What WOULD you be playing?

[Inkidu]

I do think people are looking for an alternative to WoW and that The Old Republic could offer that if Bioware chooses to differentiate itself from the WoW formula.  The biggest thing they need to do is create a serious storyline with immersion and emotional involvement.  WoW is far too comical, breaks the fourth wall a lot, and just generally feels outright silly.  I can't imagine WoW ever telling a story with any real depth or emotional resonance.

How can you have any emotional involvement in a story that thousands of people are partaking in at the same time you are? That's one of my more opinion-based problems with the MMORPG. What's it matter that I slew the dragon? That dude over there is camping the thing!

[Shjade]

How can you have any emotional involvement in a story that thousands of people are partaking in at the same time you are?

How can you have any emotional involvement in a story that is only relevant to you?

Sharing and community are what give stories meaning. If you slay the dragon and no one knows it but you, what does it matter that it happened at all?

That argument goes both ways.

[Inkidu]

How can you have any emotional involvement in a story that is only relevant to you?

Sharing and community are what give stories meaning. If you slay the dragon and no one knows it but you, what does it matter that it happened at all?

That argument goes both ways.

No, the argument does not. They are two distinct levels of psychology. Maybe friends in an MMORPG make it easier. Your average game is about the individuals accomplishments. Praise from other people is very much an instant-gratification thing. Finding deeper fulfillment in your own individual accomplishments is supposed to be a distinctly human trait.

When you're just another face in the crowd and anyone can do what you can do what's the point? If everyone can get and do everything you can do there is no accomplishment. Let's face it, in a world where everyone can be a hero there are no heroes. So to speak.

[Oniya]

No, the argument does not. They are two distinct levels of psychology. Maybe friends in an MMORPG make it easier. Your average game is about the individuals accomplishments. Praise from other people is very much an instant-gratification thing. Finding deeper fulfillment in your own individual accomplishments is supposed to be a distinctly human trait.

When you're just another face in the crowd and anyone can do what you can do what's the point? If everyone can get and do everything you can do there is no accomplishment. Let's face it, in a world where everyone can be a hero there are no heroes. So to speak.

I saw that movie!  ;D

Mr. Incredible: You mean you killed off real heroes so that you could *pretend* to be one?
Syndrome: Oh, I'm real. Real enough to defeat you! And I did it without your precious gifts, your oh-so-special powers. I'll give them heroics. I'll give them the most spectacular heroics the world has ever seen! And when I'm old and I've had my fun, I'll sell my inventions so that *everyone* can have powers. *Everyone* can be super! And when everyone's super...
[chuckles evilly]
Syndrome: - no one will be.

[Inkidu]

I saw that movie!  ;D

Mr. Incredible: You mean you killed off real heroes so that you could *pretend* to be one?
Syndrome: Oh, I'm real. Real enough to defeat you! And I did it without your precious gifts, your oh-so-special powers. I'll give them heroics. I'll give them the most spectacular heroics the world has ever seen! And when I'm old and I've had my fun, I'll sell my inventions so that *everyone* can have powers. *Everyone* can be super! And when everyone's super...
[chuckles evilly]
Syndrome: - no one will be.

Why do I think you didn't have to look that up to type it...

[Oniya]

I could smile and look all mysterious - but IMDB is my friend.   ::)

[Hemingway]

Well, the Old Republic was full of Jedi ( and Sith ). I'm certain all of those were heroes ( and villains - debateable ), to say nothing of all the soldiers, and probably a lot of smugglers and pilots and, well, you get the idea. Now, I don't know what the story is going to look like in The Old Republic, but the only time I feel what you say is true at all, is when it comes to killing some named enemy. Obviously, not everyone can be part of that.

Now, I like RP in my MMOs, too. And I think it's a hallmark of a good RPer to be able to write their character into the story, so to speak, without giving them undue credit.

Anyway, Inkidu, you may not be able to enjoy the story of any MMO on an emotional level, but I do think you're wrong to imply that others can't either.

But then again, I prefer RP. I don't care that much about equipment or achievements or raids or whatever.

