Looking for Legend of the Five Rings! L5R!

Started by Flying Tengu, May 26, 2015, 02:29:27 AM

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Flying Tengu

I've been very enthusiastic about Legend of the Five Rings lately, and would love to do just about anything with it.  Small group!  Large group!  One on one!  With just about any subject matter!

Let me know if you'd like to give some sort of L5R a try!

Muse

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Sorrow Singer

Never tried the l5r rpg. I did play the card game though. and i very much like the setting. If you need players id love to give it a shot

kckolbe

Big fan of the setting and have a couple of good modules for it.  What kind of things would you like to see in terms of time period and themes?
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Flying Tengu

Quote from: kckolbe on May 26, 2015, 07:41:31 PM
Big fan of the setting and have a couple of good modules for it.  What kind of things would you like to see in terms of time period and themes?

Speaking for myself regarding time period, I'm most comfortable with the era in the first edition L5R corebook, before empire-threatening disasters started regularly occurring.  So, anywhere post Unicorn return to before the Scorpion coup.  Before the Unicorn return is also probably ok, but the Unicorn are pretty neat.  I believe that, for later timelines, AEG at some point introduced a time-jump to settle things down a little; that would probably also be an acceptable time.

For themes... yikes.  That's a difficult question.  Personally, I enjoy playing with the various competing pulls in the life of a samurai.  Honor vs duty vs personal desire.  The third one is supposed to lose out to the others, but as a big ol' romantic softie, I like to have romance win out from time to time.  Or, at least, find a good balance.

But really, there's all sorts of fun things that can be done with it!

Muse

  ^_^;;  I don't know the timeline well enough to begin to guess when.  :)  Pitch me a plot and I'll build for it. 

  Might be fun to finaly play my sparrow, though! 
A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

How to set this Muse ablaze (O/Os)

When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

AllieCat

Ooh, L5R, been rereading all my 4th edition books (I have em all in hardcover except the newest one and the out of print enemies of the empire)

I should run something :D

Muse

*peeks* 

Ooh.  :)  Would be wonderful if you did, Allie.  :) 
A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

How to set this Muse ablaze (O/Os)

When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

Empyrean

It's been a while since I read the L5R stuff, but I remember having an idea for a young shujenga (Phoenix, Mantis, or maybe Unicorn), who has a secret love. That is, a samurai woman loves him (I'm thinking Spider or if Spider's not available then Scorpion). He has no idea she loves him, and wants to corrupt/manipulate him for her clan's benefit. I was thinking it would be a disadvantage. The character himself is nice, naive, and a big believer in virtues like Compassion.

Marie Reynolds

L5r Yes please hope to see a gm step up. Cause every time i try its doomed to fail.

Muse

A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

How to set this Muse ablaze (O/Os)

When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

Chulanowa

Interested here as well, especially if the setting is pre-Coup or, in a pinch, the Clan Wars.

kckolbe

I can't tell you all how nice it is to see all the requests for earlier settings.  I think Rokugan went to shit during the Spirit War, personally, though the Four Winds might be my favorite period.  Maybe I just love the idea of options too much.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

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Chulanowa

heh, I started playing with imperial edition, and stopped halfway through Hidden Emperor. The RPG was still in 1st edition at that point... so when i flip through 4th edition i'm like "what... what... WHAT?!

kckolbe

Okay folks.  I am considering running a campaign with a bit of alteration to it, set just after the end of the War of Spirits.  There will be a lot of elements trying to build power, and Rokugan will be fairly weak as a result of the 12 year war that just ended.  My initial thought is that our chars will be new members of a Minor Clan that was formed at the end of the war, for political reasons I will flesh out better once I've decided on the location.  This will allow characters to have initial training in whichever school they want while still being tied together.

Anyone interested?  We can hash out certain preferences before moving to a proper interest check.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

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Muse

  *pounce!* 

  Count me in! 

  BUt, erm?  Starting characters?  Will we have acess to our original schools for further training? 
A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

How to set this Muse ablaze (O/Os)

When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

kckolbe

We'll play training by ear, but I'm not gonna be much of a douche about it.  By the way, this will be 4th ed.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

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Marie Reynolds

This sounds awesome! Can we play other members of  other Minor clans that might be looking  to  bring the new minor clan  into the fold of the minor clan alliance?

kckolbe

#18
Too soon to say.  I don't want to give away too much, but think of it as an expansion draft, where each clan was ordered to give up x bodies, and one or two clans had to give up territory as well.

EDIT: If there is a reason you would prefer to not be the same clan as the group, then let me know.  Discussion might help us come up with something.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

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Marie Reynolds

Just was curious as to what options might be available.  I am just glad and excited  to see a game focused on minor clans!

Flying Tengu

Quote from: kckolbe on July 05, 2015, 07:26:26 PM
Okay folks.  I am considering running a campaign with a bit of alteration to it, set just after the end of the War of Spirits.  There will be a lot of elements trying to build power, and Rokugan will be fairly weak as a result of the 12 year war that just ended.  My initial thought is that our chars will be new members of a Minor Clan that was formed at the end of the war, for political reasons I will flesh out better once I've decided on the location.  This will allow characters to have initial training in whichever school they want while still being tied together.

Anyone interested?  We can hash out certain preferences before moving to a proper interest check.

I'd be very interested!

HairyHeretic

I'd want to know a bit more detail, but provisionally interested.
Hairys Likes, Dislikes, Games n Stuff

Cattle die, kinsmen die
You too one day shall die
I know a thing that will never die
Fair fame of one who has earned it.

kckolbe

Sorry Hairy, but given that I am neither a great GM nor a master of the lore, I'm afraid it just wouldn't be a good idea to have someone who actually knows the setting.  ~grins~

You are, of course, completely welcome, and I'd love to get your thoughts about a few possible locations and starting situation.  I will warn that I will be using a combination of modules and original adventures, starting with a module I've been wanting to use. 

May I add you on YIM?
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

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HairyHeretic

I'm happy to chat with you about anything game related that you want to. :)
Hairys Likes, Dislikes, Games n Stuff

Cattle die, kinsmen die
You too one day shall die
I know a thing that will never die
Fair fame of one who has earned it.

kckolbe

Okay, did some more work on the setting.  Currently I'm looking at the group being part of a very Minor Clan or belonging to the Great Clan established just before the game kicks off.  Either way, there will be Shadowlands scouts to deal with, other supernatural issues, potential for mass battle rules, and general instability in Rokugan, with certain legal/philosophical questions coming to the forefront.  So while there will not be a proper court, social skills will be tested as well as skirmish and warfare, with other skills coming into play as well.  I'm real big on the "whole samurai concept" and warriors will not be allowed to just remain silent and let the group courtier talk.

Some things I would like general feedback from:

I am considering different starting xp based on age.  How does everyone feel about this, and what type of scale would you be comfortable with?

I am normally pretty big on gender ratios, but I can't say that I am expecting a particularly significant amount of sexual tension, so am considering tossing that aside.

I am considering playing with the possibility of differing loyalties/philosophies within the group, which could lead to elements of pvp later on in the story.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

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Marie Reynolds

I am considering different starting xp based on age.  How does everyone feel about this, and what type of scale would you be comfortable with?
Hmm the starting age experience could be interesting. Do you have any idea on age brackets and how much experience each bracket would get?
That is my suggestion for  the age experience chart. Also have you thought about players using the lineage tables?

Age:                         Experience:
11-15                            2
16-20                            4
21-25                            6
26-30                            8
31-35                           10
36-40                           12
37-41                           14
42-46                           16
47-51                           18
52+                              20

I am normally pretty big on gender ratios, but I can't say that I am expecting a particularly significant amount of sexual tension, so am considering tossing that aside.

Well sexual tension might not be the right thing for Rokugan, Considering arranged  marriages it would be more appropriate to explore the emotional stress and tension created by the personal feelings and one's duty to the family. Also looking at the dynamics of families being displaced to  form the new clans. Also might want to look at  Vassal lineages being sent to  meet the empires demand's.

I am considering playing with the possibility of differing loyalties/philosophies within the group, which could lead to elements of pvp later on in the story.
If we do the differing loyalties and philosophies which should absolutely exist as your are drawing from various clans to create this minor clan. There is a possibility ronin might have  earned a spot in the clan.So i also think that Minor clans do have courts there are not as opulent and large as Major clans also i feel to help setup the differing camps the game really should start off in court as a  Minor clan being created is still a big deal. A Miya would be present to send the  emperor/empresses edicts Otomo would be there to oversea  its establishment and ensure the emperor's /empresses's will and mission for the minor clan. The Seppun/Monkey clan might be present to provide security for the imperial families delegation. Also if the Minor Clan Alliance has been formed they would have a delegation to welcome it into the fold. Mantis would show up trying to gain a new family or lay the  road work for that to happen.Cause the Mantis clan are like Pokemon trainers in regards to minor clans gotta catch em all! Cause i think  we have a really awesome opportunity here to  show case the growing pains of a new minor clan being formed and would give a rich environment to explore a lot of duties of  the Samurai life not regularly done in games. Solving agriculture, trade issues and etc. Also have you given thought are we going to be playing low  end samurai, courtiers, shugenja  and possibly monks. Will we be  more upcoming talent in the minor clan or big movers and shakers looked to for leadership in the minor clan and the resulting new families that may be formed  to make up the minor clan. Pvp in rokugan also does not necessarily mean a battle of the blade it can be social, economical, and  political.

I hope i am not being to overbearing or overstepping my place. I just have a lot of love for minor clans and the unique opportunities that can come from a story involving them!

kckolbe

First of, thanks for taking the time.  I genuinely appreciate it.  I am not at all opposed to lineage tables, though I dislike the "unfairness" of some players getting great rolls and others all bad luck.  I do find it really interesting, though. 

So, regarding your table, I would want to make 16 the "0" number, that being both a common gempukku age as well as the site minimum.  I was also thinking of there being more of a difference between the low and high end.  A 52 year old rank 1 char seems off.  I am thinking that Insight Rank 3 would be the goal for 51 and above.  Maybe something like this?  This would make mid-late thirties when most "normals" hit Rank 2, and early fifties Rank 3, which seem like decent points.  Obviously, older characters would be more capable, but this does make sense in a culture where elders are venerated, and older characters would have less room for mistakes.  Additionally, imagine once you get 25 xp in game.  We would have a 17 year old Rank 2, a 35 year old Rank 3, and a 52 year old Rank 4.  Who is going to be the buzz of the courts?  The young one, of course.  So I think that RP benefits would balance out mechanical ones.  I am, however, willing to alter or eliminate this system.  Very much open to feedback.  However, given that the last 25 years of Rokugani history have seen the Clan War, Oblivion's Gate, AND War of the Spirits, I would like to encourage characters that have been part of that history.

Age:                         Bonus XP:
16-18                            0
19-20                            4
21-23                            8
24-25                           12
26-28                           16
29-30                           20
31-33                           24
34-35                           28
36-38                           32
39-40                           36
41-43                           40
44-45                           44
46-48                           48
49-50                           52
51+                              56

I do want to stress that we might not be a Minor Clan.  The two options I am considering are being part of the smallest Great Clan in Rokugan OR being a Minor Clan, currently talking that over with Hairy, as my ultimate goal is to create an alternate Rokugan that is interesting, compelling, and believable, and that sets up an overarching storyline I truly believe to be original, even if the challenges along the way are completely stolen from modules.  Bear in mind that no matter what, a Great Clan will have just been created, which is a VERY big deal, and I promise I have not taken that lightly.

