What are you playing? [SPOILER TAGS PLEASE]

[Wolfy]

You are.

The satisfaction of not taking the easy way. :D

[Hemingway]

Sort of the same satisfaction you'd get from driving while blindfolded, don't ya think?

And the game is fricking hard, too. It's just throwing legions of enemies at me, and then somehow expects me to destroy some building and kill a boss outside, too. It's like .. WHAT.

[Inkidu]

Sort of the same satisfaction you'd get from driving while blindfolded, don't ya think?

And the game is fricking hard, too. It's just throwing legions of enemies at me, and then somehow expects me to destroy some building and kill a boss outside, too. It's like .. WHAT.

That's why I don't play RTSes as much as I used to. Sure I still like the occasional C&C game, but that's kind of ending now. The computer will always be faster than you. It can move things and is an omnipresent force. You're never going to move fast enough or have enough if it doesn't want you to; I also think that RTS developers are closet sadists. Either the campaign is way too easy or way too hard, or the learning curve could win the Right Triangle of the Year contest.

It's the reason the rush, and the turtle are such tried and true methods in many games today. :(

[Hemingway]

Yeah, most RTSs end up making me think like, "if this were reality, it would've been much easier."

I don't see why everyone's trying to make the most fast-paced RTS. Everyone is bragging about how their RTS is the most fast-paced, action-packed thing ever, and all it is, is a mess of flying rockets and stuff that happens too fast for any real planning to take place.

I miss the first C&C. I've been a huge fan of the series, and I've played pretty much every RTS out there, but nothing can compare to good, old C&C. Just the fact you didn't have tanks until half a dozen missions into the game, and even then you couldn't actually build them, is amazing to me. And building one was an investment both in terms of cash and time. And they were vulnerable to regular infantry with bazookas, and their main guns were terrible against infantry.

I like DoW2, don't get me wrong. It's just sometimes way too chaotic. When the enemy is just throwing hordes of enemies at you, whether or not you positioned your guys properly sort of stops mattering, and everything gets reduced to just spamming health packs and hoping it'll work out.

[Inkidu]

Well no one wants to play a game where it takes two minutes to build a power plant but I get it. It shouldn't be about who can get the most of one unit type in there faster it should reward the person for using tactics. Like lure them in with a bunch of nod bikes and blow them away.

However, it basically boils down to all or nothing hits on a base.

[Hemingway]

I'm all for doing away with base building, though perhaps not in the way DoW 2 did.

What I don't like is how much tactics seem to get watered down. Why would I bother carefully planning a three-pronged combined arms strike when just bull-rushing the enemy is so much faster and easier?

Probably my favorite RTS ever is Ground Control 2. It didn't have base-building, which is something I actually enjoy when it's done properly. Instead, you got points from killing enemies and doing objectives, and had to secure landing zones to get new units. On top of that, you actually had to think and plan. Overwhelming enemy anti-tank turrets with a massed rush of tanks would just get your tanks killed. Or maybe I just sucked back when I played it, that is a distinct possibility.

[Inkidu]

That's what I kind of liked about Star Wars: Empire at War. Sure the campaign or galactic conquest let you build up lots of units but if you played skirmish you really had to think about what you wanted even though there was some light base building, it wasn't the focus.

[Hemingway]

The best part about that game was playing as the rebels and landing small commando units on Imperial planets. You could wipe out entire planets if you were smart about it. xD

Hmm.

That was a pretty underrated game. I heard the expansion sucked, though.

[Sabby]

I don't play RTS games, but what about sappers/covert options? When you say 'it all boils down to an all or nothing assault' I picture sending sneaky types into their city to do things like... I dunno, arson? Sabotage the back gate and then throw a huge force at the front to occupy them while a second attack comes to the now unlocked gate. They'd have options for patrols though, to sniff out these guys, but they could blend in with the civvies.

Another thing I've always wondered, why health bars? Is there an RTS game where if someones shot in the head, they die? Or when they take a shot that doesn't kill them, they get injured? And I'm not talking "Oops, I died, fall over now" I mean have characters with context sensitive animations. Picture firing from a hill as a group of the enemy storm, a volley of gunfire hits them and they cartwheel and stumble and faceplant, and as the rest die, the ones thatw ere only downed try to climb to their feet and limb away but get torn up.

That's how I'd imagine an RTS being... not this number crunching.

[Bayushi]

I really can't play RTS games any more.

Starcraft got overplayed. Starcraft II has all these 1337 players pwning n00bs, so you barely get any decent experience playing the game online. Too busy getting destroyed so quickly that I'm too busy trying to figure out wtf just happened.

WC3 appears to be dead, even on B.net, so can't say much there.

The campaigns for these games are nice, but not worth the absurd amounts of cash you have to pay for them. Seriously, $50 for SC2 and it's only 1/3 of the campaign? REALLY?!

