]

I have Intel i5. It usually stays around 40 - 60 C.

Yeah, that's where that processor is supposed to be.  Keeping the fans clean is good overall maintenance, but it really shouldn't be hitting 80C.

[mia h]

Keeping the fans clean is good overall maintenance, but it really shouldn't be hitting 80C.

Popping the cover off you PC and giving it a decent vac, once in a while never hurts. The amount of dust that gets inside can be horrific, particularly if you've lots of fans.
Just need to be sensible and make sure the PC is disconnected from the power and had a chance to cool down before you stick the hoover nozzle inside it, that don't touch any if the internal components, the vac is going to have enough suction to pick up the fine dust without you having to touch anything sensitive.

[Cassandra LeMay]

Popping the cover off you PC and giving it a decent vac, once in a while never hurts. The amount of dust that gets inside can be horrific, particularly if you've lots of fans.
Just need to be sensible and make sure the PC is disconnected from the power and had a chance to cool down before you stick the hoover nozzle inside it, that don't touch any if the internal components, the vac is going to have enough suction to pick up the fine dust without you having to touch anything sensitive.

I have no idea if it's true or not, but I also once heard that it is a good idea to hold the main fan inposition while vac-ing out a PC. I was told spinning of the fan started by the strong air flow of a vacuum cleaner can generate an electrical charge, but I may well remember that wrongly. It was years ago and just something someone mentioned in passing.

[The Dark Raven]

I have no idea if it's true or not, but I also once heard that it is a good idea to hold the main fan inposition while vac-ing out a PC. I was told spinning of the fan started by the strong air flow of a vacuum cleaner can generate an electrical charge, but I may well remember that wrongly. It was years ago and just something someone mentioned in passing.

It's best to do most of the vaccing while your computer is off/idle.

[midnightblack]

I have no idea if it's true or not, but I also once heard that it is a good idea to hold the main fan inposition while vac-ing out a PC. I was told spinning of the fan started by the strong air flow of a vacuum cleaner can generate an electrical charge, but I may well remember that wrongly. It was years ago and just something someone mentioned in passing.

Vacuuming implies a strong friction of dust particles and the likes against plastic surfaces, so you can strip some electrons here and there. If this happens around the muzzle of the vacuum cleaner, there is a risk (which I personally do not know how to quantify right now) that the build-up will discharge through the hardware of your computer. Some people suggest that, instead of vacuuming the dust, you should blow it out with compressed air (making sure not to fling into oblivion one or two vital capacitors from your motherboard in the process). Anyway, for the peace of mind of anyone interested, I found this guide about grounding a vacuum cleaner. I never tried it personally, but I did use the tips from that website in other circumstances and found them pretty reliable.

As for Beorning's question, turning down the resolution and graphics options will probably solve all issues. Maybe you'll be surprised, but you can run very recent games in very safe conditions for your hardware on video cards that are 5 years old or more, if you are willing to skip the flashy graphics  :-). I'd argue that if the game is all about looks, it's not worth your time anyway.

[The Dark Raven]

Vacuuming implies a strong friction of dust particles and the likes against plastic surfaces, so you can strip some electrons here and there. If this happens around the muzzle of the vacuum cleaner, there is a risk (which I personally do not know how to quantify right now) that the build-up will discharge through the hardware of your computer. Some people suggest that, instead of vacuuming the dust, you should blow it out with compressed air (making sure not to fling into oblivion one or two vital capacitors from your motherboard in the process). Anyway, for the peace of mind of anyone interested, I found this guide about grounding a vacuum cleaner. I never tried it personally, but I did use the tips from that website in other circumstances and found them pretty reliable.

As for Beorning's question, turning down the resolution and graphics options will probably solve all issues. Maybe you'll be surprised, but you can run very recent games in very safe conditions for your hardware on video cards that are 5 years old or more, if you are willing to skip the flashy graphics  :-). I'd argue that if the game is all about looks, it's not worth your time anyway.

I think B did this already and is still having issues....

[firepyre]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I took a look, and there seems to be a fairly important point that has been missed.

Putting the memory aside for a moment, you should know that the way graphics cards are numbered isn't as straight forward as it might seem. The recommended card, a 5850 is a high end card, from the generation before yours. The 6700 is a intermediate model. Unfortunately, a 5850 probably has significantly better performance than your card, hence, I suspect, your issues.

Even if you were to upgrade the RAM, it's unlikley this would solve your problems.

[Oniya]

I think B did this already and is still having issues....

He did - from the initial post:

Initially, I thought it was a matter of me running the game with the highest graphics settings. See, another present I got for Christmas was a new monitor with default resolution of 1920 x 1080. When I ran the game, it automatically conformed to the monitor and set its resolution to 1920 x 1080, too. So, at first I thought: sure, I'll just downscale the graphics quality and the game will play okay.

It... didn't help.

Seriously: I set the graphics to 1280 x 720, the lowest setting possible. I also lowered the FPS rate to 60. And it doesn't help! The PC keeps overheating.

[firepyre]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I took a look, and there seems to be a fairly important point that has been missed.

Putting the memory aside for a moment, you should know that the way graphics cards are numbered isn't as straight forward as it might seem. The recommended card, a 5850 5770 is a decent card, from the generation before yours. The 6700 is an entry level model. Unfortunately, a 5850 5770 probably has significantly better performance than your card, hence, I suspect, your issues.

Even if you were to upgrade the RAM, it's unlikley this would solve your problems.

