Man snaps sixteen month old daughter spine in two.

[Rhapsody]

The only thing I know weed was to blame for was a story my foster father told me; some girl was high and driving a car, then hit a homeless man who crashed through her windshield and was impaled on the glass. She pulled into her garage and left him there, bleeding, where he died, because she was too freaked out to do anything about it.

According to the story, it was ecstasy, not marijuana.  A completely different type of drug altogether, and one on which it is rather easy to freak out and lose track of large chunks of time.

Urban legend: http://www.snopes.com/horrors/gruesome/bargrill.asp

Not an urban legend: http://www.wftv.com/news/2295744/detail.html

[Trieste]

Yes, people have hit people with their cars. I'm not saying that didn't happen.

Yes, people have driven home and let the people die because they are freaked out. I'm not saying that didn't happen.

But nowhere in that article does it say she was on drugs (I'm assuming it's mentioned somewheres and the wrong article was just linked) nor does she claim that she didn't know he was there. The fact that she didn't testify could be construed either way - self-implication (Canada's Fourth, the U.S.'s Fifth) or perjury, it doesn't matter. That is not a precedent case for being so drug-addled (or alcohol-addled) that you don't know right from wrong.

The fact that she took the body and then dumped it in a park could be taken as proof that she knew she'd done a bad thing, and it's sad that she would never have been caught had she not blabbed at a party.

[Rhapsody]

This is the story where the drugs are first mentioned.  Alcohol and ecstasy are identified here, then in the following story, along with the fact that after dumping the body, she went home and got laid.

[Primarch]

I don't really care whether drugs can be blamed or partially blamed or whatever. I think the more important issue is, someone was actually so cruel as to beat his own child to death, not in an isolated incident, but over a period of 8 weeks, if not more, as the kid didn't appear to gain any weight over, what was it, ten months? WHAT THE FUCK!?

[Bayushi]

I will say this. as long as its illegal, and people buy from unethical drug dealers then there is a good possibility that pot is laced with other drugs, PCP was the big t hing in the 90's...this could account for the person who got violent....since pot is proven to be a relaxant...but everyone's body chemistry is different too. I took muscle relaxers after my stint in the hospital many years ago, it was to help keep my muscles loose and not tense...can't remember the name of it right now but I will eventually....in very rare cases some people's muscles actaully spasmed uncontrollably on this medicine..which is odd since it IS a relaxant..*shrugs*

Different people have differing reactions to different drugs. Both legal and illegal.

For instance.....

An old friend and roommate of mine has two kids. Unfortunately, she has ADHD(and another issue that causes vertigo). So do both of her sons. The older son, and the mother, take a prescribed pharmaceutical that's effectively the drug known as 'Speed'. Instead of giving them a crazy high, it helps them mellow out some, and concentrate on day-to-day tasks. And yet, the youngest kid had the usual reaction to the narcotic, becoming insanely hyper(He's bad enough as it is without it.... with it, he's a damned monster!).

Also, an antibiotic that treats Staphylococcus infections didn't work so well on me when I was hospitalized after I had the car accident that ended up disabling me permanently. Where some people turn out just fine with the drug, I had to be taken off of it. It was stripping the insides of the veins in my arm(introduced via IV drip).

I'm sounding more and more like my father, but like he said, sometimes kids need a 'good crack in the ass' to straighten them out. My siblings and I; we got a few in our formative years when we fucked up, and guess what? It didn't make us drug-addicted baby-killers. Sometimes kids need a good smack upside something to spell it out for them, some of them are dense as hell and don't get it otherwise. A lot of the crap we're seeing today starts and ends in the home.

Indeed. I am of the same opinion as Overlord here. Spanking and the like teaches the child that there will be unpleasant repercussions for misbehaviour. In so doing, they learn that the behaviour in question is wrong, helping to prevent future occurrences. Unfortunately, our country has become so 'Politically Correct' that nothing can be done to a child, as far as discipline. And yet, the same states that will take your children from you for spanking allow corporal punishment in schools.

IT'S OKAY IF THE GOVERNMENT DOES IT, BUT NOT YOU!

Double standards much?

I would much rather prefer neither. However, part of what an opinion is, is that it doesn't need to have facts. Did you ever do fact and opinion questions? The question isn't whether or not there is evil that's perfectly clear, the question is what constitutes evil.