Also, on a slightly related note. I have heard rumors and I've been seeing hints in interviews and such that The Old Republic will have romance subplots. The very idea of companion romance in a fricking MMO seems insane to me. In a good way. Mainly because Visas Marr from KotOR2 was nearly as awesome as Isabela of DA2. But all that aside, I don't suppose anyone knows more about that? Or the number of companions you'll be allowed to choose from? I mean, considering it's an MMO, the selection ought to be vast, so that everyone isn't running around with the exact same people in their party. That'd be ... strange.

[Inkidu]

Well, the Old Republic was full of Jedi ( and Sith ). I'm certain all of those were heroes ( and villains - debateable ), to say nothing of all the soldiers, and probably a lot of smugglers and pilots and, well, you get the idea. Now, I don't know what the story is going to look like in The Old Republic, but the only time I feel what you say is true at all, is when it comes to killing some named enemy. Obviously, not everyone can be part of that.

Now, I like RP in my MMOs, too. And I think it's a hallmark of a good RPer to be able to write their character into the story, so to speak, without giving them undue credit.

Anyway, Inkidu, you may not be able to enjoy the story of any MMO on an emotional level, but I do think you're wrong to imply that others can't either.

But then again, I prefer RP. I don't care that much about equipment or achievements or raids or whatever.

Also, on a slightly related note. I have heard rumors and I've been seeing hints in interviews and such that The Old Republic will have romance subplots. The very idea of companion romance in a fricking MMO seems insane to me. In a good way. Mainly because Visas Marr from KotOR2 was nearly as awesome as Isabela of DA2. But all that aside, I don't suppose anyone knows more about that? Or the number of companions you'll be allowed to choose from? I mean, considering it's an MMO, the selection ought to be vast, so that everyone isn't running around with the exact same people in their party. That'd be ... strange.

I didn't imply that people couldn't. I kind of answered my own question in the process of explaining my reasons, but I wondered how people could find any emotional value in it. I means sure I could lie and say I understand, but I don't. How does anyone get emotional value when anything you accomplish is doable by everyone around you? You're not even a cog in a great big machine. In fact, iss there any end goal to MMORPGs? I've never "beaten one." Where's the evil wizard, the becoming champion, the slaying the demon, the final boss fight? They don't seem conducive to any kind of closure at all. It kind of defeats its own purpose to end, so you can't end, you can't get your reward, and your accomplishment lies where? Of course, even if there were a final boss fight, everyone and anyone could do it. What makes it so relevant to the individual then?

[consortium11]

I find myself basically agreeing with Inkidu. I'm not a big MMORPG fan anyway... partly because of this I guess, with my entire experience of the "traditional" MMORPG being about 10 minutes playing a friends WoW character and a few hours watching him play in the background while the rest of us chatted in his room.

I'm sure beating the Witch King in WoW was a rewarding experience in terms of gameplay but in terms of plot/influence/drama it's surely slightly lessened by the fact that you know it's been done 879203 times before, including by one team minutes earlier... and will be done countless times afterwards. The converse also has problems... while a game where every big bad could be beaten once would have that if you were the one to beat him I can't see (at least using current go-to MMORPG set ups and systems) how that wouldn't lead to a (very) small cadre of hardened players who did virtually all the cool stuff while the average player... even a dedicated one... never really got a look-in.

Most people play RPG's... both single and multiplayer (although some multiplayer games subvert this) so they can be the hero or at least important (in one form or another); few want to be generic footsoldier number 4367 stuck fighting generic mob enemy number 5 while the real heroes go off and kill the cool thing.

On topic both Age of Decadence and Dead State are sticking to traditional indy developer timelines of being ready "soon."

[Inkidu]

I would like to be playing The Witcher 2 come May 17, but for the life of me, I think it's only on PC. D:

[Hemingway]

May 17. Our National Day, and smack-dab in the middle of my finals.

Timing fail.

[Inkidu]

May 17. Our National Day, and smack-dab in the middle of my finals.

Timing fail.

Lucky me. All I have to do is type up some seven to ten page paper and submit it and I'm done with the semester. Still, I want my witcher! *flails* They said they were really going to do console versions this time.