Managed to get the numbers mixed up a bit, but the point stands. Here's your card side by side with the minimum one for comparison(hopefully I got the right one this time -_-): http://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/AMD-Radeon-HD-6700-vs-AMD-HD-5770/m9272vsm7752

That said, I would expect your graphics card to be overheating rather than your cpu. Hmm. Where are you getting your temp from?

[midnightblack]

Oops, I missed that somehow in the first post. Anyway, some programs do give quirky readings of the temperature. Maybe you should try running something like SpeedFan in the background while playing for a little bit, log some temperature plots and fan speeds over your hardware and see who the culprit is.

[The Dark Raven]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I took a look, and there seems to be a fairly important point that has been missed.

Putting the memory aside for a moment, you should know that the way graphics cards are numbered isn't as straight forward as it might seem. The recommended card, a 5850 is a high end card, from the generation before yours. The 6700 is a intermediate model. Unfortunately, a 5850 probably has significantly better performance than your card, hence, I suspect, your issues.

Even if you were to upgrade the RAM, it's unlikley this would solve your problems.

Truth, thought RAM could help in the interim as the graphics card is probably more expensive.

[Beorning]

Hmm. Okay then, is there some sort of free utility I could use to measure the graphic card's temperature? It is possible that the card is not coping with the game - although the Can You Run It website claims my GPU should be enough to run the game...

Drat. If the GPU is the reason for the overheating problem, then I won't be able to pursue a refund in good faith :( After all, I *knew* the recommendations for the card before purchasing the game...

BTW. Do you guys know what card is considered a reasonably high-end GPU these days?

[Nessy]

I've used HWMonitor (CPUID) in the past to monitor temps. By past i mean within the last couple of years.

[firepyre]

Hmm. Okay then, is there some sort of free utility I could use to measure the graphic card's temperature? It is possible that the card is not coping with the game - although the Can You Run It website claims my GPU should be enough to run the game...

Drat. If the GPU is the reason for the overheating problem, then I won't be able to pursue a refund in good faith :( After all, I *knew* the recommendations for the card before purchasing the game...

BTW. Do you guys know what card is considered a reasonably high-end GPU these days?

Temp monitoring app:
https://camwebapp.com/

Regardless of what the website tells you, in very untechnical terms,  your card is about 25% slower than the minimum recommended card. While it's true that that doesn't necessarily stop the game from running outright, it does mean your card is probably going to be running at full load, all the time, just to keep up. Throw in suboptimal cooling, as it's a lower end card, and it 'd hardly be surprising if it was overheating, or experiencing some other kind of crashing issue.

As for what is considered reasonably high end, that's a tough question to answer. Toms hardware does a decent hierarchy chart though that ROUGHLY groups them into tiers.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gpu-hierarchy,4388.html

They also keep a list of the current best value graphics cards, which is a decent guide if you're thinking about buying a new card, but aren't great with hardware.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-gpus,4380.html

[midnightblack]

BTW. Do you guys know what card is considered a reasonably high-end GPU these days?

It would be a good idea to first indicate your motherboard model and your power source (I couldn't see them with the rest of the specs). These are important because you want the new graphics card to actually fit inside and you want to be able to provide enough power for it to work properly. If you acquire a high-end monster with three coolers, keep in mind that it may be very noisy. Those 4 gbs of RAM might also be an issue. I think you will need at least 8 if you plan to go into very recent games. Whether or not you need more for the future is something that I don't really know. I have friends with 12 gbs of RAM and they say it's complete overkill for gaming purposes.

Lastly, don't throw your money away without some thorough searching. Some cards are ridiculously expensive and provide features that you don't actually have use for. Most knowledgeable people that I know recommend an nvidia chipset. I think the top of the line stuff is in the 970 gtx series, but I'm way behind myself on modern hardware. I can ask around for you, if need be.

[Eikichi]

Hmm. Okay then, is there some sort of free utility I could use to measure the graphic card's temperature? It is possible that the card is not coping with the game - although the Can You Run It website claims my GPU should be enough to run the game...

Drat. If the GPU is the reason for the overheating problem, then I won't be able to pursue a refund in good faith :( After all, I *knew* the recommendations for the card before purchasing the game...

Before you do settle on the GPU being the issue. I would point out that this is PC gaming we are talking about. Sometimes bugs that create issues for certain set-ups slip through the cracks. My advice would be to first see is anyone with a similar issue. As it could be an issue with the game and not your hardware. If nothing stands out as being similar to your own issue then it's safe to assume that it's an isolated case and more than likely a GPU issue.

As for monitoring your GPU and seeing if certain processes are overheating I recommend OCCT or OpenHardWareMonitor. The latter is best since the former should only be used if you have advanced knowledge of the GPU and it's limits. As if used improperly you could blow your GPU.

[Nessy]

If you do go the new GPU route, a couple of things to note about the prices shown on tomshardware, the RX480 is closer to around $200 now than 330 for the 8GB. It actually runes a little hotter and and uses more power than the 1060. For the 4GB you can often go under $200. This isn't a guess. I actually purchased mine for 215. It's not perfect but it's "high-end" in that it can run games very well at 1080p. For 4K you'd want to look at something higher end but also a fair amount more. If you're more of a 1060 fan and looking at around 200-300, then 1060 it is. 

Once you start going up you're looking at GTX 1070 ~$400+ or GTX 1080~$700.

The others are right though, before you drop funds on a GPU  try to find out if it really is the GPU or not a driver problem. My card had a nasty little mouse corruption problem they fixed with a  later driver, for example. My rig is almost 5 years old, and will be completely replaced in about 12-18months... the new GPU has really made a difference though, and I came from a 6950 which was not a cheap or power performer... just too old for driver support.