When I mention loyalties and philosophies, I don't mean viewpoints or sympathies.  I mean wiling to die for positions.

QuoteAlso have you given thought are we going to be playing low  end samurai, courtiers, shugenja  and possibly monks. Will we be  more upcoming talent in the minor clan or big movers and shakers looked to for leadership?
My goal with the table above is to have a mix of each.  Some veterans, some up and comers. 
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

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Muse

  Hm... 

  If you're wanting characters of various power levels, would it be okay ot have seondary characters? 

  It can be fun depending on how you're running it, but if it's just one PC each, I confess I'd prefer to have someone on the stornger end, and for that person to not nessicairly be in his fifties.  Mind you, there's a concept for a really old man I always wanted to try--a shugenja who retired to a monestary and became a notworthy monk, then was recalled to imperial service iwth the MAgistraits was how it originaly worked. 

  Really, if nothing else, I've never played L5R anywhere but starting level. 
A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

How to set this Muse ablaze (O/Os)

When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

Muse

Quote from: kckolbe on July 07, 2015, 01:36:01 AM
I am considering playing with the possibility of differing loyalties/philosophies within the group, which could lead to elements of pvp later on in the story.

  I'm  usualy pretty nervous about PVP elemnets--short of tournament style games.  ^_^;; 

  I mean, i'd be okay with an idea like, "Our group is on the verge of coming to blows over which faction to support, but we're still a band of brothers.  we have determined that each side of the argument will select a champion.  They'll meet on the field of honor and duel to first blood.  The whole band agrees that we will support the cause championed by the victor.  This may seem extreme, but we all beleive passionately enough about these causes to shed blood over them.  We can't condone giving up our position for any lesser reason." 
A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

How to set this Muse ablaze (O/Os)

When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

Marie Reynolds

Okay absolutely aware  that  you might not go with the minor clans. Just offer my  knowledge of Minor clan life as i have always been fascinated by the minor clans.The age experience chart looks good right forgot about the age limit cause i just thought to include young prodigies. Oh i know and such camps would use  court as a weapon to further there standing and get in to positions of authority to move there agendas forward and strengthen there positions with in the clan and the empire. The empire is not a place of roses and sunshine  I am well aware. Whichever path you choose i'll still be excited for this game!

kckolbe

I am not comfortable with starting with multiple characters since that means me having to throw more at them.  What I *am* toying with is allowing them on an in game reward basis.  I like creating NPCs that can become allies, enemies, corpses, etc, based on PC actions.  At times these chars will be nearly fleshed out and nearly statted out.  At times it could be "X family agrees to send a person for aid or training or marriage."  In cases like that, you will have a lot more freedom to create the characters.  Bear in mind, though, that you represent either a very small clan or a small part of a larger clan with more problems than resources, so having few people helps create that feel.

I actually really like Muse's suggestion for handling conflict...sounds good on paper, at least. 
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

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Flying Tengu

The game concept sounds very interesting, an exploration of post-war Rokugan, whether from the point of view of a minor clan or a major one.  The idea of being a newly created minor clan, created from drafted major clan members, does have a fair amount of appeal.

Quote from: kckolbe on July 07, 2015, 01:36:01 AMSome things I would like general feedback from:

I am considering different starting xp based on age.  How does everyone feel about this, and what type of scale would you be comfortable with?

Mmm.  I don't have very strong feelings about this, but I would say what feelings I do have are slightly negative.  I don't know that roleplay would balance mechanics, since L5R has a lot of mechanics for roleplay.  Higher xp allows a player to buy social advantages like Benten's Blessing, status, higher honor/glory, etc.  Higher rank gives a character a higher glory floor, which is presumably what causes people to talk about you?  It seems to me that roleplay would actually have to run counter to mechanics, or additional mechanics introduced (like, lower age gains glory faster), for it to balance the mechanical advantages that can be gained from higher xp and insight.

Like I said, though, my feelings about this are not particularly strong, and I'd be perfectly happy to go along with it.

Quote from: kckolbe on July 07, 2015, 01:36:01 AMI am normally pretty big on gender ratios, but I can't say that I am expecting a particularly significant amount of sexual tension, so am considering tossing that aside.

But... but... UST!  Eventually becoming RST!  If it helps, and you're ok with it, I know that Muse, MR, and I have all done crossplay before, so I imagine a gender balance could be achieved.

Quote from: kckolbe on July 07, 2015, 01:36:01 AMI am considering playing with the possibility of differing loyalties/philosophies within the group, which could lead to elements of pvp later on in the story.

Mmm, depends on how big the group is.  I think it would have to be pretty big, though.  A schism in a group of 12 means 2 groups of 6, which isn't bad.  A schism in a group of 6 means 2 groups of 3, which seems like it could be a momentum killer.  And pvp is something I generally try to avoid, although Muse's way of handling it sounds pretty good.

...

Anyway!  These are just my opinions.  Really, I'm happy with nearly anything that allows me to pretend to be a magical samurai.  And the basic concept for the game really does sound very interesting.

kckolbe

Glad you like it.  I think what appeals most to me is fixing something from the lore that always bothered me.  Toturi, Akodo Kaneka, and Yoritomo...Kumiko(?) all have their actions painted in some great light despite being extremely dishonorable at times, and this is a chance to address that as well as capture the unease that would follow a time like this (more detail later).

You make a good point regarding xp, one I am not completely unaware of.  I am considering changing the xp bonus to increments of 3, as 3 points buys a rank of glory and 6 buys a rank of status.  Bear in mind that spending the points necessary to have the appropriate glory of an older char means being weaker than an older char, so there is still a trade off.  You are correct that a distinct mechanical advantage will be held by older characters, though I do think that makes sense in this case.  Still, it is a valid point against doing it, and Muse didn't seem thrilled about it either.  Ironically, Muse seemed to dislike it for almost the opposite reason, thinking it too little a bonus for such a commitment.  I'm going to take another couple of stabs at this, as I think character history really would add to immersion and drama, but I know I shouldn't get too carried away with grand ideas.

I'm not sure what UST and RST are.

Keep up the good feedback guys.  I really do appreciate it, as it shows energy and ownership, which almost always results in a more engaging story.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

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Flying Tengu

Quote from: kckolbe on July 07, 2015, 09:11:23 PMI'm not sure what UST and RST are.

Oops!  Sorry.  Unresolved Sexual Tension, and Resolved Sexual Tension.

Anyway, it sounds like you're aware of possible issues with the age/xp thing, which is probably good enough!  I likely intend to play a younger character, but I can always include information on the involvement of parents or other older relatives in the various great events of past years.

kckolbe

Gotcha. 

And yeah, definitely aware.  One of the interesting things about L5R was a conscious decision to NOT balance different schools, as at different times, due to resources, sensei, experience, some schools were just stronger.  Look at ronin creation.  They are undeniably weaker than Clan characters. 

As far as parents go, don't worry.  I will be adding certain questions to the char profile in addition to the normal ones.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

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hellrazoromega

Hello All.

I'm new around here but I would love to do an L5R game if there is room, I am running one now but I would so love to play!

kckolbe



This is what I'm thinking of for post Spirit War Rokugan.  The silver outline contains the Stag Clan, a Great Clan created by the Treaty with the Spirits.  Hantei Ochukeo becomes Clan Champion and head of the Hantei family.  Yasuki Masashi would become head of the Masashi family, vassal to the Hantei.

The blue outline contains the Hawk Clan, a Minor Clan also created after the war.  On the surface, the purpose of this clan was both to provide a buffer between Crane and Crab as well as hunt down Shadowlands creatures within Rokugan.  However, when a member of the Toritaka family was selected as the sensei of the clan's bushi school, questions formed in the minds of many.

Nothing I post in this thread is final, so if you have ideas then let me know.

Welcome to the site.  Do me a favor and look over some of the questions I've asked and ideas thrown out and let me know what you think.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Flying Tengu

Oho, interesting!  My vague recollection is that the Toritaka school focuses on combating spirits.  Combining that with the recent war, and a mandate to hunt Shadowland threats inside the empire, one could see how certain conclusions might be drawn.  Perhaps they would be seeking spirits that did not leave the mortal realm at the end of the war.

I can also see that there could be political challenges, acting as a buffer.  After all, who really wants to act as a buffer between the Crab and... wherever the Crab want to go?

Interest levels continuing to rise!

kckolbe

Thanks, and you are right about Toritaka.  The Owl school will be very similar.  The territory is just north of Yasuki territory, which Crane still want back (and is currently daimyo-less, as the daimyo and son died as Kolat members).  So yeah, the Owl Clan (not Hawk, sorry) will be the Rokugan equivalent of Belgium, while occupying lands known for onis and goblins.  Life will suck.

As for spirits, all were ordered to become mortal (through a Phoenix ritual) or commit seppuku.  He has given that order before, and it didn't work out so well.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

hellrazoromega

Unless I am confused, you are making an Owl and Stag minor clan? I love the Toritaka (Falcon) Clan, in the canon they are eventually absorbed by the Crab in 1125 and they are indeed wicked cool spirit fighters. I love L5R games that deviate from canon, however.


kckolbe

Thanks!  I try to stay in shape, eat well, and...right.  The game.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Muse

*Grins* 

okay, so how/why was the Owl Clan founded?  Is that the clan you want us to be members of? 

And--seeing as how schools are tied to clans--will there be school sensei's for each of our schools in the clan? 
A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

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When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

kckolbe

The Owl Clan was created by the order of Toturi I, to remain a buffer presence between Crane and Crab, and to kill Shadowlands creatures within Rokugan.  It's worth noting that the path between East Mountain Village and West Mountain Village connects to tunnel systems that allow Shadowlands creatures to go under the Wall and flank the Crab.  Currently, the Crab send bushi to clear out the tunnels every couple of weeks and destroy new passages and things like that.  Guess who gets that job now?

I will be creating NPCs for any Clan schools, and there will be at least one.  The signature school will be a mix of Toritaka Bushi and Kuni Witch Hunter in purpose.  I may not create other schools, as creating other schools means creating other capable samurai, and I kind of want you guys to have to work for help.  In addition, some players may want to form their own schools, helping shape the identity of the Clan, and not having as many schools makes that easier. 

So yes, the Owl Clan will be the clan the PCs belong to.  The Stag Clan is mainly for flavor/worldbuilding, though will come into play later.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Muse

  This does sound like fun. 

  How does this clan interact with the Sparrow?  :)
A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

How to set this Muse ablaze (O/Os)

When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

kckolbe

Well, at the start of the game, it will have just been created, so there isn't really any history to go off of.  It will be a small clan, though, with leaders and diplomats as yet unwritten.  I want to wait until PCs are created and then fill in the blanks.  However, Owl territory is just south of Sparrow, so they won't be strangers.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

hellrazoromega

So would the Owl have an alliance with the Crab given that Great Clan's knowledge with killing Shadowlands creatures? Or would the Crab see the Owl as something of an embarrassment because it sort of implies that the Crab have let some things slip through into Rokugan?

kckolbe

Fine question, and I don't have an answer yet.  At the moment, the sensei is a former Crab, and the Crane lost more logistically, so the small hit to pride is more than made up for, but since a daimyo has not been created, there is still the possibility that the Crab will want to see them fail (especially if the daimyo is of Scorpion or Crane descent).  Overall, the creation of this clan benefits the Crab (aiding in one of their duties while only mildly inconveniencing them) and weakens an opponent, so they are leaning favorably.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Ephiral

If there's still room, this sounds kinda fascinating.