You made a large mistake here, Inkidu. Everything we 'know' is opinion. There is no such thing as fact or truth.

The scientific method says otherwise. Unless you can witness every possible occurrence involving a "fact" or "truth", you cannot prove that sometimes it isn't 'fact', or 'true'. Such as gravity. Which is why gravity is still a theory.

(Sorry, had to get on this.... it's a big thing with me, and always has been)

[Mathim]

That Chante Mallard one sounded a lot like the one he told me. Maybe he just decided to change the part about it being alcohol and ecstasy, making it pot instead; plus, he said it was days that she left him there dying, not hours like in the report. Not like I ever needed convincing to stay away from drugs, I decided that on my own.

Anyway, I think we have established that pot does not calm a person down ENOUGH to keep them from killing someone, is that a fair assessment of the situation?

[Rhapsody]

Anyway, I think we have established that pot does not calm a person down ENOUGH to keep them from killing someone, is that a fair assessment of the situation?

No.  I think a fair assessment of the situation is that pot shouldn't be in the equation at all, since it's only presented as media hysteria and not as a legitimate part of the story.

[Mathim]

Well that part is true enough; but I still think what I said about it was valid. It's not enough to make someone just chill and rethink such brutality. Wouldn't that have been awesome, if it had calmed him down enough to make him realize what he was doing and the situation hadn't turned as horrific as that? Then it would have given some props to marijuana usage. From what all my friends have told me, about it mellowing them out and all that, this article (to me, at least) proves it's not entirely effective. I do find that somewhat useful information, even if it was biased. Then again, they always get drunk and high at the same time so they might think it's just the pot and not the alcohol too...

[Bayushi]

We don't even know if he was under the influence of his cannabis at the time. For all we know, he lied to the police and told them that the pot made him do it.... so he could avoid going to jail.

*shrugs*

For the Record, I have never used, nor will I use(barring extreme medical circumstances) any "illegal" narcotics. Not only am I uninterested, I couldn't afford it... and many of them would further damage my brain. I've already lost a number of brain cells after my bad car wreck and brain injury... not interested in losing more, thanks.

In the same breath, however, I do not have a major issue with marijuana. I *do* have problems with those who 'celebrate' marijuana, 4:20, etc..... no major problems, just a disagreement. Those who have medical marijuana, LEGALLY, are exempt from this... provided they do not abuse their privilege. Those who use marijuana recreationally I frown at, but do not otherwise worry or fuss over. My main issue is the sub-culture that seems to revolve around the stuff, which makes it out to be 'cool', and drags impressionable youth into using.

[ShrowdedPoet]

That makes me sick!  *gets sick*

[The Overlord]

Indeed. I am of the same opinion as Overlord here. Spanking and the like teaches the child that there will be unpleasant repercussions for misbehavior. In so doing, they learn that the behavior in question is wrong, helping to prevent future occurrences. Unfortunately, our country has become so 'Politically Correct' that nothing can be done to a child, as far as discipline. And yet, the same states that will take your children from you for spanking allow corporal punishment in schools.

IT'S OKAY IF THE GOVERNMENT DOES IT, BUT NOT YOU!

Double standards much?

It's even more interesting when you consider to how many sectors the double standard goes...

Consider how much money, time and effort the DEA goes into 'illegal' drug enforcement, yet look at the billions the pharmaceuticals industry goes in pushing other drugs. And I'm to the point, more specifically they are to the point where I'll label them pushers, not providers.

The recent armada of drug commercials have been subtly insidious. Have a condition you think is wrong? Headaches? Edginess, insomnia, irritability...you can be damn sure they have a pill for it somewhere. See your doctor.

Side effects may include vertigo, excessive drooling, bleeding from every bodily cavity, motormouth, athlete's foot, easy bruising, unexplained papercuts, mummy rot, crabs, alien infestation, simulated intoxication, heart failure, seizures, difficulty breathing, difficulty concentrating, that slug-like thing that Khan put in Mr. Chekhov's ear, total neural network collapse, acute amnesia, harassment by witches...and, of course, sudden and irreversible death.