[Beorning]

Hm. If it is a driver problem, then I can't do anything about it... I really downloaded the latest drivers published for my card. So, what else I can do?

As for buying cards: how do I check if my powersource is enough and if the card fits my motherboard? Also, what is 1080p and what role does GPU RAM play?

GPUs are so complicated :(

[Oniya]

1080p means that your display uses 1080 lines to display, and displays them all for each frame 'progressively'.  Contrast this to 'i', or 'interlaced' where the display alternates odd lines and even lines between frames.  (Interlacing is what they used to use on older TVs, and could occasionally cause intermittent flickering with particular target graphics.)

GPU RAM is memory that is dedicated to processing graphics and rendering graphics.  It's memory that your computer will use for these tasks before accessing the additional RAM on your motherboard, or your virtual memory swap-file.  If you're a person who doesn't use graphic-intense programs, then you won't see much difference, but when you get into high resolution games, then you will see a definite difference in performance.

[midnightblack]

Hm. If it is a driver problem, then I can't do anything about it... I really downloaded the latest drivers published for my card. So, what else I can do?

As for buying cards: how do I check if my powersource is enough and if the card fits my motherboard? Also, what is 1080p and what role does GPU RAM play?

GPUs are so complicated :(

Knowing the motherboard model would help. If you don't know it, no longer have its box or cd with drivers but you are using Windows 7, then you can find it in Start -> All Programs -> Accessories -> System Tools -> System Information. It should be right in front of you, under a label like System Model or the likes. For the power source you probably need to poke your nose around it until you find a label from the manufacturer with its specs.

[Lithos]

Something is wrong with the cooling system if the processor is running that hot, Intel Core i5 2300 should be cooled so that it tops out around 72C even on full load. 72.6°C is the maximum allowed temperature at the heat spreader.

[Beorning]

1080p means that your display uses 1080 lines to display, and displays them all for each frame 'progressively'.  Contrast this to 'i', or 'interlaced' where the display alternates odd lines and even lines between frames.  (Interlacing is what they used to use on older TVs, and could occasionally cause intermittent flickering with particular target graphics.)

GPU RAM is memory that is dedicated to processing graphics and rendering graphics.  It's memory that your computer will use for these tasks before accessing the additional RAM on your motherboard, or your virtual memory swap-file.  If you're a person who doesn't use graphic-intense programs, then you won't see much difference, but when you get into high resolution games, then you will see a definite difference in performance.

Hm. And how do I know if I need this 1080p and how much RAM my card should have? Aargh, I'm so behind on such knowledge...

Knowing the motherboard model would help. If you don't know it, no longer have its box or cd with drivers but you are using Windows 7, then you can find it in Start -> All Programs -> Accessories -> System Tools -> System Information. It should be right in front of you, under a label like System Model or the likes. For the power source you probably need to poke your nose around it until you find a label from the manufacturer with its specs.

My motherboard is Gigabyte H67MA-USB3-B3 (Socket 1155). As for the power source, I'll have to take a closer look at it...

[Nessy]

For the power source you probably need to poke your nose around it until you find a label from the manufacturer with its specs.

Aka, open the box and take a peak at the big or little box that your power cord is plugged in. You should be able see a white label with xxxW or something like that on it. For a pre-built system, aka a computer with a manufacturer like Dell, HP, Acer... there often something on the low-end like 200W or 350W, something like that. You can still get some decent cards if your limited by your power supply (PSU).

[midnightblack]

B., I have a couple of friends who are elbow-deep in computers all day long and I've given them your motherboard model. They've certainly given me very sound advice in the past, so I trust them to come up with some good alternatives for a video card.

Edit: ok, so any card on a PCI Express x16 will fit in that motherboard. You need to check the output if your source before you buy anything. You also need to take note of the dimensions of the card you want to buy (these are detailed in its specs). If you happen to have a small/medium case, you may want to measure the available space around the card slot to make sure you have enough room for it.

[Beorning]

Okay, so I opened the PC case. My power source says that it has "DC output 500 W". Is it good or bad? Would it be enough to power a modern GPU and some additional RAM?

Also, I used CAM to take the temp readings of the GPU while running Tyranny. It seems that GPU temp while not doing anything is 38 C - and when playing Tyranny it goes up to about 50 C (with the apparent load of 55%). At the same time, CPU hits over 80 C... So, is it a GPU problem or not?

BTW. CAM shows that the RAM load when of playing Tyranny is 75%.

Any ideas, guys?

[midnightblack]

I think 500 W is enough, but just to be safe you may want to ask around a bit on some hardware forums if you decide to go purchasing. I don't know how to help you with the other questions in the last post, but I hope someone else can.

[Nessy]

Okay, so I opened the PC case. My power source says that it has "DC output 500 W". Is it good or bad? Would it be enough to power a modern GPU and some additional RAM?

Also, I used CAM to take the temp readings of the GPU while running Tyranny. It seems that GPU temp while not doing anything is 38 C - and when playing Tyranny it goes up to about 50 C (with the apparent load of 55%). At the same time, CPU hits over 80 C... So, is it a GPU problem or not?

BTW. CAM shows that the RAM load when of playing Tyranny is 75%.

Any ideas, guys?

80 for a CPU is too high. They can actually endure temperatures higher than that, but under load, aka playing a game in most circumstances, that's pretty high.  I'm assuming your not overclocking or anything like that.  While underload, 50C doesn't seem too bad though. It sounds like your CPU is getting pretty darn hot for a system that isn't overclocked.