If not, I can live (this would mark my third active L5R game in this time period).

kckolbe

Tell me about the other ones you played, and what setting elements you thought worked or didn't work.  Also, if you could start with the last post on page 1, I'd still like more feedback on those questions I asked, as well as other discussions since then.  And room is not an issue so far.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Ephiral

Quote from: kckolbe on July 07, 2015, 01:36:01 AMI am considering different starting xp based on age.  How does everyone feel about this, and what type of scale would you be comfortable with?
Am not a fan of linking mechanical benefits to flavour elements, but it's not a deal-breaker. My objection is more on principles of system design, and I get what you're trying to do here.

Quote from: kckolbe on July 07, 2015, 01:36:01 AMI am normally pretty big on gender ratios, but I can't say that I am expecting a particularly significant amount of sexual tension, so am considering tossing that aside.
Was leaning female myself since a) my other two L5R characters are male, and b) I tend to be more on the femme side on E anyway. I do think that sexual tension is a classic element of the kind of stories L5R is trying to tell - but the key is tension, the conflict between desire and duty, and possibly tragedy if/when it gets resolved.

Quote from: kckolbe on July 07, 2015, 01:36:01 AMI am considering playing with the possibility of differing loyalties/philosophies within the group, which could lead to elements of pvp later on in the story.
I like this, particularly in the way Muse presents. I wouldn't want to see anything to permanently fragment the group (unless one side is being retired as PCs), but divided loyalties and tension between them is another strong element of a good samurai story.

Quote from: kckolbe on July 07, 2015, 09:21:26 PMAnd yeah, definitely aware.  One of the interesting things about L5R was a conscious decision to NOT balance different schools, as at different times, due to resources, sensei, experience, some schools were just stronger.  Look at ronin creation.  They are undeniably weaker than Clan characters.
Ehh, I'd argue that the clans as a whole are very carefully balanced - it's just that the balance tends to be triangular. There will be a clear winner and loser among any two individuals of equal XP and insight, but there'll be a third that can demolish the "stronger" and will be spanked by the "weaker". Ronin are the exception here, but that's a) in keeping with setting, and b) a strong discouragement from playing characters who should be rare.

Overall, I'm on board with most of what's been discussed - in particular, I find the timing and positioning of the Owl clan intriguing. It's a very precarious position, which I love.

The other two games I'm currently involved in are actually in the same world, set in the mid-1140s currently. We've shifted the timeline a bit; there was no War of Spirits, and basically every other major crisis from 1130 through 1160 is kicking off now or shortly. This was partly because we thought it was a bit silly to have the Empire constantly fighting for its existence, and we wanted the last such threat to be a distant memory so the next one would take a while to seem plausible to most people. These are, in turn, a continuation of an earlier game leading up to the Second Day of Thunder. Setting elements that just flat-out didn't work for us mostly boiled down to "that seems silly" - bits like the Scorpion forgetting to check the palace basement during their coup (we had the Last Hantei smuggled out instead), or Hitomi and Yakamo replacing Onnotangu and Amaterasu (Hitomi, at least, is still Dragon Champion and up to no good.) The Hidden Emperor storyline also seems a bit out of place - the Scorpion were willing to attempt a coup based on a prophecy, but nobody says a word when the Emperor actually vanishes, is known to have been held and tortured by forces of darkness, and is visibly unhinged and defying longstanding traditions the moment he gets back? It's... salvageable, but weird, and hasn't happened in our game thus far.

kckolbe

First off, thanks for the thoughtful feedback.  I thrive on it, since I tend to come up with a lot of interesting ideas, but sometimes they can do more harm than good.  Active OOC input really is a requirement for me, largely for that reason.

QuoteAm not a fan of linking mechanical benefits to flavour elements, but it's not a deal-breaker. My objection is more on principles of system design, and I get what you're trying to do here.

Completely understandable.  I think I am going to re-do the table and scale it back a bit.  After doing some math, an average 51 year old would be half way to Insight Rank 3 with that xp, which is, in my opinion, behind the curve, but it is still an advantage over another PC, which can make things awkward.  I think I have a better idea of how to handle it now.

QuoteWas leaning female myself since a) my other two L5R characters are male, and b) I tend to be more on the femme side on E anyway. I do think that sexual tension is a classic element of the kind of stories L5R is trying to tell - but the key is tension, the conflict between desire and duty, and possibly tragedy if/when it gets resolved.
No argument here at all.  I think the issue is that much of that tone is lost once the average sex scene on E is written.  But yeah, much as with the next issue, moderation is the key.

QuoteI like this, particularly in the way Muse presents. I wouldn't want to see anything to permanently fragment the group (unless one side is being retired as PCs), but divided loyalties and tension between them is another strong element of a good samurai story.

I was glad for his suggestion.  I think that political and philosophical conflict is necessary for the story I am intending to run, but a derailing conflict can end a story, so this is a good compromise.

QuoteEhh, I'd argue that the clans as a whole are very carefully balanced - it's just that the balance tends to be triangular. There will be a clear winner and loser among any two individuals of equal XP and insight, but there'll be a third that can demolish the "stronger" and will be spanked by the "weaker". Ronin are the exception here, but that's a) in keeping with setting, and b) a strong discouragement from playing characters who should be rare.

There are enough exceptions to this to make it debatable, but I do see your point.  Regarding ronin, I'll just say that my favorite family in Rokugan is ronin, and I hate how they were written off without a single attempt to do anything with them.  It's Kaeru, by the way.

I can't say I blame you for neglecting the War of Spirits.  Everything after Toturi took the throne became very contrived, in my opinion, and the cultural impacts are kind of ignored.  Personally, I liked the challenge of trying to do a what would have happened.  I mean, the Emperor gave an order, and a large portion of Rokugan refused it.  Incidentally, the order applied to him, and the hypocrisy of that is NEVER mentioned.  Then, a force rises up to forcefully remove the Emperor, and loses, yet the leader of that movement isn't executed, or even remotely punished.  Hell, he gets to raise the Emperor's child.  This is the kind of shit that shatters belief in divine rule.  So, uh...spoiler, this game will deal with samurai whose belief in Toturi's divine mandate has been shattered.  And I kept the Hidden Emperor because it kind of contributes to the progression of that belief.

Glad you noticed the locations that Owl occupies.  I think the Stag have a nice location as well. 
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

hellrazoromega

I would love to play an older sagely, sensei type of bushi with a game like this--gender would not matter to me much depending on what the group had I could be flexible, but a middle-aged  Onna-bugeisha would be cool to play. Frankly, I could deal with all of the stuff in the last post on page one--it sounds different and I like different.

Ephiral

Quote from: kckolbe on July 09, 2015, 11:03:23 PM
First off, thanks for the thoughtful feedback.  I thrive on it, since I tend to come up with a lot of interesting ideas, but sometimes they can do more harm than good.  Active OOC input really is a requirement for me, largely for that reason.
I have shockingly little issue with this.

Quote from: kckolbe on July 09, 2015, 11:03:23 PMNo argument here at all.  I think the issue is that much of that tone is lost once the average sex scene on E is written.  But yeah, much as with the next issue, moderation is the key.
Honestly, I'd expect an L5 game to be surprisingly clean by E standards, which is one of the things that drew me to it. (Not sure I have quiiiite enough confidence in my writing to do publicly smutty.)

Quote from: kckolbe on July 09, 2015, 11:03:23 PMI can't say I blame you for neglecting the War of Spirits.  Everything after Toturi took the throne became very contrived, in my opinion, and the cultural impacts are kind of ignored.  Personally, I liked the challenge of trying to do a what would have happened.  I mean, the Emperor gave an order, and a large portion of Rokugan refused it.  Incidentally, the order applied to him, and the hypocrisy of that is NEVER mentioned.  Then, a force rises up to forcefully remove the Emperor, and loses, yet the leader of that movement isn't executed, or even remotely punished.  Hell, he gets to raise the Emperor's child.  This is the kind of shit that shatters belief in divine rule.  So, uh...spoiler, this game will deal with samurai whose belief in Toturi's divine mandate has been shattered.  And I kept the Hidden Emperor because it kind of contributes to the progression of that belief.
The War of Spirits was just weird in a lot of ways, and disrupted the (IMO) more interesting story of the first non-Hantei emperor and how he legitimizes and consolidates his authority. I agree that there was a lot of wasted potential for more grounded stories in the Toturi era, and honestly that's where I think L5R shines best. Have no issue with the Hidden Emperor if it's being grounded in verisimilitude and important to plot.

Quote from: kckolbe on July 09, 2015, 11:03:23 PMGlad you noticed the locations that Owl occupies.  I think the Stag have a nice location as well.
My current characters are a Yasuki and a Hiruma no Raikuto (I admit, I'm an unabashed Crab fan). I'm very familiar with that region and its potential issues.

Pumpkin Seeds


Pretty in Pink

*facerolls into a group game*  Is there still room?  Having read through the topic, I have an idea, but I need to get it more put together before I throw it at you, kc.  Suffice to say, I'm looking at possibly a Crab hostaged to the Owl, if that's okay?  That is, after all, a common practice.
[FLOATLEFT][/FLOATLEFT]O.O ~{=}~ Ideas ~{=}~ A&A[FLOATRIGHT][/FLOATRIGHT]

I've taken the Oath of the Drake for Group RP

Muse

  Am I the only one looking at a Shugenja?  :) 
A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

How to set this Muse ablaze (O/Os)

When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

kckolbe

Nice to see some new interest on waking up.  I haven't set a group size.

A hostage wouldn't work in this case, as the Owl will not have existed long enough to take any.  Our PCs will be heading to their new lands when the game begins.

Also, if you and Pumpkin could start with the last post on page 1, I'd still like more feedback on those questions I asked, as well as other discussions since then.  No rush on char concept.  I'm definitely interested in hearing character concepts, but they aren't required yet.  I'll do a proper recruiting thread within the next 6 days where the starting situation will be explained in more detail.  Also, while things might be negotiable in that thread, especially house rules, decisions that affect the tone and type of game are being finalized in this thread.

Quote from: Ephiral on July 10, 2015, 12:50:52 AM
Honestly, I'd expect an L5 game to be surprisingly clean by E standards, which is one of the things that drew me to it. (Not sure I have quiiiite enough confidence in my writing to do publicly smutty.)
The War of Spirits was just weird in a lot of ways, and disrupted the (IMO) more interesting story of the first non-Hantei emperor and how he legitimizes and consolidates his authority. I agree that there was a lot of wasted potential for more grounded stories in the Toturi era, and honestly that's where I think L5R shines best. Have no issue with the Hidden Emperor if it's being grounded in verisimilitude and important to plot.
My current characters are a Yasuki and a Hiruma no Raikuto (I admit, I'm an unabashed Crab fan). I'm very familiar with that region and its potential issues.

L5R is a little cleaner, as sex doesn't happen as freely. 

You make a good point on Toturi's reign being a huge precedent that isn't developed at all.  Only the Gozoku was a bigger threat to the society created by the Kami, and that ended with a very impressive and faith restoring spectacle.  With this, I think they know it's over.  Interesting that the only Emperor to make it through was Hantei XVI, by the way, the only Emperor killed by his own guards. 