IMO all the stimulants ads are part of it; can't get enough shit done during the day? Try our energy drink, it's like tapping a 55-gallon industrial drum of caffeine directly into your bloodstream! Be a good little worker drone, with our product you can stay up for 90 hours straight.

The pushers try to get doctors to promote the crap, and clearly it's all untested, so they want lab rats too. It makes the US government the largest drug cartel in history. We're clearly ripe for revolution, but as my brother said, too many people are too pacified to revolt.

We just need enough people to get good and angry...then you'll see change.

[The Overlord]

We don't even know if he was under the influence of his cannabis at the time. For all we know, he lied to the police and told them that the pot made him do it.... so he could avoid going to jail.

You bring up a very good point, but you can bet some people will still want to blame it.

[Oniya]

Just my two cents - which can't even by a piece of gum in most places.

Most recreational drugs, alcohol included, have a tendency to lower those filters that we all put up naturally.  People who are angry don't 'mellow out' after a couple drinks, they end up starting bar fights.  In person, I'm quite introverted, but I'll get very talkative after 'indulging' (half a glass of wine - I'm a cheap date lightweight.)  Oddly enough (or maybe not so much), I see that same lowering of filters with Internet communications - someone who is nasty under a veneer of social acceptability off-line is more likely to be nasty online than they are to keep that veneer.

My guess is that this low-life had a tendency to be abusive long before he lit up.  I also suspect he's downplayed what/how much he used.  Why?  Because when people get caught, that's what they do.  Watch the vids of people getting pulled over for DUI - 'Have you been drinking?'  'No, occifer, not at all! *pause* Maybe - *thinks hard* - one beer... *officer glares* ... Or five...' 

If the drugs had anything to do with it, it was most likely just in bringing his true nature to the surface.

[Rhapsody]

In the same breath, however, I do not have a major issue with marijuana. I *do* have problems with those who 'celebrate' marijuana, 4:20, etc..... no major problems, just a disagreement.

To be honest, 4:20 is only fun the first time you "celebrate" it, especially if you don't partake too often.  It gets real old real quick after that.   I've known people who are so fanatical about it, they take the day off work so they can indulge all day. 

I know I sound like a major advocate of the legalization of cannibis, and I am... but I have my limits.  I don't think it should be a free-for-all; I think it should fall under the same regulations as alcohol and cigarettes.  Taxed the same.  Carrying the same consequences as lighting up in a smoke-free environment, or driving/working/going to school while under the influence, and also carrying the same consequences for providing it the underaged as the guy who gets caught buying a six-pack for fifteen-year-olds.

[ShrowdedPoet]

This is a terrible tragedy!  That poor baby!  I want to kill the evil bastard that did it!  I want to make him live for a year in that kind of abuse.  Make him feel malnourishment, dehydration, and beatings!  I want to break his bones and not take him to the doctor!  Just give me a year with him and then I want to snap his back like he did that poor baby.  I want him to suffer and die!

[Mathim]

My only real gripe with it has been that I've seen what people who habitually indulge in it are like. They are all lazy, shiftless losers who have absolutely no dreams or goals in life other than having as much pot as possible and who are mortally afraid of the future. They live totally in the present and are, in a word, pathetic. They're the sort of people, I would presume, that grow up to live paycheck to paycheck for the rest of their lives because they didn't do anything to make sure they'd have a good future. A few years of frivolity in their teens and twenties, and the rest of their lives are totally fucked off because they're too stupid to do well in school if they go back, or they won't pass drug tests because they never stop doing the things even if they reduce their usage while trying to kick-start their future.

[ShrowdedPoet]

My only real gripe with it has been that I've seen what people who habitually indulge in it are like. They are all lazy, shiftless losers who have absolutely no dreams or goals in life other than having as much pot as possible and who are mortally afraid of the future. They live totally in the present and are, in a word, pathetic. They're the sort of people, I would presume, that grow up to live paycheck to paycheck for the rest of their lives because they didn't do anything to make sure they'd have a good future. A few years of frivolity in their teens and twenties, and the rest of their lives are totally fucked off because they're too stupid to do well in school if they go back, or they won't pass drug tests because they never stop doing the things even if they reduce their usage while trying to kick-start their future.

