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Author Topic: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies  (Read 295048 times)

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Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3850 on: August 17, 2018, 11:14:37 AM »
I liked the slapstick, it's very fitting for a movie about the most boneheaded Avenger. I can't really get behind that complaint about the drunken Valkyrie (it's pretty clear why and makes perfect sense, and gives an otherwise awesome character a charming flaw), though given we've seen his brother the Collector's personality, I can see how the Grandmaster not being a polar opposite would be disappointing, I just had WAY too much fun with Goldblum's performance to care. Maybe if it had been a different character, like the Red King or something, it wouldn't have been so disappointing for others but if we didn't see the Grandmaster here, we probably never would have in the MCU.

I will agree that Hopkins deserved more screen time, perhaps being a specter in Thor's mind one or two more times during his incarceration would have been better. As for Hela, I think if she had revealed publicly Odin's dirty secrets and gotten the people to really despair that even their prince might be a bad seed, but in the end the people showed that they never gave up hope in Thor, would have been more meaningful. Then she could have been defeated both symbolically AND physically.

Also I had made peace with Hulk never getting his own movie ever again so them integrating Planet Hulk here was probably the closest we'd have ever gotten to it anyway so I couldn't have been disappointed knowing the situation in advance. Now, if they had announced a Secret Wars film a while ago, then I'd say, yeah, wait til that one to do Planet Hulk's MCU adaptation, but it doesn't seem like we'll ever get that.

Anyway, given the contrast between the MCU and the DCEU, I'm glad they went with a more humorous approach, that makes experiencing the film with friends an even bigger blast. As for ending it upbeat...considering the very next thing is going to be a slaughter on their ship, I'm actually a little glad they gave us a little more to smile about before dimming the lights on the universe.

Offline Beorning

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3851 on: August 17, 2018, 11:57:34 AM »
I liked the slapstick, it's very fitting for a movie about the most boneheaded Avenger.

Well, as I said - I have no problem with Thor and humour. But not in a movie that is about Ragnarok! The slapstick was completely undercutting the serious parts of the movie. It was as if the director didn't care about the main storyline and just wanted to have silly fun.

It's as if they made a Dark Phoenix Saga movie, had Jean Grey blew up planets in the background, but focused on Wolverine and Cyclops getting drunk in a biker bar and slipping on banana peels...

Quote
I can't really get behind that complaint about the drunken Valkyrie (it's pretty clear why and makes perfect sense, and gives an otherwise awesome character a charming flaw)

In my opinion, having her be so much drunk that she was falling off of the stairs just made her look like a fool. Also, it furthered the comedic nature on the movie... not to mention, drunk people falling off the stairs is the real low end of comedy.

Quote
Though given we've seen his brother the Collector's personality, I can see how the Grandmaster not being a polar opposite would be disappointing, I just had WAY too much fun with Goldblum's performance to care. Maybe if it had been a different character, like the Red King or something, it wouldn't have been so disappointing for others but if we didn't see the Grandmaster here, we probably never would have in the MCU.

But what's the point of introducing a long-established character, if you change everything about him? Goldblum wasn't playing the real Grandmaster here. He was playing some idiot who just looked a little like the Grandmaster.

I admit that, in general, I'm getting tired of MCU introducing various classic Marvel concepts and characters while changing them completely.

Quote
I will agree that Hopkins deserved more screen time, perhaps being a specter in Thor's mind one or two more times during his incarceration would have been better. As for Hela, I think if she had revealed publicly Odin's dirty secrets and gotten the people to really despair that even their prince might be a bad seed, but in the end the people showed that they never gave up hope in Thor, would have been more meaningful. Then she could have been defeated both symbolically AND physically.

See, that's the kind of thing that could've been done with that movie. Instead, we got all these Sakaar antics...

Quote
Also I had made peace with Hulk never getting his own movie ever again so them integrating Planet Hulk here was probably the closest we'd have ever gotten to it anyway so I couldn't have been disappointed knowing the situation in advance. Now, if they had announced a Secret Wars film a while ago, then I'd say, yeah, wait til that one to do Planet Hulk's MCU adaptation, but it doesn't seem like we'll ever get that.

The problem is, Ragnarok wasn't really a good Planet Hulk adaptation, was it? They just lifted a few ideas from that storyline, but changed everything else. It was all wasted, really.

Quote
Anyway, given the contrast between the MCU and the DCEU, I'm glad they went with a more humorous approach, that makes experiencing the film with friends an even bigger blast. As for ending it upbeat...considering the very next thing is going to be a slaughter on their ship, I'm actually a little glad they gave us a little more to smile about before dimming the lights on the universe.