Have you tried playing this game with your case open, aka, can you see the fans spinning? Also, what's the dust situation like in your case? I'm asking primarily because an airflow problem can heat things up pretty quickly.

[Beorning]

Hm. As I mentioned earlier, I dusted off the inside of the case recently. So I don't think it's the case of the air flow...

I admit I'm a bit afraid to turn the PC on without its cover on. Isn't it risky?

Anyway, I really don't know what to make of this situation. Maybe I *should* invest in a new graphics card... But is it really the problem? Not to mention, I don't have enough money...

[Oniya]

Hm. As I mentioned earlier, I dusted off the inside of the case recently. So I don't think it's the case of the air flow...

I admit I'm a bit afraid to turn the PC on without its cover on. Isn't it risky?

Not risky, really.  You'll want to make sure that nothing can fall into the case while it's running.  If you have pets, keep them away from it, don't poke at moving parts while they're moving, that sort of thing.

[Beorning]

I don't know... I'm kind of bummed about all of this. It seems I have no chance of getting a refund for the game: the Polish publisher claims it's all the fault of my PC. I considered upgrading my PC to make new games playable, but it'd be so complicated and cost so much money...

[AmberStarfire]

Maybe you can trade it with someone online or in RL, unless it's already installed and no one else can install it now.

[Beorning]

I don't know... The game is Steam-activated. I wonder if it's tradeable...

By the way - I learned today that my PC does have, indeed, some form of on-board graphics. Apparently, it's in the CPU chip... I never thought it was possible  ::) Anyway, it was suggested to me that the problem might stem from the game trying to use this weak internal GPU... Hm. I checked my BIOS and it turned there's no way to deactivate it permanently! The only settings are "Enabled" and "Enabled if no external GPU". There's no setting to make it impossible to be activated...

If this is the problem, then the situation might be hopeless: no matter how much additional memory I put in and what new GPU I buy, the game will overheat the CPU by activating the internal GPU. Until Obsidian / Paradox releases a patch for the problem...

[AmberStarfire]

I've heard of that happening before with an onboard graphics card. I don't know if that's the same thing as the GPU.

This might be useful?
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/answers/id-2023248/turn-gpu-laptop.html

only the reverse applies?

[Beorning]

Not really, I'm afraid... If I turned off the external GPU visible in my Display Adapters, this would turn on the on-board one. But the on-board GPU isn't visible in Display Adapters, so (even if it exists - maybe it doesn't, after all...), I can't turn it off that way. And as I mentioned, my BIOS doesn't give the option for a hard block for the on-board GPU...

[Fenirus]

It will seem very simple to you once you've done it. The main thing is making sure the sticks you get will fit on your motherboard before you buy them.

http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/how-to-install-ram/ Here's a tutorial that is actually more in depth than it needs to be and is only a few minutes.

You can buy ram all over, newegg is a good site for parts, amazon sometimes has deals on it, I don't know if anywhere local would do it better where you are.

This is a great start.  If you go this route it's also the perfect time to dust out your case and check on your CPU fan.  You want to make sure it can spin freely and that there's no dust in the cooling fens.  If any of your fans (case or CPU) arin't working right you will start to see heat issues in varying degrees depending on which fan it is.  It might also just be a good chance to replace the CPU cooler as well since you'll already be in the computer.

I've got a custom setup myself and had to get an extra beefy CPU fan for my computer so it took a little extra work but that was just because of the chip I have and the cooler I went with, most will mount right on the existing mounts.  Something to think about for the future even if you don't go that route.

[Beorning]

As I mentioned, I already did dust the insides of my PC... The only thing I couldn't dust completely was the radiator, because I can't find a way of removing the CPU fan without taking the radiator out of the motherboard...

If it's a cooling problem, then it has to be something with the thermal paste. But as I said, I tested other games and they work fine...

[firepyre]

Okay, so I opened the PC case. My power source says that it has "DC output 500 W". Is it good or bad? Would it be enough to power a modern GPU and some additional RAM?

Also, I used CAM to take the temp readings of the GPU while running Tyranny. It seems that GPU temp while not doing anything is 38 C - and when playing Tyranny it goes up to about 50 C (with the apparent load of 55%). At the same time, CPU hits over 80 C... So, is it a GPU problem or not?

BTW. CAM shows that the RAM load when of playing Tyranny is 75%.

Any ideas, guys?

Huh. That's odd. If the graphics card was bottlenecking it, that's not what you'd typically expect to see. The graphics card should be much more heavily loaded. And the 2300s were excellent processors too...

How much load is your processor under? Preferably one reading from before you open the game, and one from after, and each core individually if you can. It seems odd that your processor would be the bottleneck, but there's something weird going on by the sounds of it. I'd like to see if it's heating up because it's working harder or if there's some other reason.

New thermal paste would probably help, as it does tend to degrade over time, but I doubt that would actually fix the issue.

[Nessy]

Hm. As I mentioned earlier, I dusted off the inside of the case recently. So I don't think it's the case of the air flow...

I admit I'm a bit afraid to turn the PC on without its cover on. Isn't it risky?

Anyway, I really don't know what to make of this situation. Maybe I *should* invest in a new graphics card... But is it really the problem? Not to mention, I don't have enough money...

I should have been more specific, is the fan on the CPU turning? Is there dust underneath of it? It's not just the case... it can be the fan on the CPU heatsink itself... which should spin smoothly. Not all games tax the same components the same... aka one can be very GPU heavy and another CPU heavy. I also don't think it's the thermal paste. I mean my CPU can be at 100% load and not hit that kind of heat.