I have a lot of respect for both Crab and Lion, and vague interest in the rest, though I think Crane's role in history is a little hard to believe (but I think that has more to do with presentation than substance), and the Scorpion are, in my mind, a joke.  Everything about their premise and history makes no sense to me.  I will say that I do like their absolute Clan loyalty, but yeah, would probably buy into the setting a lot easier if they didn't exist.  Kinda the same with the Dragon.  They almost never contribute, and when they do, it seems inconsistent.  I can't help but think of the Cheshire Cat from the Burton remake saying "I never get involved in politics" then randomly getting involved in politics. 
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Ephiral

Quote from: kckolbe on July 10, 2015, 08:38:02 AMYou make a good point on Toturi's reign being a huge precedent that isn't developed at all.  Only the Gozoku was a bigger threat to the society created by the Kami, and that ended with a very impressive and faith restoring spectacle.  With this, I think they know it's over.  Interesting that the only Emperor to make it through was Hantei XVI, by the way, the only Emperor killed by his own guards.
Given how the Hantei line ended, yeah, this is a pretty definitive shift. For a society that hasn't changed meaningfully in literally a thousand years, that should be a way bigger deal than the official timeline makes of it.

Quote from: kckolbe on July 10, 2015, 08:38:02 AMI have a lot of respect for both Crab and Lion, and vague interest in the rest, though I think Crane's role in history is a little hard to believe (but I think that has more to do with presentation than substance), and the Scorpion are, in my mind, a joke.  Everything about their premise and history makes no sense to me.  I will say that I do like their absolute Clan loyalty, but yeah, would probably buy into the setting a lot easier if they didn't exist.  Kinda the same with the Dragon.  They almost never contribute, and when they do, it seems inconsistent.  I can't help but think of the Cheshire Cat from the Burton remake saying "I never get involved in politics" then randomly getting involved in politics.
The Lion are mostly respectable, but lose points for me because their official clan sport is Kick The Minor Clan. The Crane... They were the Mary Sue clan to start with, and there's still precious little explanation of how exactly a clan with little expertise on the open battlefield manages to hold so much prime real estate with the Lion and Crab next door. The Scorpion I find... interesting, but poorly portrayed; they work as a tool that is occasionally useful to the empire, and vital when it comes up, and they hammer home the idea of the collective good being more important than you as an individual. The Dragon... yeah, they're there in case a Deus ex Machina is needed, and that's about it for the most part.

The clan I find I've got the unpopular stance on is the Spider. I think their treatment makes absolute and total sense.

kckolbe

It's fine if you don't like the Lion.  They are assholes and bullies.  But they are also damn consistent in who they are and how they are viewed, so I like them.  They make sense, and have a distinct, yet compatible identity.  In a society where the most important positions are determined by skill of arms, why shouldn't there be a culture that thinks force should resolve any dispute?  Also, they do selfishness well.  They constantly seek to plunder until there is a threat to the Empire, at which point they consistently act in the Empire's best interests.  They ended the Gozoku and the Clan War, and were the first Clan to take on the spirits as a whole, despite being the only Clan to worship the people that counted among their opponents.  And the only Minor Clan they look for opportunities to kick is the Dragonfly, which shouldn't exist.  What is their official duty?  They serve as heralds and doorguards to the Dragon?  What fucking sense does that make? 

As for the Spider...I stopped caring before they existed.  In 1167 Emperor Toturi III, who apparently subscribed to the Tragedy of the Month club (his bio is fucking ridiculous), decided that his life was too boring and decided to go wandering, becoming known as The Wanderer (really).  Somehow, he stays Emperor, just abandons his duty, because nothing has been going on where command decisions might need to be made.  Also, he recently married and had no heirs, and no one thought that *maybe* the issue of succession should be addressed beforehand, because it's not like there wasn't a disastrous war of succession less than a decade prior.  He stays gone until his death in 1168. 

I will say that the argument the Spider used to become a Great Clan is basically the same one *I* used to make the Stag Clan, so it's not like I'm completely opposed to them.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Ephiral

As I said, I respect the Lion, but their habit of beating on minor clans (and it ain't just the Dragonfly) is less than admirable.

Toturi III's story is beyond ridiculous.

I think the Spider thing makes sense because... really? Nobody gets unwillingly tainted ever, and a significant threat to the Empire starts wearing badges announcing who they are? Deal and deal. Notice that since they became a Great Clan, the other clans have basically been lining up to kick them in the crotch repeatedly - Clan status is not the same as safety. It's a win-win for the Empire, really.

kckolbe

Quick Status Updates:

Toritaka Reju, Rank 5 bushi, and creator and sensei of the Owl Bushi school, has been created.  He's nothing particularly special, though will seem amazingly capable compared to rank 1s.

I will decide on a daimyo much later on, after this is posted in Groups Wanted.  That is also where I will post up positions of relative importance that a starting char *might* be appointed to.

I have decided to award 1xp for every year above 16.  However, all chars will start at Rank 1, even if they have the Insight to be Rank 2.  After the first adventure (which is a quick module), everyone will be able to advance to Rank 2, at which point I will attempt an original challenge or two before going back to my crutch of modules.  Unfortunately, I only own two modules that seem applicable, so after that I better find some damn creativity.  By then I should have enough to feed off of.   

This game, which I am considering calling "Two Dead Emperors," will be posted in the recruitment thread in about 5 days.  My schedule generally consists of 4 days on and 4 days off, and I like kicking off new milestones at the beginning of my break so I can respond quickly to questions. 

On the above note, I'd like to talk about pace.  I am not a rapid poster, but I am fairly consistent.  I can absolutely be counted on for at least one IC GM post a week, with rolls, combat actions and OOC answers always within 24 hours (unless specified in advance).  This is kind of where I'd like everyone else to be, and think that 5 days should be the deadline for IC posting before getting skipped/GM'd, and 24 hours the deadline before rolls and combat actions are determined by me.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Pumpkin Seeds

See I find the Crane to be awesome.  They rigged the game in their favor and reaped the benefits throughout history.  They made it so all legal disputes can be settled by dueling and who just happens to have the best duelists...they do.  They also position their courtiers and people into important positions consistently.  TheScorpion are cool for me up until the whole shadow thing.  Its like monumental cunning clan has brain fart for decades.

hellrazoromega

See the Scorpion are may favorite Clan but they are so often played wrong IMO. So many see the Scorpion as dishonorable---just because. When the Scorpion feel have very good reasons. They know (read: believe) that against enemies who are dishonorable the honorable foe will eventually loose every time. I sort of like the idea of a Clan who pragmatically forgoes honor to work in the shadows and save others from a unsustainable noble ideal. This is not to say that Scorpion who are just dishonorable A-holes don't exist, the Clan plays with dishonor so much that even the best of them can fall. Of course this requires my standard disclaimer (The preceding was my opinion, your opinion may, and most likely will vary, this statement was not endorsed by Major League Field Hockey or the Clown College of America).

That said, I love the Crab and the Lion next. I'm lucky enough to know a couple of the devs who fleshed the Lion for AEG may moons ago and got to peek into their design so as much as I love the Scorpion and the Crab I feel I know the Lion better. After that I do enjoy the Unicorn and am rather indifferent to the other Major Clans.

Flying Tengu

Quote from: kckolbe on July 10, 2015, 03:00:08 PM
Quick Status Updates:

Toritaka Reju, Rank 5 bushi, and creator and sensei of the Owl Bushi school, has been created.  He's nothing particularly special, though will seem amazingly capable compared to rank 1s.

I will decide on a daimyo much later on, after this is posted in Groups Wanted.  That is also where I will post up positions of relative importance that a starting char *might* be appointed to.

I have decided to award 1xp for every year above 16.  However, all chars will start at Rank 1, even if they have the Insight to be Rank 2.  After the first adventure (which is a quick module), everyone will be able to advance to Rank 2, at which point I will attempt an original challenge or two before going back to my crutch of modules.  Unfortunately, I only own two modules that seem applicable, so after that I better find some damn creativity.  By then I should have enough to feed off of.   

This game, which I am considering calling "Two Dead Emperors," will be posted in the recruitment thread in about 5 days.  My schedule generally consists of 4 days on and 4 days off, and I like kicking off new milestones at the beginning of my break so I can respond quickly to questions. 

On the above note, I'd like to talk about pace.  I am not a rapid poster, but I am fairly consistent.  I can absolutely be counted on for at least one IC GM post a week, with rolls, combat actions and OOC answers always within 24 hours (unless specified in advance).  This is kind of where I'd like everyone else to be, and think that 5 days should be the deadline for IC posting before getting skipped/GM'd, and 24 hours the deadline before rolls and combat actions are determined by me.

That all sounds good to me!  Especially the bit with pace; slow but steady is better than a brief flurry of activity, after which everyone, or at least some important people, disappear.

It sounds like our characters will be taking roles of importance in the new clan, and not just the generalized troubleshooters that PCs so often are.  I'm quite curious to see what these turn out to be.

kckolbe

That's actually not the reason I dislike them.  I see them as very selfish, despite claiming to be the ones sacrificing the most (their honor).  Anyone who succumbs to the Taint loses their honor as well, and far more Crab suffer that fate than Scorpion.  So the entire premise of their worth is misleading.

Not all chars will be important, position-wise, but with such a small clan, all samurai have to carry a fair bit of responsibility.
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hellrazoromega

Quote from: kckolbe on July 10, 2015, 04:06:27 PM
That's actually not the reason I dislike them.  I see them as very selfish, despite claiming to be the ones sacrificing the most (their honor).  Anyone who succumbs to the Taint loses their honor as well, and far more Crab suffer that fate than Scorpion.  So the entire premise of their worth is misleading.

Not all chars will be important, position-wise, but with such a small clan, all samurai have to carry a fair bit of responsibility.
Yeah that was the sentiment I disagree with, though I may not have spelled it out well. I see them as selflessly sacrificing their honor for the greater good. Do they fail at it? All the time--but that is the ideal they are supposed to strive for. In any case like I said that is my take on them and they way I play them or run them or when I run games, many disagree, as is their right. ;D

Quote from: kckolbe on July 10, 2015, 03:00:08 PM
Quick Status Updates:

Toritaka Reju, Rank 5 bushi, and creator and sensei of the Owl Bushi school, has been created.  He's nothing particularly special, though will seem amazingly capable compared to rank 1s.

I will decide on a daimyo much later on, after this is posted in Groups Wanted.  That is also where I will post up positions of relative importance that a starting char *might* be appointed to.

I have decided to award 1xp for every year above 16.  However, all chars will start at Rank 1, even if they have the Insight to be Rank 2.  After the first adventure (which is a quick module), everyone will be able to advance to Rank 2, at which point I will attempt an original challenge or two before going back to my crutch of modules.  Unfortunately, I only own two modules that seem applicable, so after that I better find some damn creativity.  By then I should have enough to feed off of.   

This game, which I am considering calling "Two Dead Emperors," will be posted in the recruitment thread in about 5 days.  My schedule generally consists of 4 days on and 4 days off, and I like kicking off new milestones at the beginning of my break so I can respond quickly to questions. 

On the above note, I'd like to talk about pace.  I am not a rapid poster, but I am fairly consistent.  I can absolutely be counted on for at least one IC GM post a week, with rolls, combat actions and OOC answers always within 24 hours (unless specified in advance).  This is kind of where I'd like everyone else to be, and think that 5 days should be the deadline for IC posting before getting skipped/GM'd, and 24 hours the deadline before rolls and combat actions are determined by me.