Alright.  I've never done drugs, don't care to.  My uncle on the other hand has been doing drugs since he was 16 or younger, he's now in his late 40's.  He has a family, a house, a van, a motorcycle, a job working for the wal-mart home office, and quite a few dogs.  He's not the most inteligent fry in the vat but he's not an idiot either.  And he's a hard worker.  He's not lazy in any way! 

I perfer my uncle on pot cause he can be a very violent volitile man.  When he's on pot he's much more mellow and less crazy, scary, and violent. 

I just had to point out that not all drug users are the way you see them.  I've seen plenty of cases where they were good hard working people.

[Greenthorn]

My only real gripe with it has been that I've seen what people who habitually indulge in it are like. They are all lazy, shiftless losers who have absolutely no dreams or goals in life other than having as much pot as possible and who are mortally afraid of the future. They live totally in the present and are, in a word, pathetic. They're the sort of people, I would presume, that grow up to live paycheck to paycheck for the rest of their lives because they didn't do anything to make sure they'd have a good future. A few years of frivolity in their teens and twenties, and the rest of their lives are totally fucked off because they're too stupid to do well in school if they go back, or they won't pass drug tests because they never stop doing the things even if they reduce their usage while trying to kick-start their future.

You've got to be kidding?!

Again...hello!!

I did cocaine, acid, mushrooms, speed, and smoked pot for about 7 years of my life...and again...I'm intelligent, have kids, have employment....*sighs*

Mathim you never fail to really bring out my nasty side...nor do you ever fail to insult me by lumping people you find subpar into one group.  Shame on you.

[Rhapsody]

My only real gripe with it has been that I've seen what people who habitually indulge in it are like. They are all lazy, shiftless losers who have absolutely no dreams or goals in life other than having as much pot as possible and who are mortally afraid of the future. They live totally in the present and are, in a word, pathetic. They're the sort of people, I would presume, that grow up to live paycheck to paycheck for the rest of their lives because they didn't do anything to make sure they'd have a good future. A few years of frivolity in their teens and twenties, and the rest of their lives are totally fucked off because they're too stupid to do well in school if they go back, or they won't pass drug tests because they never stop doing the things even if they reduce their usage while trying to kick-start their future.

You can't blame the drugs entirely for that, doll.  That's mostly basic human laziness and lack of motivation.  Pot's completely out of your system in 20 or so days.

There are medical marijuana patients, like Irvin Rosenfield (one of the lucky seven to be federally funded before the US shut the program down for new intakes) who is a stockbroker.  He fully admits he smokes at least half a dozen joints during a working day, a dozen per day total, and successfully handles millions of dollars of client resources while he's doing it.  He uses it to relieve the pain of his benign bone tumors.  His employers support him, and all his clients know he uses it to manage his pain.  Maybe he's an exception, but I don't think he proves the rule.

Also, I do take exception to the "living paycheck to paycheck" coupled with "shiftless losers".  Living paycheck to paycheck is an unfortunate reality for a lot of people, myself included, because of the rising costs of basic necessities and craptacular state of economics.  It has little to do with "doing as little as possible to ensure your future" and everything to do with your circumstances opposed to the skyrocketing costs of things like groceries, gas and electricity.

[ShrowdedPoet]

Also, I do take exception to the "living paycheck to paycheck" coupled with "shiftless losers".  Living paycheck to paycheck is an unfortunate reality for a lot of people, myself included, because of the rising costs of basic necessities and craptacular state of economics.  It has little to do with "doing as little as possible to ensure your future" and everything to do with your circumstances opposed to the skyrocketing costs of things like groceries, gas and electricity.

*stands, applauds, and wipes a tear from my eye*  Beautifully stated!

[Bayushi]

Also, I do take exception to the "living paycheck to paycheck" coupled with "shiftless losers".  Living paycheck to paycheck is an unfortunate reality for a lot of people, myself included, because of the rising costs of basic necessities and craptacular state of economics.  It has little to do with "doing as little as possible to ensure your future" and everything to do with your circumstances opposed to the skyrocketing costs of things like groceries, gas and electricity.

Indeed.

And there are those of us who are forced to live paycheck-to-paycheck, namely seniors and the disabled.