[midnightblack]

I don't know... The game is Steam-activated. I wonder if it's tradeable...

By the way - I learned today that my PC does have, indeed, some form of on-board graphics. Apparently, it's in the CPU chip... I never thought it was possible  ::) Anyway, it was suggested to me that the problem might stem from the game trying to use this weak internal GPU... Hm. I checked my BIOS and it turned there's no way to deactivate it permanently! The only settings are "Enabled" and "Enabled if no external GPU". There's no setting to make it impossible to be activated...

If this is the problem, then the situation might be hopeless: no matter how much additional memory I put in and what new GPU I buy, the game will overheat the CPU by activating the internal GPU. Until Obsidian / Paradox releases a patch for the problem...

If your Radeon card is properly installed, it should have some piece of software from where you can work out various settings, including the ability to choose which applications use it. If you suspect that the game is defaulting to your integrated card, you can try to force it to use the dedicated one through that application.

[Nessy]

Not really, I'm afraid... If I turned off the external GPU visible in my Display Adapters, this would turn on the on-board one. But the on-board GPU isn't visible in Display Adapters, so (even if it exists - maybe it doesn't, after all...), I can't turn it off that way. And as I mentioned, my BIOS doesn't give the option for a hard block for the on-board GPU...

It shouldn't be necessary. Almost all chips now have a onboard GPUs, and those typically recognize when you plug your card into the PCI-E slot and just shut-off. What's your board, aka motherboard model and brand?

[Beorning]

It's Gigabyte H67MA-USB3-B3 (Socket 1155).

I examined my BIOS yesterday... There is an option for on-board GPU, but I can only choose between "Enabled" and "Enable if external GPU not present". There's no way of blocking it with no exceptions.

[Nessy]

It's Gigabyte H67MA-USB3-B3 (Socket 1155).

I examined my BIOS yesterday... There is an option for on-board GPU, but I can only choose between "Enabled" and "Enable if external GPU not present". There's no way of blocking it with no exceptions.

That's a fine mobo.

Is it set to Enable if the external GPU is not present, obviously you have one present so that should, in theory, keep the IGP from functioning?

I don't mean to annoy you or anything so please let me know if you want me to stop. I don't think that using the IGP (integrated) or the GPU (external) should ever lead to your CPU getting that hot. You have some concerns about the IGP though so it seemed worth having a look at.

[Beorning]

Ah, no problem. But I don't think the IGP is the source of the trouble - I checked the game's log and it seems that the game is using the external card.

Unfortunately, I'm out of ideas... I have no idea what else I could do. The only potential source of the trouble seems to be memory shortage - but I'm not sure if I want to invest $50 to buy new memory chips and see if the game's working then.

On the other hand, as I mentioned, the publisher really seems to be uncooperative. They keep repeating that I have a cooling problem and that's it...

BTW. Are you guys knowledgeable when it comes to PC upgrading? Let's say I take my PC, with its Intel i5 and 4 GB RAM. Let's say I add 4 GB RAM more and buy a new graphics card - let's say I invest into GeForce GTX 1070. Would this PC be running modern games at high quality? If so, would such a configuration be viable for the next few years? Or should I better simply buy a new PC?

[firepyre]

That's a fine mobo.

Is it set to Enable if the external GPU is not present, obviously you have one present so that should, in theory, keep the IGP from functioning?

I don't mean to annoy you or anything so please let me know if you want me to stop. I don't think that using the IGP (integrated) or the GPU (external) should ever lead to your CPU getting that hot. You have some concerns about the IGP though so it seemed worth having a look at.

Not to mention, if your gpu wasn't being utilized, it wouldn't show as having the load it is showing. That should pretty much rule out the integrated graphics as a problem. I actually did some looking into tyranny, and it turns out the game is quite CPU intensive, so it wouldn't be surprising if your CPU is running at, or close to 100%. If that's the case you could try an aftermarket heatsink, and new thermal paste to get the temp down to something a bit more stable.

This is pure speculation, and not something I know a lot about, but maybe you've fallen victim to the problem in this link? It certainly sounds similar to what you reported.
https://www.google.com.au/url?q=http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/two-ways-to-cool-down-your-defective-overheating-intel-cpu/&sa=U&ved=0ahUKEwiF-rWy08LRAhXIJ5QKHVE3CCQQFggLMAA&sig2=5JbxLvlMgzkKxjzMZyBtLQ&usg=AFQjCNGVtwtKv2kfWDyZW-SognGs3mfszQ

[Beorning]

Not to mention, if your gpu wasn't being utilized, it wouldn't show as having the load it is showing. That should pretty much rule out the integrated graphics as a problem. I actually did some looking into tyranny, and it turns out the game is quite CPU intensive, so it wouldn't be surprising if your CPU is running at, or close to 100%. If that's the case you could try an aftermarket heatsink, and new thermal paste to get the temp down to something a bit more stable.

But I wouldn't know how to change the heatsink myself and I can't really get this PC to a hardware service :(

Gah! It's hopeless...  :-(

[firepyre]

You could probably change a heatsink with help from a videocall. It's fairly easy to do. Most hardware stuff is. They practically slot together like lego.

The problem is, even if you change it, it may not fix it. If heat transfer to the internal heat spreader is the problem, you probably need to replace the CPU instead. In which case you have basically been royally screwed by intel, since upgrading the cpu, in your case, would mean almost starting from scratch.