[avorae]

I am splitting my time between MUA 2, FF7, Fable 3, and Mass Effect 2

[Hemingway]

I don't play RTS games, but what about sappers/covert options? When you say 'it all boils down to an all or nothing assault' I picture sending sneaky types into their city to do things like... I dunno, arson? Sabotage the back gate and then throw a huge force at the front to occupy them while a second attack comes to the now unlocked gate. They'd have options for patrols though, to sniff out these guys, but they could blend in with the civvies.

Another thing I've always wondered, why health bars? Is there an RTS game where if someones shot in the head, they die? Or when they take a shot that doesn't kill them, they get injured? And I'm not talking "Oops, I died, fall over now" I mean have characters with context sensitive animations. Picture firing from a hill as a group of the enemy storm, a volley of gunfire hits them and they cartwheel and stumble and faceplant, and as the rest die, the ones thatw ere only downed try to climb to their feet and limb away but get torn up.

That's how I'd imagine an RTS being... not this number crunching.

I was going to write a long answer, but to answer both questions at the same time; there are no games like that. It seems like everything is multiplayer-focused nowadays, and multiplayer is all about either rushing, or occasionally turtling. I can't think of any games that don't boil down to being really good at pressing hotkeys to build as much crap as fast as possible.

[Wolfy]

I was going to write a long answer, but to answer both questions at the same time; there are no games like that. It seems like everything is multiplayer-focused nowadays, and multiplayer is all about either rushing, or occasionally turtling. I can't think of any games that don't boil down to being really good at pressing hotkeys to build as much crap as fast as possible.

Actually, Dawn of War isn't about building as much crap as possible, oddly enough. :/

There's almost no building mechanic in the game at all, just capturing points and bringing in new units. There is no resource management or structure building.

[Sabby]

Was Halo Wars any good?

[Inkidu]

Was Halo Wars any good?

From what I read in Game Informer. It's good for a console RTS, in fact it's superb. The multiplayer is great, but it suffers from some campaign levels that have constantly spawning enemies and such. I think it scored around a nine. It's about twenty bucks American.

[Wolfy]

Was Halo Wars any good?

Ish ok.

[Hemingway]

Actually, Dawn of War isn't about building as much crap as possible, oddly enough. :/

There's almost no building mechanic in the game at all, just capturing points and bringing in new units. There is no resource management or structure building.

Yeah, but it's not about micromanaging and using clever tactics, either. It's still about sending your guys to capture undefended points, and while they're doing that, build a lot of guys and send them to capture more points. It's still just a matter of who's faster at hitting hotkeys. At least that's my experience.

[Inkidu]

It's one of those things that's just convention. Hell even Starcraft II (which by some people's reckoning is Jesus on a disc) suffers from a lot of the same rushing and turtling tactics. I hear the nerfed the Zerg rush but these things never really die. Some gamer with too much math and free time shifts around some units and some new fast macro-tactic emerges that whips people in no time.

"No matter how good you are at an RTS there's some South Korean nine-year-old ready to beat you with your own strategy." -Unknown.

[Wolfy]

Ahem.

Playing Kingdom Hearts Re:coded

in two weeks I'll be playing Dead space.

Then two(three?) weeks after that Marvel Vs Capcom 3.

Then Bulletstorm (Really only going to pre-order and buy it to get into the Gears of War 3 Beta. Lol)

Then March 6th will be Pokemon time. I'm getting White (For now..might change to Black..need to look at the exclusives).

it's gonna be a busy couple of months...Especially Marvel Vs Capcom 3...I want to get really good at it. :P

[Inkidu]

Wolfy, don't you end up returning most fighting games you buy?

[Oniya]

It's kind of like renting them, only different.

[Wolfy]

Wolfy, don't you end up returning most fighting games you buy?

On most cases, yes. But Crossover games like this I enjoy and keep. :D

[Wolfy]

Thor - down down fierce - MvC3 preview

Lol.

[zoarster]

I have officially been sucked into the living Internet meme that is Minecraft.

[Sabby]

I was playing Ninja Gaiden 2, but that can go fuck itself (NINJA DOGS!! BRAWWGHGHRRWRGHGFDFE!!!!)

Then I was playing Just Cause 2. That can also go fuck itself. (RPGS! BRAWWGHGHHHHRRW!!!)

Then I was playing Jurassic Park: Trespasser... and as much as I wanna rage at the physics engine that seems to make me drop my gun if I so much as turn too quickly, I can't. It gave me a zombie raptor <3

I shot it in the head. It goes staggering back... and looks at me. I'm like >.> Shoot it again. It wobbles. Shoot it again. It's still standing there, looking at me o.O So I inch close and nudge it's nose with my gun. The end presses his nose. I push until his neck bends. Rear the gun back and tap his cheek. Rear it and smack him. His head wobbles to the side.

Suddenly, I'm all like ... =D and run to grab all the chairs from inside and just hurl them at him, swing them down on his back, smack his head, throw one under his legs and then chair ram him to trip over them into a wall.

So I get bored, go to another building, come out... and he's right there! Like an obedient dog! Looking at me! I go SQUEE! ZOMBIE RAPTOR DOGGY! And unload my AK into his side so he goes tripping down the stairs.