Yeah, but the thing is, that upbeat ending with cheery 80s music just doesn't fit, either. We just saw a world being destroyed! That ending just underscores that the creators didn't really care about the story. They just used it as an excuse to make gags...

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3852 on: August 19, 2018, 12:51:57 AM »
I guess I just have a higher tolerance for the MCU having to take liberties to fit things in that it never otherwise would. I think Ragnarok being a gritty, grim film throughout in order to accommodate the gravity of the end of Asgard would have made it far worse than anything being claimed about it as is, and would have seriously lacked in any kind of adventure element which Sakaar's arena and escape provided. Give it an extra 15-20 minutes to throw in more Odin and Hela and, apart from the objections about the humor which I disagree about, the only other complaint, that of Grandmaster, would be able to be addressed. If Goldblum could have portrayed the Red King and simply be the supervisor of Sakaar while the Grandmaster is the actual OWNER of Sakaar, could have been a good way to set up a future storyline. But when you've got Thanos on the horizon, it doesn't make sense to introduce a potential Avengers-level villain right before that. Having him be as 'human' as the Collector was, as far as the MCU goes, more realistic and didn't leave any loose threads hanging in the face of Thanos' arrival.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2018, 12:56:37 AM by Mathim »

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3853 on: September 05, 2018, 05:43:46 PM »
Captain Marvel's costume is finally revealed for realsies! I guess all the green on the costume from those preliminary pics was indeed for green screen purposes because her new look is SICK!

Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide

There's also a nod to Monica Rambeau, with someone cast as her mother Maria 'Photon' Rambeau (a nod to Monica's later name Photon), so that's cool. Maybe we'll get to see both Captain Marvel ladies on the screen in Phase 4.

Online Hunter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3854 on: September 07, 2018, 09:38:02 PM »
I had heard or read some really bad reviews about Black Panther only to be pleasantly surprised by the entire movie.   I really enjoyed how it developed and loved King T'Challa's speech to the U.N. at the end.

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3855 on: September 08, 2018, 12:48:20 AM »
I had heard or read some really bad reviews about Black Panther only to be pleasantly surprised by the entire movie.   I really enjoyed how it developed and loved King T'Challa's speech to the U.N. at the end.

I wonder where from! It was largely the consensus among critics and general audiences that it was fantastic, and it didn't make as much as it did at the box office for nothing.

I started watching Iron Fist season 2. Yawn. It's not unlike how season 2 of Jessica Jones was as bad as the first but for entirely different reasons. The whole thing is just so preposterously predictable and, like JJ season 2, nobody seems to give enough of a damn to actually do something about what the obvious problem is and previous relationships be damned. You'd think they'd have learned to give that shit up by now with Bakuto betraying Colleen and whatnot even after their long-term and deep relationship. I'm at about episode 7 and there's only 10 this season which would have benefited JJ since there's not really much actual substance to the story there (Luke Cage and Daredevil are both crushing it with their 13-episode lengths), but I can definitely see why they started doing this if they're still not trying their best with Iron Fist. It breaks with the pattern of having actual interesting, well-developed villains and goes for the dime store equivalent of butt-hurt Loki as we saw Davos being groomed at the end of the first season. Very light on cameos so far but maybe the last 4 episodes will surprise me (though I doubt it at this rate). If you didn't like the first season, you're not likely to enjoy this very much. The first episode is actually pretty good but suffers from that very rapid accumulation of lag by the second episode. Methinks season 3 of Daredevil would have been better positioned here, and then this.

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3856 on: September 08, 2018, 10:23:36 PM »
Wow, did that latter half of I.F. season 2 take a turn for the worse to a magnitude that I couldn't have predicted. The MCU hasn't insulted the source material that much since Iron Man 3. Hopefully Daredevil season 3 will take the bad taste of this away when it comes out. So Jessica Jones and Iron Fist both have perfect track records so far of terrible seasons consecutively...very glad I canceled my subscription and am borrowing my friend's password.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2018, 11:03:15 PM by Mathim »

Online Hunter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3857 on: September 09, 2018, 01:09:06 AM »
Wow, did that latter half of I.F. season 2 take a turn for the worse to a magnitude that I couldn't have predicted. The MCU hasn't insulted the source material that much since Iron Man 3. Hopefully Daredevil season 3 will take the bad taste of this away when it comes out. So Jessica Jones and Iron Fist both have perfect track records so far of terrible seasons consecutively...very glad I canceled my subscription and am borrowing my friend's password.

Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
They killed off Daredevil in "The Defenders".   Don't hope for much.

Online TheSithChicken

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3858 on: September 09, 2018, 01:13:40 PM »
Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
They killed off Daredevil in "The Defenders".   Don't hope for much.

Umm... no they didn't. They showed him in a hospital at the end of the show.

