Perceptions: Older men in relationships with young women

[Clio]

I feel like Cher might be an interesting comparison to make.

I think I said in my post that gender doesn’t matter. It’s the pattern that makes it worrisome.

People will always get weirded out about things outside of what they consider to be the norm.
If no illegal acts are performed, they will have to deal with it.
Of course, freedom of speech allows them to voice their displeasure, but it also allows others to tell them what they think of it.

And that’s fine. They’re not going to jail. But many of us have experienced predatory behavior and want to protect others from it. *shrugs*

[Twisted Crow]

Yeah, that's more or less my camp, as well.

[Al Terego]

And that’s fine. They’re not going to jail. But many of us have experienced predatory behavior and want to protect others from it. *shrugs*

That sentiment is commendable, but where do we draw the line between trying to protect others and meddling, and what lengths are justifiable?

Two people, large age gap.
Both of legal age and sound mental capacity, both appear to be willing.

It might be the case that there is some exploitation (or preying, as you put it) involved, but in that case I would assume that the power gap (status, money, influence, etc.) is more important than the age gap.
Then again, the younger person may be fully aware of the the role they are expected to play in that relationship and just wants to tick "dated / slept with a celebrity" off their bucket list.

[Oniya]

Let's put it this way - if I had a child that either Leo or Cher 'took an interest in', I would make sure to point out that pattern, so that they were fully aware of the situation.  Even though that child would be a legal adult and able to give their consent.  (Little Oni is ace, and unlikely to give reciprocal interest to either Leo or Cher.  Neither one has enough interests in common with her to get to the point that flirting would be even noticed.)

[Beorning]

Let's put it this way - if I had a child that either Leo or Cher 'took an interest in', I would make sure to point out that pattern, so that they were fully aware of the situation.  Even though that child would be a legal adult and able to give their consent.  (Little Oni is ace, and unlikely to give reciprocal interest to either Leo or Cher.  Neither one has enough interests in common with her to get to the point that flirting would be even noticed.)

One week from now:

Little Oni: Hey Mom! Guess whom I just started dating! Two hints: his first name is "Leo" and his last name is "DiCaprio"!

Oniya: Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh! That's what I get for tempting fate with carelessly spoken words!

*ducks*

[Al Terego]

Let's put it this way - if I had a child that either Leo or Cher 'took an interest in', I would make sure to point out that pattern, so that they were fully aware of the situation.  Even though that child would be a legal adult and able to give their consent.

Oh, absolutely!  I'd do the same.

[Oniya]

One week from now:

Little Oni: Hey Mom! Guess whom I just started dating! Two hints: his first name is "Leo" and his last name is "DiCaprio"!

Oniya: Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh! That's what I get for tempting fate with carelessly spoken words!

*ducks*

Of the two, she's more likely to notice Cher than Leo.

[Clio]

Oh, absolutely!  I'd do the same.

And I think that’s what we’re saying here. It’s not illegal, and there are always chances that the relationship is genuine. Even if it’s just transactional, that’s totally up to them. The problem comes with the imbalance of power and those who abuse that. Leo? I don’t know. He could just be immature. Cher could be the same. The problem is the pattern, as Oniya and I have said, and it’s not surprising that it bothers many people. Just because something is legal doesn’t mean it can’t still cause harm, so it’s good to keep an eye out.

[Beguile's Mistress]

I've often found older men to be a better deal than younger men who are immature compared to what I like.  I've always liked a wider age gap than most people do.  It makes me feel more comfortable.

[Deamonbane]

I've read somewhere that people's brains aren't fully developed until 25 years old? Something like that? Which is why I'd say that people who consistently look for a partner who's under that age could point to a controlling aspect of the relationship which might be unhealthy.

That said, I haven't heard of any of Leo's girlfriends voicing any complaints about how he treats them. I'm not sure if that's a good indicator for what's going on, though. My going theory is that he's in need of a beard, as it were, but that's neither here nor there.

The power dynamics involved is what gets most people to raise their eyebrows. Is it illegal for a boss to date an employee? Not necessarily. It's also not technically illegal for professors to date of-age students. But there's a reason why both these examples are frowned upon if not outright banned in most places of business and universities and is a liability insurance nightmare.

As was said before, what's going on in the privacy of their relationship is between them.  Doesn't mean we can't comment on the potential for power imbalances and the abuses which have been perpetuated under similar conditions in the past.

[Clio]

I've read somewhere that people's brains aren't fully developed until 25 years old? Something like that? Which is why I'd say that people who consistently look for a partner who's under that age could point to a controlling aspect of the relationship which might be unhealthy.

That said, I haven't heard of any of Leo's girlfriends voicing any complaints about how he treats them. I'm not sure if that's a good indicator for what's going on, though. My going theory is that he's in need of a beard, as it were, but that's neither here nor there.