I'm usually good for posting everyday or at the very least every other day, On occasion when things would be longer I would usually be able to give notice.

kckolbe

I don't mind a selfish, underhanded Clan.  I think what bothers me is that they only ever turn that underhandedness inward.  Sometimes it is for a good cause, but consider the Lion.  They constantly turn their might on other clans for personal gain, but you also see them devastating Shadowlands forces (or Spirits).  Moments like that validate their existence.  The Scorpion, on the other hand, only deceive Rokuganis.  Interaction with foreigners is done by the Phoenix (Yobanjin tribes), Mantis (Ivory Kingdoms), and Unicorn (can't remember their name), but the Scorpion...not so much.  In addition, and this is huge, there is ANOTHER clan whose job it is to engage in underhanded behavior for the good of the Empire, the Tortoise.  The Scorpion were so bad at their ONLY contribution to Rokugan that the Emperor created an entirely new clan just to do that shit.  In addition, the Scorpion Clan Coup was pretty embarrassing.  They lost because they were counting on the Crab to ally with them.  1) Maybe if you don't constantly fuck people over, they might help you when you ask for it.  2) If you can't predict the fucking CRAB's decisions, then you just suck at reading people.

Also, I'm just not a fan of dark and mysterious.  Sadly, it's probably more about that than anything else. 
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hellrazoromega

Quote from: kckolbe on July 10, 2015, 07:27:10 PM
I don't mind a selfish, underhanded Clan.  I think what bothers me is that they only ever turn that underhandedness inward.  Sometimes it is for a good cause, but consider the Lion.  They constantly turn their might on other clans for personal gain, but you also see them devastating Shadowlands forces (or Spirits).  Moments like that validate their existence.  The Scorpion, on the other hand, only deceive Rokuganis.  Interaction with foreigners is done by the Phoenix (Yobanjin tribes), Mantis (Ivory Kingdoms), and Unicorn (can't remember their name), but the Scorpion...not so much.  In addition, and this is huge, there is ANOTHER clan whose job it is to engage in underhanded behavior for the good of the Empire, the Tortoise.  The Scorpion were so bad at their ONLY contribution to Rokugan that the Emperor created an entirely new clan just to do that shit.  In addition, the Scorpion Clan Coup was pretty embarrassing.  They lost because they were counting on the Crab to ally with them.  1) Maybe if you don't constantly fuck people over, they might help you when you ask for it.  2) If you can't predict the fucking CRAB's decisions, then you just suck at reading people.

Also, I'm just not a fan of dark and mysterious.  Sadly, it's probably more about that than anything else.
I can agree with some of that and I strongly agree about the outward uses of the Scorpion, in fact I incorporate some of that in my own games to deviate from canon. Myself I'm a huge fan of dark and mysterious--so long as it is for a higher noble cause and not just dark and mysterious because it is "cool" or for its own sake. Without an an underlying noble cause then I too don't care for dark and mysterious. I also agree about the Coup, as well as several other parts of Rokugani history, which sadly comes from having an RPG integrally tied to a CCG in its progression and development. Frankly, I take all the BS in Rokugan which thematically does not make sense to me for that reason and as you point out the Coup is a prime example, the Scorpion should not have expected aid from the Crab, of all the Clans. Tying things properties so closely together has some merits but it also makes for amazing plot gaps. For instance,  I love The Iron Kingdoms setting but by being tied to Warmachine/Hordes the setting falls apart under close scrutiny because some, if not all, of the major powers would eventually collapse under the weight of constant warfare. Rokugan suffers from some of the same issues by being tied to a card game, so parts of its history just make no sense---even within the confines of its own setting.

That said, I still love the Rokugan and am one of those weirdos who has my own take on, and love for, many fictional organizations which others seem to dislike (the Scorpion, the Jedi Order, etc.).

kckolbe

The card game does deserve a lot of the blame...but not as much as just bad or lazy writing.  When I was first introduced to Rokugan, I absolutely fell in love with it.  It was the first RPG setting that actually had a real feel to it.  It was its own world.  HOWEVER, a lot of what I loved later got retconned away to provide a half-ass explanation for something, or to give minor glory to someone else.  The Kaeru weren't even causing any lore issues, but they were made to disappear (the vassal to a vassal) just so they wouldn't have to be mentioned anymore.  That's not the card game; that's laziness. 
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
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Marie Reynolds

So what clans are people being mandated to send members to become the new minor clan. Also have Ronin been granted the chance to swear  fealty to the new clan Daimyo?

kckolbe

The acceptance of ronin will be determined by the daimyo, and which Clans get tapped will be based on which characters we get. 
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Pumpkin Seeds

Kind of thinking a crane duelist or courtier.

Ephiral

Lazy writing, lazier editing, and shit-poor research have been a problem in L5R's history - there is a very good reason there are no L5R edition wars. John Wick, to be blunt, thought he knew way more about feudal Asia than he does, and didn't rein his writers in in any meaningful way. An interesting problem we came across in the Second Day of Thunder game I mentioned: The times given for army movements in the Clan War are wildly inconsistent and occasionally impossible, because they apparently forgot whether Rokugan was Fantasy China or Fantasy Japan.

Oh, and... 1e Kakita Artisans. Nuff said.

hellrazoromega

To be fair Rokugan is based on "feudal" Asia but it is neither feudal nor Asia (feudal is so not a proper term in this context, sorry I'm a historian so I hang up on these things). In the beginning Rokugan was supposed to be a blend of Chinese and Japanese elements, as you say, but then rampant Nipponophilia took hold (not all AEG's fault, Japanese culture tends to get more traction in Western fiction that other parts of Asia, for the most part) and things ever since have been more Japanese with some very out of place Chinese (and other Asian) elements. There have been some writers who were very good and others who were...well.... Without some good writers, I doubt even Nippionophilia could sustain a totally awful game--though I could be, and often am, wrong. I only partially agree on the edition wars, I don't think edition wars are as much of an issue with many games unless the changes are drastic and to the system, more so than the setting (though exceptions apply).  I agree the editing has long been a issue but sadly I have noticed it has gotten bad industry wide, as of late.  Lastly, I'll say, to be fair, that few games which have been around as long as L5R and that have an ongoing meta pot filled with major wars don't suffer from similar issues to some degree (again exceptions apply). Games, or any IP, with a long history need to have someone in charge of continuity to be able to say when things just don't fit the world or make sense within its own rules.

All that said, I'd love to see what the Owl school ends up looking like.

kckolbe

Here's the current school:

+1 Intelligence

Athletics, Hunting (Tracking), Defense, Lore: Spirit Realms, Lore: Shadowlands, Investigation, any one Skill

RANK ONE: A HUNTER’S EYES

An Owl must be hunting for prey at all times, for his enemies can appear anywhere.  You add +1k0 to all Skill rolls involving the Perception Trait when creatures from the Shadowlands or spirits are involved.  Additionally, when striking a creature from the Shadowlands or a Spirit Realm (including oni from Jigoku and hungry dead from Gaki-do), you add +1k0 to all damage rolls per School Rank.  When spending a Void Point on Lore: Shadowlands or Lore: Spirit Realms, add +3k1 instead of +1k1.

RANK TWO: KNOW THE PREY

Hunters do not confine themselves to rooting out their prey—they also learn how to fight the spirits and creatures of the Shadowlands, and spend considerable time studying their strengths and weaknesses.  Any time you are confronted by a Shadowlands creature or spirit, you may take a Free Action to roll the appropriate Lore / Intelligence at TN 20 to recall either one specific strength (such as Invulnerability) or one specific weakness (such as jade) for that creature.  You choose whether you recall a strength or a weakness, but the GM chooses the exact information. You may Raise on this roll to learn additional pieces of information—one strength or weakness per Raise, or to add +1k0 to damage rolls per raise.  Additionally, against all opponents, ignore damage reduction equal to School Rank.

RANK THREE: FINISH THE HUNT

At this rank the Hunter learns to capitalize on his tracking and knowledge and take his prey down.  You may make melee attacks as a Simple Action.

RANK FOUR: BE WARY OF PREDATORS

You may add your school rank to Armor TN, Perception checks, and Initiative checks against Shadowlands creatures and spirits.  In addition, you may spend a Void point to gain half of this bonus for an entire skirmish against any type of opponent.  If a Shadowlands creature or spirit, instead add your rank in the appropriate lore skill on top of the normal bonus.

RANK FIVE: ADAPT TO THE PREY

After attacking a Shadowlands creature or spirit, roll the appropriate Lore / Intelligence at TN equal to the opponent's Armor TN+5.  If the initial attack roll was a miss, then the Lore roll replaces the missed attack.  If the initial attack was a hit and the Lore roll succeeded, then add one Free Raise to the attack for damage.
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Ephiral

Seems interesting and thematic, but a touch strong in places. Specifically, the rank 2 and 5. Looking at a character I've got who happens to be a rank 2 bushi, if I were Owl school, I'd be routinely throwing 10k3 for both to-hit and damage - before accuracy raises or void expenditure. It's a narrowish field, but that's still pretty hefty for rank 2.

Rank 5 basically means I can stop worrying about missing basically ever, as even raising to a 50% miss chance means I connect 75% of the time - more, if I decide to blow a void on accuracy. So now I can afford to raise for damage to the cap. Without spending a single XP on imrpoving combat efficiency in any way (including Void, which is actually often a very good buy in terms of insight efficiency), this same character is now likely throwing 10k6 damage anytime the specialty applies.

This character is fairly high-XP for Rank 2, but... it wouldn't take much work to acquire the same level of efficiency.

kckolbe

There aren't any bonuses to hit in this school, so not seeing where 10k3 to hit comes in.  Rank 5 does make raise gambling a lot more appealing, but at a small penalty (The +5 TN).  And yes, there are tons of bonuses to damage, but bear in mind that spirits take half damage against normal weapons and that many Shadowlands creatures have a lot of damage reduction, which this class does little to mitigate, so the damage is a bit misleading.

Also bear in mind that specialized enemy classes do offer specialized bonuses.  Check out the Kuni Witch Hunter in particular, which is focused against Shadowlands enemies and characters who are Tainted, a specialized, though large, category of enemies.  I kind of used that class as the basis, strength wise.
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Pretty in Pink

Okay.  That school kinda murders my concept anyway.  XD  I was planning on at the very least (if it was approved at least) playing a member of the Toritaka (I think that's the family that lives in the Valley of Spirits) lending her expertise to the newly formed clan as a trainer in all things spirit related.

As for the age = experience, I like it, and I think that's an appropriate scaling for it.  As far as the party balance on male to female...  I tend to steer away from playing males myself, and I usually end up in games that are mainly female.  That said, I don't mind either direction.  The big thing to keep in mind is the allowances afforded to females in the era we're going to be playing in, and what that's going to mean for the female PCs.  For instance: Technically, a female could not be part of any school that was classified as a Bushi school.  However, they were ENCOURAGED to go into the Shugenja and Courtier schools.

As for progression speed, as long as there's at least a post a week, I'll be able to maintain interest easily enough.  And I've played with you before, kc, so I know you either post as you said, or you're at least letting us know OOC what's going on to prevent it.

If the concept I listed at the beginning still works, great, I'll start working on it, otherwise I'll need that five days to come up with a new concept.  Could always reprise one of my old concepts that I think I have a paper sheet floating around here in my room for.
[FLOATLEFT][/FLOATLEFT]O.O ~{=}~ Ideas ~{=}~ A&A[FLOATRIGHT][/FLOATRIGHT]

I've taken the Oath of the Drake for Group RP

Ephiral

#79
Quote from: kckolbe on July 11, 2015, 05:17:39 AM
There aren't any bonuses to hit in this school, so not seeing where 10k3 to hit comes in.  Rank 5 does make raise gambling a lot more appealing, but at a small penalty (The +5 TN).  And yes, there are tons of bonuses to damage, but bear in mind that spirits take half damage against normal weapons and that many Shadowlands creatures have a lot of damage reduction, which this class does little to mitigate, so the damage is a bit misleading.