Online Hunter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3859 on: September 09, 2018, 05:50:17 PM »
Umm... no they didn't. They showed him in a hospital at the end of the show.

Then I remembered wrong.    :'(

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3860 on: September 10, 2018, 01:35:58 PM »
LOL, beat me to correcting it. Although, I will add he wakes up in a nunnery and one of the sisters tells another to go get a woman who is likely to be Matt's mother whom he hasn't had any contact with since before his dad died, so we'll see how that goes. DD season 3 is supposed to drop later this year, probably around Xmas unless they wait til 2019. But since everyone in the Defenders will have gotten their season 2 done by now (except Punisher, but he wasn't in the Defenders anyway) it should be soon that we get another Defenders season announced. Too bad there's so little buildup for any new overarching threat. If they introduce Blade, that alone would merit getting the gang back together and add more diversity since they'd be going hardcore into the supernatural. But they won't. That would be too awesome to handle.

I'm still hoping they'll bring in Shang Chi at some point, I think he and Danny would get along well, although as I mentioned, I didn't care for the direction they went with at the end there with this season of Iron Fist, so I'm not sure how much effort I'll put into keeping up with these series if they're not ones with a good track record.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2018, 03:57:34 PM by Mathim »

Offline TheGlyphstone

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3861 on: September 12, 2018, 11:33:29 AM »

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3862 on: September 12, 2018, 07:47:57 PM »
See, to me that says they either are, or should have already, scrapping the DCEU and started over. I've got nothing against Cavill as the character, it's the character's portrayal as written that was the problem. I do like conceptually what they wanted to do with Aquaman and Shazam but I just really, really wish they could have started a new continuity with them and just distanced them from the rest of the JL and what came before it. A Flashpoint movie would have fixed that (with Kevin Smith directing...that would be so awesome) and let use have the best of both worlds with a Days of Future Past style soft reboot, but no, they can only copy the MCU (poorly), not the X-Men. Take the blinders off, Warner Brothers.

Offline DeMalachine

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3863 on: September 18, 2018, 08:45:52 AM »
Cap trailer finally drops. Looks pretty damn good.


Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3864 on: September 18, 2018, 02:39:41 PM »
Fuck, you beat me to it. I have to wait til my lunch to watch it with sound but just visually, yeah, looks awesome. Can't wait! And oh, Samuel L. Jackson, every penny spent on making you look like your Pulp Fiction self is worth it.

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3865 on: September 27, 2018, 02:13:02 PM »
Can't believe how close together the next season of Daredevil is being released after we just got Iron Fist so recently.


Offline CaptainNexus616

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3866 on: September 30, 2018, 09:18:00 AM »
Honestly its about time if I'm going to be frank.

I re-watched the first season of Daredevil again a few weeks back and forgot how much I enjoyed it. I'm all ready to see an adaptation of the Born Again story line especially with Vincent returning as Fisk. Seeing these two pull themselves back up from their lowest points for another battle will hopefully be exciting.

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3867 on: September 30, 2018, 08:16:23 PM »
It looks like Matt has taken off the kid gloves, as it were, so he's finally agreeing with the Punisher, about the lethal approach. Curious how that's going to go now that he's downgraded back to the early season 1 costume and doesn't have his good costume and sticks/grappling hook.

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3868 on: October 03, 2018, 02:17:31 PM »
Venom's sitting at 28% on Rottentomatoes. Par for the course as far as Sony's track record goes, it's down there with the DCEU's lowest scores. My friend is still going to see it, but I'm giving it a pass. I can't remember if it was supposed to be set in the MCU or not but I hope it isn't.


...Okay, I spoke too soon. I apparently won more free IMAX tickets to it so I'll probably see it since I'm not the one paying for it. I know at least one other friend who'll want to see it anyway so maybe it'll be better with a friend.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2018, 11:06:05 PM by Mathim »

Offline CaptainNexus616

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3869 on: October 04, 2018, 11:46:35 PM »


The Return of the King

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3870 on: October 07, 2018, 01:47:02 AM »


The Return of the King

Fuuuuuuck, I can't wait, that looks amazingly bitchin'.

As for Venom...