The power dynamics involved is what gets most people to raise their eyebrows. Is it illegal for a boss to date an employee? Not necessarily. It's also not technically illegal for professors to date of-age students. But there's a reason why both these examples are frowned upon if not outright banned in most places of business and universities and is a liability insurance nightmare.

As was said before, what's going on in the privacy of their relationship is between them.  Doesn't mean we can't comment on the potential for power imbalances and the abuses which have been perpetuated under similar conditions in the past.

Agreed.

[Trigon]

I'm inclined to say that the "half your age plus 7 rule" generally breaks down outside of a narrow range of ages. For example, by the age of 50 the younger partner is 32...

But beyond that, I don't think there is anything wrong with large age gaps at least in principle. My personal experience has been that it matters much less when both partners are older. Say, one is 30 and the other is 40+ vs one being 20 and the other 30+. Generally I don't go younger than about 24, but that's just me.

[Trigon]

Here are some statistics regarding age gap relationships if you want to take a look: https://relationshipsadvice.co/age-gap-relationship-statistics/#t-1665985537165

Apparently it is far more common among same sex couples, particularly men. And in the USA, it is more socially acceptable for the male to be older.

[Forsaken]

I find it interesting that in an age where "acceptance" is a big thing as well as identity and personal freedom that it is considered ok to shame an older man x younger woman relationship.

There are a lot of assumptions that are made to allow the shaming;

*  The woman is being manipulated/coerced in some way - because she is young and doesn't have a clue.
* The man is paying her. Could be the case but lets be honest the man tends to pay in most cases anyway, in some form or another.
* The man is controlling her or can't handle a woman his own age, needs to have some little doe that he can have superiority over.

I recently saw a Youtube clip where older women are trying to shame younger women. Telling them not to have relationships with older men. Basically these older women are jealous and feel threatened.

Shaming is the main tool employed in all cases of course. The problem is the shaming of men and white heterosexual men in particular has become so common that most of us don't give a shit anymore.

[Starling]

Okay, I'll be prefacing this by saying that I do not live in the US.

However, could the general acceptance of a fictional 40-something-year-old dating a 19-year-old, be partially attributed to the fact that the person is indeed fictional and thus can be predicted? We can know much more about that person, and we can assume based on that whether or not they can be trusted to not take advantage of the 19-year-old's lack of experience with the wider world and people in general. There is more than one type of intelligence mind you, and experience is just as important as the knowledge itself. Especially in real life. 

Also, in fiction, fictional people get harmed. Not real ones. It's easier to sleep at night knowing that, I guess. 

Hence Leonardo Di Caprio's romances are frowned upon because they are very real, and because real human beings as so much less predictable, so much more complicated, and less trustworthy than fictional characters. This is a very real barely-and-adult, potentially with far less experience dating a man whose intentions we can't truly know because all he shows is a crafted public persona... We don't truly know if his relationship is a healthy one or not, and just the possibility that it might not be, is made worse by this age gap that increases the chances of this being an unhealthy relationship. 

Also, as someone has mentioned, Di Caprio seems to have a preference, a predilection to dating people below the age when the brain finishes developing - around the age of 25 - who are more likely to be impulsive (not that they will be, just are more likely to be). I feel if he stuck it out and still dated them even after this point, it'd be less weird. But he dumps them once they become, I guess "too mature" for him mentally. And he is not the only celebrity - heck, male celebrities are not the only ones who indulge in this - to do so. Besides, it can be seen as a status thing. If you're that rich, famous, and successful, many more will know you and thus potentially want to date you, many more young, attractive folk you can hang off your shoulder as decoration. Or that's how it reads. Besides, you mention that the character the cop fell for was "intelligent". Not much of a personality, but it means we know something about her. We never get to know anything about Di Caprio's dates, just that they are young. It reduces them to their age and does no favours to either party. 

... And perhaps that's what worries people most. The reality of it. 

It's no longer a fantasy, and therefore, the unsaid rules change.

And, hey, I ain't saying whether it's right or wrong. For all we know, Leonardo's relationships could be perfectly healthy, and happy relationship and the two just then go their separate ways because they got what they wanted and they're ready to move on. I think it's just that the other partner is barely into adulthood, maybe the younger partner reminds parents of a daughter they'd wish to protect from potentially sketchy folk because she's of a similar age to their own children, or maybe it icks out people her age because they don't really trust guys in general, especially older ones.  

Plus, Hollywood has, in general, a nasty history of sexual abuse/harassment. (Often between older guys and younger women/girls.) Which doesn't boost confidence. 

I can see why people are worried about both older men dating much younger women and older women dating much younger men, but I can also consider the idea that maybe in some cases it really is just an overreaction and things are okay. 

Still, these things very much depend on individual circumstances and we won't know if DiCaprio is taking advantage of anyone until they speak up. 

Innocent until proven guilty and all that. 

However, I'd probably inform someone in that 19-25 age range if a celebrity who was dating them had such a pattern, as others have mentioned. It's not like young adults can't figure things out for themselves and don't have any critical thinking ability.