There are a fair good amount of folks who became disabled before they'd worked long enough to receive disability benefits(SSDI: Supplemental Security Disability Income), instead receiving Social Security benefits(SSI: Supplemental Security Income). SSDI awards amounts proportionally equivalent to however much they were making before their disabling injury occurred. SSI awards the same amount, regardless(excluding states that voluntarily choose to add a 'cost of living adjustment', such as California). If I had worked but one year(quarter) longer, I would have been receiving approximately $1500 to $1800 US. Instead, I receive Social Security: $634 a month. Most one-bedroom apartments in my area cost approximately $650 per month, which prices me out of the housing market entirely. This doesn't include utilities/garbage and amenities(internet, etc).

So I obviously live paycheck to paycheck. And yet I'm 'villified' for being poor. I'm a good ways under the poverty line, by income. I do not even receive $10,000 a year. I have been priced out of housing, priced out of transportation(I can't afford a vehicle, insurance and/or gasoline), and if it weren't for Federally mandated Medicaid, I would be priced out of health care.

And to think.... the Dhimmicrats want to improve the lives of the lower-class of the country.... but put billions of tax dollars into pork projects(not that Republicans are exempt... but they're not preaching 'social justice by wealth redistribution') instead of giving the Social Security fund the billions they've pilfered from... back.

I'm permanently disabled, lucky to be able to still read, speak, walk, think critically, and type. And I am looking at a bleak future where I'll be destitute and back on the streets because the Social Security fund finally falls through when Congress raids it for more pork-barrel funding.

...sorry for bringing politics into it, but as you can see, I'm seeing problems ahead.

[Mathim]

Hey, I know about living paycheck to paycheck when my mom got disabled, and that was the reason I first experienced homelessness. Thanks to that, I'm going to college and getting a fucking master's degree no matter how many student loans I have to take out. Theoretically everyone should be able to do that. THEORETICALLY. I'm sure there are exceptions or everyone would do this, right? That's the smart thing to do, right?

I admit I should have rephrased my previous statement to 'the ones I have seen', meaning my former co-workers, and there were at least two dozen of them all in the same boat. I tried and tried to convince them to get back on track but to no avail, and that was a year ago, and they're still all stuck exactly where they were a year ago. I'm not saying people are capable of change (it's obviously possible) but the people I've been around who do drugs like that have ranged from just stealing their dad's medical marijuana to damaging their brains irreversibly on ecstasy. I haven't met anyone personally who was able to do this kind of thing without serious repercussions. But I'm sure it's possible, it's just much, much less likely for someone who habitually does drugs (and LOTS of drugs, to the point where you're messed up in class and at work) than someone who doesn't, to succeed in college and work. I mean, look at who's running the country.

[OldSchoolGamer]

Hey, I know about living paycheck to paycheck when my mom got disabled, and that was the reason I first experienced homelessness. Thanks to that, I'm going to college and getting a fucking master's degree no matter how many student loans I have to take out. Theoretically everyone should be able to do that. THEORETICALLY. I'm sure there are exceptions or everyone would do this, right? That's the smart thing to do, right?

Perhaps.

I never recommend anyone get a degree for the sake of getting a degree.  Degrees can be overrated.  Few are actually a guarantee of anything.  And bear in mind that if, for whatever reason, you are unable to repay those student loans, the government will hound you to the ends of the Earth to collect.  Bankruptcy won't help you.  They can and will get judgments, garnish your wages, ruin your credit...basically make your financial life miserable.  I had a friend of mine in that boat tell me she wished she had borrowed the money from the Mob because at least then she'd have known where she stood.

[The Overlord]

I never recommend anyone get a degree for the sake of getting a degree.  Degrees can be overrated.  Few are actually a guarantee of anything.  And bear in mind that if, for whatever reason, you are unable to repay those student loans, the government will hound you to the ends of the Earth to collect.  Bankruptcy won't help you.  They can and will get judgments, garnish your wages, ruin your credit...basically make your financial life miserable.  I had a friend of mine in that boat tell me she wished she had borrowed the money from the Mob because at least then she'd have known where she stood.

I'm about through with school myself but I'm really not concerned on the loans. I'll get them paid back. If Plan A doesn't accomplish that goal then Plans B, C, or D eventually will. There's plenty of money to be had out there, it's just how we go about it.