I'd say it was okay. Not terrible, not good, not great, just somewhere middling. Mainly the pace of the first act could have been a bit more balanced with excitement because it was practically non-stop once the second act began. A lot of the action was pretty difficult to handle because it was night during most of those scenes and his color scheme is all black, and it devolves into that rough jump-cutting that makes it nigh-impossible to follow for a great deal of the fighting. What I was able to see, though, I enjoyed, and in all honesty, even if there hadn't been a mid-credits tease for the next one (I didn't stay to see if there was also a post-credits since the mid-credits one was so satisfying), I would have supported there being a sequel, I think there's now a whole hell of a lot more potential in the follow-up than in this origin story. Now that the general gist is out of the way, here's some spoiler stuff.
Spoiler: Click to Show/Hide
Eddie wasn't exactly charming or likeable and him being played by Tom Hardy (whose teeth I never noticed before seeing them in IMAX 3D but they look even more crooked than my own) didn't help that since I haven't got a positive opinion on him. The lack of control the symbiote had in terms of behavior and hunger during its initial bonding to Eddie was off-putting and didn't really add much, it just made it harder to accept that the symbiote knew what it was doing when it finally took control to get Eddie out of the shitstorm he found himself in. The amount of collateral damage the bad guys were causing in pursuit of Venom during the big chase was absolutely asinine and to think they'd get away with that without being caught was laughable, yet it happened. But since their whole corporation and leadership ended up killed and/or destroyed, it wouldn't matter in the end anyway, but still, that they'd go to those lengths and cause that much mayhem in the effort was just foolish.

The villain was cliche as were the things he did, I'm not familiar with the actor but I'd have preferred someone more physically imposing just given how things look and turn out. Also it seemed like there was a missed opportunity with the scientist who helped Eddie infiltrate the Life Foundation, she could have bonded with the symbiote that was made to kill her and tried to stop the villain, only to be killed by him and his superior symbiote, which would have made more sense as far as why it wanted Venom eliminated, but no, they went with the cliche 'no loose ends' approach.

The symbiotes having names like they did was never really explained, so that was pretty dumb on its own. Venom being sort of his world's version of post-disgrace Eddie Brock was both humorous and kind of a good way of showing why they bonded, but when it came to Venom deciding to be a hero, it needed to be spelled out more why it was inspired by Eddie to do so, that wasn't exactly clear why it would risk its own life to save humanity from a symbiote invasion from the few hours it had spent with Eddie as its host. A few flashbacks or more conversations with the symbiote accessing Eddie's memories would have accomplished that, and with the movie barely being 2 hours long, that could have been easily inserted without needing more special effects budget.

I had though the symbiote having its own sort of selfish personality and more control over Eddie would be a bad thing but it turned out not to be, at least in this universe where Spider-Man had nothing to do with him. Eddie Brock's character being changed to someone less assertive and judicious helped the dominant symbiote personality work, and it having a voice that we the audience hear worked to its benefit rather than simply having Eddie reacting to unheard voices. Its gruesome sense of humor did grow on me, in spite of how over-the-top it was, so I'm actually looking forward to seeing them interact from the very beginning in the next movie and have their connection deepen. This story does have a lot more potential and if they play it right, the sequel might turn out better even if it is Sony's project.

The mid-credits scene...Woody Harrelson in a Ronald McDonald wig as Cletus Kasady, threatening 'Carnage' when he escapes from prison...they have the recipe for a spectacular sequel, I have no confidence they won't fuck it up, but all the pieces are there. Let's hope someone who knows what they're doing gets to pick them up and put them together. I am convinced of three things as far as it's concerned:
1. It has to be rated R. There's just no other way to evolve the story in the direction it needs to go. It worked for Deadpool, it'll work for Venom. As far as making a better quality film, at least; can't really say the successful box office numbers will follow, but if they deliver on the promises this movie had, it might be worth the risk.
2. It should be called Venom: Carnage Rules.
3. The Venom symbiote should release its spawn when Eddie Brock is present at Cletus Kasady's execution, so the transformation into Carnage can happen as Kasady is supposed to be getting put down, making it the most dramatic moment for him to be able to escape and wreak havoc while doing so.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2018, 08:59:07 AM by Mathim »

Offline DeMalachine

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3871 on: October 08, 2018, 02:25:54 PM »
Despite attracting a stinker of a score on Rotten Tomatoes, Venom is doing some pretty healthy box office: https://ew.com/movies/2018/10/07/venom-star-is-born-box-office-record/

Interstingly, the 30% critics score on RT is contrasted quite heavily by the 88% audience score (at time of writing). People are likin' it.

Offline Arkaniel

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3872 on: October 08, 2018, 04:34:49 PM »
I watched it Saturday evening and I thought it was a fun, entertaining movie. I’m not going to look at it from a critic’s point of view, but I went with the intention to see a fun movie and it exceeded my expectations.

Offline MathimTopic starter

Re: The Gauntlet Has Been Thrown: The Future of Superhero Movies
« Reply #3873 on: October 08, 2018, 07:31:29 PM »
My expectations were rock-bottom so it did end up being somewhat of a surprise. My friend gave it a 6.5/10 overall, I landed on a flat 6. It's still a D- but not a failure.