Also bear in mind that specialized enemy classes do offer specialized bonuses.  Check out the Kuni Witch Hunter in particular, which is focused against Shadowlands enemies and characters who are Tainted, a specialized, though large, category of enemies.  I kind of used that class as the basis, strength wise.

10k3 is the base to-hit for this guy without school bonuses. Am AFB at the moment and tend to keep out of the GM sections, but unless our enemies have piles of wounds and/or reduction, that's still a two-hit kill (average ~35 damage plus raises).

And yes, the Kuni Witch Hunter offers some nice bonuses against a limited number of targets - and this school's rank 2 is literally "Kuni, plus the ability to pull out bonus damage that doesn't count against your accuracy raise cap". That strikes me as... potentially problematic, and I figured it'd be a good idea to point it out. That said, I admit I forgot how beefy the Kuni 5 is, and withdraw my concerns on Owl 5 in light of it.

EDIT: Just so we're clear here, this is just me calling attention to things that might be an issue. If you're sure it's not a problem, I'll roll with it.

kckolbe

The Kuni 4 is pretty beefy as well.  And I'm not confident that it's not an issue, just confident that it isn't ridiculously out of balance.
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Flying Tengu

Looks pretty good to me, except I do note that none of the school skills are a weapon skill.  Obviously, you could just get one with xp, and you could use the 1 point in any skill to get a weapon skill, but it seems like it should be part of the core curriculum, so to speak.

hellrazoromega

Quote from: Ephiral on July 11, 2015, 09:30:22 AM
10k3 is the base to-hit for this guy without school bonuses. Am AFB at the moment and tend to keep out of the GM sections, but unless our enemies have piles of wounds and/or reduction, that's still a two-hit kill (average ~35 damage plus raises).

And yes, the Kuni Witch Hunter offers some nice bonuses against a limited number of targets - and this school's rank 2 is literally "Kuni, plus the ability to pull out bonus damage that doesn't count against your accuracy raise cap". That strikes me as... potentially problematic, and I figured it'd be a good idea to point it out. That said, I admit I forgot how beefy the Kuni 5 is, and withdraw my concerns on Owl 5 in light of it.

EDIT: Just so we're clear here, this is just me calling attention to things that might be an issue. If you're sure it's not a problem, I'll roll with it.

But unless we are talking about some nasty Oni a two hit kill is not unusual in L5R even at higher ranks (sometimes especially at higher ranks). With some Shadowlands creatures if you don't take them down in the first couple of rounds you are hosed because half the party is dead or dying. Because the ability is situational (only works against Shadowlands creatures or spirits) I don't see it as too powerful. If it worked against any opponent then I'd agree it was too powerful but since, even with the clan's focus, I doubt we will be encountering only the creatures this covers I don't think it is too bad.

I do have to ask, do tainted humans count as Shadowlands creatures for the purposes of this ability?

kckolbe

The one remaining skill can be used on any weapon.  Toritaka school uses spears, Kuni use heavy, and both use kenjutsu, so I didn't want to force one
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
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Ephiral

All right. As I said, this was more "That raises an eyebrow and might be a problem" than "This is totes broken change it now!". I do like that the school is open  on weapon selection. And the tainted-human question is a good one. I'm guessing no, but it's worth asking.

Would we even be able to start in the Owl school, given that it's just forming?

kckolbe

Just got home from work.

PiP: Out of curiosity, why does the school murder your concept?  It is kind of similar to the Toritaka Bushi school, after all.  As for experience from age, I am going to scale it down significantly to 1 point per year, and also require that all characters start at Insight Rank 1.  So yeah, barely a noticeable bonus, but too many people were uncomfortable with it, and a little bit is better than nothing, so it was an easy compromise.  As for your character concept, all characters will need to be members of the Owl Clan.  Having been a Toritaka (Crab) is perfectly acceptable and fitting.  As for training, the current school sensei is a Toritaka Bushi 1/Kuni Witch Hunter 4.  Were you wanting your char to be the sensei?  I removed you from skype a while back (I periodically remove everyone I haven't spoken to in a while), but you are welcome to re-add me and we can discuss concepts.  PM is fine as well, or posting here.

hellrazoromega: Tainted opponents do not receive the bonus.  That would have made the "favored enemy" bonuses a bit too broad, in my opinion. 

Ephiral: No worries.  I post things to get feedback, and your concerns were valid and based off comparisons to existing mechanics.  I am considering changing the +1k0 damage/level to just +1k0 and making Perception get the scaling bonus.  I am okay with a limited number of characters beginning as Owl bushi, having been trained before the clan was created.  The school could have existed as just one veteran samurai's technique, and just gained recognition due to being what the new Clan called for.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
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HopeFox

#86
Hey guys! I would love to join in on this game - L5R is a particular favourite of mine.

The "new clan" setting is great, I think - it lets us assemble characters from all over Rokugan with all sorts of reasons for joining (or being sent to) the new clan to work together.

I do think the bushi school is a little bit on the powerful side, but then so are some of the canon schools, really. I would say that the Rank 3 ability is a bit too powerful - usually when a school gets "simple action attacks" at rank 3, it's restricted by target (e.g. tainted creatures) or weapon (e.g. katana).

Regarding age, I rather feel that the game would run more smoothly if all PCs were in the same rough age bracket (16-22, say), both to avoid worrying about XP differences, and to put everyone on the same social level. I don't think it's a big problem either way, though.

I have a few character ideas. I do love Lions, and I have an idea for a Lion bushi or monk who volunteered to join the new clan after a personal tragedy. Alternatively, a Scorpion bushi or courtier who was deemed "too useless to keep, but too loyal to execute". I can play male or female no problem, so if we're suffering a deficiency of males, I'm happy to fill it.

Edit: Oh, and on the topic of gender issues, I remember that in the first L5R game I played, not sure whether this was actually in the books or a creative interpretation of the setting, but in most families, the rule wasn't "women are not bushi", but "bushi are not women". If you were a female bushi and not an Otaku or Matsu, then you were considered, legally and socially, to be a man, and so it was dishonourable for a samurai-ko to act like a woman, or for anyone else to treat them as one. I thought it made for an interesting bit of social flavour.
If you're such an iconoclast, where were you when we trashed Constantinople?

kckolbe

Yeah, I am coming around to restricting Rank 3 a bit.  Might make that the one exception and allow tainted creatures as well as the other targets.

I just like having age disparity.  It helps build more varied relationships.  Also, I prefer playing older chars (well, older than teenager).  I feel the same about different status, though it's not as though a PC will start off as Clan Champion or anything, but there will be positions of minor status available to "qualified" PCs.  And the xp difference of 1 point a year is pretty minor.  I don't expect any difficulties from that minor imbalance.

Take your time to decide on a concept, really no rush.

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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
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HopeFox

On the subject of age, what sort of time progression are you planning on having? Will we have an adventure or two followed by several months of downtime? That would give us opportunities to do personal stuff that isn't worth playing through live, but is still very important for samurai, like land management, training, religious duties, and the respectable kind of courtship. It would also alleviate the problem of very young characters achieving high ranks - by the time we level up, we'll have at least a few more years behind us.
If you're such an iconoclast, where were you when we trashed Constantinople?

kckolbe

#89
I must admit that I hadn't thought of that.  I knew I invited you for a reason!  Can I hear everyone's thoughts?  Also, while I'm here, I am currently using the 3rd ed book to compare populations and get an idea of the Owl Clan's size and distribution.  If anyone has useful knowledge on that, completely down for hearing it, because the numbers I am getting mean a larger clan than expected.
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Ephiral

I'm all for the extended downtime, for basically the reasons stated. Will try to dig through Emerald Empire for demographics later tonight if I can.

hellrazoromega

#91
Quote from: kckolbe on July 11, 2015, 07:06:26 PM


hellrazoromega: Tainted opponents do not receive the bonus.  That would have made the "favored enemy" bonuses a bit too broad, in my opinion. 


Good I just wanted to be sure and I agree.


Quote from: HopeFox on July 11, 2015, 08:09:22 PM

Edit: Oh, and on the topic of gender issues, I remember that in the first L5R game I played, not sure whether this was actually in the books or a creative interpretation of the setting, but in most families, the rule wasn't "women are not bushi", but "bushi are not women". If you were a female bushi and not an Otaku or Matsu, then you were considered, legally and socially, to be a man, and so it was dishonourable for a samurai-ko to act like a woman, or for anyone else to treat them as one. I thought it made for an interesting bit of social flavour.
I suppose that would depend on the era, like many fictional settings, Rokugan seems to stay static in some of its cultural mores. In real life (while once again acknowledging that Rokugan is not Japan) Onna-bugeisha were viewed differently depending on era, though in some of those eras the sentiments you state above were close to the truth.

Quote from: kckolbe on July 11, 2015, 09:30:48 PM
I must admit that I hadn't thought of that.  I knew I invited you for a reason!  Can I hear everyone's thoughts?  Also, while I'm here, I am currently using the 3rd ed book to compare populations and get an idea of the Owl Clan's size and distribution.  If anyone has useful knowledge on that, completely down for hearing it, because the numbers I am getting mean a larger clan than expected.
I love the idea of extended downtime and think it makes sense.

I must admit that I grew up on RPGs long before the 90s when the 'everything and everyone must be balanced,' era of gaming came into being. So the idea of differing ages and XP levels does not bother me. In fact I think it is cool and different, so long as you offer XP on a 'curve', if you will, so the people on the lower end have a chance to get close or catch up.


Flying Tengu

Yeah, I'm really fond of the downtime idea.  I've always felt that relationships in these games can feel a bit rushed.  If two characters didn't know each other ahead of time, it'll seem as though they went from strangers to the closest of friends in a few weeks' time.  Having an off-camera period of several months from time to time seems like it would really help these relationships feel more natural.

kckolbe

All right, will include the occasional down time, which will allow time for training and crafting and such.  It seems the average Minor Clan/Imperial holding has a population of 4,613 samurai per territory, though that includes some large cities, which our clan doesn't have.  Our number will be much lower, but still nowhere near the "PCs are pretty much the only samurai" that I'd envisioned.  I may just edit the setting's numbers, leaving total population unchanged, but lowering the samurai population to 10% of what is listed.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

HopeFox

Quote from: kckolbe on July 12, 2015, 05:11:23 AM
All right, will include the occasional down time, which will allow time for training and crafting and such.  It seems the average Minor Clan/Imperial holding has a population of 4,613 samurai per territory, though that includes some large cities, which our clan doesn't have.  Our number will be much lower, but still nowhere near the "PCs are pretty much the only samurai" that I'd envisioned.  I may just edit the setting's numbers, leaving total population unchanged, but lowering the samurai population to 10% of what is listed.

It's entirely plausible that the new Owl Clan territory will have fewer samurai than the Rokugani average. A lot of the Crab and Crane samurai who owned land in there would have vacated, if they weren't drafted into becoming Owls. Also, there's a difference between "person of samurai caste" and "person who is likely to be going around actively fighting bandits and monsters and stuff". Some will have their hands full just administering their own lands, and others just don't care. Filter out all of the samurai who have important official duties or their own ties to worry about, and the number of samurai who are actually available to be troubleshooters can be quite low.
If you're such an iconoclast, where were you when we trashed Constantinople?

hellrazoromega

I would say that population is good. Even with 10% or 46 samurai, as HopeFox said some will be spouses, courtiers and what not. Also have you envisioned this game eventually getting to the point where we might have a few NPC bushi serving us, whom we could set to task during downtime reports? Just curious because that could have an impact on what a good number would be.

kckolbe

Long post.