[Beorning]

But if it's a heatsink problem, then why didn't it come up with other games? I have Pillars of Eternity and it's working fine. And it seems to have higher CPU requirements than Tyranny - if official specs are to be believed, at least.

Are there any stress tests over at the web where I could check how my CPU deals with high load?

[Oniya]

There are a few CPU benchmarking programs out there - not web-based, but usually a small download of a program that does a lot of calculations, like calculating a few million digits of pi, fast Fourier transforms, or Mersenne primes.  Combining one of these with a temperature monitor (like the one you've been using), and you should be able to see how your CPU is performing under stress.

http://www.pcgamer.com/the-best-benchmarking-tools-for-testing-your-cpu/

[firepyre]

The ariticle above is more focused on finding out how fast your processor is. That said, prime95 is mentioned which is pretty much the go to for stress testing. You'll want to look for the  torture test option and then small ftts, which will stress your cpu most. Below is the link for prime95, as well as a link that has a basic rundown of stress testing.

http://www.mersenne.org/download/

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2028882/keep-it-stable-stupid-how-to-stress-test-your-pc-hardware.html

[Nessy]

But if it's a heatsink problem, then why didn't it come up with other games? I have Pillars of Eternity and it's working fine. And it seems to have higher CPU requirements than Tyranny - if official specs are to be believed, at least.

Are there any stress tests over at the web where I could check how my CPU deals with high load?

Some games offload the work on to the GPU better than others do. Tyranny is a Nov 2016 release... which is fairly recent. They might have a problem that can be patched out too. I didn't think a game should access a CPU in that way to cause it harm.... To be clear, your CPU can handle heats at greater than 80C. It can actually do a fair bit more before physical damage occurs, but over time, running it like that is going to cause undo stress and wear. Software not running properly though and causing hardware issues... it's happened before just not common.

Stress testing is an excellent way to verify the problem though. We're doing educated guesses based on the symptoms provided.

[Beorning]

Okay, I'll try this. Any advice on stress-testing? How do these programs work - would they turn themselves off when the PC goes too hot? Or do I need to keep watch and stop the test manually?

[Nessy]

Okay, I'll try this. Any advice on stress-testing? How do these programs work - would they turn themselves off when the PC goes too hot? Or do I need to keep watch and stop the test manually?

Your CPU / BIOS should have a built in kill switch outside of the software. If you actually hit dangerous levels, the whole system should just shut down rather than burn up on it's own. I've had this happen to me a few years ago when I may have, slightly, accidentally not seated the heatsink properly. I've also overclocked my system too and had a similar result. It's an auto-shut-off mechanism that should be in place for every modern system.

summary: Aka, it shouldn't allow your hardware to heat to the point of actually melting and instead just shut off suddenly when it reaches a certain temperature.

[Oniya]

That said, it might not be a bad idea to keep an eye on it, so you know how long it can run without reaching 'bad' temperatures.

[Beorning]

Okay, what the hell?

I tried using that Prime95 thing. I chose the "small numbers" option (the one that's supposed to generate maximum heat). I started the test and my CPU temp app gave an overheat warning about 1 second! In about 3 seconds, the CPU reached 99 C!

What is that thing???

[Oniya]

The program is a mathematical search for a certain type of prime number.  The reason that it is used as a stress test is that it does a lot of calculations to do so.  This is purely CPU activity (your GPU isn't involved in the crunching.)

[Beorning]

That I know - but the instructions say to have it run for a few hours. So, I gather that it shouldn't be overheating my PC in a matter of a few seconds..?

[Nessy]

That I know - but the instructions say to have it run for a few hours. So, I gather that it shouldn't be overheating my PC in a matter of a few seconds..?

Nope it certainly should not.  Do you have anyone near who is comfortable with opening your computer and looking at your hardware. I only ask because i get the impression you're not. I have questions about your heatsink... thermal paste should not just wear away, but I am wondering if something got knocked loose or maybe the fan isn't spinning. Did you happen to see if the fan was spinning? Aka it's not the test I'm sure.

[Beorning]

Hmm. I do know how to open the PC, I do it occassionally. What I'm not comfortable with is fidding with the inside too much, as these components look so fragile...

What would you like to know about the heatsink?

[Nessy]

Hmm. I do know how to open the PC, I do it occassionally. What I'm not comfortable with is fidding with the inside too much, as these components look so fragile...

What would you like to know about the heatsink?

When your PC is on, the fan is spinning right?

If the heatsink is not seated properly, or for some weird reason the thermal paste is not there (been building systems since 2000, haven't seen this yet), the heat won't be distributed properly, aka the heat won't distribute.

I mean your idle temperatures (when you're not gaming, watching videos and stuff), should be maybe... 10 above room temperature, maybe more depending on your airflow and case crowding... for your CPU to hit 99C though it seems like you need someone to help you make sure that heatsink is doing it's job... and if it's not you can replace it.

[Beorning]

Argh. I really don't know what's going with this PC anymore. It seems to hit 60 - 70 C when visiting sites with many animated banners, like Wikia. And even when it's relatively cold, it still is working loudly...

I have no idea what to do with it anymore...

BTW. I'd be interested in your opinion, guys: let's say I was to buy a completely new PC. I would like the new PC to run games at 1920 x 1080, on high settings. I'd like to run current games and remain viable in that respect for the next few years. What configuration should I be looking for?

[firepyre]

Did you end up trying anything with the heatsink yet?


As for the new PC:

What's your budget, and do you have anyone to build it for you, or are you needing a prebuilt one? What do you tend to use your PC for? Do you want new, or can it be a second hand machine?