So, I decided to use the number of samurai listed (and using samurai in the meaning of caste, not profession.  Warrior samurai are called bushi), but make some changes to the concept of schools.  Basically, not every samurai attends a school.  This shouldn't be surprising, as there are rules in the book for it.  In this world, however, *most* samurai don't attend them.  Why aren't any school-less samurai ever mentioned?  Two reasons.  One, most of those unschooled samurai prove too inconsequential to ever have their names recorded.  Two, those that do are offered to train at a school, which is invariably accepted.

Second, of those who do go to a school, most don't go to the most prestigious ones.  By rough mental tally, there are a little over 60 noteworthy "basic" schools in the books.  Over 1/4th of them are shugenja schools, despite shugenja being quite rare (they are mentioned a lot because they are more likely to be significant individually, but in total numbers they aren't significant).  I figure that there is no way such a small number of schools could train even CLOSE to the 1,436,000 samurai currently living in Rokugan.  Again, almost all the samurai we HEAR about did, but that is because those samurai are well connected and/or very gifted.

I did a lot of math today.  I also made a lot of assumptions and factored in a lot of personal bias.  I am going to spill almost a lot of it.  If there is something game-breakingly upsetting about them to you, please let me know.  I will say that I feel very good about this.  After all, this setting is largely about talking about the "glossed over" details of Rokugan, so why not talk about the insignificant samurai who, in both history and every other game, are nothing but a number?  Your characters, for the first part of the game, will be among those samurai.  Possibly talented, possibly even a little connected, but also, as far as Rokugan history is concerned, meaningless. 

That will change.  After your first adventure you will jump to Insight Rank 2 and be significantly stronger than at least 24.5095% of the samurai in Rokugan.  Those of you with a little status or glory or allies might find yourselves promoted to ranks that mean nothing outside your Clan, and seemingly very little within it, but we won't stop there.  Yes, you will all have the chance to be placed in charge of other samurai, and to advise those above you, and have your words have real impact, at least to those directly surrounding you.  A word on Insight Rank.  I have decided that Rank 8 is going to be the cap on this game.  Not only will your characters never surpass that, but a higher Insight will not exist.  If an Insight Rank 8 opponent is killed without the help of significant NPCs, expect an epilogue to be on the way.

So, without further delay, here is a breakdown of all 1,436,000 samurai in Rokugan by Insight Rank, whether or not they attended a samurai school, and whether or not that school was known Empire-wide.

Rank   Total      Unschooled   Common      Great      Percent
1   351,956      316,760        28,157          7,039     24.5095
2   853,792      683,034      119,530        51,227     59.4563
3   204,448      143,114        36,800        24,534     14.2373
4   22,112          14,467          4,823          4,822       1.6791
5   1,348                 674              270             404       0.0938
6   270                      49              108             113       0.0188
7   62                          8                19               35       0.0043
8   13                          1                  3                 9       0.0009
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

HopeFox

Quote from: kckolbe on July 12, 2015, 07:45:13 PM
Long post.

So, I decided to use the number of samurai listed (and using samurai in the meaning of caste, not profession.  Warrior samurai are called bushi), but make some changes to the concept of schools.  Basically, not every samurai attends a school.  This shouldn't be surprising, as there are rules in the book for it.  In this world, however, *most* samurai don't attend them.  Why aren't any school-less samurai ever mentioned?  Two reasons.  One, most of those unschooled samurai prove too inconsequential to ever have their names recorded.  Two, those that do are offered to train at a school, which is invariably accepted.

It's also important to note that the majority of samurai don't belong to the great families, but to vassal families of those families. There's a section about them in one of the books (Emerald Empire, I think), and they generally aren't as notable as the great families.

QuoteI did a lot of math today.  I also made a lot of assumptions and factored in a lot of personal bias.  I am going to spill almost a lot of it.  If there is something game-breakingly upsetting about them to you, please let me know.  I will say that I feel very good about this.  After all, this setting is largely about talking about the "glossed over" details of Rokugan, so why not talk about the insignificant samurai who, in both history and every other game, are nothing but a number?  Your characters, for the first part of the game, will be among those samurai.  Possibly talented, possibly even a little connected, but also, as far as Rokugan history is concerned, meaningless. 

I like this. I like the idea of starting out in the shadows, because that's where good stories start.

The numbers look good. Demographics are always hard in games like this, and I'm willing to suspend some disbelief if the numbers start conflicting down the line.
If you're such an iconoclast, where were you when we trashed Constantinople?

Marie Reynolds

I am cool with the down time idea it would add a lot of opportunity for development of characters and ties between them. The population  things is a good thing to keep in mind and if you want to keep the population relatively close to the average numbers could have ronin  fill those spots. Also will this minor clan have more then one family and as it grows will different schools  get made such as a courtiers or possibly a shugenja school since  we will be facing spiritual threats.

kckolbe

The Great Clans books list some of them, too, I think.  I think the minor vassal families are a nice touch for larger clans, but I don't see our Clan starting out with any, given that most of those names are granted due to service to the parent clan.  I looked up the size of armies in Rokugan, and it was not pretty.  The standard set by the Lion is 144,000 troops (all samurai), which, suffice to say, the Owl do not have.  It was weird reading the size descriptions, because they start so small and then explode.  This information was taken from Masters of War, 3rd ed, by the way.

Squadron: 20 men plus 1 sergeant.  So far, so good, great opportunity for a low-ranking samurai.
Company: 7 squadrons, plus a lieutenant and 5 support officers.  Again, no issues there, only 150 people, less for a more efficient clan.
Legion: I expected this to be where things exploded, since legion is such a grand word, but it's only 5 companies plus a captain.  That's only 750 people or so.
Army: Consists of FORTY-EIGHT LEGIONS (about 36,000 samurai).  What the fuck? 
Four armies compose the total force (144,000)

That number, 144,000, is just under half the number of total samurai the Lion have.  Remember that bushi and shugenja are counted in that number, and presumably several courtiers among the support staffs.  So we have a good idea of about what percentage of a clan's samurai is devoted full time to military life.  I imagine that smaller clans fill some of that with reserves that spend normal days fulfilling some other function, making them less well-trained.  The Crane, for example, only have 213,000 samurai, but I also imagine that they require fewer courtiers to manage their affairs, possibly devoting a higher percentage of troops to the army.  I should note that peasants aren't even mentioned, so I assume all of them work fields and such unless conscripted.

Our clan will only have about 2 legions worth of samurai in the proper army, making them not even a blip on the radar, though they should feel safe given that Toturi himself created them, and probably wouldn't tolerate anyone fucking with them.

***

As for other schools, I'd much rather those potential sensei be "unlocked" through gameplay and brought into the clan, or discovered from within the ranks of the nameless.  Kind of a shame, since I had a wonderful idea for a martial courtier class, but I wanted to leave room for characters to be recruited as sensei or for PCs to eventually start their own school.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Ephiral

Personally, given the strategies of the clans involved, I would expect the Lion to be on the high side of average for army size - they would be the benchmark, but seek to build a force superior to anything any single clan could field against them. (Whether they can succeed at this is another question.) The Crane, on the other hand, use court as a primary tactic - warfare for them largely consists of delaying actions until they can get the political concessions they need. Given their culture and strategy, I'd expect them to be on the low side in terms of troop numbers.

(The Crab are something of an anomaly here - they are organized around pretty much every function of their clan serving the military directly, and have a huge overall percentage of troops, but only a tiny fraction of these can be fielded at any given time because the Wall.)

HopeFox

Do the Owl have a family name at all yet? The Mantis lacked one for quite a while, after all that treason they did.

The Lion are very much on the upper end of militarization - most clans do not turn as much of their samurai and peasants into soldiers as that. But yes, the other clans' armies are much bigger than ours.

I like the idea of needing to build the Owl infrastructure and prestige from the ground up. I think it'll make for a very fun game.
If you're such an iconoclast, where were you when we trashed Constantinople?

kckolbe

Well, the Mantis kind of formed without official permission.  Not an issue for these guys.  There will be a family name, just haven't decided on it.

I wish I'd seen something about usage of peasants in the Masters of War book, because I imagine that the Lion use more of their peasants for war than anyone else, but they actually don't seem to use many of their samurai for it, according to Masters of War.  I think the reason that Lion are considered to devote more samurai to their army than anyone else is due to them just having more samurai than anyone else.  Only the Crab are even close, but many of their samurai are stuck on the wall, as Ephiral said. 

Crab                 4,610,000        258,000      
Crane               3,820,000        213,000      
Dragon             1,830,000       101,000   
Lion                 5,280,000        292,000      
Mantis              1,110,000         66,000   
Phoenix            1,590,000         88,000   
Scorpion          1,810,000        102,000      
Unicorn            3,650,000        203,000

I think it will be, too, though your characters will have to make a lot of tough decisions, many of which will be a bit over their head.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

hellrazoromega

Quote from: HopeFox on July 13, 2015, 04:37:08 PM
Do the Owl have a family name at all yet? The Mantis lacked one for quite a while, after all that treason they did.

Fukurou, perhaps?

HopeFox

Yeah, the Mantis were all kinds of dodgy, and even lost their family name the first time around. Let's not do that, okay?

So I'm definitely leaning towards a Matsu bushi in his early twenties, who volunteered for the new Clan for personal reasons. If he's going to learn the Owl school as he gains Insight Rank, that opens some interesting possibilities for how he combines his old and new techniques, and it means that two bushi won't be very similar even if they're going to the same school. Could be fun to run across a former Kakita in the dojo...
If you're such an iconoclast, where were you when we trashed Constantinople?

Muse

  I left her hisory write up at home, so I can't send it til tomorow or the day after, but I'm working on a shugenja--a former unicorn clan girl.  :)
A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

How to set this Muse ablaze (O/Os)

When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

kckolbe

Speaking of multiple schools, I am working on a new advantage that I think adds interesting options for that.

Combine Styles: 10 points.  If a character has at least one rank in two different non shugenja schools, a character may "skip" techniques to instead learn a higher technique, provided that technique is equal or lower in School Rank than the character is in Insight Rank.  Skipped techniques may later be learned in place of higher ranks.  For example, an Akodo Bushi 2, Kuni Witch Hunter 1 gains a new Rank and wants to learn the Rank 4 ability.  Since the character would be Insight Rank 4, he could learn the Rank 4 ability of the Kuni Witch Hunter School.  However, one of the benefits of the Rank 4 is an increase to the Rank 2 ability, which the character does not have, so that portion of the benefit does not apply.  Should the char go back and learn the Rank 2 ability, then the bonus to it from Rank 4 is immediately applied.  Note that this advantage does not affect how rank 1 in a new school is obtained).  Note that the character may advance in either school, removing the limitation from Multiple Schools.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

kckolbe

Please vote for the family name you prefer

Nobuhito
Reijiro
Washichi
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread


Ephiral

Prefer Nobuhito over Reijiro, but it's a very weak preference. Both of them are way ahead of Washichi.

kckolbe

Wasichi was kind of a wild card.  It's different.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

HopeFox

If you're such an iconoclast, where were you when we trashed Constantinople?