[Beorning]

Did you end up trying anything with the heatsink yet?

Not yet. I'll be trying to remove it and apply thermal paste to it on Tuesday or so...

As for the new PC:

What's your budget, and do you have anyone to build it for you, or are you needing a prebuilt one? What do you tend to use your PC for? Do you want new, or can it be a second hand machine?

Well, technically, I don't have a budget yet, as I still need to secure funds for this hypothetical new PC. The reason I'm asking is, in part,  to see how much money I'd need to buy the PC I need.

As for your other questions, I think I'd prefer to buy a new, prebuilt PC. I'd like to use for gaming - well, not only that, but I want this PC to run modern games and to do it well.

[Nessy]

Well, technically, I don't have a budget yet, as I still need to secure funds for this hypothetical new PC. The reason I'm asking is, in part,  to see how much money I'd need to buy the PC I need.

There are a lot of affordable options to do what you're asking for. You're basically looking for Blu-Ray kind of quality graphics while the top end is obsessed with 4K and VR. The nVidia 1060 cards can do what you're asking for in most cases, and if at any point the GPU is your limit, you can replace it without doing the whole machine... it's just a card.

Having said that, it might be early to feel you HAVE to buy a new system. If you're CPU is overheating, it's going to do so 100% of the time.... but it's not going to work very hard always so it won't be noticeable always. If you hit those temps often enough... you risk damaging you're hardware too.

Budget system approximate 600-700 ; Midrange maybe around 1400-1500, top tier is around 3k. This is just for the box itself in USD and not likely using any super slick deals... aka you're building it yourself at roughly retail price. Again rough estimates, RAM prices are currently on the rise but that's not something to be too alarmed about.

please note: pre-built systems could be a lot higher or even lower too.

[Beorning]

Ha! Let's say, then, then I buy GeForce 1060 and expand RAM to 8 GBs. Would that be enough for me to play modern games in good quality?

Regarding the overheating issue - uhm, so... I faced my fears today and applied new thermal paste to the CPU today. The result is that the base temperature dropped to 35 - 40 C and the animation - intensive webpages aren't overheating the PC anymore. As for Tyranny - it... also seems to run at acceptable temperatures! Around 55 C, actually. Although the cooler does start working louder when the game is on, so I'm still not sure if it's okay to run the game...

Anyway, it seems that I need to recant every curse I issued at the Paradox and Cenega techs: I did have a cooling problem after all...

[Nessy]

Ha! Let's say, then, then I buy GeForce 1060 and expand RAM to 8 GBs. Would that be enough for me to play modern games in good quality?

Regarding the overheating issue - uhm, so... I faced my fears today and applied new thermal paste to the CPU today. The result is that the base temperature dropped to 35 - 40 C and the animation - intensive webpages aren't overheating the PC anymore. As for Tyranny - it... also seems to run at acceptable temperatures! Around 55 C, actually. Although the cooler does start working louder when the game is on, so I'm still not sure if it's okay to run the game...

Anyway, it seems that I need to recant every curse I issued at the Paradox and Cenega techs: I did have a cooling problem after all...

If you mean the fan starts spinning when you're playing Tyranny, that's normal! The fans are "smart" so to speak. They're only going to go fast when they need to, so you don't normally hear the video cards fan spinning much outside of gaming or something like graphic design. CPU fans you don't normally hear too often if you get dusty or you have a big one. Anyway hearing your fans is often a sign of a cheaper (plastic) or thinner case (metal), not an issue with the fans themselves.

As for 1060, the 1060 is a modern card. I built my system in 2012, just slapped a RX480 in it a few weeks ago. That's the AMD competitor to 1060. I did have to do a firmware update for the card, but otherwise it should keep me going a year or two so long as everyone else holds up. 55C and 60C are fine, perfectly acceptable. If you're still concerned about that you can run the test again and   it should never hit 99C.

It's always hard to recommend what people should buy, but a 1060 isn't just a good budget card, it's just good overall for anything but 4k gaming, anything higher is going to hit you around $400. More ram is good, and if you're at 4GB, i would think 8 will give you noticeable improvements, not just in gaming.

[Beorning]

What about the CPU, though? I asked around and I was told that with i5-2300 and with a 5 y.o. motherboard, I would better off simply buying a completely new PC...

BTW. Speaking of new CPUs: do you guys happen to know what's the difference between i7-6700 (3.4 GHz) and i7-76700K (4.0 GHz)? I understand that the latter is better, but how much better?

[Nessy]

What about the CPU, though? I asked around and I was told that with i5-2300 and with a 5 y.o. motherboard, I would better off simply buying a completely new PC...

BTW. Speaking of new CPUs: do you guys happen to know what's the difference between i7-6700 (3.4 GHz) and i7-76700K (4.0 GHz)? I understand that the latter is better, but how much better?

The CPU is okay. You're going to run into some trouble with the games that have some beefy requirements like Conan Exiles. It's all a matter of do you want to spend the money now or just patch it up for another year or two and do it later.

Usually the most notable difference between the Intel XXXX CPUS and XXXXK CPUS is overclocking ability, aka the K version usually lets you do more and has more unlocked settings than the non-K version. Based on our conversation, I doubt you'll be doing  much overclocking. If the price is close though it could be worth it if you ever decide to do it later.

[Beorning]

Hmm. I've looked at the requirements for some games and I really don't think my CPU is okay anymore... I certainly won't be running Witcher 3 with it, even if I got the best graphics card.

I guess it *is* time to buy a new PC. I mean, what's the point of buying GeForce 1070 + more RAM for $700 now and spending the same amount of money later, if I could buy a whole PC with i5-6600 + GeForce 1070 + 16 GB RAM (which, from what I've read on various benchmarking sites, should be a really good modern PC able to run anything) for $1400?

[Nessy]

Hmm. I've looked at the requirements for some games and I really don't think my CPU is okay anymore... I certainly won't be running Witcher 3 with it, even if I got the best graphics card.

I guess it *is* time to buy a new PC. I mean, what's the point of buying GeForce 1070 + more RAM for $700 now and spending the same amount of money later, if I could buy a whole PC with i5-6600 + GeForce 1070 + 16 GB RAM (which, from what I've read on various benchmarking sites, should be a really good modern PC able to run anything) for $1400?

I would not recommend buying 1070 and more RAM. That's why I mentioned the 1060.  You'd be better off with a new system and a 1060 over an older system than a 1070 because... you can always replace the 1060 later. All of this based on the assumption you don't want to spend 1200+ today. If you do, or more like, if you are ready to spend that much then it's a matter of spending some time on reading about what you want and see if there are any changes in technology around the corner.

I just assumed you'd rather spend say 300 now and take your time with deciding about a new build, but if you've got it then by all means spend some time reading about what's out there. I assume this will be a prebuilt system of some kind and a desktop. The laptop route is a different animal and a little bit more.

I often use PC Gamer as a guide, not an authority, to give you an idea of where things are at right now:

http://www.pcgamer.com/best-gaming-pc/

[Beorning]

Admittedly, I don't quite know what I want at this stage... I haven't been planning to buy a new PC this year. On the other hand, all this madness I went through with Tyranny really made me realize that my PC is getting old and may soon not to be able to run anything new. I mean, I was hoping to get Tides of Numenera, but I checked the game's system requirements and I'm not sure my PC even fits the minimum requirements...

Argh. Decisions, decisions :(

[Nessy]

Admittedly, I don't quite know what I want at this stage... I haven't been planning to buy a new PC this year. On the other hand, all this madness I went through with Tyranny really made me realize that my PC is getting old and may soon not to be able to run anything new. I mean, I was hoping to get Tides of Numenera, but I checked the game's system requirements and I'm not sure my PC even fits the minimum requirements...

Argh. Decisions, decisions :(

If you're able to do what you want to do today, don't rush yourself. Take your time. Read what's available. See what's coming. I know it sucks when things don't work, but if it's stable now, you've got time. Hell you could wake up tomorrow and see a  really slick deal on a rig that fits your needs perfectly, or if not tomorrow next month, or two months for now.  If Tyranny is your passion and you can enjoy it again, sounds like you can, enjoy it. Kick back, relax and just look up on CPUs one night. Maybe motherboards the next. Check out the pre-built systems or maybe look at building your own.

And believe me, I know where you're at. My build is from 2012. I am also pushing the edge. I bought a RX480 just to squeeze out another year because I am not sure either. I want to buy when I want to not because I have to. For me that could be 6 months, could be year... who knows? I'd be the first one to buy a new system tomorrow if mine died today too.  I totally understand as a gamer myself.

[Beorning]

The annoying thing is that I might be able to borrow the money I need from my family and pay them back through the rest of the year... but it'd mean I wouldn't be spending money on almost anything else. And I hoped to buy some other stuff this year, too. Also, I planned to finally start saving, so that I would have a solid "in the case of emergency" fund. But if I end up buying the new PC, that won't be possible..

Agh! I talked to a friend about it not too long ago and he put me to shame, saying that he's shocked that I'd be willing to spend that much just to be able to play computer games. Hmmmm...

[Nessy]

Agh! I talked to a friend about it not too long ago and he put me to shame, saying that he's shocked that I'd be willing to spend that much just to be able to play computer games. Hmmmm...

Anyone who doesn't enjoy computer or video games as a primary pass time won't understand... they never do. I am a full grown woman with a very fortunate job, and I am sure others still judge me for this.

Here's my somewhat unsolicited advice.  If you're computer works for you today, as in you can play the games you want today, like Tyranny, and it's an enjoyable experience, just start saving for a new computer. Put aside some money with each paycheck or whenever you get an influx of money, and the next time you run into a game you have a game you can't play, you can decide if you want to do the video card or GPU path and RAM or go for the new. By the way, you can do a step down and do a pretty nice rig for under 1k easily, like around 600 and 700 that would play games very well. You can shave some money off that 6700k chip by looking at the 6600 instead, and the 1060 video cards do fine for none 4k gaming, and even then they can do 4k.

[Beorning]

Alright, here's one more question...

My old PC. Do you guys think it's still viable for reselling? It's still not a bad PC and it'd be more than enough if someone wants to surf the web, do some simple image editing or even play less demanding games. The only downside is that it's over 5 years old... So, do you guys think if it makes sense to sell it? If so, how much could I charge for such a rig?

[Oniya]

I've never sold an old PC.  When I upgrade, the old one typically gets wiped and handed off to anyone I know with a lower system.

[Beorning]

It's a possibility. But considering that I'm not really earning much, I'd prefer to hand off the old PC for some money - to cushion the costs of the new one...

But of course I don't want to rip anyone off. That's why I'm asking if such a PC is even viable for selling anymore...

[Nessy]

Sorry, I'm not good to answer that one either. I wipe my old ones and hand them off or they sit in my closet waiting for me to decide what to do with them. I've seen them listed in craigslist before, but I always think they're way overpriced for something so old.

[Inkidu]

Sadly PC depreciate about as bad as cars.