Flying Tengu


kckolbe

Let's go with Reijiro then. 

Also, HopeFox, I just finished writing up a VERY different type of Kakita.  I don't expect him to be a serious rival for your Matsu, but should be interesting.

Naturally, I am not writing out all 4000 NPCs, but I am writing out some of the more significant ones, plus those who may have plot points later on.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Pumpkin Seeds

Should I try for duelist or courtier you think?

kckolbe

Room for either, really, though I am concerned that you haven't been involved in the world building we've been doing or answered the questions I asked when you first posted interest.  Based on that, I'm not sure you are a good fit for this group.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

Pumpkin Seeds


HopeFox

Quote from: kckolbe on July 14, 2015, 10:52:10 PM
Let's go with Reijiro then. 

Also, HopeFox, I just finished writing up a VERY different type of Kakita.  I don't expect him to be a serious rival for your Matsu, but should be interesting.

Naturally, I am not writing out all 4000 NPCs, but I am writing out some of the more significant ones, plus those who may have plot points later on.

As long as he's not some useless artiste who thinks that dressing nicely and acting clever is more important than duty, I'm sure we'll get along fine!

(btw, being a duelist counts as being a useless artiste)
If you're such an iconoclast, where were you when we trashed Constantinople?

kckolbe

But HopeFox, what do you think about male models?  No, I really do think you'll like this one.  Your char might not, though he also won't be part of the group, not often at least.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

HopeFox

Quote from: kckolbe on July 15, 2015, 04:41:09 AM
But HopeFox, what do you think about male models?  No, I really do think you'll like this one.  Your char might not, though he also won't be part of the group, not often at least.

Well... uh... we all serve the Emperor in our own special ways, I'm sure...

No, he sounds awesome. I look forward to meeting him!
If you're such an iconoclast, where were you when we trashed Constantinople?

kckolbe

Just to be clear, he isn't a model, just seemed like a good opportunity to adapt a joke from Zoolander.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

kckolbe

New Rule:  Family Trait Bonuses.  I've never been a big fan of the family trait bonuses, so now each family has 3 traits to choose from.  You still only get one.

Hida Strength, Stamina, Willpower
Kuni Intelligence, Willpower, Perception
Hiruma Agility, Reflexes, Stamina
Yasuki Intelligence, Awareness, Willpower
Kaiu Intelligence, Strength, Perception
Toritaka Perception, Stamina, Agility

Doji Awareness, Intelligence, Perception
Daidoji Stamina, Reflexes, Agility
Asahina Willpower, Awareness, Intelligence
Kakita Agility, Reflexes, Awareness

Kitsuki Perception, Intelligence, Awareness
Mirumoto Agility, Strength, Intelligence
Tamori Willpower, Stamina, Strength
Togashi Agility, Void, Stamina

Akodo Perception, Agility, Awareness
Kitsu Perception, Awareness, Reflexes
Matsu Strength, Stamina, Willpower
Ikoma Intelligence, Awareness, Perception

Kitsune Willpower, Perception, Stamina
Tsuruchi Reflexes, Perception, Agility
Moshi Intelligence, Awareness, Willpower
Yoritomo Agility, Stamina, Strength

Agasha Intelligence, Awareness, Stamina
Asako Intelligence, Perception, Awareness
Isawa Willpower, Intelligence, Perception
Shiba Stamina, Agility, Reflexes

Bayushi Agility, Perception, Reflexes
Shosuro Awareness, Reflexes, Agility
Soshi Perception, Awareness, Willpower
Yogo Stamina, Willpower, Intelligence

Horiuchi Willpower, Intelligence, Stamina
Ide Awareness, Reflexes, Perception
Iuchi Awareness, Perception, Strength
Moto Strength, Willpower, Stamina
Shinjo Agility, Reflexes, Awareness
Utaku Agility, Stamina, Strength

Badger Strength, Stamina, Willpower

Dragonfly Perception, Awareness, Stamina

Hare Reflexes, Agility, Perception

Monkey Willpower, Perception, Stamina

Sparrow Awareness, Perception, Stamina

Tortoise Awareness, Perception, Willpower

Kaeru Awareness, Intelligence, Reflexes
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

hellrazoromega

So are we OK to post potential character ideas here? I was thinking a Hiruma scout either taken into or working with the clan.

kckolbe

Go ahead.  And prefer actually part of the clan.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

hellrazoromega

Quote from: kckolbe on July 15, 2015, 11:28:13 PM
Go ahead.  And prefer actually part of the clan.
That is fine, is it still OK to take the Hiruma scout school and have been brought into the clan?

I'm sorry with all the buzz what year are we playing in again? Is Lore Nezumi culture OK to take--for a Hiruma scout and are fingers if jade available as a item when taking equipment? Just wondering because I have a character in mind.

kckolbe

It is the most likely case.  Your chars (so far) were all fully trained before this clan was created.  So can begin as a Hiruma scout and continue as one as well, though you would be relying on different teachers, which isn't an issue, not for a while at least.  The year will be 1151, less than one year after the treaty ending the war.

Lore: Nezumi will be allowed but is recommended against as I tend to avoid non humans in this setting.  Jade would be fine for a Hiruma scout, because you never know.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

hellrazoromega

Quote from: kckolbe on July 15, 2015, 11:47:33 PM
It is the most likely case.  Your chars (so far) were all fully trained before this clan was created.  So can begin as a Hiruma scout and continue as one as well, though you would be relying on different teachers, which isn't an issue, not for a while at least.  The year will be 1151, less than one year after the treaty ending the war.

Lore: Nezumi will be allowed but is recommended against as I tend to avoid non humans in this setting.  Jade would be fine for a Hiruma scout, because you never know.
No worries I only have one point dumped into the lore more as a fluff thing.
Oh and just out of curiosity are you using Heritage tables?

kckolbe

I'll have to get back to you on Heritage tables.  One of those things where I love the feel, but not crazy about the effect at times.  It can lead to significant disparity between chars, far more than the age thing which folks were pretty low on.
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Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

hellrazoromega

Quote from: kckolbe on July 16, 2015, 01:31:22 AM
I'll have to get back to you on Heritage tables.  One of those things where I love the feel, but not crazy about the effect at times.  It can lead to significant disparity between chars, far more than the age thing which folks were pretty low on.
No worries I'm good either way, some love them some hate them, I use them in my games but tend to be flexible on rolls as they can be all over the map like you say.

Anyway I have the 20 questions answered to give you a bit of a hint of the character I have in mind. Once you figure out XP I can flesh her out more, I am basing her on a character from a game which died after barely starting so I can a likely will tweak based on the XP.

20 Questions
WHAT CLAN DOES YOUR CHARACTER BELONG TO?
Owl

HOW WOULD OTHERS DESCRIBE YOUR CHARACTER’S APPEARANCE?
Unkempt and rough. Fumiko dresses and acts like a scout and relishes the act of “getting dirty” to hide herself

IS YOUR CHARACTER A BUSHI, SHUGENJA, MONK, OR COURTIER?
Onna-bugeisha, domo arigato.

WHAT FAMILY DOES YOUR CHARACTER BELONG TO?
Hiruma Mizu---the woman who taught her

WHAT IS YOUR CHARACTER’S MAIN MOTIVATION?
See, but not be seen; map out and report dangers, and not be seen; defend the Empire---and well, you get the idea.

WHO IS THE PERSON YOUR CHARACTER TRUSTS MOST?
Hiruma Moriko (Mother)

WHAT IS YOUR CHARACTER’S GREATEST STRENGTH? GREATEST WEAKNESS?
Fumiko’s loyalty is slow to emerge but once given little can shake it. Fumiko has a temper that causes her to often act before she thinks, she is also sensitive about her small stature (small for a Crab at least).

WHAT DOES YOUR CHARACTER THINK OF BUSHIDO?
Bushido is a way of life—that said, nothing beyond the from the Shadowlands deserves the tenets of Bushido except perhaps Nezumi.

WHAT IS YOUR CHARACTER’S OPINION OF HER OWN CLAN?
a Clan with a new and exciting mission.

IS YOUR CHARACTER MARRIED?
Betrothed—the less said to Fumiko about that approaching day, the better. (Leaving that open—could be an NPC, or a PC—works either way but the latter could be a hoot)

DOES YOUR CHARACTER HAVE ANY PREJUDICES?
Phoenix and Dragon seem to spend a lot of time contemplating their own navels and Crane nearly give her fits with how well-groomed they are.

TO WHOM DOES YOUR CHARACTER OWE THE MOST LOYALTY?
Her new Clan.

WHAT ARE YOUR CHARACTER’S FAVORITE AND LEAST FAVORITE THINGS?
Favorites: A flawless scouting mission well away from ceremonies and “proper” things, and freedom. And her family sword. Least Favorite: Anything that threatens said freedom.

DOES YOUR CHARACTER HAVE ANY RECURRING MANNERISMS?
Absentmindedly winding her finger through the Sageo scabbard

WHAT ABOUT YOUR CHARACTER’S EMOTIONS?
A very uneven temper that is quickly roused and just as rapidly cooled. She can drink with the very person she was screaming at minute before—after a good fist fight, of course.

HOW WOULD YOUR CHARACTER HANDLE A SUBORDINATE’S IMPROPER BEHAVIOR?
Stern action but not over reaction—after some of the things she has seen beyond the Wall a little improper behavior is the least of her concerns. Punishment must fit the offense.

HOW WOULD YOUR CHARACTER’S PARENTS DESCRIBE HER?
Wild but driven and focused—and perhaps somewhat pretty, if you can nail her down long enough to clean her up.

WHAT IS YOUR CHARACTER’S HIGHEST AMBITION?
To be in charge of training all the scouts of the Owl and to see more of Rokugan, an secretly perhaps other lands.

HOW RELIGIOUS IS YOUR CHARACTER?
Very—serving beyond the wall drives you to one extreme or the other, few fall in the middle.

IF YOU COULD, WHAT ADVICE WOULD YOU GIVE YOUR CHARACTER?
Watch your back and by extension the backs of those you are attached to.

kckolbe

XP is as normal plus 1xp per year above 16.
Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread

hellrazoromega

Quote from: kckolbe on July 16, 2015, 01:53:30 AM
XP is as normal plus 1xp per year above 16.

OK I'll have to ponder that some--one could get quite old very fast without any increase in Insight rank. Have to think where I want her to be.

HopeFox

I think my Matsu bushi is about 23. He's been an adult and an active bushi for a few years, but is yet to do anything of very great note.
If you're such an iconoclast, where were you when we trashed Constantinople?

Muse

I currently have Kotone at seventeen.  She could be as old as ninteen.  Might make the sudden loss of her betrothal more dramatic if it happened in the year she was to be married...  :) 

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pDiKxEC0U2ndYLtYCctV2CTnKtkmEDs-D6mROL-DpbA/edit

  Do we have any other Shugenja?  I'm tweaking my combat style and spell selection.  Would be nice if someone wasn't defecient in water spells. 

A link for all of us who ever had a shouting match with our muse: http://www.ted.com/talks/elizabeth_gilbert_on_genius.html

How to set this Muse ablaze (O/Os)

When the little angel won't appear no matter how many plum blossoms you swirl:  https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=135346.msg16474321#msg16474321 (Major update 5/10/2023)

kckolbe

Ons/Offs  A/A  Oath of the Drake
(From the Penis Game) Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Penis
I love a wet nymph.  "Letting some guy have [her] just to have another woman is a losing trade"

Buffy: The Vampire Slayer(IC#2)
Intro Thread